Evil Beyond Imagination

[Netzach]

I don't count as Christian, either, so it won't help for me to say I think it's bullshit, either.

Yep. We can go in circles all day long, it doesn't matter.

I want to see every Lutheran and Methodist and Baptist pastor left of Robertson writing letters to the editor about this, talking about it on Sunday, coming down on it as completely freaking unacceptable.

I suspect crickets will be audible now for a while.

 

[WriterDom]

I think if you sent 8 million Jews or Mormons to Haiti in 1850 they would be prosperous now. No matter how the world treated them. Especially the Jews. You could send all the Jews to the moon and as long as they had basic life support they would live long and prosper.

 

[Netzach]

I think if you sent 8 million Jews or Mormons to Haiti in 1850 they would be prosperous now. No matter how the world treated them. Especially the Jews. You could send all the Jews to the moon and as long as they had basic life support they would live long and prosper.

*facepalm*
do you think it's any different being told you can't live here we are thus kicking you out, move along, versus being told, you must live here your entire life and work for us, because we believe you are basically slightly more intelligent than cattle, but more or less cattle?

There's no comparison of the obstacles. And that kind of magical thinking about Jews is why we've wound up everywhere except the moon.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Robertson desperately wants to believe that God acts to punish those with whom he (Pat) disagrees politically. This has always been a central tenet of his faith: The Almighty is a right-wing evangelical American, probably Southern, and He is a vengeful Bubba God.

Interesting: Pat never seems to cite God's wrath when say, tornadoes destroy conservative little towns in the heartland.

 

[graceanne]

 

[ThorkelGriersen]

I think if you sent 8 million Jews or Mormons to Haiti in 1850 they would be prosperous now. No matter how the world treated them. Especially the Jews. You could send all the Jews to the moon and as long as they had basic life support they would live long and prosper.

Back after long post #25.

Yeah, the magic Jews. It really must be easy to roll out the stereotypes when one has little knowledge of the people being analyzed. As I said above [#25] most people in the world only want a few simple things in life. If they get more then they are happy -- and certainly don't turn it down. BUT THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS UNIVERSALLY SMART SHREWD JEWS WHO CAN ALWAYS MAKE MONEY REGARDLESS OF ANYTHING ELSE. Just one more thing that makes me want to scream.

Someone a long ago refered to Americans as "Rocked in the Cradle of Continental Security" --And insularity, I might add. It blows my mind how little Americans understand about the rest of the world.

 

[Sharpened]

There are plenty of wonderful Christians doing incredible things to assist the people of Haiti.

Also, if I had a relative as batshit crazy as Pat Robertson, I'd make sure everything he said was filmed too, to record the hilarity for posteriety.

 

[chy_girl]

*snip*
why is it that every time any kind of discussion like this comes up, it's the people who believe in God who are terrible, and the people who don't who are shining examples of all things great and wonderful? Can we still not accept that there are awesome people and shitty people and all flavors in between, and some of them believe in God and some don't?

Personally, and based on years of experience in multiple denominations of the Christian faith, it is far less about the Christians than it is about The Church.

You can find free thinking souls anywhere, just as you can find the mindless drones anywhere. For me, that's what creates the difference between a Christian and A Member of the Church.

The Church elder, the minister, the deacons... These are the one's who hold the microphone and these are the one's seem to like to hand down god's judgment according to their own personal benefits and advancements - or just which member of congregation they like more. For these people and their mindless little sheep I hold no respect beyond the minimum for any human being... And that get reflected back onto The Church.

*shrugs*
Don't lecture me on god's love for all living being and god's omnipotence and then turn around and tell me that god doesn't love homosexuals or god wouldn't understand an incest/rape victim terminating a resulting pregnancy. And The Church certainley doesn't get to brow beat an 18 year old unwed mother for her choices while reluctantly offering god's forgiveness if she learns the error of her ways and then turn around celebrating the deacon's 14 year old daughter giving birth to kid fathered by the drug dealer at school.

People who believe in Christ that are busy removing the beam from their own eye are fine. The tend to actually follow the teachings of Christ in the spirit which it was intended.

The Church who is so very willing to remove the splinter from their neighbor's eye with a jack hammer? They can fuck off for all I care - Pat Robertson included.

Robertson desperately wants to believe that God acts to punish those with whom he (Pat) disagrees politically. This has always been a central tenet of his faith: The Almighty is a right-wing evangelical American, probably Southern, and He is a vengeful Bubba God.

Interesting: Pat never seems to cite God's wrath when say, tornadoes destroy conservative little towns in the heartland.

Power can be very caustic to the soul, especially at the level that he has been afforded. He uses a belief and a teaching as the judge while he himself plays jury and executioner. "God-like" is not the same as "God-complex." To bad people like Mr. Robertson are so clouded in their perceived blessing from above to see the difference.

And the reason that he never seems to cite God's wrath when disaster strikes good Christian folk... It's because the 'good Christian folk' are merely being tested in the steadfastness of their faith. It's a trial by fire allowing them the opportunity to grow in god's love and devotion and trust in him to set everything back to rights. And if it doesn't get better, then, and I quote, "you just need to pray harder and stop taking it back after giving it to god." It's also the biggest load of dingleberries I've seen this side of a cow pasture fence in the middle of November.

But then again, it could just have something to do with the fact that the people who live in Haiti are far from likely to send him money each month. Robertson's an ass-hat, but he's smart enough to know better than to shit where he eats.

 

[Netzach]

Robertson's an ass-hat, but he's smart enough to know better than to shit where eats.

Again, I still have to harp on where he's eating. Liberia. Charles Taylor. Zaire. Mobutu.

 

[MasterPhoenix]

Does anyone need any further proof that Pat Robertson is a douchebag of the first order?

To me, it is not a religious thing as I know many Christians who are wonderful people. Pat Robertson is just a douchebag.

Here is something I came across in response:

http://www.boingboing.net/2010/01/1...tml?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

Haiti's real deal with the devil

Pat Robertson thinks that Haiti is poverty stricken (and earthquake-stricken) because the country made a deal with Satan to help them overthrow the French.

Back in May, the Times Online provided some slightly better insight into Haiti's past. Beyond a vague assumption that Imperialism had probably screwed Haiti somehow, I didn't know much about the country's history. Reading this story has been nothing short of nauseating.

Summary: Haiti was forced to pay France for its freedom. When they couldn't afford the ransom, France (and other countries, including the United States) helpfully offered high-interest loans. By 1900, 80% of Haiti's annual budget went to paying off its "reparation" debt. They didn't make the last payment until 1947. Just 10 years later, dictator François Duvalier took over the country and promptly bankrupted it, taking out more high-interest loans to pay for his corrupt lifestyle. The Duvalier family, with the blind-eye financial assistance of Western countries, killed 10s of thousands of Haitians, until the Haitian people overthrew them in 1986. Today, Haiti is still paying off the debt of an oppressive dictator no one would help them get rid of for 30 years.

The rest of the world refuses to forgive this debt.

So, in a way, maybe Robertson is right. Haiti is caught in a deal with the devil, and the devil is us.

Update: mgfarrelly points out another thing I didn't know—the U.S. Congress is currently considering a bill called The Jubilee Act for Responsible Lending and Expanded Debt Cancellation. Part of what this bill would do is help countries like Haiti get their debt canceled, without making that cancellation conditional on things like closing down free schools or raising the cost of fresh water. Maybe a good time to contact your representatives about about this bi-partisan measure.

 

[JMohegan]

Does anyone need any further proof that Pat Robertson is a douchebag of the first order?

To me, it is not a religious thing as I know many Christians who are wonderful people. Pat Robertson is just a douchebag.

The difference between Pat Robertson and the average douchebag on the street is that Robertson has an audience.

And it seems to me that those who buy his books, watch his network (CBN), send their children to his university (Regent), fund his advocacy groups (Christian Coalition and the ACLJ), and boost the ratings of his TV show (700 Club), bear responsibility for propping him up.

No, that list does not include all Christians. But it does include a whole hell of a lot.

 

[JMohegan]

Official statement from CBN, copied below. Gotta love the assertion about "scholars" concluding that the country is "cursed."



On today’s The 700 Club, during a segment about the devastation, suffering and humanitarian effort that is needed in Haiti, Dr. Robertson also spoke about Haiti’s history. His comments were based on the widely-discussed 1791 slave rebellion led by Boukman Dutty at Bois Caiman, where the slaves allegedly made a famous pact with the devil in exchange for victory over the French. This history, combined with the horrible state of the country, has led countless scholars and religious figures over the centuries to believe the country is cursed.

Dr. Robertson never stated that the earthquake was God’s wrath. If you watch the entire video segment, Dr. Robertson’s compassion for the people of Haiti is clear. He called for prayer for them. His humanitarian arm has been working to help thousands of people in Haiti over the last year, and they are currently launching a major relief and recovery effort to help the victims of this disaster. They have sent a shipment of millions of dollars worth of medications that is now in Haiti, and their disaster team leaders are expected to arrive tomorrow and begin operations to ease the suffering.

Chris Roslan
Spokesman for CBN

 

[Homburg]

I have no words to describe the disgust.

Wow.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

... those who buy his books, watch his network (CBN), send their children to his university (Regent), fund his advocacy groups (Christian Coalition and the ACLJ), and boost the ratings of his TV show (700 Club), bear responsibility for propping him up.

...or vote for his candidates (Regent alumnus and Gov.-elect Bob McDonnell).

 

[JMohegan]

...or vote for his candidates (Regent alumnus and Gov.-elect Bob McDonnell).

*groans*

 

[Homburg]

...or vote for his candidates (Regent alumnus and Gov.-elect Bob McDonnell).

Which is yet another reason why I did NOT vote for him.

 

[JMohegan]

I'm ok with that. I do think that it's time for decent mainstream Christians to take on some of the weight of screaming about things like this. If I say something about it, well, I'm a queer agnostic Jew blah blah, who cares?

If Christians think this is intolerable, let's hear it. I'm waiting. I'm waiting for them to explain that it's not me/us/this church, just like moderate Muslims have to do every six seconds.

Here's one. Well, technically three, but the blonde in particular is apparently the outspoken right wing Christian on that show.

 

[chy_girl]

Here's one. Well, technically three, but the blonde in particular is apparently the outspoken right wing Christian on that show.

Wow! I have to say that the respect level for Elisabeth Hasselbeck (the blond) just went up a notch... maybe two.

Though one could make the argument that Elisabeth and Whoopie agreeing that strongly over anything anything religion or politically based is a sign that hell will freeze over soon.

 

[Netzach]

Here's one. Well, technically three, but the blonde in particular is apparently the outspoken right wing Christian on that show.

Nice, her human cred went up.

 

[clock1]

I think if you sent 8 million Jews or Mormons to Haiti in 1850 they would be prosperous now. No matter how the world treated them. Especially the Jews. You could send all the Jews to the moon and as long as they had basic life support they would live long and prosper.

I know it was only 6 million (perhaps two more would have made a difference) but the world observed how much they prospered in Germany in the 30s and 40s.

Fact is ideas and effort produce results, different people, places, ideas and efforts produce different results.

There is no god, no devil, no sin, no holiness.

All there is is time and nature. The planet, solar system, universe etc were set in motion, they have progressed through time since then. Theories abound, one day some remnant of the human race might understand. Right now we don't. As a result we create gods and devils from chariot riding sun gods to men who rise from crosses. All are mans' attempt to explain the still unexplainable.

Pat has what Jesus never dreamed of... Mass Communication. (Yes that is an echo from the musical JCS.)

Tomorrow the planet will be a little older, a little newer, a little different. That is the miracle, until explained by science.

 

[AngelicAssassin]

If we devoted 1% of our military budget to helping the needy, we wouldn't need to be fighting wars all over the world.

And yet some of the first US boots on the ground were US military. PotUS earmarked 100 million off the cuff, and none of that goes to reimbursement of the military costs required for those boots. As an aside, name me another organization that combines all the things required for basic civilization and does each of them well enough to rival the civilian leaders in their fields. That would include FedEx, AT&T, and the Red Cross. The major difference? None of those organizations have a Ma Deuce (at a minimum) mounted in ring turrets on their vehicles.

i'll skip the administration costs of handling that 1% based on other well-intentioned efforts.

The USSR tried that; it didn't work.

Thank God, or the Flying Spaghetti Monster if that's your bent, for US Stingers.

Bad things are going to happen very soon.

i thought they already had. i'm sure the family and friends of those lost on the USS Arizona and others at Pearl, Task Force Smith, Khe Sanh or the entire Wall for that matter, the Marine Barracks in Beirut, 9/11, Khobar Towers, ad nauseum would tend to disagree as well.

My brother --a scientist (no farther quantification, to avoid "outing") said: When a group of illiterates can build a $2.35 road-side bomb that we take out with a $500,000.00 Predator drone and a $60,000 Hellfire missile, we have already lost.

So, the price of a life isn't worth $560,000.00, but

• 3.2 billion (1% of Clinton's lowest Defense budge in 1996)
• 7.3 billion (1% of Bush's highest Defense budget in 2008)
• 8.7 billion (1% of Obama's current defense budget for 2010)*

is fine with you? Can't have it both ways. i'd rather have a point target weapon fired from an unmanned drone take out an illiterate's dubiously armed device than risk an EOD service member's life when at all possible. And no, i didn't miss the hyperbole in your example either.

No more bail-outs. The Chinese have canceled the national Visa card.

As long as ~ 35% of China's GDP is based on exports and their dependence on foreign trade hovers @ 60%, i don't think so, nor do i really care. If you wanna ride the pony, you gotta pay, one way or another.

* All Defense budget outlays extrapolated from these reported figures.

 

[Daddy2mylilgirl]

The Devil's open letter response to Pat Robertson

Dear Pat Robertson,

I know that you know that all press is good press, so I appreciate the shout-out. And you make God look like a big mean bully who kicks people when they are down, so I'm all over that action.

But when you say that Haiti has made a pact with me, it is totally humiliating. I may be evil incarnate, but I'm no welcher. The way you put it, making a deal with me leaves folks desperate and impoverished.

Sure, in the afterlife, but when I strike bargains with people, they first get something here on earth -- glamour, beauty, talent, wealth, fame, glory, a golden fiddle. Those Haitians have nothing, and I mean nothing. And that was before the earthquake. Haven't you seen "Crossroads"? Or "Damn Yankees"?

If I had a thing going with Haiti, there'd be lots of banks, skyscrapers, SUVs, exclusive night clubs, Botox -- that kind of thing. An 80 percent poverty rate is so not my style. Nothing against it -- I'm just saying: Not how I roll.

You're doing great work, Pat, and I don't want to clip your wings -- just, come on, you're making me look bad. And not the good kind of bad. Keep blaming God. That's working. But leave me out of it, please. Or we may need to renegotiate your own contract.

Best, Satan

 

[Netzach]

And yet some of the first US boots on the ground were US military. PotUS earmarked 100 million off the cuff, and none of that goes to reimbursement of the military costs required for those boots. As an aside, name me another organization that combines all the things required for basic civilization and does each of them well enough to rival the civilian leaders in their fields. That would include FedEx, AT&T, and the Red Cross. The major difference? None of those organizations have a Ma Deuce (at a minimum) mounted in ring turrets on their vehicles.

i'll skip the administration costs of handling that 1% based on other well-intentioned efforts.Thank God, or the Flying Spaghetti Monster if that's your bent, for US Stingers.i thought they already had. i'm sure the family and friends of those lost on the USS Arizona and others at Pearl, Task Force Smith, Khe Sanh or the entire Wall for that matter, the Marine Barracks in Beirut, 9/11, Khobar Towers, ad nauseum would tend to disagree as well.So, the price of a life isn't worth $560,000.00, but

• 3.2 billion (1% of Clinton's lowest Defense budge in 1996)
• 7.3 billion (1% of Bush's highest Defense budget in 2008)
• 8.7 billion (1% of Obama's current defense budget for 2010)*

is fine with you? Can't have it both ways. i'd rather have a point target weapon fired from an unmanned drone take out an illiterate's dubiously armed device than risk an EOD service member's life when at all possible. And no, i didn't miss the hyperbole in your example either. As long as ~ 35% of China's GDP is based on exports and their dependence on foreign trade hovers @ 60%, i don't think so, nor do i really care. If you wanna ride the pony, you gotta pay, one way or another.

* All Defense budget outlays extrapolated from these reported figures.

China is also about to do a lot of investing in Africa that is going to necessitate that they do things with their currency that they've been unwilling to consider. I agree in some part with all of the above, but particularly that our relationship of indebtedness to China is overstated and their dependence on our markets understated.

 

[Homburg]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-PEaWUduCM

Olberman, wow.

 

[eastern sun]

Pat Robertson feeds our hungry souls. Why do so many people want to eat at his table?

If we can simplify everything into good and evil, true and false, left and right, us and them, D and s, it just makes life easier, doesn't it?