how soon to submit?

[dolf]

firstly i want to make it absolutely clear that this post is NOT a personal critisism of anybody...


ok, i talk to a few Doms...mostly on a purely friendship level. those that have been more than that have pushed for me to submit/change my behaviour in what seems to me to be a very short time. with me this results in running away, very fast and extremely freaked out...

i feel like i'd like to spend weeks...perhaps months even...getting to know someone before i felt comfortable with submitting to them but time and time again, just as i am getting to like a person, they get very heavy...and it scares the crap out of me. am i being naive? or perhaps cowardly?

i know that this works for a lot of people. sometimes it "clicks" right away. i know also that i'm more nervous than a lot of other subs might be. is there a reasonable, "polite" amount of time?



opinions please?
xx

*ducks*

 

[graceanne]

*hugs*

I'm pretty sure that everyone here will agree with me in saying that a D/s relationship requires trust, and that doesn't happen overnight. When it's online, it takes even longer, because it's so easy for the other person to be lying. You should be able to take as long as you want coming to trust someone before you submit, and if they have a problem with that, then they're evidently not 'the one'.

 

[rakastuja]

I guess it depends a lot what you mean with submitting.

If submitting means serious life-style thing its pretty equal to relatioship. And at least I dont commit into relationship before I know the other person well. It does take time.

Not that I'm too experieced with BDSM though...

 

[Desdemona]

Submission takes time. That's reality. It doesn't happen over night.

In my experience, it takes months for me to learn to trust and to truly submit. Before that happens, yes we play. I trust a little bit at a time and watch to see how my trust is received. Then I trust a little more. It isn't something that can be forced. For me it requires in person, skin to skin contact. I have to be able to look into his eyes and to know that the chemistry between us is real and not just the smoke and mirrors of online interactions.

I used to be much more of a flirt than I am now. Once I decided to give the relationship a try, my behavior changed towards others. That happened before I gave my complete submission as a result of my committment to try and make the relationship work.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that it won't happen until you're ready. I run away too, if someone tries to force me before I'm ready. You have a right to choose to give your submission. It can't be taken by force. It's earned along with trust as a result of communication, getting to know each other, and developing the relationship.

 

[Mr Blonde]

I know people will come along and just give glib answers like "whenever the sub is ready" or "a teacher is always patient" but for me it is 2-3 months and this post is an attempt to explain why.

I meet women in real life and have not used internet dating. So for me, assuming to start with a first date within a week of meeting her...all goes well and we date a few times. I screen her for submissive tendencies, she is responsive but on average will be less experienced. We go ahead and start talking about "how it will go" and I'd say in a month's time from first "hello" we have definitely slept together.

While we continue to talk, we start re-doing some kinky things she already feels comfortable with. That is another 2-4 weeks. Then at a certain point, I begin making things clear and start actively domming her but there is no hard action. We are now talking but it is more feedback/discussion of what just happened.

Around another 2-4 weeks I build up slightly, then by the 2-3 month mark I will attempt a fairly involved event. Something fairly extreme that clearly says what this relationship is about. It might cause some aftermath, but usually it is within one week of this big scene where things come together. We can each see how the relationship will go. It usually takes away all of her butterflies and the trust grows exponentially.

To be honest, and this will make me sound highly suspect but I will admit it anyway, I have lost two or three women immediately after the first big event. These women were fair and evenhanded -- they said I tried to warn them but they didn't understand. They accepted that it was consentual but realize this is not the relationship for them. It does not make me happy that being involved with me might have caused an emotional scar but they were willing experimenters.

So anyway, in a mature relationship that is trying for a future together, I don't start truly taking their submission until the 2-3 month mark. Some women are clearly ready before that, and some women are still not ready by that time, but I probably use that timeframe because it is what makes me comfortable.

 

[Desdemona]

I think 2-3 months of regular in person interactions is fair. By that point, I certainly know whether I'm going to want to submit to someone or not. Plenty of times, I know the first time we meet that it won't happen. At that point, there won't be a second meeting.

 

[Kajira Callista]

I don't think a dominant should be trying to change you in any way or force you to submit.. Trying to change you or force submission means you weren't what they were looking for in the first place and that looks like a clearly paved path for disaster. For me personally...I would rather be alone and wait then to not be able to be me with the person I submit to. Submission is not something easily revealed for some people and I am one of them, no one sees the true me until I feel safe and I trust. So if they are trying to push you someplace and your tummy is telling you no......listen.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I think 2-3 months of regular in person interactions is fair. By that point, I certainly know whether I'm going to want to submit to someone or not. Plenty of times, I know the first time we meet that it won't happen. At that point, there won't be a second meeting.

A woman after my own heart. As I was not into going to munches, clubs or parties, the only way I had to meet prospective Doms was online. I had those who assumed I would submit simply because they emailed me...fat chance. Others who thought if I agreed to meet them after much talking that it was a certainty.....not likely. And some who pushed for an immediate meeting without wanting to give out any information or time to talk online....they went in the reject pile. Oh, and those who on meeting proposed we get to having sex in the most vanilla of ways and then discuss D/s and the possibility of us being together for more than a one night stand....they also went in the reject pile.

With Francisco, we talked for a minimum of 8 hours everyday online, often twice that time, and also had phone calls. We started talking April 2002 and continued that pattern until he flew to Oz for our first meeting in August 2002, and of course we married before he went home. It was not usual for either of us, but we knew each other more deeply and intimately before we met face to face than most people who had met in more conventional ways and been married for years. It just was right for us. There was not online play, just talk, talk, talk, about anything and everything.

Catalina http://www.smilies4you.de/content/feiertage/a25.gif

 

[dolf]

*sneaking in quietly, listening carefully, not wanting to upset the flow of input*

thankyou all
xx

 

[rosco rathbone]

There's a whole flirtatious/serious game that goes on where signals are exchanged and both parties become comfortable with each other, just as in regular vanilla mating.

 

[Shadowsdream]

This is one of those impossible questions to answer for there are too many nuances to give a blanket answer.

Online...instant submission would bore and turn Me off (IF) I were to even do online Domination.

When I am getting to know a submissive online they can kiss their ass goodbye if they even try to submit to Me...I find it disengenuous and feel I am submitting to their needs to submit...so here for Me...it takes months of getting to know the real person behind the submissive before I have any real interest in knowing them in realtime for the possibility of a D/s or BDSM relationship.

In My real world I have no need to have anyone submit to Me but do find that many do just as a matter of course. In small ways that is pleasing all of U/us. Point in question...Saturday night was My Christmas party for My local club..a Gorean slave girl was greatful for a day I had spent with her helping her through a very disturbing sadness in the BDSM world and wanted to show her appreciation in her own way...she brought a crystal goblet to the party and served Me all night in the Gorean way...a male sub that I mentor and use to serve at all of My private events served Me through his own desires all of the food I wished throughout the evening. he also took care of My gifts etc.

I chose not to bring a personal submissive with Me and had no need to Dominate anyone yet the entire evening found Me served by many simply because it brought them pleasure to do so and it pleased Me to accept that very special kind of submission.

Personally I do not think you can put a time on submission in the real world..at least not in My real world but I sincerely believe that submission is given not taken..it is accepted not expected.

 

[WriterDom]

Three weeks is enough time to pursue an interest, and to put an end to Dom shopping, in my opinion. I'm not saying she submits after 3 weeks, but a mutual agreement of exclusivity can be given while compatibility is explored.

 

[Netzach]

I don't do timelines and I don't do litmus tests. Every time I've done this it's felt like some kind of pouting or passive aggression, I don't like how it makes me act.

I don't wait around indefinitely to see if someone's interested in playing with me/submitting to me on certain levels-- that's just being a wallflower-- but I see total or even significant submission as a long term project and investment most of the time.

 

[bluntforcemama]

Submitting

Trust your instincts. I operate on a gut level.

 

[TigerClaw]

It all boils down to brains and trust. There are a number of things you shouldnt do until a certain level of trust is present. Depending on the kind of relationship you want and the person. I disagree with some of the shorter time frames here. In order to know someone it will take time.

 

[FungiUg]

i feel like i'd like to spend weeks...perhaps months even...getting to know someone before i felt comfortable with submitting to them

That sounds perfectly fine to me.

Most people will be okay if you say "I need you to back off -- I don't mind chatting, but I'm not ready for anything more from you."

Be prepared to say no. We dom/mes are pushy buggers, and given an inch we will take a mile.

If someone you are talking to won't accept that... then that's a good indication they have boundary issues. Safe is something we encourage, remember? You should only submit when you feel ready and when it is something you want to do and with whom someone you want to submit to.

 

[CutieMouse]

*****

 

[h_i_s]

Concerning either entering in play sessions, or a committed 24/7 D/s situation, the best standard to measure it all against is the comfort level, and trust of the individuals involved.

The definition of what a reasonable amount of time IS will vary from one sub to another, dependant on the Dom in question. Know yourself, your likes & dislikes, and limits and be sure to communicate them. Be sure to know the same of the person you are dealing with, sub or Dom.

Regardless, every submissive is different, as is every Dominant. Some are more evidently deserving of trust and earn it quite early on. Some are capable of trusting early on, some are not. Listen to your instincts and never ignore any potential red flags which might exist. There is no one perfect & correct standard of measuring the amount of time.

¸,ø¤º°sinn0cent1°º¤ø,¸ (proudly owned by, and devoted to INSIDEYOURMIND)

 

[Guest]

 

[blackwatch1881]

maybe this is just me... but I find it easier to submit when its there from the outset. you can usualy tell within the first few days of talking whether they worth giving the time of day. There are some out there you can really click with.

As for time period, its hard because with each person its different. When I was younger I foolishly dived in head first into everything being a little eager to discover this new found pleasure. But usually for saftys sake it was usualy a few months of talking online and on the phone before we met, even in that time though I supose my natural sub side was always present, so I dont think I can 'submit' as such at certain time frame, it just kinda happens with the right person.

 

[ekstasis]

all of you give me hope in finding that perfect Dom... thank you

 

[catalina_francisco]

all of you give me hope in finding that perfect Dom... thank you

LOL, there is no such thing as perfect, even for Doms, but you can get lucky and get real close.

Catalina

 

[ekstasis]

fair enough i can settle for close to perfect

 

[LunarKitten]

firstly i want to make it absolutely clear that this post is NOT a personal critisism of anybody...


ok, i talk to a few Doms...mostly on a purely friendship level. those that have been more than that have pushed for me to submit/change my behaviour in what seems to me to be a very short time. with me this results in running away, very fast and extremely freaked out...

i feel like i'd like to spend weeks...perhaps months even...getting to know someone before i felt comfortable with submitting to them but time and time again, just as i am getting to like a person, they get very heavy...and it scares the crap out of me. am i being naive? or perhaps cowardly?

i know that this works for a lot of people. sometimes it "clicks" right away. i know also that i'm more nervous than a lot of other subs might be. is there a reasonable, "polite" amount of time?



opinions please?
xx

*ducks*

I was like that, though I would find myself doing little submissive things with them - like calling them Sir, waiting for them to eat first, walking slightly behind them. But with Master, everything just clicked right away. I was getting his coffee and making sure he didn't need anything....before our relationship even became a relationship! lol

I think you know it's right when it's right. Though sometimes it takes a LOT of work to get to that point. If you're not comfortable, tell them that you're not. If they're the right one for you, they will understand and back off. If not...well, you have your answer on if they are the right ones for you

*huggles*

 

[h_i_s]

For me, i have never offered to submit to anyone other than my Master. In order to submit, there must be trust and respect established first.

D/s is a concentual exchange between us at all times, i concented initially and in doing so my concent to submit is understood as being infinite. The first time i offered my submission to Him, was the last time i actually *offered*. From that point on, it has been understood that i am His. my purpose is to obey and please Him at anytime, in any way He chooses.

D/s is a concentual exchange. Submission is first given when offered by the 'sub', and when He in turn He decides to accept it.

¸,ø¤º°sinn0cent1°º¤ø,¸ (proudly owned by, and devoted to INSIDEYOURMIND)