For those who assume supporting a Trump presidency over a Biden one means being a MAGA Trumper....

JaySecrets

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I am pretty exhausted with those who can't seem to separate support for a person's policies, or at least many of them, from blanket support for a man. Agreement on some key points does not, nor has it ever, equated to a cult following. For example, I agree with much of the moral teachings of Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses and could have a very good conversation about the state of society today. But I could never join with them on any other level because there are key components to their teachings that I consider to be dangerous and that make them horrible cults. In many ways, cults of personality are worse.

So, for those of you who are unable to distinguish enough to have a nuanced conversation, I am going to post here four MAJOR areas where I disagree with Trump's stated platform. I understand that on three of these issues it's because I don't think he goes far enough or gives too much, but that alone makes the point that I do not consider, nor have I ever considered, him a conservative in any sense of the word. He is a populist and a pragmatist. But I do prefer him over the alternative currently out there.

Having said all that, here are my four points of major DISAGREEMENT with Trump.

1: His stance on tariffs. He did this before and I had a major beef then too. Tariffs do not help any economy, not does the intended target of a tariff, especially if they, fairly or unfairly, control much of that market, ever actually take the biggest hit. This should be basic economics 101. When prices go up, the consumer, not the company, is going to pay them. So using tariffs to punish China and other bad actors on the national stage is just a bad idea. It has never worked. If he does this, it will easily at least partially undercut the economic benefits of a Trump presidency.

2: His willingness to leave abortion laws up to the states. Abortion is a human rights issue. A baby is IN a mother's womb, but it is not PART of her body. We know this to be scientifically true. The baby has separate DNA, can be a separate gender, has different needs, and is not legitimately a "my body, my choice" issue. That is a human life. That life, no matter how it is conceived, is precious. There are other options if the mother is in danger, or it was conceived in a horrific way, but to murder a baby because of crimes not its own is horrific. Abortion, taking the life of an innocent, is ALWAYS murder. We would not leave the right to murder a baby 1 hour out of the womb, even born prematurely, up to the states. The location of that baby's body has no bearing on whether or not it should be considered a crime of the most heinous nature. Instead of taking the easy route of leaving it up to the states, there needs to be support for treating murder as murder on a national level. Period.

3. Funding for Israel in their defense, short of actual crimes and corruption, which they have not been part of at least up to this point, should never have even the consideration of qualifiers beyond the consideration of what we can afford. I know there are a LOT of you that will flip out on this statement, but I stand by it. That is a much longer discussion I don't feel the need to get into here. But his willingness to add caveats to funding and aid makes me very nervous.

4. Heavy pushes on the so-called vax for Covid-19. These things are a nightmare and are making things worse. Again, because of the purpose of this thread, I am not going to engage in the debate over the position. There are great threads and posts out there that have that debate. You can make up your own mind on that subject. I am very nervous that a push compromise on this, though, can and will lead to taking away freedom of choice on this issue. As with any vax issue, I believe failure to allow individual and family liberty on this is in fact a fundamental constitutional violation of individual rights and opens the door to far more egregious violations. Give a government an inch, they will take... everything!

There are, of course, other minor issues, but these are huge deals for me. But given the choice between these and dealing with a radical leftist socialist agenda being pushed forward, I have no issues voting for the man. I just want there to be actual conservatives around him to keep him in check.
 
If you vote for a candidate, then you will be complicit in their agenda. Whether you like this or not is irrelevant.

There is no ballot where you can vote for a candidate with a disclaimer
You cannot possibly have read all of what was said as quickly as that. SO what you just posted is knee-jerk reaction. Exactly the opposite of nuanced thought and debate. Unless your intention was to prove my point, you may want to actually read what others have to say, consider it, and give a full, well-thought-out, multi=sentence response. Thank you for your input, though. I appreciate it.
 
You cannot possibly have read all of what was said as quickly as that. SO what you just posted is knee-jerk reaction. Exactly the opposite of nuanced thought and debate. Unless your intention was to prove my point, you may want to actually read what others have to say, consider it, and give a full, well-thought-out, multi=sentence response. Thank you for your input, though. I appreciate it.
Is your discussion meant to be about specific policies or are you just upset that people blanketly call you MAGA?

I read your OP and it seems like the latter.

There have been multiple threads about specific 45 policies.
 
You cannot possibly have read all of what was said as quickly as that. SO what you just posted is knee-jerk reaction. Exactly the opposite of nuanced thought and debate. Unless your intention was to prove my point, you may want to actually read what others have to say, consider it, and give a full, well-thought-out, multi=sentence response. Thank you for your input, though. I appreciate it.
don't be ridiculous

seriously, some of us read and digest things quicker than others, and it took me less than two minutes to read your post, whereas post 2 came 3 minutes after your OP.

you shouldn't judge everyone's abilities to read and comprehend and format on, perhaps, your own.
 
For the record, I don't like generalizing people by their candidate choice. My comment above was not that I believe you agree with any MAGA policies or all of them, but more a reaction of how you presented your topic.

I'm a moderate lefty who gets thrown into multiple buckets that don't fit. It's the nature of polarized political discussion I've just gotten used to.
 
One of many inevitable "waaah - I don't wanna be known as MAGA!!" threads from weak-assed Deplorables we'll see as Trump's fate gets closer to being sealed. 😎

We knew they were coming: The future of Deplorables will be them trying to hide their past: https://forum.literotica.com/thread...ll-be-them-trying-to-hide-their-past.1605322/

Never forget: the party who staunchly defends the practice of profiling, hates to be profiled. Profile the fuck out of them, make it hurt, and laugh while you do. 👍
 
Here's why I'm opposed to Donald Trump:

1. His racism and xenophobia
2. His corruption
3. His misogyny


There are dozens of other good reasons to be opposed to Donald Trump, but the big 3 were obvious 8 years ago, and have only become more obvious since.
 
Here's why I'm opposed to Donald Trump:

1. His racism and xenophobia
2. His corruption
3. His misogyny


There are dozens of other good reasons to be opposed to Donald Trump, but the big 3 were obvious 8 years ago, and have only become more obvious since.
You post those in random order, and not ranked, right? Like who could tell, it's hard to see where his racism ends and his misogyny starts...
 
There are, of course, other minor issues, but these are huge deals for me. But given the choice between these and dealing with a radical leftist socialist agenda being pushed forward, I have no issues voting for the man.

If you’re willing to vote for a candidate that you have “huge deals” with, then that sounds like a personal problem.

And there is no “radical leftist socialist agenda” in the US. That’s right wing propaganda designed to prejudice you against candidates that you don’t have “huge deals” with.
 
Here's why I'm opposed to Donald Trump:

1. His racism and xenophobia
2. His corruption
3. His misogyny


There are dozens of other good reasons to be opposed to Donald Trump, but the big 3 were obvious 8 years ago, and have only become more obvious since.

My biggest problem with Trump and today’s Republican Party is that they are conspiracy nuts.

I will not enable conspiracy lunacy by voting for it.
 
I just want there to be actual conservatives around him to keep him in check.
Think about this for one second. What person could be a good President if he needs people around him to keep him in check????

Like honestly Fisher, did you even think about this for a second????

You could say the say same about Putin, he needs people around him to keep him in check, but guess what, there are none. There won't be any around Trump either.....
 
Think about this for one second. What person could be a good President if he needs people around him to keep him in check????

Like honestly Fisher, did you even think about this for a second????

You could say the say same about Putin, he needs people around him to keep him in check, but guess what, there are none. There won't be any around Trump either.....
45 has publicly stated that those people are the deep state and that he won't be hiring those types if he wins this time around.

Stephen Miller is being floated as attorney general or head of DHS.
 
45 has publicly stated that those people are the deep state and that he won't be hiring those types if he wins this time around.

Stephen Miller is being floated as attorney general or head of DHS.
he's stated that the people he'll hire will be those who agree the 2020 election was stolen from him. so nutjobs or liars-to-get-a-position.

just the bestest peoples!
 
If you vote for a guy who says that he will change the Constitution, make himself dictator, imprison people who disagree with him, who is proud to be against women's rights, goes golfing rather than read security briefings (yet takes the security papers with him when voted out of office), don't be too surprised when people think you support the policies of changing the Constitution, having a dictator, imprisoning political opponents, ending women's rights and degrading national security.
 
To be fair - I believe we had a "why won't you vote for your opponent" thread that was meant (I think) to discuss specific policy disagreements, but it fizzled out quite spectacularly and quickly and I can't find it.

I won't vote for 45 because of a large number of policies and also he's an asshole. I don't agree with Biden on quite a few messaging issues and I'd prefer both just retire.
 
I don't mind wearing the MAGA label, but Making America Great Again is a job for other people now, preferably at least a decade younger. I say other people because it's a job for everyone that wants it done, not just one person.
 
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