Do you believe in Magic?

[graceanne]

^----- This made me giggle enough my fiance gave me an odd expression.


I WISH I had some sort of shamanistic ability with any animal...would make my job a LOT easier xD

Well, the property next to ours isn't developed at all. The lady who owns it considers it an investment for her children, and she gets a tax break by letting it grow wild so it can, and does, house crap tons of wild life. We have pheasents and hawks and a million different birds, and a minimum of three deer and coyotes, an eagle, and ... A BILLION STUPID SUICIDAL BUNNY RABBITS. That I haven't run any of them over with my car is an absolute miracle and proof that God will never give me something I couldn't handle. They will run out in front of my car and then dodge me like I'm some kind of predator, when all I want is for them to get off my drive way.

The issue is that we adopted an abandoned cat when we moved here, and he rewards us by keeping the mice to a minimum. Unfortunately, occasionally he goes after a rabbit, and then I have to take care of it until it dies.

 

[seela]

I had a dream where all kinds of strange things happened to me, and in that dream I thought that I have to post in this thread about my experiences.

But no, I don't believe in magic. I'm afraid I'm too rational to believe. Science explains so much already.

 

[bhndblueyes88]

I had a dream where all kinds of strange things happened to me, and in that dream I thought that I have to post in this thread about my experiences.

But no, I don't believe in magic. I'm afraid I'm too rational to believe. Science explains so much already.

I don't think "believing in magic" is irrational at ALL. I mean, blind faith in something can certainly be considered irrational, of course. But, consider where we were a millennium ago and where we are now. How many things can we explain now that, before, we could only explain with "it's MAGIC!!". Hell, if you go back further, we considered the fact the sun rose, moved across the sky, and fell to be the work of gods!

Taking this understanding of human history and the development of knowledge into account, I think it is nothing BUT rational to accept that there are events and experiences that may have perfectly logical scientific explanations that we just can't understand yet. Maybe we lack the appropriate detection device, or maybe it all occurs on a level that we can't actively perceive or wrap our minds around.

If you tried to explain to a tribesman the energy that exists between particles and sub-particles, he may just look at you like YOU are the idiot. Of course the energy is there between things...that's MAGIC!!

Of course, this all does depend how you define "magic", I suppose.

 

[seela]

Taking this understanding of human history and the development of knowledge into account, I think it is nothing BUT rational to accept that there are events and experiences that may have perfectly logical scientific explanations that we just can't understand yet. Maybe we lack the appropriate detection device, or maybe it all occurs on a level that we can't actively perceive or wrap our minds around.

This is what I was thinking of when I said I'm too rational to believe in magic. When I hear about things that don't seem to make sense to me, my mind goes immediately to "it's something science hasn't yet found an answer for".

 

[bhndblueyes88]

This is what I was thinking of when I said I'm too rational to believe in magic. When I hear about things that don't seem to make sense to me, my mind goes immediately to "it's something science hasn't yet found an answer for".

I don't think that necessarily means it's not "magic" though. Science is just a process for discovering and learning. Maybe we'll Science up some Magic (or, at least, energies/dimensions/whatever that explain Magic and you might as well just call "magic" )

 

[seela]

I don't think that necessarily means it's not "magic" though. Science is just a process for discovering and learning. Maybe we'll Science up some Magic (or, at least, energies/dimensions/whatever that explain Magic and you might as well just call "magic" )

Yeah, I guess it boils down to how we define magic.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Anxiety stems from a series of chemical and psychological processes with roots in the "reptile brain," while worrying is a little more evolved. Neither are intrinsically related to belief in magic.

They are survival traits at their core; consciously or subconsciously trying to be mentally prepared.

I can certainly understand how superstition can restore some sense of agency in a chaotic world, though.

You are saying that behavior can be explained in a more scientifically explainable way than "magic." I agree.

But sometimes our behaviors, while explainable from a standpoint of evolutionary biology, seem so absurd and often self-defeating in the modern world, that to continue them seems to require a belief in magic. Worry and anxiety responses do us harm in all kinds of ways when, to our ancient ancestors, they might have meant escape from cobras and tigers.

It's funny that magic is usually associated with older cultures. In many ways we have created a world where the stresses and demands are so out of sync with our ancient bodies that "magic" seems a reasonable option.

 

[knot_sweet]

I believe in small magics.

That moment of silence around dawn.

Instantly feeling better when I'm immersed in nature.

A genuine smile at a passing stranger that makes them feel warm for a moment.

The giggles that happen because of soap bubbles.

People with amazing abilities with animals, like horse whisperers.

The fact that even though every leaf on a tree is the same colour, I can still see all of them.

Then there are the bigger magics like clairvoyance and healing hands and some of those unexplainable (to me anyway) tricks that magicians perform. Like the guy who appeared to turn a wall full of paper butterflies to life.

I believe in magic, just not the book and spell and wand kind.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

What I'm saying is that having a brain/ body that is biologically hardwired to stress about things does not require or even suggest that the person doing the worrying believes in magic.

Attempting to cope with this stress in irrational ways doesn't necessarily either. Humans are not vulcans. Resorting to outright superstition might. Many superstitious people will tell you they don't believe in magic, however, and when pressed about their superstitions are more than happy to chalk it up to "just plain silliness."

OCD does not require a belief in magic either. OCD is most often about cause and effect extrapolated in an irrational and emotional way. I don't need to resort to magic to tell you that if I get drain tar on my hands I will scrub them till they bleed.

Eventually our modern world will need to catch up to the fact that we do indeed have ancient bodies. I'm seeing more and more ways people find to honor that, to work with it, instead of trying to fix it with pills and lumbar support.

I hope this is true. Because this is either a shitty OS update, antiquated hardware, or both.

I suppose if one washes one's hands until they are raw and bleeding, there is some basis in logic that "more is better." But if I take a few steps back from my own brain, I usually don't see much difference in my tail-chasing, gerbil-wheel worries and my touching faith in wearing my lucky socks during the first half and sitting in the chair that worked so well in 2010. I'm fact, the sock/chair combo has a superior success rate!

See? Magic.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

"gerbil wheel worries" are not evidence that you believe in magic, it's just the underside of the hedonic treadmill.

If you feel your lucky socks make you special, and sitting in the correct chair grants you self permission to yell at your TV or whatever other antics gets your adrenaline pumping and makes you feel relevant to a time delayed "live" game a thousand miles away...

... I personally think cheering at a TV to be about as silly as wearing your lucky socks. Fate conspired for me to grow up hating spectator sports of all kinds.

Part of my issue with drain tar in particular is that its Tar; it's water proofed. no amount of soapy water helps, its a little like getting sap or pitch on yourself, except that oil doesn't help either... now imagine that the tar is from a food service drain, a never-sanitized crevice that is used for the passage of all manner of disgusting and downright poisonous substances. "chicken juice" and mop water, among other things.

I have a hard time believing ANYONE wouldn't continue scrubbing till they bled, just thinking about it makes me want to go shower.

I brought it up as an example of OCD behavior. I do tend to wash my hands excessively other times as well. I don't "feel germs crawling on me" as other hand washers complain about; my hands feel poisonous, if that makes any sense. I become acutely aware that touching my own or anyone's face or food could make them very ill.

It's irrational. It's an example of the criteria you are using to characterize belief in magic. My point here; if someone does or does not believe in magic, let them say so for themselves.

I appreciate your views on this matter. How about you speak for the hand washers, and I will represent those few honored by Fortuna with magical footwear? Which, by the way, were potent yesterday, thanks to a surge of chair karma.

Maybe you should stop by. While I curse the officials, you can curse spectator sports.

 

[knot_sweet]

Two of my favourite quotes on the subjects of worrying and magic;

"Just because we understand how something works doesn't make it any less magical"

This is true for things like photosynthesis and magic eye pictures.


"Worry, but know that worrying is as effective as trying to solve an algebra equation by chewing bubblegum" - Baz Lurhman.

True...if you do your best with what you've got, then there's no point worrying because you couldn't have anything else.

And Deeg, your socks are only magic if they don't stink after not washing them for the whole season.

 

[shewantsmore]

i would like to believe there is magic out there.As people have said on here so many different kinds of magic im just believer and love to find out more

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Two of my favourite quotes on the subjects of worrying and magic;

"Just because we understand how something works doesn't make it any less magical"

This is true for things like photosynthesis and magic eye pictures.


"Worry, but know that worrying is as effective as trying to solve an algebra equation by chewing bubblegum" - Baz Lurhman.

True...if you do your best with what you've got, then there's no point worrying because you couldn't have anything else.

And Deeg, your socks are only magic if they don't stink after not washing them for the whole season.

Great quotes. And now I know why I struggled with algebra. I ate tic tacs.

Sock magic works best with perspiration intact from previous games.

Reviewing my posts; I've been making no sense at all.

I know that feeling. It seems to pass if you just post a lot of inane dross.

 

[knot_sweet]

actually, replicating your study circumstances during a test improves your outcome, particularly when it comes to foods and smells, as these can play a heavy influence on your brain chemistry.

so if you study algebra while chewing bubble gum you will absolutely be more able to solve algebra by chewing bubble gum.

please note the key differences between 'by' and 'while'.

 

[MeekMe]

I hate that I keep thinking about this question. The other day I described something as being "magical." I immediately thought of this question. >_<

Do I? I have no idea. It seems believing in magic is sometimes fun. I really like the thought, but at the same time I'm too gullible. I know I'm gullible, so I have to tell myself, "don't believe everything! That's how they get you!"

U_U;; I want to believe, but I think that just means I'm silly.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

My inane dross seems to come in short discreet bursts. Perhaps we can just be thankful for that.

Ironically, dross is an interesting word to bring up both in this thread and at this time; I've seen it used to describe seemingly un-noteworthy objects which store tiny reserves of magic by virtue of ridiculous sentimental value.

A shiny rock picked up at random when you were three. The first shoe lace you ever tied by yourself. The lone tent stake salvaged from your first camping trip. The empty wine bottle from your honeymoon.

This kind of rubbish has always been hard for me to let go of; tangible evidence of fond memories. Fortunately I've never hoarded them in huge quantity, they tend to be solitarily tucked away in dark corners, buried beneath mountains of abandoned projects.

We've finally been working to get rid of those mountains these past couple weeks, and we're finding that they are mostly my wife's pet projects that she never gets around to. Less than a quarter of these abandoned projects are my own, often intermingled with her stuff I didn't know how to deal with, but it's these bits of dross that turn up every here and there that have been really shutting me down.

Its just as bad for me when it's not my dross; I love to hear the stories about these curiosities. Fortunately my wife has no patience for it.

It's a good word. "Dross." Useful. Evocative. I like the way that my mouth feels vaguely slavic when I say it.

So memories and reminders are the waste products of events. That's an interesting idea. I'm fairly sentimental, and tend toward hoarderism, too. Usually when I go back through stuff (if I ever do) the ticket stubs and bobbleheads have separated themselves into "essential" memories and "why the hell did I save that" memories.

Like your wife, I am just as bad about unfinished projects. I think the scraps let me hold the past, and the projects let me hold the future.

I know you will say that that isn't magic, but I think it is.

Nice poem, in your other post.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Still; I am learning that every tiny piece of magic is not necessarily worth saving, the nostalgic flotsam can be so chaotic that it gridlocks and stagnates; it is much better to have a focused intent and flow.

Question though; Why do you suppose I would call abandoned projects "not-magic"?

Perhaps I have been misunderstood; talking about magic is like talking about an uncodified religion. Broad strokes just don't work; you must paint yourself and leave it for others to do the same. It's not constructive to generally say that demographics believe something beyond the identity of that grouping of people, particularly when there are biological reasons to justify a behavior outside of belief. Belief is sadly less an indicator of human behavior than simple conditioning.

An interesting thought. I definitely misunderstood you, and this made me consider things in a different way.

Thanks.

 

[Redrosewitch]

Given that part of my name is ' witch ' I think you can guess my answer is ' yes. '

Not Hocus Pocus Fairy Godmother magic of course, but things like the laws of attraction, the power of your thoughts and beliefs to help manifest things in your life. To me these are magic.