Does the Left want US to loose in Iraq?

[zipman]

I love threads like this one.

All anyone has to do is read a few pages to see the utter desperation and pathetic lies of the far-right lunatics.

The sad part is they actually believe the crap they spew.

 

[busybody..]

If you cut one RIGHT leg off your PCPooch, he would lean LEFT!

 

[Weenieschnitzel]

Oh come on, give him a chance......

how many more?

 

[wazhazhe]

he still has another two left on his term, come on, a little leeway dude...

No politician deserves any leeway. This one put the US in a war it can't win for no good reason. The only end to this is the withdrawal of US troops, just like Vietnam. The only accomplishments we can expect are dead and wounded American soldiers, billions of dollars wasted and the creation of a new haven for terrorists.

I don't owe the man anything.

 

[andystx]

I obviously know a damn sight more about global politics than you do, you retarded little prick.

I am sure the british soccer hooligan perspective on global politics would make for some fascinating reading but unfortunately it has as much relevance in a conversation about American politics as a mug of warm beer. Great for you if you enjoy it, just don't expect civilized folk to be all that interested in it.

 

[Wolf_Song]

I love threads like this one.

All anyone has to do is read a few pages to see the utter desperation and pathetic lies of the far-right lunatics.

The sad part is they actually believe the crap they spew.

( Golf clap )

 

[RobDownSouth]

A substantial part of the Republican Party, some of its politicians and many of its loudest supporters want to shift all blame for problems in Iraq onto their political opponents.

 

[DevilishTexan]

FALSE OR DECEPTIVE INTELLIGENCE BRIEFINGS TO MEMBERS OF CONGRESS
Donald Rumsfeld - Senate Armed Services Committee testimony and public statements - Sept 19, 2002: (Saddam) "amassed large clandestine stockpiles of chemical weapons and that we know he continues to hide chemical and biological weapons, moving them to different locations as often as every 12-24 hours and placing them in residential neighborhoods". Rumsfeld stated five times to the committee variations of: "We know Iraq has weapons of mass destruction"

DIA - Iraq: Key WMD facilities and Operational Support Study- September 2002. "There is no reliable information on whether Iraq is producing and stockpiling chemical weapons or where Iraq has or will establish its chemical warfare agent production facilities".

DOD private briefing to Sen. Bill Nelson of Florida according to Nelson's 2/4/2002 Senate Armed Services Committee testimony:: "I was told not only that (Iraq) had weapons of mass destruction .... but there were also unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) that could be put on ships off the Eastern Seaboard and flown over Eastern Seaboard cities with weapons of mass destruction". "However, I was not told that there was a dispute in the intelligence community over the veracity of that information". "...it was Air Force intelligence that specifically discounted that, ... it was not true". "...Why was I not told that there was this disagreement in the intelligence community instead of being told that it was gospel truth that those UAVs could be flown over Eastern Seaboard cities?" DOD requested to answer in a closed session even though Nelson's question and the answer should not be classified.

Douglas Feith - Letter to Senate Intelligence Committee Chairs - October 27, 2003: (Stated still classified connections between Iraq and Al Qaeda)
DOD statement on news reports of Al Qaeda and Iraq connection - November 15, 2003: (Referencing Feith Oct. 27 letter) "News reports that the Defense Department recently confirmed new information with respect to contacts between Al Qaeda and Iraq are inaccurate". "The classified annex was not an analysis of the substantive issue of the relationship between Iraq and Al Qaeda, and it drew no conclusions"
U.N. Monitoring Group on Al Qaeda - June 2003: "Nothing has come to our notice that would indicate links…"

FALSE OR DECEPTIVE CHARGES TO THE UNITED NATIONS (U.N.)

Colin Powell - U.N. Security Council address - February 5, 2003: "Saddam Hussein is determined to get his hands on a nuclear bomb. He is so determined that he has made repeated attempts to acquire high-specification aluminum tubes from 11 different countries even after the inspections resumed" "We also have intelligence from multiple sources that Iraq is attempting to acquire magnets and high-speed balancing machines to enrich uranium"

Mohammed Elbaredei - U.N. Security Council testimony- March 7, 2003: "The nuclear weapons program is defunct". "There is no indication of resumed nuclear activities or prohibited activities". There is no indication that Iraq is attempting to import enriched uranium"; "There is no indication that Iraq is attempting to import tubes for uranium enrichment". "There is no indication to date that Iraq imported magnets for use in centrifuge development"

Colin Powell U.N Security Council Address - February 5, 2003: "We have first hand descriptions of biological weapons on wheels and rails", "We know that Iraq has at least 7 of these mobile biological facilities", "There can be no doubt that Saddam Hussein has biological weapons and the capability to rapidly produce more, many more"

Hans Blix - U.N. Security Council testimony- March 7, 2003: "No evidence so far has been found for mobile biological weapons units"; "No underground facilities were found for chemical and biological weapons…"

Colin Powell - Address to U.N. Security Council - February 5, 2003: "The issue before us is not how much time we are willing to give the inspectors to be frustrated by Iraqi obstruction. But how much longer are we willing to put up with Iraq's non-compliance before we as a council, we as the United Nations, say 'Enough is Enough' "

Mohammed Elbaredei, Hans Blix - U.N. Security Council testimony - March 7, 2003: "Iraq has been forthcoming", "inspections are moving forward", they have made "important progress" and have had "few difficulties".

Colin Powell - U.N. Security Council address- February 5, 2003: " "Our conservative estimate is that Iraq today has a stockpile of between 100 and 500 tons of chemical weapons agent".

David Kay - Congressional Intelligence Committee testimony - October 2, 2003: "Multiple sources with varied access and reliability have told ISG that Iraq did not have a large, ongoing, centrally controlled CW program after 1991. Information found to date suggests that Iraq's large-scale capability to develop, produce and fill new CW munitions was reduced, if not completely destroyed…".

FALSE OR DECEPTIVE STATEMENTS ABOUT IRAQ OBSTRUCTION OF U.N. WEAPONS INSPECTORS

Condoleezza Rice - NBC Meet the Press - February 16, 2003: "We have sources who tell us that the Iraqis, through their intelligence efforts, are working very hard to frustrate the inspectors"

Colin Powell - Center for Strategic and International Studies speech - March 5, 2003: "Inspections will amount to little more than casting at shadows unless Iraq lifts the fog of denial and deception that prevents inspectors from seeing the true magnitude of what they are up against"

Mohammed Elbaredei, Hans Blix - U.N. Security Council testimony - March 7, 2003: "Iraq has been forthcoming", "inspections are moving forward", they have made "important progress" and have had "few difficulties".

FALSE OR DECEPTIVE STATEMENTS ABOUT IRAQ CONNECTIONS AL QAEDA AND TERRORISM

George W. Bush - State of the Union - January 28, 2003: "Evidence from intelligence sources, secret communications and statements by people now in custody reveal that Saddam Hussein aids and protects terrorists including members of Al Qaeda.

George W. Bush - Radio Address - February 8, 2003: "Saddam Hussein has longstanding, direct and continuing ties to terrorist networks".

George Tenet - Senate Testimony - February 11, 2003: "Iraq is harboring senior members of a terrorist network led by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, a close associate of Osama Bin Laden.

U.N. Monitoring Group on Al Qaeda - June 2003: "Nothing has come to our notice that would indicate links…"

FALSE OR DECEPTIVE STATEMENTS ABOUT IRAQI NUCLEAR WEAPONS
Dick Cheney - Veterans of Foreign Wars 103rd National Convention - August 26, 2002: "Simply stated, there is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction", "We now know that Saddam has resumed his efforts to acquire nuclear weapons. Many of us are convinced that Saddam will acquire nuclear weapons fairly soon"

Dick Cheney - NBC's Meet the Press - September 8, 2002: "We do know with absolute certainty that he is using his procurement system to acquire the equipment he needs in order to enrich uranium to build a nuclear weapon"

George W. Bush - Address on Iraq - October 7, 2002: "Iraq has attempted to purchase high-strength aluminum tubes and other equipment needed for gas centrifuges, which are used to enrich uranium for nuclear weapons"

George W. Bush - Address to the Nation on War with Iraq - March 17, 2003: "Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised"

George W. Bush - Address to Iraq - October 7, 2002: "Iraq has attempted to purchase high-strength aluminum tubes and other equipment needed for gas centrifuges, which are used to enrich uranium for nuclear weapons"

Mohammed Elbaredei - U.N. Security Council testimony- March 7, 2003: "The nuclear weapons program is defunct". "There is no indication of resumed nuclear activities or prohibited activities". There is no indication that Iraq is attempting to import enriched uranium"; "There is no indication that Iraq is attempting to import tubes for uranium enrichment". "There is no indication to date that Iraq imported magnets for use in centrifuge development"

FALSE OR DECEPTIVE STATEMENTS ABOUT IRAQI CHEMICAL WEAPONS

Colin Powell - Fox News Sunday, September 8, 2002: "There is no doubt that he has chemical weapons stocks"
George W. Bush - Address on Iraq October 7, 2002: "We know that the regime has produced thousands of tons of chemical agents, including mustard gas, sarin nerve gas, and VX nerve gas" (repeated with 500 tons in January 28, 2003 State of the Union)
George W. Bush - Radio Address - February 8, 2003: "We have sources that tell us that Saddam Hussein recently authorized Iraqi field commanders to use chemical weapons -- the very weapons the dictator tells us he does not have."
Donald Rumsfeld - Press Conference - March 30, 2003: "We know where they are. They are in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad." referring to the 100-500 metric tons of chemical weapons which have never been found.
Hans Blix - U.N. Security Council testimony- March 7, 2003: "No underground facilities were found for chemical and biological weapons…"

FALSE OR DECEPTIVE STATEMENTS ABOUT IRAQI BIOLOGICAL WEAPONS
George W. Bush - United Nations Address Sept 12, 2002: Right now Iraq is expanding and improving facilities that were used for the production of biological weapons
Hans Blix - U.N. Security Council testimony- March 7, 2003: "No evidence so far has been found for mobile biological weapons units"; "No underground facilities were found for chemical and biological weapons…"

FALSE OR DECEPTIVE GENERAL STATEMENTS TO THE MEDIA

Tommy Franks - Pentagon Press Briefing - March 22, 2003: "There is no doubt that the regime of Saddam Hussein possesses weapons of mass destruction. As this operation continues, those weapons will be identified, found, along with the people who have produced them and who guard them." -
Victoria Clark - Pentagon Press Briefing - March 22, 2003: "One of our top objectives is to find and destroy the WMD. There are a number of sites:"
Colin Powell - (Response to U.N. Weapons Inspectors Testimony) - Mar 8, 2003: "So has the strategic decision been made to disarm Iraq of its weapons of mass destruction by the leadership in Baghdad? I think our judgment has to be clearly not."
Ari Fleisher - White House Press Briefing - December 2, 2002: "If he declares he has none, then we will know that Saddam Hussein is once again misleading the world."
Ari Fleisher - White House Press Briefing - January 9, 2003: "We know for a fact that there are weapons there."
Ari Fleisher - White House Press Briefing - March 21, 2003: "Well, there is no question that we have evidence and information that Iraq has weapons of mass destruction, biological and chemical particularly ... all this will be made clear in the course of the operation, for whatever duration it takes"
David Kay - Senate Armed Services Committee testimony - October 2, 2003: "We were all wrong…"

Link?

 

[Masters_Falcon]

I honestly don't give a shit about how is right and who is wrong who wants us to lose and who doesn't I just want this over because my husband is one of the sodliers over there risking his ass... and while I support my husband and the other troops over there I hate this whole freaking situation.

And FYI I am a republican.... just like my parents were before me.. but I guess having my husband over there makes me feel a little differently then most conservatives.

 

[JamesSD]

In California's 50th, both parties made mammoth turnout efforts, but the balance of turnout and of opinion seems to have remained the same, even though Democrats had a seriously contested primary for governor and Republicans didn't. The angry Democratic left and its aiders and abettors in the press seem to have succeeded in souring public opinion, but they haven't succeeded in producing victory margins for the Democrats. Maybe they're doing just the opposite.

This political analysis is so bad it's laughable.

The Republicans barely clung to their seat in the 50th in a district engineered to be right wing, in the most right wing metropolitan area of the state (I know, my girlfriend lives about 5 miles from that district. It's full of huge homes).

Typically incumbent Governors don't have hotly contested primaries. Arnold is pretty much a sitting duck at this point anyway, he can't win a real, fair election.

Sorry to attack just one point, but such a gross mischaracterization of facts can't be ignored, and shows how flawed the logic is.

 

[JamesSD]

I honestly don't give a shit about how is right and who is wrong who wants us to lose and who doesn't I just want this over because my husband is one of the sodliers over there risking his ass... and while I support my husband and the other troops over there I hate this whole freaking situation.

And FYI I am a republican.... just like my parents were before me.. but I guess having my husband over there makes me feel a little differently then most conservatives.

I think everyone has a husband, neighbor, relative or friend whose life has been put in danger. And while all are brave, I think most are eager to come home to their loved ones as soon as possible.

 

[Masters_Falcon]

I think everyone has a husband, neighbor, relative or friend whose life has been put in danger. And while all are brave, I think most are eager to come home to their loved ones as soon as possible.

Yeah pretty much not a day goes by that my husband doesn't say how much he wants to be home... It is only his honor and sense of duty that keep him from fiding ways out of going back time and again.. (this is our second time through this)

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

Link?

This was just portions of a larger article here. You're welcome to read all if you wish and check the quotes. I checked a good sampling of them and found no discrepancies.

 

[BlueEyesInLevis]

To those on here have said its ridiculous to think the left wants us to loose in Iraq, let me ask this question.......

If they DID want us to loose how would their rhetoric be any different than it is today?

 

[busybody..]

This was just portions of a larger article here. You're welcome to read all if you wish and check the quotes. I checked a good sampling of them and found no discrepancies.

I dont dispute ANYTHING that was said in that link!

I do dispute that when stuff was said

It was KNOW to be UNTRUE

When you have analysts DISPUTING the meanings of findings and the Pres and Co lean one way over another, it doesnt mean they lied!

When "facts" may have shown them to be wrong it doesnt mean they lied

And remeber

CIA Asshole Himself, said SLAM DUNK!

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

I dont dispute ANYTHING that was said in that link!

I do dispute that when stuff was said

It was KNOW to be UNTRUE

When you have analysts DISPUTING the meanings of findings and the Pres and Co lean one way over another, it doesnt mean they lied!

When "facts" may have shown them to be wrong it doesnt mean they lied

And remeber

CIA Asshole Himself, said SLAM DUNK!

Pay particular attention to the dates when most if not all of those things were discredited. Yup, before the invasion on March 19, 2003.

Hell some of the quotes from Rumsfeld and Co. were made after they were proven to be inaccurate.

 

[The Mutt]

To those on here have said its ridiculous to think the left wants us to loose in Iraq, let me ask this question.......

If they DID want us to loose how would their rhetoric be any different than it is today?

How would you define "winning" in Iraq?

 

[busybody..]

Pay particular attention to the dates when most if not all of those things were discredited. Yup, before the invasion on March 19, 2003.

Hell some of the quotes from Rumsfeld and Co. were made after they were proven to be inaccurate.

I dont see them as discredited

I see them as differnt POV

As I said

Many "analysts" looked at data

Many came with differing viewpoints

I can show you as much info as you did to point the other way

You know that!

 

[BlueEyesInLevis]

How would you define "winning" in Iraq?

Lets see.......

1. Formation of a democratic government with voting rights for women
2. Killing terrorists like Zarquoi
3. Training and suppling their police forces
4. Putting Saddam on trial
5. Building up their infastructure

Now answer my question.

 

[The Mutt]

The answer is "No."

 

[BlueEyesInLevis]

The answer is "No."

Thanks for making my point.

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

Lets see.......

1. Formation of a democratic government with voting rights for women Death threats made against ALL voters, yay equality!
2. Killing terrorists like Zarquoi and letting other Terrorists get away, like Osama
3. Training and suppling their police forces filled with death squads from two religious factions
4. Putting Saddam on trial I'll give you that one
5. Building up their infastructure despite millions of dollars misplaced,wasted, and unaccounted for.

Now answer my question.

Bold are my comments.

 

[The Mutt]

Lets see.......

1. Formation of a democratic government with voting rights for women
2. Killing terrorists like Zarquoi
3. Training and suppling their police forces
4. Putting Saddam on trial
5. Building up their infastructure

Then we've already won. Bring the troops home.

 

[andystx]

Give that lady a.. something..

This Iraq debacle has been one fucking bullshit story after another. Mission accomplished hell, Mission Revised is more like it. We've been given so many reasons why Iraq was invaded that I'd wager upwards of 70% believe it was Iraq behind 9/11 as shown in andystx's post.

Talk to a geopolitical expert, ask them exactly how many secular dictatorships allow religious extremist terrorists to train and be housed in thier country. The two do no coexist, the religious terrorists would be seen by the dictator as a threat to themselves.

I assume you have heard the expression, "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." Can I also assume you know which group of people coined the expression?

Having said that, there is nothing in any of my posts on this thread that even vaguely implies Iraq was "behind 9/11." In fact you won't find any posts from me on this forum that try to hold that postition. The truth is I don't care whether or not Iraq was involved in the execution of the events of 9/11. The war in Iraq was never a police action. It was never about bringing the criminals involved in 9/11 to justice (most of those actual criminals were already dead.)

 

[Fagin]

The He is Daniel.
So the IDF have never, ever lied? The Israeli government has never, ever lied?

They are way more reliable than Hamas.

Isreal didn't kill those on the beach