Love and Sexuality: can they be mutually exclusive?

[alexandraaah]

Hey friendly pervs, draaah has a question. I have a very close friend (yeah yeah, it's me, but seriously it's not) and he's fallen for this amazing woman.

Now, for all intents and purposes, he's a straight man. He's dated women exclusively, and has had two experimental encounters with men for kicks.

The concern/question/discussion: he's in love with this woman, yet he's turned on by the thought of men. He's not interested in dating, falling in love with, or waking up to a man everyday...just in the sexual fantasy department.

He's feeling tremendous guilt about this, as he feels she should be the one who's "getting him off."

Here's a paraphrasing of what he just said to me to make his confusion clearer to you:


"I guess part of the thing that is causing me so much guilt and confusion is that guys have taken up the bulk of my fantasy life. How does that play into the whole thing? Shouldn't I be in total lusty drive over this girl I'm supposedly in love with?"

Thoughts, anyone?

 

[ExLimey]

Hijack

Hey, long time no see! How's things?

 

[Hamletmaschine]

What's confusing him? The fact that he lusts after someone besides the person he loves, or that fact that the object of his desire is another man?

If it's the former, tell him he'll get used to it when he's 40 and divorced twice.

If it's the latter, tell him to join the Baptist Church.

 

[alexandraaah]

Hijack

Hey, long time no see! How's things?

Hey sweets! Nice to see you, too.

Now answer the question, fuckers.

 

[alexandraaah]

What's confusing him? The fact that he lusts after someone besides the person he loves, or that fact that the object of his desire is another man?

If it's the former, tell him he'll get used to it when he's 40 and divorced twice.

If it's the latter, tell him to join the Baptist Church.

You suck, Hamlet.

But you're still really sexy.

Now tell me, how would you feel, if it were you?

 

[perks]

that's a tough one.

I only know from my perspective, which is my fantasies involve men and women, although mostly women, and I've never been with someone physically that I was completely in love with.
I never expected one person to be my all in the sexual/ love/ lust category.

I would investigate to find out why he feels the guilt. Is it because of how he was taught things are supposed to be? If the fantasy is healthy and embraced by his partner, then why is there guilt?

I guess what I'm saying, is that, there isn't a problem in the fantasy, but in the guilt department. If he's feeling guilty, then he has a problem with it. Either he needs to accept that he thinks that way, or follow the path of what he supposes he is to do.

However, in the long run, I don't know how the fantasies will play out if you choose to be monogamous. I've not experienced that, and could only speculate.

 

[alexandraaah]

However, in the long run, I don't know how the fantasies will play out if you choose to be monogamous. I've not experienced that, and could only speculate.

Thanks perks, great post.

Question: do you think your partner/lover/spouse should know each fantasy that you are experiencing?

Is it some breach of trust if you don't share?

 

[ExLimey]

Has he had the opportunity to partake of this woman? If not, I think maybe once he does she will become the fantasy and surplant the other.


Is it that he feels you should be consumed with everything for the one you're with, but he feels like he's betraying her somehow because he still holds fantasies about others!!??

I think ultimately his actions should speak more than his thoughts.

I don't know, ask me if/when I'm in this situation.

PS - PM on the way.

 

[KillerMuffin]

Love and sexuality can be mutually exclusive. Bisexual people exist. They're turned on by both sexes. In today's monogamy by law society, you have to pick one to hook up with. Unless you've found a hermaphrodite, you're going to be sexually attracted to someone who does not have the plumbing that turns you on a percentage of the time.

I look at it this way. El Stud-O is married to me. He loves me. He looks at other women. They turn him on. No different.

 

[Lasher]

Hey, Draaah, this one is pretty simple.

Everyone has fantasies. It would be great if every fantasy you had could be fulfilled by your one and only partner. But that's not really realistic, don't you think?

Have fantasies should be a healthy thing... Maybe the guilt is coming from his fear of sharing this with his partner? Not so much having the fantasy but fearing that it will come out?

It's also interesting that the same fantasy with the genders reversed is almost universally accepted as a good thing. Every man (including myself, lol) loves the idea of two girls together - and the idea of your partner sharing that with you is pretty incredible, lol. Maybe he should try bringing his fantasy out in the open a little. Who knows what could happen?

 

[alexandraaah]

Love and sexuality can be mutually exclusive. Bisexual people exist. They're turned on by both sexes. In today's monogamy by law society, you have to pick one to hook up with. Unless you've found a hermaphrodite, you're going to be sexually attracted to someone who does not have the plumbing that turns you on a percentage of the time.

I look at it this way. El Stud-O is married to me. He loves me. He looks at other women. They turn him on. No different.

Difference is, it's the men that are turning him on-in his mind. He's really conflicted about this and wondering about his sexuality.

He doesn't feel gay, except for the fantasies.

Hrm...what gives?

 

[perks]

Thanks perks, great post.

Question: do you think your partner/lover/spouse should know each fantasy that you are experiencing?

Is it some breach of trust if you don't share?

well again, I only know from my perspective.

I think you know when it is a breach of trust and when it isn't.

If you've decided to share all and every fantasy between the two of you, and you don't, then sure it is.

But I don't think that is the case in most relationships. We all have thoughts, fantasies. I don't think you need to betray yourself in order to be monogamous.

Monagamy is a conscious act, not an unconscious one.

I think the thing that most people have issue with, is they think there is this cookie cutter shape of what a relationship should be. It should be between a man and a woman and they should love only each other and think only of each other. I don't buy that.

A relationship is what you two make it together, and if that entails sharing homosexual fantasies, or playing pinball, it's still what the two of you make it. It's not anyone else's rules.

The guilt is when you put other people's standards into your relationship. There shouldn't be any expectations in a relationship, until you both figure out what the rules are. Not for everyone else, but for the two of you.

 

[alexandraaah]

Maybe he should try bringing his fantasy out in the open a little. Who knows what could happen?

He has and she's been really understanding from a sexuality perspective, as she's gone through some similar feelings.

However, he's burdening himself with guilt that she's wholly turned on by him, but he's not wholly turned on by her, just for the mere fact that she's a woman.

 

[Olivianna]

No, KM, I beg to differ. The problem stated by Alex is that the guy is primarily turned on by men. It is different from your example, in which your Muffin is turned on by women other than you. If a man found that he was almost exclusively attracted to men, then I would assume he was homosexual.

As for question #2: Depends on what kind of relationship you're in - that is, whether you are in one in which you feel comfortable expressing such things openly. However, if a man was withholding the fact of his very gay leanings from his partner/spouse (assuming this partner/spouse was a woman ) then I would say that he was being distrustful.

 

[WaxNWane]

Love & sexuality, sure.

Love & intimacy, nope.

 

[alexandraaah]

Love & sexuality, sure.

Love & intimacy, nope.

Please expand, oh elusive one.

 

[Hamletmaschine]

You suck, Hamlet.

But you're still really sexy.

Now tell me, how would you feel, if it were you?

What you say is true. But I can live with that.

If it were me, I would not be too concerned. If I were still a kid, though, I'd be all fucked up by it.

 

[alexandraaah]

What you say is true. But I can live with that.

If it were me, I would not be too concerned. If I were still a kid, though, I'd be all fucked up by it.

Hmm...define kid; he's rounding the corner on 30. 28, to be exact.

 

[KillerMuffin]

I didn't read it as "primarily turned on by men," Olivianna. I read it as a man who is turned on at least equally be men as women, if not then less than. She identified him as a straight man who has had male encounters and is turned on by his woman, and disturbed because she doesn't exclusively do it for him.


There's really nothing that I can think of that will help a man with that other than time and working it out with his lady.

 

[Olivianna]

Yeah, KM. I see what you mean, having just read the post over again. It's kind of confusing actually - it isn't really clear whether this is a "bulk of his fantasy life" kind of a thing or what. Perhaps he should consider why it is that he isn't very sexually attracted to this particular woman. Maybe it has less to do with fantasies about men than about his lack of attraction to her. I suggest he write Dan Savage about his problem - then he'll get the straight dope.

 

[Image]

Missing the point...

I have always been one to be able to separate love and romance, from raw, uninhibited sex. It may be selfish.... but I really can see his dilemma. I am not sure what the psychology is but I am certain the difference exists.
When it comes to day to day romance, the things that make my heart flutter, I want a man.... But my dirty little secret that no one knows is in the heat of the moment, right before I cum, I picture my face buried between the thighs of a beautiful woman... Go figure...
But each facet, I'm sure, he feels deeply... it's not an "either or" question....

 

[alexandraaah]

I didn't read it as "primarily turned on by men," Olivianna. I read it as a man who is turned on at least equally be men as women, if not then less than. She identified him as a straight man who has had male encounters and is turned on by his woman, and disturbed because she doesn't exclusively do it for him.


There's really nothing that I can think of that will help a man with that other than time and working it out with his lady.

That's just it Muff; he's turned on almost exclusively (as of late) by men in his head but not in reality.

I agree with Olivianna in that it's more socially accepted for women to have such feelings, which is perhaps why we don't struggle with this as much.

Part of it also, is that due to one encounter (with his lady) where he became frustrated with this whole situation, he's sort of perseverating on the whole issue and, in some ways, making it worse.

 

[alexandraaah]

I suggest he write Dan Savage about his problem - then he'll get the straight dope.

God, that's funny. He was just consulting Savage Love earlier today.

 

[A Desert Rose]

I have read this entire thread. I have absolutely nothing to add, because it is a subject I am very ignorant about, but it has been interesting reading others opinions and ideas on this topic.

 

[alexandraaah]

Okee, I have an addendum sort of question:

MEN: what would your concerns be, if any, if this was you?

WOMEN: what would your concerns be, if any, if this was your love?