Free?

[BotanyBoy]

Candi's delusions deepen.

 

[Que]

How many uneducated and unskilled workers in an economy not set up to exploit either do you figure we should import to really get this capitalism thing moving along?

What is it about being an illegal immigrant that in your view tends to make them more successful at growing the economy while being uneducated and unskilled versus say native born Americans with no education and no skills?

 

[Ramone45]

I favor free health care until they are deported which should take no longer than a week.

 

[HisArpy]

Candi's delusions deepen.

This.

I mean, the guy basically admits in this thread he doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about, and that IN FACT Que was correct about Medi-Cal receiving Fed monies. But he just blithely continues on with the same old, same old as if what he just admitted never happened.

I think maybe it's the moonshine he's drinking or something. That shit's nasty and it'll rot your brain before your liver gives out.

I wonder how people feel knowing that the 6th largest economy in the world NEEDS the tax dollars of hard working people who live/work in less well off States in order to balance their budget just so that illegal immigrants can be given the FREE HEALTH CARE that they themselves can't get or have?

 

[HisArpy]

I favor free health care until they are deported which should take no longer than a week.

2 points here:

1. If you make that the policy, they'll wait until they get sick, step across the border, get their diseases and disorders fixed, then go home courtesy of the American Taxpayer; and,

2. Why a week? 2 hours ought to be more than enough time to point them at the border and tell them to run for it.

 

[CandiCame]

How many uneducated and unskilled workers in an economy not set up to exploit either do you figure we should import to really get this capitalism thing moving along?

What is it about being an illegal immigrant that in your view tends to make them more successful at growing the economy while being uneducated and unskilled versus say native born Americans with no education and no skills?

There's actually a shitton of reasons that all combine into the clusterfuck we have created that makes it the case of why it's economically better to get your unskilled labor, particularly your unskilled agricultural labor, from these immigrants rather than citizens, and they're all pretty fucked up and make me want to take a rifle to a clocktower. Keep in mind that I'm not saying the way our economy is set up is GOOD, I'm just not willing to lie about it like you do.

The fact that Americans think they're too good to do it and the government provides protections for citizens that they won't provide for anybody else. That's the difference. It's not ethical, because, as I said before, I live in a late-state capitalism dystopian hellscape and a lot of people are just cool with ignoring that.

An American working the same job, making the same money as an undocumented worker is eligible for tax and social benefits that an undocumented worker is not. They can get, for example, a child tax credit, or an earned income credit. These are refundable credits, so they'll sometimes (especially at my desk) wind up getting more back than they paid in. But because immigrants aren't eligible for that, they pay more than they take out, even when they take advantage of the few social programs, like emergency room visits, that they are allowed to take advantage of.

Citizens are also eligible for social benefits that undocumented workers are not, things like WIC, housing subsidies, EBT, etc.

Now is it ethically ok that immigrants don't get these tax and social benefits despite paying into the system? No. Absolutely not. It's fucking deplorable that we'd force one mother to go to the ER and another gets a suite with a pull-out couch because one's got a government assigned number the other doesn't like we're living straight out of the book of revelations, but that's how that ACTUALLY works, so let's just call it like it is. Whoever wrote that code is going to hell, but it's the code we have.

Also, our pool of unskilled labor is just too low because your generation bitches at my generation because we won't have enough kids to fill that gap. There simply aren't enough people in that pool. We have to either fill it with immigration or start fucking like rabbits. 2018 was the fourth year in a row that our birthrate dropped, and, coincidentally, the fourth year in a row I didn't have any more kids. That doesn't mean anything, it just is a weird coincidence.

Our citizen birthrate is dropping at a time when the global birthrate is skyrocketing, because, and I cannot stress this enough, we don't want to have kids. We can't fucking afford them. Y'all keep asking why we ain't having kids like we're gonna have a different answer. I couldn't sell my organs and pay for her college. I hope she marries rich. Both her parents are hot so it's like... at least she'll be pretty, and economically that's important. Attractive people do receive financial benefits, economists call it beauty privilege but that's not important here. What is important is we aren't producing enough citizens to fill the jobs that need to be filled in the unskilled labor sector for capitalism to work. If every uneducated redneck moved to California to harvest grain, there still wouldn't be enough people to do it. It would rot on the vine.

But the thing is, we ain't gonna do that. Americans would rather be unemployed than work the jobs in the conditions immigrants currently work. We would literally rather starve than do what we're asking these people to do.

Which goes back to what I said about how fucking unethical it is and how we shouldn't have ANYBODY working in those conditions, especially because Agriculture is still exempt from child labor laws, so as you can see from the statistics about half the people out there with no shade and water are fucking children. It's unacceptable.

Speaking of children, though, no one except you on the planet is arguing that we don't need a huge influx of unskilled labor in order for capitalism to work, even the other diehard republicans. This is a basic backbone, like elementary level shit economics. It's so fucking wild to me that you're arguing that.

The issue is that if we don't want slaves, which is what we had and decided against because Jesus fucking Christ we should have never let it get that bad, then we have to use immigrants. And if we're not gonna use immigrants, what's the next step? I don't know, I think we need the immigrants and just give them humane conditions, but the Tea Party apparently has an idea, and it's to bring back street urchins.

The argument goes that if we included both adults and children as young as 12, lower minimum wage to $5.25 and do away with safety regulations, we could fill the gap.

That doesn't math, because of the low birth rate, which is where their idea about doing away with family planning services like abortion and birth control come in. Pump those kids out and put them in the fucking fields instead of school.

And so far, that is the ONLY idea I've seen that maths. Like I'll give then this: their numbers actually add up. But they're making a HUGE leap of faith by assuming that everyone is as shitty a person as they are, and will actually provide that child labor. We won't. Millenials would rather go abstinent then have kids we can't afford. We can go without sex if it means we don't have to play that. And remember that millenials are hitting 30. We're the childbearing generation. This plan won't work.

And it's the ONLY plan.

So right now we need the immigrants, or we need somebody to look at the REAL numbers, not fake one you make up and then provides link saying you made it up listing 1/5th instead of 1/3 and shit, real, actual numbers, and come up with a better plan.

We need a huge pool of unskilled workers to provide labor, labor as a consumable under capitalism, and we're not gonna fuck um into existence. They HAVE to come from somewhere or the whole system falls apart.

So here's my plan: treat them like citizens. Tell these factory farm corporations that they have to treat ALL people like people. That'll do a lot; first of all, it would stop this incentive to hire immigrants over Americans. Second of all, it would allow American to get the benefits they correctly believe they deserve, and humane working conditions, so that it would actually be a viable option and people would be willing to work it, again, forcing these corporations not to incentivize immigrants. Thirdly, let the immigrants have access to the same pool of resources as citizens. That'll narrow the gap until it's almost nonexistent, and make the entire pool cheaper for everyone because they'll have access to things like safety regulations and preventative care, which are cheaper to treat. This model does presume that because of the low birth rate, we are still going to have immigration to cover the gap, but it doesn't provide incentive for these corporations to hire immigrants OVER citizens like it does now.

Basically, we need to shift the cost away from government and onto corporations. We need to stop subsidizing their workforce, and stop incentivizing them to hire people who will put up with bullshit. This should be on THEM, not on us.

 

[CandiCame]

This.

I mean, the guy basically admits in this thread he doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about, and that IN FACT Que was correct about Medi-Cal receiving Fed monies. But he just blithely continues on with the same old, same old as if what he just admitted never happened.

I think maybe it's the moonshine he's drinking or something. That shit's nasty and it'll rot your brain before your liver gives out.

I wonder how people feel knowing that the 6th largest economy in the world NEEDS the tax dollars of hard working people who live/work in less well off States in order to balance their budget just so that illegal immigrants can be given the FREE HEALTH CARE that they themselves can't get or have?

I already proved that states with higher numbers of undocumented workers are subsidizing states with lower numbers of undocumented workers.

And I included the federal aid that medi-cal gets in my calculations, far from glossing over it, I proved that even with that money they're paying out more than they're taking. I did the calculations in a post.

Y'all really will just lie about shit.

 

[HisArpy]

There's actually a shitton of reasons that all combine into the clusterfuck we have created that makes it the case of why it's economically better to get your unskilled labor, particularly your unskilled agricultural labor, from these immigrants rather than citizens, and they're all pretty fucked up and make me want to take a rifle to a clocktower. Keep in mind that I'm not saying the way our economy is set up is GOOD, I'm just not willing to lie about it like you do.

The fact that Americans think they're too good to do it and the government provides protections for citizens that they won't provide for anybody else. That's the difference. It's not ethical, because, as I said before, I live in a late-state capitalism dystopian hellscape and a lot of people are just cool with ignoring that.

An American working the same job, making the same money as an undocumented worker is eligible for tax and social benefits that an undocumented worker is not. They can get, for example, a child tax credit, or an earned income credit. These are refundable credits, so they'll sometimes (especially at my desk) wind up getting more back than they paid in. But because immigrants aren't eligible for that, they pay more than they take out, even when they take advantage of the few social programs, like emergency room visits, that they are allowed to take advantage of.

Citizens are also eligible for social benefits that undocumented workers are not, things like WIC, housing subsidies, EBT, etc.

Now is it ethically ok that immigrants don't get these tax and social benefits despite paying into the system? No. Absolutely not. It's fucking deplorable that we'd force one mother to go to the ER and another gets a suite with a pull-out couch because one's got a government assigned number the other doesn't like we're living straight out of the book of revelations, but that's how that ACTUALLY works, so let's just call it like it is. Whoever wrote that code is going to hell, but it's the code we have.

Also, our pool of unskilled labor is just too low because your generation bitches at my generation because we won't have enough kids to fill that gap. There simply aren't enough people in that pool. We have to either fill it with immigration or start fucking like rabbits. 2018 was the fourth year in a row that our birthrate dropped, and, coincidentally, the fourth year in a row I didn't have any more kids. That doesn't mean anything, it just is a weird coincidence.

Our citizen birthrate is dropping at a time when the global birthrate is skyrocketing, because, and I cannot stress this enough, we don't want to have kids. We can't fucking afford them. Y'all keep asking why we ain't having kids like we're gonna have a different answer. I couldn't sell my organs and pay for her college. I hope she marries rich. Both her parents are hot so it's like... at least she'll be pretty, and economically that's important. Attractive people do receive financial benefits, economists call it beauty privilege but that's not important here. What is important is we aren't producing enough citizens to fill the jobs that need to be filled in the unskilled labor sector for capitalism to work. If every uneducated redneck moved to California to harvest grain, there still wouldn't be enough people to do it. It would rot on the vine.

But the thing is, we ain't gonna do that. Americans would rather be unemployed than work the jobs in the conditions immigrants currently work. We would literally rather starve than do what we're asking these people to do.

Which goes back to what I said about how fucking unethical it is and how we shouldn't have ANYBODY working in those conditions, especially because Agriculture is still exempt from child labor laws, so as you can see from the statistics about half the people out there with no shade and water are fucking children. It's unacceptable.

Speaking of children, though, no one except you on the planet is arguing that we don't need a huge influx of unskilled labor in order for capitalism to work, even the other diehard republicans. This is a basic backbone, like elementary level shit economics. It's so fucking wild to me that you're arguing that.

The issue is that if we don't want slaves, which is what we had and decided against because Jesus fucking Christ we should have never let it get that bad, then we have to use immigrants. And if we're not gonna use immigrants, what's the next step? I don't know, I think we need the immigrants and just give them humane conditions, but the Tea Party apparently has an idea, and it's to bring back street urchins.

The argument goes that if we included both adults and children as young as 12, lower minimum wage to $5.25 and do away with safety regulations, we could fill the gap.

That doesn't math, because of the low birth rate, which is where their idea about doing away with family planning services like abortion and birth control come in. Pump those kids out and put them in the fucking fields instead of school.

And so far, that is the ONLY idea I've seen that maths. Like I'll give then this: their numbers actually add up. But they're making a HUGE leap of faith by assuming that everyone is as shitty a person as they are, and will actually provide that child labor. We won't. Millenials would rather go abstinent then have kids we can't afford. We can go without sex if it means we don't have to play that. And remember that millenials are hitting 30. We're the childbearing generation. This plan won't work.

And it's the ONLY plan.

So right now we need the immigrants, or we need somebody to look at the REAL numbers, not fake one you make up and then provides link saying you made it up listing 1/5th instead of 1/3 and shit, real, actual numbers, and come up with a better plan.

We need a huge pool of unskilled workers to provide labor, labor as a consumable under capitalism, and we're not gonna fuck um into existence. They HAVE to come from somewhere or the whole system falls apart.

So here's my plan: treat them like citizens. Tell these factory farm corporations that they have to treat ALL people like people. That'll do a lot; first of all, it would stop this incentive to hire immigrants over Americans. Second of all, it would allow American to get the benefits they correctly believe they deserve, and humane working conditions, so that it would actually be a viable option and people would be willing to work it, again, forcing these corporations not to incentivize immigrants. Thirdly, let the immigrants have access to the same pool of resources as citizens. That'll narrow the gap until it's almost nonexistent, and make the entire pool cheaper for everyone because they'll have access to things like safety regulations and preventative care, which are cheaper to treat. This model does presume that because of the low birth rate, we are still going to have immigration to cover the gap, but it doesn't provide incentive for these corporations to hire immigrants OVER citizens like it does now.

Basically, we need to shift the cost away from government and onto corporations. We need to stop subsidizing their workforce, and stop incentivizing them to hire people who will put up with bullshit. This should be on THEM, not on us.

So, you want to pay MORE for your food and other items you purchase? You WANT higher utility bills? And at the same time you're OKAY WITH poor roads, schools, and less public services?

Or, are you trying to tell us you want all of that PLUS "higher taxes" to pay for those declining public services?

 

[CandiCame]

So, you want to pay MORE for your food and other items you purchase? You WANT higher utility bills? And at the same time you're OKAY WITH poor roads, schools, and less public services?

Or, are you trying to tell us you want all of that PLUS "higher taxes" to pay for those declining public services?

Again, we could stop subsidizing JUST Wal-mart and cover our healthcare costs for the entire country. I went over this already. Either read the whole thread or hush.

The cost of immigration is negligible. The real problem is the way the entire corporate tax system is handled. If we cut out those subsidies, if we made them pay for their own workforce, we would see a surplus, not a deficient. Under these suggestions individual taxes would go down.

Sales tax would likely go down too, in specific areas affected, but not federally. Like the places who see those changes would likely have lower sales taxes but it would take more huberis than I have to say that there would be a noticeable instant change.

But in terms of income tax, yes, we could see an overall decrease with no change in services because they'd be more than offset by the corporate taxes, by 40-something percent. I can't remember exactly but I included a chart in one of my other posts.

Edit: Also, not for nothing but I wouldn't notice an uptick in my utility bills even if you didn't have it ass-backwards because I'm off the grid. Idk how people keep forgetting that given I know I have to give off a 'crazy man in the woods' vibe. I mean, I pay for internet and I reckon they are going up. They seem to just do whatever they want. But they wouldn't be affected by this, they just don't wanna run line up my holler because there aren't a lot of people up here. But in terms of like, food prices and the like you wouldn't see a noticeable difference.

 

[InsightRiot]

I'm actually starting to think we should maybe try some Candi style government. The world is overpopulated with a bunch of maladaptive, dygenic people. War would end the DNA of good people, and the rejects would be left behind to repopulate. Communism-esque government would starve out the worst DNA.

However, you never know, in this clown world we may do everything in our power to keep those people alive.

 

[Kantarii]

Quote from Endgame: All the money in the world never bought a second of time. Paraphrased: All the money in the world can’t fix fucking stupid - and giving away free shit to non citizens when we have people here who are citizenS that deserve it and don’t get it is FUCKIN” STUPID.

Fuck the Democrats, their hypocrisy and stupid pipedreams.
Kantp

 

[CandiCame]

Quote from Endgame: All the money in the world never bought a second of time. Paraphrased: All the money in the world can’t fix fucking stupid - and giving away free shit to non citizens when we have people here who are citizenS that deserve it and don’t get it is FUCKIN” STUPID.

Fuck the Democrats, their hypocrisy and stupid pipedreams.
Kantp

So no math, sources, or anything, huh?

Weird how that keeps happening.

Y'all just proclaim shit like that makes it true with jack and shit to back it up.

 

[cowslinger64]

Quote from Endgame: All the money in the world never bought a second of time. Paraphrased: All the money in the world can’t fix fucking stupid - and giving away free shit to non citizens when we have people here who are citizenS that deserve it and don’t get it is FUCKIN” STUPID.

Fuck the Democrats, their hypocrisy and stupid pipedreams.
Kantp

While I disagree with this particular policy, your anger at the dems regarding Healthcare is extremely misplaced...surely you are aware of the gop plans of fuck you and die....and the fuck you, I GOT MINE!

Not to mention their disdain for gays, transgenders, cross dressing and non Christians...

Why in the world would someone like you support them? Are you that ignorant?

 

[BotanyBoy]

Y'all just proclaim shit like that makes it true with jack and shit to back it up.

Candi projects again.....

 

[CandiCame]

While I disagree with this particular policy, your anger at the dems regarding Healthcare is extremely misplaced...surely you are aware of the gop plans of fuck you and die....and the fuck you, I GOT MINE!

Not to mention their disdain for gays, transgenders, cross dressing and non Christians...

Why in the world would someone like you support them? Are you that ignorant?

Some people don't love themselves.

 

[Que]

So no math, sources, or anything, huh?

Weird how that keeps happening.

Y'all just proclaim shit like that makes it true with jack and shit to back it up.

You claim to be a f****** accountant.

Poor people who are American citizens cost the government mote in per capita expenditures than the government collects from them ...that's how it works you f****** idiot.

Take a poor person strip them of their citizenship and they don't suddenly contribute more to the coffers then it cost for them to be residents, wherever the f*** they live, you f****** idiot.

Take the entire budget for every goddamn penny that gets spent in the state of California by local county state and federal government. Do you have the f****** number, you f****** idiot? I don't but you claim to. California's expenditures as a STATE is 180 BILLION (Some of which it gets from the feds, but not including direct money spent by the Feds directly in California which is the most powerful acquirer of govt pork, such as defense plants and the like ..)

Now, divide that f****** number by the f****** number people in f****** California. (39,560,000)

JUST Califormia's per resident expenditures for JUST the State of California, not including local county and fed money directly spent there is $4,500 per resident, legal and not legal.

It is HIGHER than $375.

Pretty much any f****** example that I can possibly give you blows you out of the goddamn water you f****** idiot.

Take a small hard-working landscaper in California. He's got a f****** pickup truck and he's got a lawnmower, a leaf blower, some rakes, a hedge trimmer, and a weedeater... he doesn't pay one goddamn dime in taxes and he's got two kids. Each of those two kids cost the local school district about $30,000 a year to educate. That's just f****** education. That doesn't count the roads that he drives his pickup truck down that doesn't count the sidewalks. That doesn't count the police department or even the traffic engineering department to put the light bulbs in the traffic lights you f****** idiot.

Poor people, (citizens or not) are net expenses, not net revenue to the various government coffers because ACCOUNTING.

Next you will be telling me that homeless people increase the wealth of a locale because they aren't using up homes.

 

[HisArpy]

You claim to be a f****** accountant.

Poor people who are American citizens cost the government mote in per capita expenditures than the government collects from them ...that's how it works you f****** idiot.

Take a poor person strip them of their citizenship and they don't suddenly contribute more to the coffers then it cost for them to be residents, wherever the f*** they live, you f****** idiot.

Take the entire budget for every goddamn penny that gets spent in the state of California by local county state and federal government. Do you have the f****** number, you f****** idiot? I don't but you claim to. California's expenditures as a STATE is 180 BILLION (Some of which it gets from the feds, but not including direct money spent by the Feds directly in California which is the most powerful acquirer of govt pork, such as defense plants and the like ..)

Now, divide that f****** number by the f****** number people in f****** California. (39,560,000)

JUST Califormia's per resident expenditures for JUST the State of California, not including local county and fed money directly spent there is $4,500 per resident, legal and not legal.

It is HIGHER than $375.

Pretty much any f****** example that I can possibly give you blows you out of the goddamn water you f****** idiot.

Take a small hard-working landscaper in California. He's got a f****** pickup truck and he's got a lawnmower, a leaf blower, some rakes, a hedge trimmer, and a weedeater... he doesn't pay one goddamn dime in taxes and he's got two kids. Each of those two kids cost the local school district about $30,000 a year to educate. That's just f****** education. That doesn't count the roads that he drives his pickup truck down that doesn't count the sidewalks. That doesn't count the police department or even the traffic engineering department to put the light bulbs in the traffic lights you f****** idiot.

Poor people, (citizens or not) are net expenses, not net revenue to the various government coffers because ACCOUNTING.

Next you will be telling me that homeless people increase the wealth of a locale because they aren't using up homes.

Now now, don't blow a gasket. Candi's game is to fuck things up by missing several of the key indicators of the conversation then make it all about him.

He wants to tax WalMart in order to eliminate illegal immigration. I'm scratching my head over that one. I guess he believes that raising taxes will lower the retail price of the product on the shelves. Or something like that anyway.

ILLEGAL immigration is a problem. The problem is that the "legal" immigration numbers are too low by half AND work visa's are way way way too low. What we need to do is increase legal immigration by 1 million/year AND set up a guest worker program so that foreign nationals can come and work for a limited period of time then they have to leave and reapply for a new visa, in their home country, in person.

From there, E-verify needs to be up and running with added penalties for employing illegal immigrants or visa workers past the expiration date on their work permit.

These things would keep production costs low and allow bigger immigration opportunities for those who want to come here and become citizens.

But Candi, and the rest of the progressives, want to tax WalMart so that illegal immigrants don't have to work for low wages. Like that's going to disincentivize anything.

 

[cowslinger64]

Poor people who are American citizens cost the government mote in per capita expenditures than the government collects from them ...that's how it works you f****** idiot.

While disregarding the rest of your crap... here's a question.

How much do YOU cost the state of Arizona, Mr. Stagnant Wages?

 

[Que]

Now now, don't blow a gasket. Candi's game is to fuck things up by missing several of the key indicators of the conversation then make it all about him.

He wants to tax WalMart in order to eliminate illegal immigration. I'm scratching my head over that one. I guess he believes that raising taxes will lower the retail price of the product on the shelves. Or something like that anyway.

ILLEGAL immigration is a problem. The problem is that the "legal" immigration numbers are too low by half AND work visa's are way way way too low. What we need to do is increase legal immigration by 1 million/year AND set up a guest worker program so that foreign nationals can come and work for a limited period of time then they have to leave and reapply for a new visa, in their home country, in person.

From there, E-verify needs to be up and running with added penalties for employing illegal immigrants or visa workers past the expiration date on their work permit.

These things would keep production costs low and allow bigger immigration opportunities for those who want to come here and become citizens.

But Candi, and the rest of the progressives, want to tax WalMart so that illegal immigrants don't have to work for low wages. Like that's going to disincentivize anything.

During the last 15 years (with the exception of the Trump recovery which should have been the Obama recovery with all of that delayed consumer demand) the only growth in employment was in immigrant employment. HB1 visas are hugely abused.

With strict enforcement on hiring of illegals, employment and wages would have risen.

There is no such thing as a job Americans dont want won't do. 5here ate jobs Americans won't do for the price illegals will.

Employers are not just hiring illegal aliens because of how cheap they are. Often illegals are paid pretty much about the same amount that an average American citizen would get for the same job. The difference is with an illegal you don't have to worry about workman's compensation claims you don't have to pay work men's Compensation Insurance, you don't have to worry about unemployment claims, you don't have to pay unemployment insurance, ditto for actual health insurance. Doodle for overtime wages. Ditto for short pay for inclement weather cancellation. You also don't have to worry about them getting a big pickup truck putting some lettering on the side and competing with you next week once you get them good and trained.

There are other incentives although the above does not apply when you're hiring a guest worker on a work bisa.

Given the strength of the Trump economy it is possible that we now do need to import some Engineers. But we sure as hell didn't need to do that for the last 10 years. But all the big Democratic donors running big tech companies have been doing nothing but hiring Asian Engineers on work visas because they're far cheaper than American graduated engineers.

 

[BotanyBoy]

While disregarding the rest of your crap... here's a question.

How much do YOU cost the state of Arizona, Mr. Stagnant Wages?

Shit talking because you can't dispute the facts.

When will the lower 47% start paying their fair share???

 

[Que]

While disregarding the rest of your crap... here's a question.

How much do YOU cost the state of Arizona, Mr. Stagnant Wages?

Why do you make things up? My wages are not stagnant because I'm no longer living in the Obama economy. I don't know if you've noticed but during the Trump economy there has been a major boom which is why even a layabout lazy f****** Union hack such as yourself isn't sitting around the union hall right now when by all rights, since Michigan is now a right to work state, you should be sitting on your ass while a bus load of illegal immigrants from Arizona are doing your f****** job you f****** dumbass.

That said, unlike Luke and yourself I don't embellish my financial situation nor have I made any attempt whatsoever to suggest otherwise.

My RISING income (not actual wages, mr beholden to the union hall calling you up) is not likely in top 50% of Arizonans, especially counting retirees so I would EXPECT that I am probably a net taker of government services. That has not always been the case, historically, and will not be in the future.

I take far less than I could. No doubt because I don't accept any direct benefits. If I find myself seriously I'll or injured I will avail myself of the stupidity that is the no preexisting condition exclusion requirement of Obamacare, get coverage, get treated and immediately drop it, because that us how you idiots set it up.

Since I don't eat like Rob, I am pretty healthy.

I use streets, municipal water, which is.pribsblt not at true cost, but might be in AZ for conservation reasons, so I enjoy police protection and fire and so on...like anyone else.

One son at ASU. Some of that is likely subsidized. One daughter still in grammar school...heavily subsidized. That is paid by property taxes. The ENTIRE tax bill for my entire block doesn't pay for one child.

Which is why Candi (and you) are idiots.

No illegal alien making less than me pays what it costs for one more resident in my city. Population costs. Services cost. Roads cost. Ambulances sitting around waiting just in case we need them cause. You figure out how many ambulances you need based on how many residents you have whether or not those residents are legal or not.

 

[Que]

Shit talking because you can't dispute the facts.

When will the lower 47% start paying their fair share???

Exactly. I assume I am probably in the 47%. For now. Not because greedy capitalism put me there, but because I could be more nimble, but instead stat too long un whatever it us I am doing because I am change averse.

Had Obama just gotten the f*** out of the way and just bask in the glory of what would have been known as the Obama recovery by just keeping the f*** out of the way the real estate market would have come back after all the banks took it in the shorts like they should have for making loans to people who could not afford to repay the loans.

Can you imagine how much work there would have been buying and selling real estate and in my case a praising all of those deals with those bargain-basement prices that should have been easily available to anybody who did have the means to buy?

I also hang in there when the price of copper was dropping despite the fact that that's what I was earning my living doing.

I then decided to go completely Against the Grain with my next Endeavor and paid the price for that. Paying my dues though painful is paying off now. For now. And frankly I should get out and move on and probably will.

But none of any of that including Obama stupidity is really the government's responsibility. The government sets up whatever stupid rules they want and my job is to exploit them.

 

[Kantarii]

So no math, sources, or anything, huh?

Weird how that keeps happening.

Y'all just proclaim shit like that makes it true with jack and shit to back it up.

If you want numbers, either read an arithmetic book or a phone book.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Exactly. I assume I am probably in the 47%. For now. Not because greedy capitalism put me there, but because I could be more nimble, but instead stat too long un whatever it us I am doing because I am change averse.

Had Obama just gotten the f*** out of the way and just bask in the glory of what would have been known as the Obama recovery by just keeping the f*** out of the way the real estate market would have come back after all the banks took it in the shorts like they should have for making loans to people who could not afford to repay the loans.

Can you imagine how much work there would have been buying and selling real estate and in my case a praising all of those deals with those bargain-basement prices that should have been easily available to anybody who did have the means to buy?

I also hang in there when the price of copper was dropping despite the fact that that's what I was earning my living doing.

I then decided to go completely Against the Grain with my next Endeavor and paid the price for that. Paying my dues though painful is paying off now. For now. And frankly I should get out and move on and probably will.

But none of any of that including Obama stupidity is really the government's responsibility. The government sets up whatever stupid rules they want and my job is to exploit them.

I thought about getting into a different gig, moving this past spring would have been the perfect time to do it. But I'm a grower, it's what I do to pay the bills on my lifestyle and figuring out a new game was daunting and scary. Going back to my first chosen profession seemed thrilling but high risk.

Instead of changing my game I just changed stock and re-invested in fresh infrastructure. Summer beds/pads and a new state of the shit hot art deep winter green house.

I might not pay taxes for a couple years writing it all off/forward......but plants will sell and I'll be doing the do that I love to do and no doubt paying taxes again even if you count my military retirement pay as a tax break.

 

[RobDownSouth]

That’s where you’re wrong. I’m not upset.

Of course you're not upset, dearie. You simply want to stir things up.
Like the GB's Ur-Tranny NotAJ says, "tee hee!"

I don’t plan on voting for a Democrat in the next 40+ years give or take the possibility I appear in one of your obituary threads.

"40+ years" would be a stretch, no? One thinks your remaining years will be akin to your ex-wives, to wit: nasty, brutish and short.