Muslims

[smoothg103rd]

Why do everyone here bash Muslims? Do you realize that Islam is a religion of peace? I don't have a religion, but if I did I would take my shahada. And to me the way they live makes more sense than Christians. As I said I'm not a religious person but it seems to me that the Masjid is more faithful than a Church. Just my opinion

 

[Que]

Interesting gambit.

The book may preach peace but lately it seems a lot of those in those mid-east that teach the book seem to justify a lot of <less than peaceful> missionary techniques. I don't know much at all about how the American Black Muslim movement allies itself with some of the mid-east versions.

I have no idea if their teachings are closer to sunni, then shia or the reverse.

I also just have a minimal understanding as to why shias and sunnis find it so important that everyone follow their particular version.

The only Muslim I know is from the Sudan. He seems neither heavily religious, nor concerned at all about the beliefs of others.

 

[John Doe]

We don't all do that.

 

[Libsam]

the first 4 pillars of the religion are cool, but the others after that are kind of scary.

Also, I just learned the definition of taqiyya (Think I spelled that right).
It's not a cool word, man.

 

[Sean Renaud]

the first 4 pillars of the religion are cool, but the others after that are kind of scary.

Also, I just learned the definition of taqiyya (Think I spelled that right).
It's not a cool word, man.

It's basically "Don't commit suicide like an idiot." Most religions may not flat out say it but it's usually part of common fucking sense.

 

[smoothg103rd]

Muslim was the religion of my people. Slaves was Muslim how I see as if it was there religion than it should be mines, if I decide to have one. I think the teaching is more sunni if I'm not mistaken. CHRISTIANS are hypocrites and I don't like that. Islam is the most faithful religion. Making salaat ramanda I like it.

 

[Libsam]

It's basically "Don't commit suicide like an idiot." Most religions may not flat out say it but it's usually part of common fucking sense.

I was under the impression that it meant Muslims were allowed to lie to non-believers.

 

[smoothg103rd]

the first 4 pillars of the religion are cool, but the others after that are kind of scary.

Also, I just learned the definition of taqiyya (Think I spelled that right).
It's not a cool word, man.

What pillars are ? I believe it's only five. So you are talking about the last one?

 

[Sean Renaud]

I was under the impression that it meant Muslims were allowed to lie to non-believers.

Nope. It means that Muslims are allowed (and to some degree encouraged) to lie, specifically about their religion, when they are in a situation where they are being persecuted.

In short, if saying you're a Muslim is going to get you marched off to the gas chamber you're supposed to grab a cross, say your hail Marys and live to see another day.

 

[Que]

Muslim was the religion of my people. Slaves was Muslim how I see as if it was there religion than it should be mines, if I decide to have one. I think the teaching is more sunni if I'm not mistaken. CHRISTIANS are hypocrites and I don't like that. Islam is the most faithful religion. Making salaat ramanda I like it.

What I know of the muslim faith is that it tends to be fairly "pure" in the sense that there are guidelines, its been handed down for centuries and it makes for an orderly society when it is followed

Christianity has so many flavors that it is like you are talking about nothing at all. If any particular aspect of Christianity doesn't appeal to you, there is a pastor that will tell you exactly what you want to hear.

You afraid of catching the gay? There is a pastor for you out there.

Already caught the gay and want to be told the bible didn't really mean it? There's a different pastor for you.

There are a few principles that make universal sense. Do unto others as you want done makes sense to me. I am sure there is a corresponding precept in Islam, Judaism, Wicca, whatever.

If I felt it a worthy exercise, I could probably come up with a half a dozen things that everyone agrees. I could then start my own religion. My Dad's sister did that, more or less. She had a doctorate in Psychology, and was an ordained minister of some stripe and took a counseling practice and built a church out of it. She had books and followers. I dunno what they did about all that after she passed.

 

[Libsam]

What pillars are ? I believe it's only five. So you are talking about the last one?

Oops, my bad, I meant to say 5, the first 5 pillars. Anyways, after 5 some sects take it to 11 pillars. Those last 6 are just different ways of saying "kill the infidels"

 

[Que]

Nope. It means that Muslims are allowed (and to some degree encouraged) to lie, specifically about their religion, when they are in a situation where they are being persecuted.

In short, if saying you're a Muslim is going to get you marched off to the gas chamber you're supposed to grab a cross, say your hail Marys and live to see another day.

I think the interpretation is stretched a little bit further than that these days. My understanding is most clerics will say that any subterfuge is acceptable, if the intent is to further the work and glory of Allah. I don't know that I disagree on principle. At least it is intellectually consistent.

If there is a God and His name is Allah, then Allah gets to decide if any penalty attaches to any dissembling. If the intent of the trickster is to praise Allah, why would Allah be punitive about that?

I think Christians have their own version of that. It's OK to hurt my neighbors feelings (violating love thy neighbor as thyself) as long as you are doing it to "save" their immortal soul.

 

[smoothg103rd]

What I know of the muslim faith is that it tends to be fairly "pure" in the sense that there are guidelines, its been handed down for centuries and it makes for an orderly society when it is followed

Christianity has so many flavors that it is like you are talking about nothing at all. If any particular aspect of Christianity doesn't appeal to you, there is a pastor that will tell you exactly what you want to hear.

You afraid of catching the gay? There is a pastor for you out there.

Already caught the gay and want to be told the bible didn't really mean it? There's a different pastor for you.

There are a few principles that make universal sense. Do unto others as you want done makes sense to me. I am sure there is a corresponding precept in Islam, Judaism, Wicca, whatever.

If I felt it a worthy exercise, I could probably come up with a half a dozen things that everyone agrees. I could then start my own religion. My Dad's sister did that, more or less. She had a doctorate in Psychology, and was an ordained minister of some stripe and took a counseling practice and built a church out of it. She had books and followers. I dunno what they did about all that after she passed.

And that's the reason why I don't have a religion, its like a million out here. How you know the one you following is the correct one? I believe in what I see and I wasn't living when the prophet was ( so called) walking the earth. But islam make the most sense to me and was the religion of my ancestors. So if I had to choose it will be it. My father Muslim one of my babymothers is Muslim and a couple of my friends and family. They might not be on their dean but its their religion. And what they explain to me make sense

 

[Sean Renaud]

I think the interpretation is stretched a little bit further than that these days. My understanding is most clerics will say that any subterfuge is acceptable, if the intent is to further the work and glory of Allah. I don't know that I disagree on principle. At least it is intellectually consistent.

If there is a God and His name is Allah, then Allah gets to decide if any penalty attaches to any dissembling. If the intent of the trickster is to praise Allah, why would Allah be punitive about that?

I think Christians have their own version of that. It's OK to hurt my neighbors feelings (violating love thy neighbor as thyself) as long as you are doing it to "save" their immortal soul.

I'm sure there are cases where it is. However it seems like the majority of of Muslims are fairly open and honest about their goals. It is one of things that I do "admire" about them. As you more eloquently put Christians basically logic their way around everything. I think it's because the majority of Christians are really agnostic or atheist and lack the courage to admit it or feel they need the social structure that religion provides.

I think that most Christians are Christian in name only. There are true believers and they may or may not believe it's okay to hurt your neighbor as long as your saving them. But that's thinking long term and if I honestly thought that my hurting someone I cared about in the short term would help them in the long term I'd do it too.

I think however that the whole lover the sinner hate the sin is thinly vieled BS and hardly anybody does it.

 

[John Doe]

And that's the reason why I don't have a religion, its like a million out here. How you know the one you following is the correct one? I believe in what I see and I wasn't living when the prophet was ( so called) walking the earth. But islam make the most sense to me and was the religion of my ancestors. So if I had to choose it will be it. My father Muslim one of my babymothers is Muslim and a couple of my friends and family. They might not be on their dean but its their religion. And what they explain to me make sense

What makes a religion the "correct" one?

 

[smoothg103rd]

What makes a religion the "correct" one?

The only one

 

[John Doe]

The only one

The only one for what?

 

[smoothg103rd]

The only one for what?

We would never know the truth. Every religious book was man made, and we all know how much men lie. I just can't put my faith in something I never witness. What's your religion?

 

[Que]

I'm sure there are cases where it is. However it seems like the majority of of Muslims are fairly open and honest about their goals. It is one of things that I do "admire" about them. As you more eloquently put Christians basically logic their way around everything. I think it's because the majority of Christians are really agnostic or atheist and lack the courage to admit it or feel they need the social structure that religion provides.

That is amazingly astute. Most people that I run into that don't happen to believe in it to any degree, would not understand the brilliance of what you just wrote.

I had a conversation with my wife years ago. She grew up outside of religion joined, fell away from it, met me, rejoined. I would say in all honesty my faith was (is?) based on fear. It doesn't feel empowering that way. I know christens who have faith based on love and I respect them. I had an angry god style dad and have trouble picturing a loving god.

So I was having a crisis of faith one time when this conversation happened. I was reaching agnostic. The reasons don;t matter. I expressed some fear that I was losing faith, she explained (correctly I think) that actual faith requires that you have the integrity to be able to have doubt.

I think that most Christians are Christian in name only. There are true believers and they may or may not believe it's okay to hurt your neighbor as long as your saving them. But that's thinking long term and if I honestly thought that my hurting someone I cared about in the short term would help them in the long term I'd do it too.

There's the rub. There are principles taught in the Christian Faiths (and really most religions) that I truly believe would benefit my children to follow. People that manage to follow a Christian faith with love and joy tend to lead happy productive lives.

The flip side is that it tends to be polarizing. If you think black and white, sin and righteousness...you set yourself up for some vicious negative spirals of self-doubt when you don't "measure up" to impossibly high standards.

I think however that the whole lover the sinner hate the sin is thinly veiled BS and hardly anybody does it.

Again, well said. Sounds like you are intimately familiar with the community. A lot of critics of religion fail to impress me because they obviously don't know the first thing about doctrine or culture. Easy for them to throw rocks from the outside when their ignorance is complete.

I think however that the whole lover the sinner hate the sin is thinly veiled BS and hardly anybody does it.

I have been privileged to know a few inspiring people that can do just that, and they are exceptionally rare. I have noticed they do this by loving the sinner and keeping their concerns about the sin to themselves.

 

[Que]

We would never know the truth. Every religious book was man made, and we all know how much men lie. I just can't put my faith in something I never witness. What's your religion?

Faith is just that, faith. It is choosing to believe in something you cannot witness.

My take on it is that if there is a God, he would speak to every individual culture in the language and traditions of that people. So it makes sense that different cultures perceive him differently.

So what to do when cultures intersect, and the misinterpretations cause conflict?

Seems to me God should be the one to sort that out.

Just as Christ talked to Peter and Allah to Mohamed, and god inspired the Hindu and the Buddhists...why wouldn't he speak to your own heart, in a way that makes sense to you? You are no less valuable to Him than a guy named Mohammed that honestly sought him.

 

[toubab]

Muslim was the religion of my people. Slaves was Muslim how I see as if it was there religion than it should be mines, if I decide to have one. I think the teaching is more sunni if I'm not mistaken. CHRISTIANS are hypocrites and I don't like that. Islam is the most faithful religion. Making salaat ramanda I like it.

Smoove, if you actually believe all that you should take a little time to research the Arab slave trade, which predates Islam, and then the subject of slavery in Islam. Chances are some of your ancestors, if not all, were sold into slavery by Muslims, if you are a descendant of American slaves.

 

[smoothg103rd]

Smoove, if you actually believe all that you should take a little time to research the Arab slave trade, which predates Islam, and then the subject of slavery in Islam. Chances are some of your ancestors, if not all, were sold into slavery by Muslims, if you are a descendant of American slaves.

Majority of my ancestors was Muslim. Majority of the people in Africa are Muslims

 

[duranman]

Why do everyone here bash Muslims? Do you realize that Islam is a religion of peace? I don't have a religion, but if I did I would take my shahada. And to me the way they live makes more sense than Christians. As I said I'm not a religious person but it seems to me that the Masjid is more faithful than a Church. Just my opinion

Good points. But fuck me they're ugly bastards. Like ALL of them...

 

[smoothg103rd]

Faith is just that, faith. It is choosing to believe in something you cannot witness.

My take on it is that if there is a God, he would speak to every individual culture in the language and traditions of that people. So it makes sense that different cultures perceive him differently.

So what to do when cultures intersect, and the misinterpretations cause conflict?

Seems to me God should be the one to sort that out.

Just as Christ talked to Peter and Allah to Mohamed, and god inspired the Hindu and the Buddhists...why wouldn't he speak to your own heart, in a way that makes sense to you? You are no less valuable to Him than a guy named Mohammed that honestly sought him.

Makes sense but I how God is portrayed I don't think he would do that. Many religious means many wars , much hate and little peace. People hate what they cannot understand. Difference point of views cause hate. And I don't think God would cause hate.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

On tv the other day I watched Muslims put a woman in a pit and stone her to death, that's Islam in a nutshell. Wherever Muslims are is a cluster-fuck of violence, poverty, and ignorance. Niggers are naturally attracted to it.