In this place, we are all equals, dammit.

[cymbidia]

I am just myself.

I am wrong, just as you are wrong, sometimes, about some things. I'm right about some things, too, just like you.

I am certainly not some kinda voice of... of... something, issuing edicts from on high.

The thought that anyone at all could view me in such a light, even a little, scares me. I post my feelings and thoughts and experiences and desires and needs here - just like anyone. I am no more or no less responsible for this place, these threads, the wisdom and laughter and questions we've gathered here in a last couple of days than are you.

Don't put me in any kinda different place than that, please.

If you think i'm wrong, disagree. I would, to you. I have, to you. I will again, to you. I don't get to do it if you don't. Either we all are free to speak our minds and our truths or none of us are. Either this is a place where we all can learn and grow and benefit from the wisdom of the others, or it is a sham and an example of overweening hubris on my part.

If we're all not approximate equals here, then this place will wither and die. This place cannot stand the control of one Supreme Dominant. We have three moderators, guys, a Dominant, a Switch, and a submissive. That was done deliberately.



"Okay, okay, okay!" you say, "what the fuck are you ranting about now, b?"

Well, i got a PM this morning from one of us, a person with lots of experience and the possessor of charm and knowledge and a ready supply of really useful stuff to add to our collective storehouse of info.

This person disagreed, violently, wildly, immediately, with assertions i'd made in one of my posts, but didn't want to post so in public, didn't want to... i am not sure...

Didn't feel enabled?

I feel kinda sick that anyone coming here would feel disinclined to speak their truth and invite all of you, now and forever, to do so readily.

If it hurts felings, we'll work through it.

There's a huge enormous difference between flaming someone and speaking your truth.

We won't do flames here, okay?
We will speak our truth.

some times our truth won't match the truth that others hold. So be it. There can be many people who are right in any given matter. Hardly ever is there a situation, and *especially* in the kinds of things we talk about, where there's only one way of being right and all the rest of the ways of being are wrong.

Speak your truth.
Don't flame, but disagree if you must, if you need to, so your truth can be heard and discussed.

It doesn't matter who you're disagreeing with - we all grow from the discussion of topics and ideas that were previously just kicking round in our heads, unchallenged and bereft of stimulus.


I ask that person who sent me the PM to please post to the thread that was passed over. Post your truth. Let's all talk about it.

You could be right.
I could be wrong.

You could be right for some people and i could be right for some people.

You could be right for *me*, after i think about it and talk about it and listen to your reasoning.

Don't gag yourself on my account.
None of you.
Please.
b.

 

[JazzManJim]

cym,
I've seen posts from you similar to this and I finally wanted to weigh in on the whole subject.

You are, in my experience, one of the most knowledgeble people on the subject of BDSM I've ever met. I've been involved in BDSM chats, talking to folks in the lifestyle, and doing my required reading for gonig on six or seven years now and you're near the very top of the list. You have insights that you've been unafraid, in general, to share. When you speak on the subject I'm more inclined to listen to you than a lot of others, based on yoru knowledge and experience. Whether you like it or not, you're going to be considered an expert on the subject.

I prefer your speaking up on things, even if I disagree with you, which I have in the past. I've not posted my disagreements, because in the areas where we've disagreed I've either been significantly less knowledgeble than you on the area and would have merely been posting unsubstantiated belief or didn't believe that my disagreement would bring anything particularly useful to the table. Pretty much, when I don't post (and that's a rare thing, innit it?), it's because of one of those two reasons I mentioned, on any topic.

I whole heartedly agree with you that anyone who wants to say something should perk up and do it. I also think that we should hold back the flaming brands for a while, until we get this forum up and running well, and until a justifiable idiot shows up. It's only a matter of time. On the other hand, I'd rather not see you apologize for other folks' perceptions of you. You've earned your expertise and your voice of authority on a lot of subjects, this one being perhaps the greatest. I hear what you're saying about this, but I don't think an apology from you, in any form, was warranted. You're doing a good thing here (well, many are doing a good thing, but I doubt it would have gotten started without your kicking it in the rear!) and you should be well and truly proud of it. What others think of you, or think of their opinions is unfortunate sometimes and I wish more folks would bring their well-considered opinions to the table.

Hell, I'm rambling now. In a nutshell...keep posting the way you always have, cym, and don't apologize for the wisdom and knowledge that your experience and research has brought you. And for everyone else, just post your stuff. We want to hear it. That's why we're all here, right?

 

[riff]

I hope it wasn't me with my "elite squad" crack in the lifestyle, fetish, kink thread.

I am reassured by your plea that in this place we are all equals. Being unfamiliar with the furniture of BDSM, I naturally feel less equal. I know what I know (my own tastes and preferences tot he extent that I have explored them), but I am not hip on everything.

I enjoy learning. Creating an open and unintimidating environment is very important!

 

[cymbidia]

Jimmie, thank you. You're both kind and wise.. and reassuring.

I feel as if i walk a fine line here, as i always did in the Monster, between being a participant in the discussions like any other participant and filling something akin to a shepards role with regard to insuring all the new little sheep get rounded up to have thier questions answered adequately. I don't want to be overbearing (gods no!) but i do want to participate in discussions, too. I definitely don't want to be someone with whom others don't feel they can disagree in public.

At the same time, i do have a lot more practical experience with all this than many. I know that and so do you. That doesn't make me better at it, or a deeper thinker about it, or more qualified, or any of that - but it does give me an edge when talking about some of this if only cuz i've been doing anmd thinking about it for so long.

It's a bit of an uncomfy line to walk, for me. It always has been, too, even from the very beginning of the Monster thread.

Poke me when i get weird about it, okay?
That'd work best for us all.



And Riff?
Relax. It definitely wasn't your post.
Actually, i'm quite amazed and proud of how open and forthright you've been about asking your questions these last few days. You're doing a great job of seeking into this whole thing. Keep on keeping on.

 

[doctor_insanus]

Hey, Cym...

Congratulations to you and everyone else involved in this board! I'm glad you finally get your own forum to share your wisdom and experiences with the rest of us.

Don't worry too much about it... this is gonna kick ass!

Take care. I'll be checking this one out on a regular basis.

 

[JazzManJim]

Jimmie, thank you. You're both kind and wise.. and reassuring.

I feel as if i walk a fine line here, as i always did in the Monster, between being a participant in the discussions like any other participant and filling something akin to a shepards role with regard to insuring all the new little sheep get rounded up to have thier questions answered adequately. I don't want to be overbearing (gods no!) but i do want to participate in discussions, too. I definitely don't want to be someone with whom others don't feel they can disagree in public.

Well, you're both. Like it or not, you're going to be a guide to a lot of folks who don't have the experience you do, and even to a lot of those who do. You still get to participate and play with the rest of us, but you're also going to be Mama Bear, too. You don't have to do one or the other, though. You can do both!

At the same time, i do have a lot more practical experience with all this than many. I know that and so do you. That doesn't make me better at it, or a deeper thinker about it, or more qualified, or any of that - but it does give me an edge when talking about some of this if only cuz i've been doing anmd thinking about it for so long.

That makes you an expert in the field. You're practical knowledge that most folks don't have, and you've earned every bit of it. That means that yuo're going to be looked up to a whole lot, even by those who have been around the block a few times. And it's not just because you have the practical know-how. It's because when you give the knowledge out, it's never in a small dose. You're always careful to give out all the info you can, with all the ins and outs and perils and pitfalls and little neat tricks that you've learned. That's stuff you just can't read in any book or find a whole lot of places. I always pay attention to your posts, even though I'm a Dom. It's kind of like Roger Clemens reading a hitting essay written by Barry Bonds - it's always good to know as much about the "other side" as you can, and a post written by an expert helps more than you can imagine!

Don't you worry - if you get weird on us again, I'll give you the most loving and naughtiest nudge I can.

 

[MissTaken]

We are all equals, yes.

We all bring experience and knowledge to the board, yes.

Between cym, risia, WD, cellis, Wiz and a few others, not only have I gained insight, but have received invaluable support and acceptance.

The more I learn, the more I can add.

Diversity is the key to lit. We certainly have diversity!

 

[petrel]

Cymbidia - we do look up to you a little - at least i do but thank you so much for posting your feelings about this.

I am very aware that i have a tendancy in RL to rush in and take thigns over a bit and to sound off as if i am the acknoweldged expert - usually i manage to stop before i upset anyone and my cute smile gets me out of any major trouble. Here on lit however i can't judge peoples body language to tell if they are upset and i can't flash my grin to apologise so yes if it is soemone more expereinced than me i do tend to shut up.

a lot of this is due to a bad expereince i had once in the lit chat room. someone new was in the bdsm room asking a few questions i answered them and we were chating a little, someone else there was also answering the questions and basically told me to but out as i didn't know what i was talking about.
I felt really small after that for a long while (hence my silence from the boards for a while) although the person asking questions intiated a private chat with me becasue they had felt intimidated too we both felt as if we were sneaking aorund behind the teachers back.

i don't bear any grudges or anything i am just trying to say that although i have never seen it here on the boards it does happen that 'newbies' can get shut out by little cliches.

thank you to everyone here for not letting it happen on this board

 

[Wizard]

I wanted to echo what MissTaken has said......Well all have learned things and are here to learn from one another and share what we know and have done......Our likes and dislikes......

I think it will be a good balance.

 

[Ebonyfire]

Just as long as....

we stay out of the "my D/s is better than your D/s, the list will flourish and grow.

Hopefully this forum will not degenerate in to a debate over who is a "True Dom/me" or "True Sub" either. Respect for each other's choices will allow everyone to contribute.

Ebony

 

[carrie-on]

I too,have been in the lifestyle for many years. I learn something new here daily. When I first started coming to Lit,the first thread I read was the Monster and I was hooked. I visited it daily,took from it what I needed and even contributed to it when I felt I had something to add.
Cym,you were the first person to welcome me and I have trusted your advice ever since.
I didn't always agree with what I have read but that was just me. I like to look at both sides of something and this side may look better to me than it does to you.
I appreciate the effort that has been put forth by Laurel,Manu and yourself to make this forum more organized than the Monster. I read it all the way through non-stop and that was when there were a lot less pages than now. It looks too daunting to a new person and I really think this will help all of us.
And I agree...We ARE all equals here! Let's act like it.

 

[BlondGirl]

Re: Just as long as....

my D/s is better than your D/s

HA! I know for a fact that MY kink gets me off better than your kink!!!

 

[SpectreT]

To quote Heinlein: "All men are created unequal."

Doesn't mean anybody's better or worse than anyone else, our individual abilities are great, and amazing, but it's what we get and give by combining those talents and hard-won skill and knowledge that makes us a community. The fact that we can do this so effectively makes us human. The fact that we respect knowledge and experience proves us wise.

If yer ever so noticably fulla shit that I can call you on it, yer in big trouble, ya silly orchid. Doesn't mean you've got all my answers, though. Piercing certain areas of my anatomy, for example, ain't quite my idea of a fun Saturday night.

A little Cyber-Gift, b.:

 

[HotXBunz]

{Slinking in, looking both ways, taking a deep breath}

Hi - I'm HotXBunz and I was the mystery PMer that started all of this.

Let me say that I took my rant private, not because I didn't feel I couldn't do it on the thread, but because I didn't want to be the first voice of dissention in our "spanking" new forum. I am also sitting on the sidelines watching how the "voice" of this forum is going to go. I know I could have a say so in the direction by posting but I choose to be cautious because I can see the consequences of irresponsibility. This forum is read by lifestylers and by those who are curious. I know it may be my imagination but I feel the warm cocoon of the mega thread is gone and there are other factors to consider when posting.

Cymbidia is a Goddess in my eyes and I respect her opinions and knowledge and also care about her feelings. She is probably one of the most eloquent spokespersons I have ever heard for the BDSM lifestyle and an all around good person. Something she posted merely pushed one of my hot buttons and I felt strongly enough about the topic that I wanted her to hear another side of the coin. Not to change her mind on the topic, just to share what was important to me. I know she is open to feedback and felt I could be candid with her. I do not know that I would feel that comfortable out there on a thread. The fact I even PMed her is a testimony to the respect I have for her and for what is happening here in this forum.

Bless her, she suffered through one of my lengthy, illustrated, waa waa rants about politics and semantics. As I am not as fired up as I was yesterday, I may find an abbreviated way to share my feelings.
Cymbidia, do not take what I wrote to you as a message to not be yourself and do not diminish the fact you are an important voice here. You are needed in that capacity. When folks tell you that you are important here that is not your cue to think you are being bossy or lording over us. This may be a good time for you to finally accept your important presence and quit apologizing for being the dynamic person you are.

Maybe I need a few days in the Menstrual Hut. Everything I post sounds bitchy. LOL

 

[JazzManJim]

Re: Just as long as....

we stay out of the "my D/s is better than your D/s, the list will flourish and grow.

Ebony, I agree entirely.

But every time I read that sentence up there, it looks like the old "My Kung Fu is stronger than your Kung Fu".

Hmmm....ballet-like fights across rooftops using floggers and handcuffs. It'd be like "Crouching Subbie, Hidden Domme"!

 

[Jesters_girl]

Being the new kid on the block here, i'd just like to say that this forum is great. Having only been here for a couple of days, i've already learned quite a bit.
The way i see it, once you stop learning, you stop growing and stop living. By having a place where we can view the opinions of many different kinds of people, involved in many different kinds of relationships, we can only grow in our own relationships.
Thanks to all who share their ideas and experiences here.

Be well all,
Js_g

 

[cellis]

I need this forum to be a safe place for me to come to... and it is no secret to anyone that I am having a hard time without the old thread...

I need the exchange of ideas... I need different and differing points of views...

I need support and equality... as I certainly do not have all the answers...

I need to be able to weigh things for myself...

and I don't think that I am alone in these feelings...

So, I think that there has to be some kind of consensus that as varing and diverse as the BDSM lifestyle, so then too are the opinions and experiences of those who live it and post here...

I think we need to embrace our diversity here, our differences, and certainly know that because all of our experiences are not the same, then too will our opinions differ...

I want everyone to feel comfortable here posting as they wish... Sharing their experiences... Let those who need it, take what they wish... wade through what is right for them... and leave the rest behind...

 

[SpectreT]

Re: Re: Just as long as....

Ebony, I agree entirely.

But every time I read that sentence up there, it looks like the old "My Kung Fu is stronger than your Kung Fu".

Hmmm....ballet-like fights across rooftops using floggers and handcuffs. It'd be like "Crouching Subbie, Hidden Domme"!

JazzMan, Yer a nut.

Give me some time, and a chance to make a few phone calls, asn I could probably do a credible parody of "Kung Fu Fighting", with a BDSM theme.

 

[JazzManJim]

Re: Re: Re: Just as long as....

JazzMan, Yer a nut.

Give me some time, and a chance to make a few phone calls, asn I could probably do a credible parody of "Kung Fu Fighting", with a BDSM theme.

BDSM ain't all about being serious and scholarly, right?

Hey...give me time and I'm sure between us, we could handle it!

 

[Ebonyfire]

Re: Re: Just as long as....

HA! I know for a fact that MY kink gets me off better than your kink!!!

You do not even know what my kink is....LOL

 

[Ebonyfire]

Re: Re: Re: Just as long as....

JazzMan, Yer a nut.

Give me some time, and a chance to make a few phone calls, asn I could probably do a credible parody of "Kung Fu Fighting", with a BDSM theme.

Hyahhhhhhhhh! (kicking fiercely in 5 inch heels) and oops falling on her Domme ass....ouch that hurts!

Ebony

 

[morninggirl5]

Re: Just as long as....

we stay out of the "my D/s is better than your D/s, the list will flourish and grow.

Hopefully this forum will not degenerate in to a debate over who is a "True Dom/me" or "True Sub" either. Respect for each other's choices will allow everyone to contribute.

Ebony

I went searching for this thread because of the discussion of truth in it. Ebony's post said it pretty clearly and concisely though.

 

[lilfrk]

You rock mg...Thank you for this.


(I'm just going to follow you around for awhile.)

 

[~Dream~]

respecting the knowledgeable

I need this forum to be a safe place for me to come to... and it is no secret to anyone that I am having a hard time without the old thread...

I need the exchange of ideas... I need different and differing points of views...

I need support and equality... as I certainly do not have all the answers...

I need to be able to weigh things for myself...

and I don't think that I am alone in these feelings...

So, I think that there has to be some kind of consensus that as varing and diverse as the BDSM lifestyle, so then too are the opinions and experiences of those who live it and post here...

I think we need to embrace our diversity here, our differences, and certainly know that because all of our experiences are not the same, then too will our opinions differ...

I want everyone to feel comfortable here posting as they wish... Sharing their experiences... Let those who need it, take what they wish... wade through what is right for them... and leave the rest behind...

Now that I have a skin-to skin experience with my Master to fall back on I feel I am more experienced to say different things..
CYMBIDIA and I never got along at first due to my mostly being so young and inexperienced I think..sorry for the disrespect Cym.
Now however I have come to appreciate several of your posts and meaningful words and advise and have incorporated it in to my own BDSM lifestyle so I wanted to take this opportunity to thank you publicly..

 

[artful]

Re: Just as long as....

we stay out of the "my D/s is better than your D/s, the list will flourish and grow.

Hopefully this forum will not degenerate in to a debate over who is a "True Dom/me" or "True Sub" either. Respect for each other's choices will allow everyone to contribute.

Ebony

Six months later Sis, I still find your words so honest and direct. I just love it when that happens.

I would add also, though I have learned much by many who post here in this Forum, I have as much respect for cym's experience and knowledge as any.

Let none of us forget,..."We ALL sometimes have bad days." At times I make posts I wish I hadn't.
Most of us here do!

Making my opinion KNOWN,...being able to express it freely, is important to me. Can I do this if I feel THREATENED by senior people? People who have earned the respect of the *Majority*?

Some people when THEY make an errant post, have supporters who JUMP on their side to DEFEND that POV,(Even when it may not be accurate)?

For ME,...the answer is NO! I think most NEW posters to this Forum, feel the same way.

cym is a "standard" that most of us look up to,... because we SEE the woman for who she genuinely IS.

A woman who has GREAT knowledge and wishes to be helpful to all,...especially NEW people. The people who JUMP on the 'Band Wagon' to defend her posts, are the ones whereby *FLAMES* easily erupt.

I have said it before,...and I will say it again, "I don't WANT, nor NEED anyone to defend my POV."

(JMHO),...but it's mine,...and I own it!