How To Handle Difficult Situation?

[Recidiva]

I understand that but sometimes confessing all just doesn't achieve anything it only makes things worse. I'm not saying it's right or fair but neither is rubbing her face in it for the sake of it.

That is a completely illogical assumption. It's already bad. It's just illustrating how bad it is. it's reflecting reality. If it is on him to bear that crushing guilt, you're not doing him any favors either. It is giving her a chance to deal with reality and him a chance to deal with reality and they can look at it together and navigate together.

Otherwise he's treating her like a dog and making her choices for her and bearing the guilt of doing that to another human being. It's corrosive, and over time, either leads to confession way past the point where it should have happened, or in him taking further liberties because he got her trust now and she won't see reality, so why not just ride that sucker into the ground.

 

[SmileyGirl]

That is a completely illogical assumption. It's already bad. It's just illustrating how bad it is. it's reflecting reality. If it is on him to bear that crushing guilt, you're not doing him any favors either. It is giving her a chance to deal with reality and him a chance to deal with reality and they can look at it together and navigate together.

Otherwise he's treating her like a dog and making her choices for her and bearing the guilt of doing that to another human being. It's corrosive, and over time, either leads to confession way past the point where it should have happened, or in him taking further liberties because he got her trust now and she won't see reality, so why not just ride that sucker into the ground.

He hasn't physically cheated with anyone. In an ideal world to confess and tell all I'm sure would be the right thing to do. If things are already on shaky ground won't this just be another thing to contend with? Maybe he can make things right. Not every situation is the same. It's not set in stone that their marriage will crumble eventually further down the line. I'm sure people make mistakes and put it right without having to cause their partner unnecessary pain.

 

[Recidiva]

He hasn't physically cheated with anyone. In an ideal world to confess and tell all I'm sure would be the right thing to do. If things are already on shaky ground won't this just be another thing to contend with? Maybe he can make things right. Not every situation is the same. It's not set in stone that their marriage will crumble eventually further down the line. I'm sure people make mistakes and put it right without having to cause their partner unnecessary pain.

I get that you mean well, I just can't get on board, because truth is truth and candy-coating it or concealing it doesn't do anybody any favors in the end.

If it wasn't that big of a deal, he can confess and she can shrug and hug him and they can go out to dinner.

If it is indicative of much deeper communication problems, then admitting that the communication is exactly how bad is the real issue. If you can't communicate about not being able to communicate...this is a problem that repeats itself over and over.

This is not about me being fire and brimstone. This is the best advice I can give when dealing with humans and frailty and choices. Tailoring truths isn't a good long-term strategy.

The reality is that when the communication gets better...he'll want to confess anyway because she's cool and she deserves it.

Later isn't better. Yeah, it'll piss her off maybe, but otherwise it's knowing insult over possibly inadvertent injury.

Anyway, this isn't about making someone wrong, it is supposed to be about making something right the hard way, which is to let people have their own opinions and then do your best to put it back together. In the end people who truly love each other want the other to be happy. If that is missing...perhaps it isn't love.

 

[Recidiva]

People candy coat the truth all day every day, at what level does it become acceptable or unacceptable. Only the individual gets to decide that. It's how we stop from killing each other....or (novel approach) hurting each other unnecessarily.


No honey, your arse looks great in that.
Yum! You're a great cook.
No, I've never thought about someone else while I'm having sex with you.
Yes, I love my job, especially the hours and the overtime.
Oh yes, I LOVE your mother. (Said no daughter-in-law ever)
I just hang around on a sex forum for the conversation.
etc. etc. etc.

Yeah, that's true. There are a lot of people who do that and want that, and if they agree to do that and want that together, that's cool.

I just don't know if she's one of them and it's time to find out.

Heh. My husband and I do actually both hang out on this forum together for the conversation. So yeah, I really do this and so does he. We get along fine telling truths. We didn't get along so well in previous marriages not telling truths.

And in fact I wanted to cyber here on this site and I figured it was no big deal, but I asked him first and he thought it was a big deal and guess what, I don't do it. Because we make choices together and I don't want to hurt him and I trust that he won't hurt me.

 

[Lord Pmann]

My husband and I do actually both hang out on this forum together for the conversation.

Conversation is the only reason Rainshine is here too. She was talking about the other sick fuckers here. She's an angel of sorts. In church every Sunday with a big black bible. Healing lepers and all.

 

[Recidiva]

Conversation is the only reason Rainshine is here too. She was talking about the other sick fuckers here. She's an angel of sorts. In church every Sunday with a big black bible. Healing lepers and all.

Oh, well, I'm not an angel. I don't even go to church.

I do however not hurt people unnecessarily by my actions and then justify not telling the truth about it.

 

[Recidiva]

You wanted to cyber? Hmm... I digress...good on you for speaking to your husband first though, I do agree with you on that much at least. Not everyone's as wise or indeed in your marriage though, and perhaps you learned the hard way through your first, failed, marriage. Maybe if the OP resolves this situation before it becomes terminal, he can stick to just one marriage and protect his wife's heart from his bad move.

Yeah, it's up to him. Your point of view is valid for a certain personality's standpoint. If he can make that call and make all right, good for him.

I'm a really good liar, I know that. I also know that I lose all respect for people if I lie to them and they buy it. I like hanging with smart people.

You have a wife that wants to be lied to, doesn't already know or suspect the truth and you want her to stay that way? Sure, it's squicky, but lots of people's relationships are squicky to me. Not my call. I just couldn't do it myself.

 

[Lord Pmann]

That's not entirely true, I missed Church this week.

I can see you turning into a little devil already. You're looking a little horny. (See what I did there?)

 

[Recidiva]

What on earth is squicky? Is that one of those made up words people use that will eventually bully its way into a dictionary because the whole stupid world is dumbing down?

Urban Dictionary:

squick


1. Noun. The physical sense of repulsion upon encountering a concept or situation one finds disgusting.
2. Noun. A situation or concept which engenders this reaction.
3. Verb, transitive. To cause someone to have this reaction.
4. Verb, intransitive. To experience this reaction.

The concept of the "squick" differs from the concept of "disgust" in that "squick" refers purely to the physical sensation of repulsion, and does not imply a moral component.

Stating that something is "disgusting" implies a judgment that it is bad or wrong. Stating that something "squicks you" is merely an observation of your reaction to it, but does not imply a judgment that such a thing is universally wrong.

The statement "kiddie porn squicks me" and "kiddie porn disgusts me" may both be true. In my case, the second sentence is true, and I assume that the first is also true, but, having never encountered it, I have no way of knowing for sure.

In general, distinguishing between "squick" and "disgust" is an important part of living in a tolerant society.

It is my contention that most anti-gay attitudes, for instance, are the result of people finding that gay sex squicks them -- and, because they don't know about the concept of the "squick", they assume that gay sex DISGUSTS them, which implies that there is something morally objectionable about it.

 

[Recidiva]

Short answer. Yes.

It is a most excellent word.

 

[Recidiva]

It is a dumb non-word, even worse than amazeballs.

Sorry, OP, I will stop hijacking your thread with word wars.

*cough*dumb word*cough*

Reasonable people can come to an accord

 

[CutieMouse]

The OP is in the midst of an emotional affair. As someone who hung out in a marriage full of emotional affairs... Talk to your wife.

Emotional affairs are a sign of serious issues in a marriage. Not because if the online sex, necessarily, but because of the shared emotional intimacy - the eagerness to check for texts, share conversations, stories/ life events, etc. Odds are good you've already emotionally checked out, and you wife knows it (on some level, even unconsciously).

You haven't physically cheated, so there may be an opportunity to rekindle the marriage (if that's what both/ either of you want), but doing so kinda sorta requires acknowledging the fact that you've chosen to invest outside the relationship, and ask for help getting things back on track (individual or couples therapy usually comes up at this point).

I was miserable the last few years if my marriage, because I knew (in my heart) he was "gone", but he refused to acknowledge it (because nothing physical ever happened). We did therapy, etc. My marriage got technically stronger... As soon as I believed I really did deserve better, I divorced him. We're both better (10 years later) for having faced the issues head on, instead of trying to "save" the marriage.

 

[njlauren]

Selfishness isn't a virtue. He agreed to love and honor her, he did neither. He broke his word, he should come clean and make a new agreement.

If she'd asked to be lied to and have the truth hidden, he probably wouldn't be considering it a "difficult situation."

That is all great and moral, but it leaves out that people make mistakes, and the fact that he is asking what to do on here says he still loves and honors his wife enough to be bothered about it. Given that it was an online only thing, hasn't gone that far, there probably isn't much to tell and would only cause more of a rift..it isn't a matter of the original vows, it is a matter of what would help the marriage survive, if that is the goal.

 

[njlauren]

No, you've missed a nuance.

On the off chance that his wife is not, in fact like him or like you, and might in fact be like me, and would be absolutely infuriated at reserving myself for monogamy and not being out having fun when I clearly could have had an open relationship...maybe consider my advice.

Because if he was like you or she was like him or like you, it wouldn't be a problem in the first place.

You can't speak for her, he can't speak for her and I am simply saying...let her speak for her.

My way has the actual benefit or providing another human being with reality and choices that she should have had in the first place if she hadn't made an agreement with someone who couldn't keep that agreement.

Your way is the equivalent of stoning someone for adultery, it is about punishing both people for something that isn't a major transgression. Your advice is filtered by your own worldview, that the guy is a cheating slime who broke his 'sacred' wedding vows, and want it out in the open so he can be lashed (or the emotional equivalent of it). I don't condone what the OP did, but your response is more about your moral judgement then trying to help him. If he had cheated or had an affair with the woman in question, other than the emotional one, I would be telling him he probably will need to confess it because likely it would come out if it lasted any length of time, but with this, it wouldn't do her any good.

 

[njlauren]

But the argument is that the marriage must be preserved by lying. I'm advocating attempting to save the marriage through truth.

If he knows he can't save it through the truth, he probably knew it before he chose to lie.

So I don't think he's the best judge of character and maybe she can salvage it, but someone needs to be a grownup.

Being a grownup doesn't necessarily mean playing by rules laid down on little kids, like "lying will get you sent to hell' and so forth. Marriages are not perfect things, everyone does stupid things (I am not necessarily talking about cheating), and sometimes it is better to let sleeping dogs lie. In this case, her knowing the truth won't make the marriage any better, it probably will make it worse. Assuming the OP is sincere in trying to save his marriage, her not knowing is likely to be a better thing, because if he starts telling her the things that aren't working, and she knows about this, it will make her feel doubly horrible. If he tells her it isn't working right and talks about what he needs, it can be framed as that, rather than her taking it to mean she is inadequate; whereas if he tells her about the other woman, she will be devastated, and will take it as a sign she isn't attractive, isn't doing the right thing, and will be hurt and angry and also upset with herself, beating herself up, too.

I think a lot of answers are trying to say what is better for the marriage, and it could be the refrain little kids are taught "it is bad to lie" may not be the best way to go.

 

[desertslave]

The OP is in the midst of an emotional affair. As someone who hung out in a marriage full of emotional affairs... Talk to your wife.

Emotional affairs are a sign of serious issues in a marriage. Not because if the online sex, necessarily, but because of the shared emotional intimacy - the eagerness to check for texts, share conversations, stories/ life events, etc. Odds are good you've already emotionally checked out, and you wife knows it (on some level, even unconsciously).

You haven't physically cheated, so there may be an opportunity to rekindle the marriage (if that's what both/ either of you want), but doing so kinda sorta requires acknowledging the fact that you've chosen to invest outside the relationship, and ask for help getting things back on track (individual or couples therapy usually comes up at this point).

I was miserable the last few years if my marriage, because I knew (in my heart) he was "gone", but he refused to acknowledge it (because nothing physical ever happened). We did therapy, etc. My marriage got technically stronger... As soon as I believed I really did deserve better, I divorced him. We're both better (10 years later) for having faced the issues head on, instead of trying to "save" the marriage.

This is a very wise lady and you would do quite well to think on her words seriously and at length.

I was in the last throes of my marriage when I discovered that he was strolling online, chatting with others and possibly meeting with a few of them (I'll never know for sure, and ultimately it doesn't really matter). I had already started questioning our marriage on other grounds, and mainly sticking it out "for the children." We had a serious talk and decided to double down and make it work. Within 3 months he had broken all but one of his promises about making changes, while I'd kept my end of the bargain faithfully.

Flash forward a few months, when I met someone online somewhat by accident. We started to chat and the rest could be "been there, done that" to the OP's story. The difference was that we were both unhappy in our respective marriages, and had made genuine efforts to salvage them, before we finally met in person. Those months in between were, in that perfect hindsight, an incredibly slippery slope. The chance to meet when we did was crazywonderful serendipity.

I'm NOT saying this as encouragement to cut & run! I've recently been on the other side of that experience (looong story) and it was an awful time. Learning that someone you love and trust has been giving their heart, mind and desires to another when you've been living in faith to what you think is your relationship can be devastating. If you decide you have to come clean, be prepared for the consequences and inevitable blowback.

You, dear OP, need to decide where you want both relationships to go....which one continues and which one ends? From there I (personally) think it's best to act on your decision while causing the very least possible hurt to whoever you're making an end with. Confession tends to make you feel better, but causes havoc and heartache to the other person.

I wish you luck, and you have my complete sympathy.

 

[njlauren]

I think the wisest advice is if you think you love your wife, is to cut off with the cyber and text and so forth with the other woman, and work with your wife on making it a balanced relationship. You are having an affair, an emotional one, and take it from me, it is going to affect your real one even if it is virtual. You may think it is harmless, but it isn't, you are taking space in your emotions that your wife would have and give it to someone else, and she is going to notice, believe me. You will probably get to the point where if you don't text the other person, you get anxious or moody, it can be alike a drug.

The other thing is cyber relationships are not the same as IRL ones,and it is very easy to get into a mode where an online person is 'perfect' compared to your real one, because they are just an avatar in the void. Your relationship is defined in small bursts, and you are having fun, sexting, etc..but you have none of the real world angst that comes with a relationship, you aren't having conversations with her about that the roof needs redoing on the house but the funds are low, she doesn't have to worry that one of your jobs might go south and then what, and so forth. The other person may well be a great person, sexy, etc, but you also might find out the image of them in your head is better than they are, online is much more like an adult play date than the real thing.

My advice would be to break it off and see if the things that don't work can be fixed. Among other things, you need to let your wife know you want her to initiate sex, and also maybe explore doing different things. It can be helpful to get a counselor trained in sex issues to help, too, I would find a woman myself, and have her work with you guys. Your wife could simply be shy or inexperienced, sex isn't something that never changes like eye color, people learn to open up and enjoy it who never could. My spouse had been horribly sexually abused as a child, and she was able to recover from the effects of that (no, it wasn't easy, and it took a lot of time, and it hurt our sex lives for a good part of our time together), so it is always possible to get there. If your wife is such a great mate otherwise, then fine tune the engine, don't throw it away because a cylinder is misfiring, you owe it to her and yourself to do it, to try

 

[Mixed_Emotions]

Wow! I'm honestly stunned by how quickly this thread took off. I'm just posting a quick update so nobody thinks I've abandoned the discussion. Had a very busy day at work and had wanted to post a proper response when I got home but was surprised to find dinner waiting for me already, which was repaid in a much appreciated back rub. My wife and I actually had a great evening together eating dinner and talking, listening to music and even had a brief but open conversation about our sex life. It was honestly a breath of fresh air and I'm heading to bed now in a much better mood than the one I took with me last night. Thanks everybody for your advice and suggestions thus far and hopefully I'll be able to respond in kind tomorrow. I know that one night doesn't fix things but tonight was definitely a step in the right direction at the very least.

 

[ElijaRDC]

If you think your marriage is salvageable and you are 100% willing to talk to your wife about the lack of intimacy and put in the (likely monumental) effort that will be required to rekindle it, including ending your online infidelity, DO NOT tell her about it. Bury it, never do it again, and move forward.

If, on the other hand, you do not believe that the intimacy can be restored and that you and your wife should go your separate ways, again, telling her about it is unnecessary at best.

The decision between those two things is up to you, and considering that I have never been married, can very easily see myself never getting married in the future, and that my longest relationship thus far was when I was in high school, I'm not one to give advice on the matter, except to say that situations like this are one damn good reason why I'm so careful about marriage. If you choose to try and work things out with your wife, you have a long, tough road ahead of you.

 

[NightL]

It is a dumb non-word, even worse than amazeballs.

...but I thought pmann has amazeballs?

 

[NightL]

No no, he has whaleskin balls. I'm told.

No no no, I thought the amazeballs were a supplement to the whaleskin foreskin (see what I have done there?)

 

[Lord Pmann]

No no, he has whaleskin balls. I'm told.

You know they're gorgeous.

 

[IrisAlthea]

Wow! I'm honestly stunned by how quickly this thread took off. I'm just posting a quick update so nobody thinks I've abandoned the discussion. Had a very busy day at work and had wanted to post a proper response when I got home but was surprised to find dinner waiting for me already, which was repaid in a much appreciated back rub. My wife and I actually had a great evening together eating dinner and talking, listening to music and even had a brief but open conversation about our sex life. It was honestly a breath of fresh air and I'm heading to bed now in a much better mood than the one I took with me last night. Thanks everybody for your advice and suggestions thus far and hopefully I'll be able to respond in kind tomorrow. I know that one night doesn't fix things but tonight was definitely a step in the right direction at the very least.

No, one night doesn't fix things and before you can fix things with your wife you'll need to make up your mind about where you're going from here. Do you want to stay in the marriage, find greener pastures or will you keep going behind her back?
One thing to keep in mind is that your online thing is not the same as your marriage. One is about infatuation and often infatuation with your own mind, to be honest. The other is about the hard work of actually living with and adjusting to another person.

 

[Scrubber]

I agree with those who are of the view that there is nothing to be gained by the OP telling his wife about the cyber affair.

I would most certainly not want such information shoved down my throat unless I asked my husband a specific question about it. I think that it is entirely possible that the OP's wife has an inkling that something is off - if she is choosing to brush it under the carpet then I think that is her prerogative.

It could well be the case that once something like this is out in the open it becomes a deal breaker; the wounded spouse is now definitely hurt and humiliated and it becomes a bridge that the couple cannot cross.

I think that the OP should continue talking to his wife about their issues and should end the cyber relationship. If the cyber friend is a true friend she will understand and back off. If the cyber friend is not a true friend then the OP will find himself playing with fire; but he made his bed, so to speak.