So when is this "Honest" discussion regarding race relations goint to occur?

[4est_4est_Gump]

Fine...

I'm pretty sure that given how small that town is, Phil might've been the only baby born that day, but I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt...


How's this?

"100% of white men named Phil Collins born born 30 January 1951 in Chiswick, Middlesex, England played drums for a band called Genesis."

So, it is not a fact, but a hypothesis.

If you are going to challenge other people, then maybe hold yourself to the same standard?

 

[RobDownSouth]

If you are going to challenge other people, then maybe hold yourself to the same standard?

http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj236/thundersqueaks/irony_meter.gif

 

[Ishmael]

There was a bit of rioting in the overnight for the thread.

I was impressed that, for a change, it wasn't exclusively a bunch of white people discussing what is to be done, or not done for the black community.

Discussions worthy of a southern slave owner.

Ishmael

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

For some of us, an honest conversation means examining the learned and shared culture of the African-American community that has not joined the Middle Class that precludes it from advancing and achieving the American Dream as part of the problem that leads to events like Ferguson. But to others, that means "blaming the victim." If you cannot blame the victim, then someone else must be blamed, so we blame "white privilege. This is the politically correct discussion and those who demand an "honest discussion" are being disingenuous.

What is required is to discard the unassailable victim fallacy if we are to have an "honest" discussion.

If you ask white trash why they don't get ahead, they blame 'Corporate America,' nepotism/birth and Wall Street.

 

[Busybody]

Is "honest" discussion possible?

With whom?

MSNBC Guest: “Foundation Of This Country Is Racism And White Supremacy”…




On the plus side, libs have completely given up trying to hide their disgust for America.

Via Daily Caller:


Appearing on MSNBC’s “The Reid Report,” The Nation’s Mychal Denzel Smith said the foundation of the United States is racism and white supremacy.

… We’re not then dealing with the systematic ideas that uphold racism and white supremacy in this country and that lead to a death of Trayvon Martin or Michael Brown, Renisha McBride, on and on and on. What we haven’t dealt with, we refuse to deal with it is the idea, the fact that the foundation of this country is racism and white supremacy. And we are — all of our institutions uphold that.

 

[Ishmael]

For some of us, an honest conversation means examining the learned and saared culture of the African-American community that has not joined the Middle Class that precludes it from advancing and achieving the American Dream as part of the problem that leads to events like Ferguson. But to others, that means "blaming the victim." If you cannot blame the victim, then someone else must be blamed, so we blame "white privilege. This is the politically correct discussion and those who demand an "honest discussion" are being disingenuous.

What is required is to discard the unassailable victim fallacy if we are to have an "honest" discussion.

If you ask white trash why they don't get ahead, they blame 'Corporate America,' nepotism/birth and Wall Street.

"Blame" is the operative word. It's all about individual choices and communal attitudes. Each individual, regardless of race, station in life, or handicaps, must make their own decision as to how to make their way forward as a law abiding member of society. And in some cases that means departing from the accepted mind set of your specific group of peers.

I often wonder if this so called 'white privilege' is nothing more than the white man believing that anything is possible while the black man (and other groups including the generational poverty stricken white man) believes that they are held back no matter what they do? Self fulfilling views of life.

Ishmael

 

[Busybody]

"Blame" is the operative word. It's all about individual choices and communal attitudes. Each individual, regardless of race, station in life, or handicaps, must make their own decision as to how to make their way forward as a law abiding member of society. And in some cases that means departing from the accepted mind set of your specific group of peers.

I often wonder if this so called 'white privilege' is nothing more than the white man believing that anything is possible while the black man (and other groups including the generational poverty stricken white man) believes that they are held back no matter what they do? Self fulfilling views of life.

Ishmael

http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=1116243

read the 2nd post

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

I've said it too many times, "Look at all these lazy bucks just lying around blaming the white man..."

 

[RobDownSouth]

I've said it too many times, "Look at all these lazy bucks just lying around blaming the white man..."

Too many times indeed.

But hey, that's what race baiters such as yourself do.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Is "honest" discussion possible?

With whom?

MSNBC Guest: “Foundation Of This Country Is Racism And White Supremacy”…




On the plus side, libs have completely given up trying to hide their disgust for America.

Via Daily Caller:


Appearing on MSNBC’s “The Reid Report,” The Nation’s Mychal Denzel Smith said the foundation of the United States is racism and white supremacy.

… We’re not then dealing with the systematic ideas that uphold racism and white supremacy in this country and that lead to a death of Trayvon Martin or Michael Brown, Renisha McBride, on and on and on. What we haven’t dealt with, we refuse to deal with it is the idea, the fact that the foundation of this country is racism and white supremacy. And we are — all of our institutions uphold that.

Every ethnic group I know of catches shit, it wasn't rich folks who came here on the May Flower or to Jamestown, plenty were indentured servants or the destitute heirs of Brit peasants. Greeks, Jews, Italians, Irish, et al took it in stride and improved their fortunes. I recently did the genealogy for a Cuban guy, the last 5 generations of his people were cigar makers in Tampa and Key West. The sole group that never gets any traction in America or Africa or anywhere are blacks.

 

[Busybody]

Is "honest" discussion possible?

With whom?

.

TIME Defends Blacks Looting In Ferguson…




Alternate headline: Rich liberal elitist defends poor blacks looting and burning down their neighborhood.

Ferguson: In Defense of Rioting – TIME


When a police officer shoots a young, unarmed black man in the streets, then does not face indictment, anger in the community is inevitable. It’s what we do with that anger that counts. In such a case, is rioting so wrong?

Riots are a necessary part of the evolution of society. Unfortunately, we do not live in a universal utopia where people have the basic human rights they deserve simply for existing, and until we get there, the legitimate frustration, sorrow and pain of the marginalized voices will boil over, spilling out into our streets. As “normal” citizens watch the events of Ferguson unfurl on their television screens and Twitter feeds, there is a lot of head shaking, finger pointing, and privileged explanation going on. We wish to seclude the incident and the people involved. To separate it from our history as a nation, to dehumanize the change agents because of their bad and sometimes violent decisions—because if we can separate the underlying racial tensions that clearly exist in our country from the looting and rioting of select individuals, we can continue to ignore the problem. […]

Instead of tearing down other human beings who are acting upon decades of pent-up anger at a system decidedly against them, a system that has told them they are less than human for years, we ought to be reaching out to help them regain the humanity they lost, not when a few set fire to the buildings in Ferguson, but when they were born the wrong color in the post-racial America.

 

[Que]

There is an implicit bigotry in the idea rioting is the only avenue for expression that the "black community' has. The eyes of the nation are there. Can no one so impasshioned simply use their words and write a piece, or give an oration? It has to include looting?

 

[Busybody]

There is an implicit bigotry in the idea rioting is the only avenue for expression that the "black community' has. The eyes of the nation are there. Can no one so impasshioned simply use their words and write a piece, or give an oration? It has to include looting?

or that VOTER ID only hurts COLOREDS

 

[Sean Renaud]

There is an implicit bigotry in the idea rioting is the only avenue for expression that the "black community' has. The eyes of the nation are there. Can no one so impasshioned simply use their words and write a piece, or give an oration? It has to include looting?

It doesn't have to but it often does. And honestly with good reason.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

TIME Defends Blacks Looting In Ferguson…




Alternate headline: Rich liberal elitist defends poor blacks looting and burning down their neighborhood.

Ferguson: In Defense of Rioting – TIME


When a police officer shoots a young, unarmed black man in the streets, then does not face indictment, anger in the community is inevitable. It’s what we do with that anger that counts. In such a case, is rioting so wrong?

Riots are a necessary part of the evolution of society. Unfortunately, we do not live in a universal utopia where people have the basic human rights they deserve simply for existing, and until we get there, the legitimate frustration, sorrow and pain of the marginalized voices will boil over, spilling out into our streets. As “normal” citizens watch the events of Ferguson unfurl on their television screens and Twitter feeds, there is a lot of head shaking, finger pointing, and privileged explanation going on. We wish to seclude the incident and the people involved. To separate it from our history as a nation, to dehumanize the change agents because of their bad and sometimes violent decisions—because if we can separate the underlying racial tensions that clearly exist in our country from the looting and rioting of select individuals, we can continue to ignore the problem. […]

Instead of tearing down other human beings who are acting upon decades of pent-up anger at a system decidedly against them, a system that has told them they are less than human for years, we ought to be reaching out to help them regain the humanity they lost, not when a few set fire to the buildings in Ferguson, but when they were born the wrong color in the post-racial America.

JUST DONT START THE RIOTING AT THE TIME OFFICE IN NEW YORK OR DC.

 

[possum123]

How is it possible to have an honest discussion when one side does not even know how to read?

 

[Sean Renaud]

It's very difficult but we'll manage.

 

[unregistered]

 

[kbate]

White flight was not a reaction to the presence of black people in the community.

It was a reaction to Liberal Democrat politicians and their proclivity to redistribution and program instead of focusing on staying out of the way of equal opportunity by the way of creating needless and false "opportunities."

So if you do not like what has happened in the cities, then blame the true culprit, the white self-righteous moral busybody that is the 60s era liberal who decided to put down his pipe bomb in order to infiltrate the colleges and and take over the leadership of the Democrat Party.

jesus fuck,

There's the single biggest bit of revisionist bullshite ever posted on this board.

 

[Jennifer]

jesus fuck,

There's the single biggest bit of revisionist bullshite ever posted on this board.

And that's saying a LOT.

 

[DooleyDarter]

jesus fuck,

There's the single biggest bit of revisionist bullshite ever posted on this board.

where the hell have you been the past 40 years?

 

[possum123]

It is sort of hard for me to understand how some people think.
Some actually think it is a crime for a cop to protect himself.
At the same time they think it is not a crime for a group of people to loot and burn the property of other people.
Their parents really have something to be proud of.

 

[Sean Renaud]

It is sort of hard for me to understand how some people think.
Some actually think it is a crime for a cop to protect himself.
At the same time they think it is not a crime for a group of people to loot and burn the property of other people.
Their parents really have something to be proud of.

Nobody thinks it's a crime for a cop to protect themselves. Nobody. What a lot of people think is that this sort of thing happens way too often to blacks and that it's not self defense.

Nobody thinks it isn't a crime for a group of people to loot and burn the property of others. We do however understand that people get frustrated especially when they don't feel they are being listened to.

I don't honestly see how you can look at the Founding Fathers with pride and be upset about this. . .unless the difference again comes down to skin. And it's not just them, we romanticize cowboys who were another group of terrorists and up through Al Capone.

 

[Joeybagadonuts]

Seriously, when? Obama promised an honest discussion during his 2008 run for the presidency. And Holder reiterated that sentiment during his nomination hearings. But has there been any open and honest discussions, not to my knowledge.

And by discussion I mean give and take, not a lecture by one side to the other. Not name calling when disagreements occur, and they will. Not shouting down the other side under the concept that over-talking and being loud carries the day.

I'll start;

The facts are that blacks are approx. 13% of the population but they commit close to 50% of all violent crimes and property crimes. The sole exception is rape in which their statistics are in line with their representation of the population. Over 93% of all black victims of murder were murdered by fellow blacks. And that victimization profile is true for all other violent crimes (except the aforementioned Rape). Bottom line is that overwhelmingly blacks are the victims of crime and those crimes were committed by fellow blacks.

The police know where the crime is taking place. Little push pins in maps on the wall have been replaced by GIS computer graphics, but they know. And they assign their resources accordingly. Is it any wonder that the police have a higher representation in black communities than in others? And it should go without saying that the higher the police presence, the higher the arrest rates.

And that begs the question, "Are the police victimizing the black community or are they protecting the victims of criminals?"

The police cannot fix the problems in the black communities, that fix has to come from within the community itself. The community can blame 'whitey' all they want but 'whitey' isn't forcing the black criminals to victimize their own. And poverty is no excuse for criminal behavior. There are far to many poverty stricken of all races and cultures that don't resort to criminal activity just because they're poor.

There is plenty of wrongs being perpetrated by the police out there and their victims come in all creeds and colors. Picking bogus causes and behaving in a criminal manner is not swaying popular opinion to anyone's cause. Make sure you have a real issue before you take to the streets.

OK, your turn.

Ishmael

and I'm still curious to know the reasons you believe that black men commit more violent crimes than any other other racial or ethnic group.

 

[Kitty]

and I'm still curious to know the reasons you believe that black men commit more violent crimes than any other other racial or ethnic group.

I'm still curious why he said that black people are the "only" ones who commit crime in impoverished communities.