Presented the opportunity....

[FurryFury]

That's so true. There are also what I'd call different levels of rape.

The way I was raped, by a man who I loved and meant it when I said no is very different from a violent rape or child rape.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

For those of you who said you would not want to watch such a thing, is it because you would feel so much empathy for the victim that the experience would be unbearable, almost as if you were being raped yourself?

<snip>

Do you feel that by watching the video, even though it had already happened, you would be in some way implicitly approving of the act?

I'm not interested in hurting someone that does not, on some level, enjoy being hurt.

I don't want to watch other people being hurt who don't consent to being hurt, either because they enjoy it or are being paid to pretend like they enjoy it.

And, in case it comes up later in the thread, put me down as "against drowning adorable puppies," too.

 

[insert____here]

no, i would not want to watch a real rape video.

the concept of walking into a room, not knowing what is going to happen, not being heard if i say no...but being there of my own free will...that arouses me. i'm not sure if i would do it though....

equally i would not watch if there was a video of another woman doing this. always i would question if she really really wanted out. and that is just plain horrifying to me.

true rape is not an act of submission on behalf of the victim. it's feeling something break way down deep where some people can never fix it. i would not want to watch that happen to anyone.

and yes, i always glance at an accident. for two reasons; is it someone i know? and can i possibly be useful (i have heavy duty first aid and site control training. had to use it a couple of times already)? once i've established no in both cases i stop looking.

 

[eastern sun]

Back in 1973, when I was eleven years old, I visited London with my mother, and was overwhelmed by the billboards of bloody accident victims who hadn't worn their seatbelts. Their faces, shattered and gaping, loomed above the skyline throughout the city. I couldn't stand what I was seeing, and I couldn't stop looking either.

The last few years, I read the stories of military gang-rape in Africa, in which the women who are still children are rejected by their families after the trauma of the rape itself.

I watch the video of the teenager being beaten to death in Chicago in the AOL headlines.

I am excited by what I see, like the kids who were there.

We are a brutal species.

 

[eastern sun]

would you want to watch a video of an actual rape?

Marquis, what are your feelings about videos or pictures of actual torture?

Have you taken a look at the Abu Ghraib photos?

Or the videos of stonings and beheadings?

 

[Netzach]

Depends on the victim. Women being raped doesn't do anything for me. Maybe it's empathy maybe it's actually a need for more stimulation and a lack of empathy. I've tried, really I have. It basically just dismays and semi-bores. Kind of like trying to sexualize the cheetah eating a baby gazelle or something. I know that tons of women get off on the lurid tabloid true crime thing, and I've decided I'm just an outlier on the bell curve.

Get me into a violent pulp western or something and I'm all over it though. Male violence, is the shit for me.

Woman gets raped = dog bites man.

Man gets raped = man bites dog.

I remember people being SO HORRIFIED at pulp fiction. And I'm sitting here going "this is actually fucking humorous to me and oddly hot, I must be missing something."

I also like footage of men beating the shit out of each other. Nonsexualized male violence = good times. And if it's boxing, guilt free.

So if it's some prison security cam of someone having ALL his sanctity violated, even if it was awful I'd probably watch, get off, and feel sort of bad about it. If I substitute Gitmo or Abu Ghraib for random chick being raped I can get into your "my dick is hard, my brain is horrified" kind of conflict.

I'm disinterested again by the time snuff rolls around in the question of torture. Death is a buzzkill for me, people talking about the "and there's something even they couldn't take away" moment is way better for me. Ah, reduced to that.

 

[ecstaticsub]

Eight months after being raped, a friend of mine drove her car into the forest, stuck a hose into the exhaust, and gassed herself. She wasn't found for two weeks, in spite of extensive searches by the police, her family, and her friends.

My friend was raped in a brutal and sustained attack by several men. She had just turned 20 and was attending a local musical festival when she wandered off from her friends in the early hours of the morning and was attacked. From her statement made to the police (which I have read), several men stood around and watched the entire event and did nothing - this was in spite of her screaming and crying and pleading. Nobody was charged with assault because she could not identify the men involved, she was drunk, and not a single person came forward as a witness.
She was one of the strongest, funniest, bravest people I knew at that age, and I watched this destroy her.

I think that if I ever heard that there was a video of the event in circulation (which is obviously unlikely given that this was a number of years ago), I would also suggest that the viewers had the opportunity watch "parts II and II of the series." I mean seeing her corpse being removed from the car and watching the funeral would be oh so titillating as well - would it not?.

There is a world of difference between reality and fantasy, and it scares me that the boundaries are so blurry for some.

I am so sorry about your friend. The fact that people stood around and watched and did nothing is sickening.

That fact is another reason (maybe the main reason) I would never watch a real rape video. For that video to have existed someone would have had to be holding a camera and doing nothing to help or participating. To then watch that video I feel would be condoning or even encouraging rape.

We have kids beating up other kids just to be able to put it up on youtube. I am sure there are rapists stupid enough to make videos of themselves or other committing this horrific crime just to show it off. We all know it has happened in date rape cases.

The thought that if my rape had happened today it could have been recorded and someone else could have watched it and gotten turned on or entertained???? WTF. It makes me sick.

 

[insert____here]

Marquis, what are your feelings about videos or pictures of actual torture?

Have you taken a look at the Abu Ghraib photos?

Or the videos of stonings and beheadings?

i once read a book about tortures throughout the ages. it didn't need pictures. if it had had any, it would have been banned.
i read the whole book with a horrified fascintation of just exactly what people are capable of doing to another human being and what another person would be willing to do to escape from the pain.
i wasn't aroused by it at all, just completely overwhelmed and couldn't put it down.
the depths to which we as humans can sink is truly unforgivable at times.

 

[Etoile]

I cannot answer until confronted with the situation. Which means I don't know now. Probably I would, but I don't know.

I can't watch suffering animals, but I read Dreamin' Demon regularly so it's "more okay" when it's not animals. I think the major reason I can't watch animals is that my heart breaks because they can't understand WHY something is being done to them. A human being attacked knows it's because the attacker is deranged and mentally ill. An animal just has no idea.

I cringe visibly when watching violence against women, but it doesn't horrify me and haunt me like it does with animals. I still can't forget an episode of Rescue Ink I watched for three minutes quite some time ago. But violence against women is less traumatic for me. (Less, not non.)

The scene in Irreversible didn't do a thing for me either way. It's probably close to what an actual rape would look like, I'm guessing. But it neither disgusted nor aroused me...just "eh."

 

[neci]

i have watched it in a non sexual setting. it does zero for me sexually to watch actual rape or torture - or view pictures - or hear stories. if anything it brings out the sadist in me, and i thoroughly visualize chopping someone's dick and balls off and throwing them away.

i love SVU and Criminal Minds. i think i am pretty desensitized when it comes to violent crime and abuse, and it takes a lot to get under my skin.

what pisses me off about rape videos is that by watching the video, you essentially rape the victim again and again. in the vast majority of cases, the victim does NOT put the video out for consumption. in my opinion, by watching it, the viewer participates in the further dehumanization and abuse of the rape victim.

 

[InternetAlias]

For those of you who said you would watch the video, is it more because of a morbid curiosity or because you think you'd be turned on by it? Do you feel that by watching the video, even though it had already happened, you would be in some way implicitly approving of the act?

If I did end up watching anything: Morbid curiosity, 100%

I can say with certainty that I wouldn't feel like I was "implicitly approving" of it... just because I see something doesn't mean I agree with it, implicitly or otherwise. On the other hand I would possibly feel "guilty" for seeing it, as if it almost made it happen, made it more real - this is kind of an abstract thought process though.

The scene in Irreversible didn't do a thing for me either way. It's probably close to what an actual rape would look like, I'm guessing. But it neither disgusted nor aroused me...just "eh."

Really? I've come across predominantly "negative" reactions from that with the odd disturbingly postive reaction, but never ambivalent.

In terms of cinema there's not much out there that really disturbs me, and that film manages it on repeat occasions. Disgust is certainly not the word I'd use for what I consider to be a powerful scene in a reasonably good film though. There's several films out there with infamous rape scenes, but that's the only one I've seen that's made me uncomfortable, mainly because it's not glorified in either the way it's shot or acted, and it goes on far too long. It's not fun, it is interesting, but at least it's fiction.

 

[coquettish]

Absolutley not. I couldn't sit through "The Cell" without having an anxiety reaction. I can't watch some episodes of SVU or CSI for the same reason. Ditto Saw and it's ilk. And they are fiction, albeit based on reality fiction. Nuh-uh.

 

[azyae]

hmmmm, no wouldn't watch it. forced nonconsensual rape does not do it for me at all. now if presented with it as a link, not knowing what it was, turning it on would i turn it off immediately, no idea hasn't happened and hope it doesn't. i do however have rape fantasies of my own, many actually of varying degrees....i should write them out.

 

[nh23]

Although I had to admit this, I'd watch it. Porn to me is Natural Born Killers. I have a pretty big violence fetish. And before anyone yells I'm a survivor of many years of sexual abuse, so I know what it feels like to be in that position. It doesn't change how my body and mind react to certain things though, whether I want them to or not.

 

[rida]

I'm a whimp.
I cannot watch sadistic violent scene in movies, whether sexual or otherwise without being unable to take them off my mind. That one scene from Seven still hunts me, because even thou I closed my eyes, the sound was still on ...

Part of me would want to watch thou (with the sound off. I could not handle the sounds of screaming and crying ...). And at the same time I'd feel horrified about watching, and would probably focus my attention on the people's faces, trying to read what's going on in their mind. Sort of turning it into a psychology study.

I don't think it would turn me on.

And I would hold on to the hope that because the video is around, the culprits got what they deserved (AKA they got recognizes, and convicted).

 

[StrayKat]

There is a world of difference between reality and fantasy, and it scares me that the boundaries are so blurry for some.

Seriously, its scary.
I can only assume it comes from comfortable, pampered living without any kind of real danger. Some people have no idea what life outside of their safe little world can actually look like.

 

[eastern sun]

Seriously, its scary.
I can only assume it comes from comfortable, pampered living without any kind of real danger. Some people have no idea what life outside of their safe little world can actually look like.

You do have a sadistic streak, StrayKat. Be careful in your assumptions.

 

[Kajira Callista]

Seriously, its scary.
I can only assume it comes from comfortable, pampered living without any kind of real danger. Some people have no idea what life outside of their safe little world can actually look like.

Or maybe from surviving horrible things and know you can do that. Please don't assume things like that. If the shoe was on the other foot I'm betting you wouldn' t care for the feeling it produces.

 

[StrayKat]

You do have a sadistic streak, StrayKat. Be careful in your assumptions.

Oh yes I do, sometimes more than I would care for
Its not always easy to curb it either.

So what would you say, why some people cant really tell the difference?

Or maybe from surviving horrible things and know you can do that. Please don't assume things like that. If the shoe was on the other foot I'm betting you wouldn' t care for the feeling it produces.

So surviving horrible things, like having your life jeopardized, or even worse having the lives and sanity of those you love jeopardized blurs ones perspective to the point of wanting those horrible things to happen again?
Or maybe I missed your point?

If you think having vague or no boundaries between fantasy and reality is good thing, well we differ in opinion but I can respect yours.

 

[Kajira Callista]

Oh yes I do, sometimes more than I would care for
Its not always easy to curb it either.

So what would you say, why some people cant really tell the difference?



So surviving horrible things, like having your life jeopardized, or even worse having the lives and sanity of those you love jeopardized blurs ones perspective to the point of wanting those horrible things to happen again?
Or maybe I missed your point?

If you think having vague or no boundaries between fantasy and reality is good thing, well we differ in opinion but I can respect yours.

Nothing i my life is blurred nor vague. In order to understand someones point, sometimes you need to actually listen to what they are saying rather then adding an undertone of your opinion to their words.
I don't do the online bicker thing so if thats what you are fishing for you won't get it here. Sorry.

 

[StrayKat]

Nothing i my life is blurred nor vague. In order to understand someones point, sometimes you need to actually listen to what they are saying rather then adding an undertone of your opinion to their words.
I don't do the online bicker thing so if thats what you are fishing for you won't get it here. Sorry.

I am not "fishing" for anything, I am stating my opinion just like you or anyone else. If it bothers you, you are welcomed to ignore me.

What I see here is not myself in certain situation but other women that have gone through rape that ruined their lives. Just as my own fears for my children.
I have two daughters. If something like that would happen to them and someone made a video from it, I would have zero understanding for anyone watching that video for enjoyment purposes, or if you wish, wanking.

Sorry, I am only human and I can see things from other people perspective only so far.

 

[Netzach]

Seriously, its scary.
I can only assume it comes from comfortable, pampered living without any kind of real danger. Some people have no idea what life outside of their safe little world can actually look like.

Anyone who's been slapped up in a relationship some could say the same thing about every single person on this board. Being aroused by something has nothing to do with your sense of boundaries between fantasy and reality. What you DO with your arousal does.

 

[StrayKat]

Anyone who's been slapped up in a relationship some could say the same thing about every single person on this board. Being aroused by something has nothing to do with your sense of boundaries between fantasy and reality. What you DO with your arousal does.

I was answering to:

There is a world of difference between reality and fantasy, and it scares me that the boundaries are so blurry for some.

There are people that cross those boundaries because they have trouble seeing the difference. And then they hurt someone badly with their arousal.
That is the kind I was referring to. Blurring the boundaries can lead to crossing them.
I am not judging the arousal per se, I admit I dont understand it but I am not judging it. I can only imagine myself in situation where I could react violently at it, but thats my personal problem. What I am judging is how far some people can go in mixing fantasy and reality - and I was saying my opinion on where it comes from.

 

[Etoile]

Really? I've come across predominantly "negative" reactions from that with the odd disturbingly postive reaction, but never ambivalent.

In terms of cinema there's not much out there that really disturbs me, and that film manages it on repeat occasions. Disgust is certainly not the word I'd use for what I consider to be a powerful scene in a reasonably good film though. There's several films out there with infamous rape scenes, but that's the only one I've seen that's made me uncomfortable, mainly because it's not glorified in either the way it's shot or acted, and it goes on far too long. It's not fun, it is interesting, but at least it's fiction.

I haven't seen the whole movie, but I am definitely ambivalent about the rape scene. It doesn't make me uncomfortable, and it doesn't turn me on. It's just there.

 

[Netzach]

I was answering to:



There are people that cross those boundaries because they have trouble seeing the difference. And then they hurt someone badly with their arousal.
That is the kind I was referring to. Blurring the boundaries can lead to crossing them.
I am not judging the arousal per se, I admit I dont understand it but I am not judging it. I can only imagine myself in situation where I could react violently at it, but thats my personal problem. What I am judging is how far some people can go in mixing fantasy and reality - and I was saying my opinion on where it comes from.

It's true. Blurring the boundaries between fantasy and reality can hurt and even kill, but it hasn't lead us to ban religion yet, only most types of fetish imagery in the UK. Can you give me an example where any other kind of crime is subject to punishment prior to it happening?

It has led to people being imprisoned in my own state who did nothing but mix horror and porn genres - films made with special effects and adult actors with their ID's on file the way the law requires. Absolutely disturbing and fucked up shit from the way I've had it told to me, but done with makeup, convincing screams and a grasp of internal anatomy in the special effects.

The people blurring the two the most are the people creating thoughtcrimes. The people equating porn and rape in the 80's. To me, that's a slap in the face to anyone who has actually experienced rape.

You don't have to film a rape to get thrown in jail - in fact you're more likely to by filming something that makes most people uncomfortable sexually - versus being Roman Polanski and assraping 13 year olds. But it feels GOOD to punish someone for selling her nasty panties or making scat porn or some fringe behavior, and it feels BAD to have Whoopi and Tilda Swinton upset for arresting their Very Important Icon. It's so much easier to get upset over an image of a thing than the thing itself, violence on TV versus the violence outside the damn door.