How Democrats' beefed-up IRS could hurt low-income Americans

[Counselor706]

The newest health care and climate spending bill from Democrats includes an $80 billion boost to the Internal Revenue Service that is intended to help the agency crack down on wealthy tax cheats. However, Republican critics say that a bigger IRS could ultimately hurt lower-income Americans.

Providing the IRS with an influx of funding has been a top priority for President Biden. It has emerged as one of the most prominent financiers of the Inflation Reduction Act that Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., and Sen. Joe Manchin, D-W.Va., unveiled last week.

But GOP lawmakers have sounded the alarm over the proposal, warning that it could have serious ramifications for lower-income workers.

That's because the IRS disproportionately targets low-income Americans when it conducts tax audits each year. In fact, households with less than $25,000 in earnings are five times as likely to be audited by the agency than everyone else, according to a recent analysis of tax data from fiscal year 2021 by the Transactional Records Access Clearinghouse (TRAC) at Syracuse University.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/democrats-beefed-up-irs-hurt-low-income-americans

 

[ll74]

Lol....could

 

[Chernosoth]

This is pretty standard for nations in decline. Squeeze harder and more slips through their fingers. There will be all sorts of workarounds as more of the nation learns to avoid anything federal.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Yep, the black economy takes off, more and more goes under the table. It's why they like the idea of doing away with cash.

 

[YDB95]

Translation: the rich are better at cheating. That's true, but it's no excuse not to go after them.

 

[Kindfarmer]

https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/democrats-beefed-up-irs-hurt-low-income-americans

#NewsForDumbFox isn’t a credible source.

Obviously, you didn’t know.

 

[MissMandy86]

Could ... means bullshit ..
could means misinformation.

The irs was told by Biden not to go after citizens making less then 400k a year

Your article left that out .. how convenient they forgot to put that part in

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Lol

Could ... means bullshit ..
could means misinformation.

The irs was told by Biden not to go after citizens making less then 400k a year

Your article left that out .. how convenient they forgot to put that part in

Could ... means bullshit ..
could means misinformation.

The irs was told by Biden not to go after citizens making less then 400k a year

Your article left that out .. how convenient they forgot to put that part in

Gee, that’s reassuring. Funny how they forgot to include any provisions like that in the actual bill. The IRS can and will go wherever they think the money is. Basic arithmetic and historical data point to middle and low income households and businesses. If Democrats were serious about that meaningless promise, House Dems could insert it into the bill. Don’t bet on it.

 

[MissMandy86]

Lol


Gee, that’s reassuring. Funny how they forgot to include any provisions like that in the actual bill. The IRS can and will go wherever they think the money is. Basic arithmetic and historical data point to middle and low income households and businesses. If Democrats were serious about that meaningless promise, House Dems could insert it into the bill. Don’t bet on it.

Republican lawmakers lambast the Biden administration for a new plan that earmarks some $78 billion to the IRS over the next decade, the Department of Treasury is pushing back, saying that the funding won't be used to expand audits of households making less than $400,000 per year.

https://people.com/politics/irs-has...mericans-making-less-than-400k-arent-targets/

 

[Rightguide]

Joe Biden and the Democrats are fucking liars. They say those new 87,000 IRS agents are going to go after the billionaires. There are at present 664 billionaires in the US. so are they going to assign 130 IRS agents to each of those billionaires? Think again and get ready to be oppressed.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Re

Republican lawmakers lambast the Biden administration for a new plan that earmarks some $78 billion to the IRS over the next decade, the Department of Treasury is pushing back, saying that the funding won't be used to expand audits of households making less than $400,000 per year.

https://people.com/politics/irs-has...mericans-making-less-than-400k-arent-targets/

Biden and Treasury officials can make as many toothless, nuanced and contradictory promises they want, but the single source of the truth is the language in the bill itself. There is nothing in the bill prohibiting more audits or other means of targeting households and businesses earning less than $400K. The bill specifically earmarks $46 billion for enforcement which includes hiring enforcement agents, legal support, and “investigative technologies.” Historically, most enforcement activity has been aimed at those making less than $200K and there is not reason to believe that will change.

To the extent anyone wants to believe Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen’s statement is a binding promise (which it’s not), her choice of words are worth noting.

“Specifically, I direct that any additional resources — including any new personnel or auditors that are hired — shall not be used to increase the share of small business or households below the $400,000 threshold that are audited relative to historical levels.”

 

[Rightguide]

The Democrats are building a federal police state.

 

[Counselor706]

The White House is engaged in a heated battle with conservatives over what impact a new spending bill will have on the IRS, how much the agency will grow, and who will become the target of the agency's strengthened enforcement muscles.

Republicans have come out in force claiming the opposite — that the bill will result in increased audits for taxpayers at all income levels.

They point to a Joint Committee on Taxation report that estimates between 78%-90% of new money raised will come from tax filers reporting less than $200,000 in income, with only 4%-9% coming from those earning more than $500,000.

A Congressional Budget Office post similarly concedes that the audit rate would rise for all taxpayers if the IRS receives more funding.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/white-house/biden-no-new-audits

 

[ll74]

Biden and Treasury officials can make as many toothless, nuanced and contradictory promises they want, but the single source of the truth is the language in the bill itself. There is nothing in the bill prohibiting more audits or other means of targeting households and businesses earning less than $400K. The bill specifically earmarks $46 billion for enforcement which includes hiring enforcement agents, legal support, and “investigative technologies.” Historically, most enforcement activity has been aimed at those making less than $200K and there is not reason to believe that will change.

To the extent anyone wants to believe Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen’s statement is a binding promise (which it’s not), her choice of words are worth noting.

“Specifically, I direct that any additional resources — including any new personnel or auditors that are hired — shall not be used to increase the share of small business or households below the $400,000 threshold that are audited relative to historical levels.”

And there's absolutely no language in the bill that increases the typical auditing that the IRS performs.

Your spin is meant to push the incorrect assertion that the IRS will target medium and low income people more than they typically would. Having more resources to do the regular job which has been unable to be done because of lack of resources is what the bill accomplishes.

Add to it that there are more resources dedicated to modernizing antiquated systems that have led to bottlenecks.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

No

And there's absolutely no language in the bill that increases the typical auditing that the IRS performs.

Your spin is meant to push the incorrect assertion that the IRS will target medium and low income people more than they typically would. Having more resources to do the regular job which has been unable to be done because of lack of resources is what the bill accomplishes.

Add to it that there are more resources dedicated to modernizing antiquated systems that have led to bottlenecks.

No. I said most of the $46 billion earmarked for enforcement will target the same individuals and businesses they have historically targeted. Ironically Janet Yellen said the same, and historical IRS data shows which income brackets those groups fall into. Mostly under $200K. Try to keep up.

 

[ll74]

No

No. I said most of the $46 billion earmarked for enforcement will target the same individuals and businesses they have historically targeted. Ironically Janet Yellen said the same, and historical IRS data shows which income brackets those groups fall into. Mostly under $200K. Try to keep up.

It targets people who owe taxes. There's truly no reason to go deeper than that. Unless you need to spin to your narrative....which you do. it doesn't raise their taxes or target them because of this bill.

The bill will be signed next week. Good luck with your narrative.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

It targets people who owe taxes. There's truly no reason to go deeper than that. Unless you need to spin to your narrative....which you do. it doesn't raise their taxes or target them because of this bill.

The bill will be signed next week. Good luck with your narrative.

Nobody said it doesn’t target people who owe taxes. (Well actually you did when you originally claimed it was intended for refunds, but we can ignore that. Lol). Of course it’s intended to target people they believe owe taxes, and as you continue to overlook, those efforts historically target people making under $200K.

 

[ll74]

Nobody said it doesn’t target people who owe taxes. (Well actually you did when you originally claimed it was intended for refunds, but we can ignore that. Lol). Of course it’s intended to target people they believe owe taxes, and as you continue to overlook, those efforts historically target people making under $200K.

I'm not overlooking anything. It's just not an issue to me. Those people already owed taxes.

You're intending to make the bill out to be something it isn't by obfuscating facts.

It is not doing anything new regarding taxes and the IRS isn't creating some new task force to target medium and low income citizens. The only reason you bring up incomee levels is to infer that something different is happening because of this bill. All that is new is that the IRS has more resources to do their job and they will also have resources to modernize their job.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

I'm not overlooking anything. It's just not an issue to me. Those people already owed taxes.

You're intending to make the bill out to be something it isn't by obfuscating facts.

It is not doing anything new regarding taxes and the IRS isn't creating some new task force to target medium and low income citizens. The only reason you bring up incomee levels is to infer that something different is happening because of this bill. All that is new is that the IRS has more resources to do their job and they will also have resources to modernize their job.

1. My post obviously is an issue with you.
2. Monitoring and tracking taxable activities, and auditing tax returns does mean all subjects of those actions owe taxes.
3. They are stepping up enforcement activity from $66 billion to $11.7 billion. That is $46 billion in new funding. More agents, legal support, something the Congressional Research Service calls “investigative technology” (they use the quotation marks) and possibly investments for cryptocurrency taxation. This is all net new money and resources.
4. Business technology modernization, taxpayer services, operations support are separate not included in the new $46 billion. Those are separate categories.

Sorry it’s so difficult for you to understand this.

 

[ll74]

1. My post obviously is an issue with you.
2. Monitoring and tracking taxable activities, and auditing tax returns does mean all subjects of those actions owe taxes.
3. They are stepping up enforcement activity from $66 billion to $11.7 billion. That is $46 billion in new funding. More agents, legal support, something the Congressional Research Service calls “investigative technology” (they use the quotation marks) and possibly investments for cryptocurrency taxation. This is all net new money and resources.
4. Business technology modernization, taxpayer services, operations support are separate not included in the new $46 billion. Those are separate categories.

Sorry it’s so difficult for you to understand this.

1.Of course it is, because it's dishonest.
2. semantics
3. Yes, because they have a backlog
4. Yep

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

Why would anyone actually be worried about this. Trump has been under IRS investigation for a decade and they can’t find anything to actually charge him with. If they can’t get Trump, and that’s the guy they want to get, how would they get anyone?

 

[colddiesel]

A few inconvenient facts, very easily found.

IRS staff numbers dropped 13% from 2012 to 2020 to about 80,000.
33% reduction in audit staff since 2013.
28% of all staff are eligible to retire in next two years.
Less auditors now than there were 69 years ago(1953) when the economy was 1/7 of what it is now.
2/3 of all the IRS staff are women, and 10,000 are temporary contractors.
The attrition rate for permanent employees is approaching 28% pa.

The whole tax system will collapse without staff and budget increases.

 

[MarcvsAvrelivs]

I did put lead into the center of the coinage, but it was only to give it more weight at the market.

 

[MarcvsAvrelivs]

A few inconvenient facts, very easily found.

IRS staff numbers dropped 13% from 2012 to 2020 to about 80,000.
33% reduction in audit staff since 2013.
28% of all staff are eligible to retire in next two years.
Less auditors now than there were 69 years ago(1953) when the economy was 1/7 of what it is now.
2/3 of all the IRS staff are women, and 10,000 are temporary contractors.
The attrition rate for permanent employees is approaching 28% pa.

The whole tax system will collapse without staff and budget increases.

Please factor in technology and the electronic audit.
The whole tax system should collapse.
It is built upon premise faulty.

Income should not be taxed. Commercial activity should be taxed.
A citizen that gets to keep its income spends or invests those proceeds.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Joe Biden and the Democrats are fucking liars. They say those new 87,000 IRS agents are going to go after the billionaires. There are at present 664 billionaires in the US. so are they going to assign 130 IRS agents to each of those billionaires? Think again and get ready to be oppressed.

Yep, it’s BS. They are going to increase enforcement on all taxpayer groups consistent with historical distribution, which historically targets those earning less than $200K the most.

The WH is also spewing BS about how much will be raised over the next decade. The Congressional Budget Office projects the gain at roughly $120 billion between 2022 and 2031, while the Biden administration pegs it at roughly $400 billion.Lol.

The good news, as reported in today’s WSJ, is much of the money likely to never get spent.