Climate continues to change.

[phrodeau]

The nuclear waste site in Marshall Islands is at risk of flooding from the rising sea level. US says it’s Marshall Islands’ problem, and they say it’s the US’s.

https://www.latimes.com/projects/marshall-islands-nuclear-testing-sea-level-rise/

 

[Conager]

I'm not grid connected. I literally used the word prepper. I mean the house "grid". I can't remember what it's called because my whole house is literally just kinda rigged together. The AC thing.

And no, I have no comprehension of what anything I have is called. That's not how I roll. I'm not an electrician, I'm a hillbilly with a lot of cousins and no desire to pay some big-city power company anything So you know, the average solar panel consumer. But I don't need to know all them fancy words, I just gotta know how to hook it up, how to maintain it, and how it works.

I never said they charge at night. They charge during the day and you use the stored energy at night, or during snowy days or whatever. There's enough in the bank to last us about 48 hours in the winter. As I already explained, I found that out the lazy-ass way. So what that other guy was saying about, "You have to run a generator at night", you don't. That's simply not true. At night it pulls from the batteries. Then the next day you get enough to run the house and charge the batteries. Now, I am on top of a hill, so it might not work as well for somebody that can't get enough south facing sun, because you do need a full-exposure spot for your system. But I think most folks if they're in a partial shade area put them on the roof. Mine's just on a little wooden thing me and my cousin built a little bit more up the hill. If I'm getting enough in rural Appalachia in the middle of the Danial Boone National Forest, I'd say you'd be hard pressed to find a spot where you can't get enough.

The battery bank is actually the most expensive part, and my house is actually pretty big, in the sense that it's not a tinyhouse like I wanted because I just kinda... kept building because I kept getting more people so I went over the 1K sq ft limit, so that's why my system was so much more expensive than what you're thinking of with the tiny house/RV kits. I know people are getting 12V kits for like $2K but that just wouldn't work for my situation. Everyone is different. I've got a deep freeze and shit. That just wouldn't work for me. If I had done that, I would have to run a generator at night because I wouldn't have enough to charge the bank coming in. So you do have to choose the best fit for your specific situation.

But come the situation me and mine'll have power. And food. And ammo if my brother would stop fucking wasting it all.

Laughs.

Everyone has a friend or brother that burns through ammo, because noise is fun.

I'm one to talk; I went through three boxes of shells to get two quail.

WB, btw.

 

[CandiCame]

Laughs.

Everyone has a friend or brother that burns through ammo, because noise is fun.

I'm one to talk; I went through three boxes of shells to get two quail.

WB, btw.

That shit's just got too fucking expensive. I swear to god I used to be able to get a box of 50 .38s for like $5. I swear to god. I had to go get some earlier this week and that shit was $20.

No one will bitch about this with me but that is fucking high. Shit has got too high.

But at least I got carded. I'm pushing 30 and that's like 50 in Twink years. I still look 17! I'm pretty!

Edit: Also in his defense he doesn't burn through it because 'noise is fun', he shoots competitively so he does have to practice. He's damn good, too.

I'm the 'noise is fun' guy. When we got that AR-15 I was out back of the house like even after I ran out of cans just shooting to shoot like a dumbass, because my dumbass redneck brain went, "Damn there ain't nary bit a' kick to this! Darlin, get the four year old, she needs to shoot this!"

To be fair to me I did have earplus in. It's not the noise it's just fuckin fun to shoot. I love that gun so much...

 

[CandiCame]

SOMEBODY has to generate the off-hours electricity. If you allow solar consumers to "sell" excess capacity to the grid when the sun shines then use that credit to "buy" power from the grid when the sun is not shining, they are still using coal/gas/nuk/hydro or what have you. That has a capital cost.

As has been pointed out Germany did exactly what you would like to do. They maximize their use of solar and wind all of which had to be backed up by redundancy, so although I'm sure they burned less fossil fuels than if they didn't have that system in place their cost per kilowatt-hour is greater because you have to run parallel systems. The only savings just as I said are your savings on the actual purchase of fossil fuels. There are zero savings on capital expenditures because you still have all of the same capital expenditures that you would have if you didn't have any solar and wind *plus* the capital expenditures of solar and wind.

It's cheaper build and run a gas powered electricity plant 24 hours a day in continuous operation then it is to start and stop that for 10 to 14 hours a day and also build and run a solar plant to operate during the other hours of the day.

Let's imagine that you have a solar powered car that you use to go grocery shopping when the sun shines. Sometimes you want to go grocery shopping at night so you have a second gasoline-powered car in the garage for that purpose. It isn't possible that it's cheaper to own both cars than it is to only own the gasoline-powered car.

Again, if you have a self-contained system this is not the case. It just stores that excess that you generate and then you use that at night. And during the day if your lazy ass won't go knock the snow off the panels. It doesn't magically disappear, it's stored in the power bank. You just have to size the system to your needs. You can't run a full-sized house on an RV system. That's what y'all are talking about, but nobody with sense does that. People only do that to save money on the start-up costs.

 

[Conager]

Again, if you have a self-contained system this is not the case. It just stores that excess that you generate and then you use that at night. And during the day if your lazy ass won't go knock the snow off the panels. It doesn't magically disappear, it's stored in the power bank. You just have to size the system to your needs. You can't run a full-sized house on an RV system. That's what y'all are talking about, but nobody with sense does that. People only do that to save money on the start-up costs.

We are talking about powering Germany. There aren't enough batteries in the world to power Germany.

 

[Hal9000_]

The nuclear waste site in Marshall Islands is at risk of flooding from the rising sea level. US says it’s Marshall Islands’ problem, and they say it’s the US’s.

https://www.latimes.com/projects/marshall-islands-nuclear-testing-sea-level-rise/

The dome. Nasty stuff. I think we all know the actual reason commercial nuclear plants exist. Weapons material production. Probably the only reason most are still operational.

Subsidized and operating at loss of profits.

 

[CandiCame]

We are talking about powering Germany. There aren't enough batteries in the world to power Germany.

You can fit Germany inside of California and have room for Disneyland and all the tourists. There are easily enough batteries in the world to run Germany. Like I said, you can run the whole US from unused land on the Arizona desert. Hyperbolically, you can run Germany on a car battery.

 

[Dribble]

The dome. Nasty stuff. I think we all know the actual reason commercial nuclear plants exist. Weapons material production. Probably the only reason most are still operational.

Subsidized and operating at loss of profits.

Same reason they built many of the TVA dams where they did...needed the electricity for Oak Ridge.

 

[Conager]

You can fit Germany inside of California and have room for Disneyland and all the tourists. There are easily enough batteries in the world to run Germany. Like I said, you can run the whole US from unused land on the Arizona desert. Hyperbolically, you can run Germany on a car battery.

A shame the Germans don't have any German engineers to implement your totally workable solution.

 

[Dribble]

Que has no clue...parallel systems? Dude...you have a demand...let us call that x. It is met by present fossil fuel facility production Y. Initially X=Y. You have a supply from wind, solar, rats running around on a wheel...let us call that Z. Z is connected to the same grid as Y. Now demand X=Z+(Y-Z). One source is cheaper and better for the environment Z.

what a fucking brain dead waste.

 

[Conager]

Same reason they built many of the TVA dams where they did...needed the electricity for Oak Ridge.

The TVA features both an assured water supply and additional on-peak power generation by opening the sluices to the hydrolelectric side.

Palo Verde takes it a step further by taking excess generating capacity off-peak and using it to pump water uphill as a power storage technique.

 

[Conager]

Que has no clue...parallel systems? Dude...you have a demand...let us call that x. It is met by present fossil fuel facility production Y. Initially X=Y. You have a supply from wind, solar, rats running around on a wheel...let us call that Z. Z is connected to the same grid as Y. Now demand X=Z+(Y-Z). One source is cheaper and better for the environment Z.

what a fucking brain dead waste.

I already acknowledged that WHEN you are generating with wind or solar (but ONLY when) you are saving on the cost of fossil fuels that would have been burned. That is your only savings.

Pretending you understand algebra doesn't change the equation at all. You still have to be able to generate 100% of your needs on-peak for any time with coal, gas, hydro, or nuclear that the other system is not generating. Otherwise you have California.

Oh wait you one of those geniuses that does live in California, and votes "green," for illegals over infrastructure, and Democrats.

 

[Dribble]

I already acknowledged that WHEN you are generating with wind or solar (but ONLY when) you are saving on the cost of fossil fuels that would have been burned. That is your only savings.

Pretending you understand algebra doesn't change the equation at all. You still have to be able to generate 100% of your needs on-peak for any time with coal, gas, hydro, or nuclear that the other system is not generating. Otherwise you have California.

Oh wait you one of those geniuses that does live in California, and votes "green," for illegals over infrastructure, and Democrats.

Dude...step back...take a breath. You are making a fool of yourself again, and that is not my goal. Anytime you can reduce costs, it saves money. So if I can produce electricity at half the cost....for half the day (which is incorrect...but it doesn't matter), which costs less? The production method that costs more full time? Or the production method that can produce at half the cost half the time? That's right...math don't lie.

Now, let us talk physics. Ever hear of potential energy? You know...pumping water up during a time of excess energy...releasing water at night to generate power? Or maybe how about thermal dynamics? Heat up water during periods of excess energy...recoup the energy later?

Germany's electricity is expensive because of the carbon taxes they must pay. You know...paying for the nuclear dismantling...paying for the coal they still use. Again...numbers don't lie.

 

[Conager]

Moving the goal posts doesn't help you. Your assertion was that the cost of solar including all capital costs is the cost of generating solar, and OMITTED the cost of either storing that or ALSO paying for the capital cost of a complete, redundant, generating capacity.

In my initial post pointing out your stupidity I ACKNOWLEDGED the cost savings that solar does provide. Me pointing out that a good portion of those savings are offset by having parallel generating capacity is exactly that, and no more.

Continuing to argue that the solar power when it is generated is cheaper to generate (when no one's arguing against that )doesn't help your argument that it included all associated capital costs when it doesn't.

Chin up, maybe you can find a typo, you dullard.

 

[Hal9000_]

SPS's.... Solar Power Satellites that beam down microwave energy to receiving stations to be converted and distributed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space-based_solar_power

I know...I know... "It'll never work!"

 

[Conager]

SPS's.... Solar Power Satellites that beam down microwave energy to receiving stations to be converted and distributed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space-based_solar_power

I know...I know... "It'll never work!"

You going to invest when DC Solar adds that to their product line?

 

[cowslinger64]

Moving the goal posts doesn't help you. Your assertion was that the cost of solar including all capital costs is the cost of generating solar, and OMITTED the cost of either storing that or ALSO paying for the capital cost of a complete, redundant, generating capacity.

In my initial post pointing out your stupidity I ACKNOWLEDGED the cost savings that solar does provide. Me pointing out that a good portion of those savings are offset by having parallel generating capacity is exactly that, and no more.

Continuing to argue that the solar power when it is generated is cheaper to generate (when no one's arguing against that )doesn't help your argument that it included all associated capital costs when it doesn't.

Chin up, maybe you can find a typo, you dullard.

How was work today?


https://uberpeople.net/attachments/img_2048-jpg.98871/

 

[CandiCame]

Moving the goal posts doesn't help you. Your assertion was that the cost of solar including all capital costs is the cost of generating solar, and OMITTED the cost of either storing that or ALSO paying for the capital cost of a complete, redundant, generating capacity.

In my initial post pointing out your stupidity I ACKNOWLEDGED the cost savings that solar does provide. Me pointing out that a good portion of those savings are offset by having parallel generating capacity is exactly that, and no more.

Continuing to argue that the solar power when it is generated is cheaper to generate (when no one's arguing against that )doesn't help your argument that it included all associated capital costs when it doesn't.

Chin up, maybe you can find a typo, you dullard.

It doesn't cost anything to store past the investment. I included that in my cost. It'd just be in Euros or whatever gay-ass rainbow colored currency they use to pay for power banks over there.

Like... you know how if you buy cloud storage you have to pay for it every month, but if you buy a harddrive you just own it until you break it? That's how solar do.

Edit: Also, if you want a backup I got my generator for next to nothing because I helped the guy do some roof shit. I mean, you gotta put gas in it, but check whatever your equivalency of craigslist is. You can find used shit on there all the time. I'd rather have propane but real talk I am basing that exclusively on the fact that I want to be Hank Hill.

 

[CandiCame]

Also, is that Que?

And if so why'd you choose your username? I've been gone.

Edit: CHANGE

Jesus Christ. I'm tired. I've been up since 3. And I was already kinda dumb so it is what it is.

 

[Conager]

 

[gunthernehmen]

I'm not grid connected. I literally used the word prepper. I mean the house "grid". I can't remember what it's called because my whole house is literally just kinda rigged together. The AC thing.

And no, I have no comprehension of what anything I have is called. That's not how I roll. I'm not an electrician, I'm a hillbilly with a lot of cousins and no desire to pay some big-city power company anything So you know, the average solar panel consumer. But I don't need to know all them fancy words, I just gotta know how to hook it up, how to maintain it, and how it works.

I never said they charge at night. They charge during the day and you use the stored energy at night, or during snowy days or whatever. There's enough in the bank to last us about 48 hours in the winter. As I already explained, I found that out the lazy-ass way. So what that other guy was saying about, "You have to run a generator at night", you don't. That's simply not true. At night it pulls from the batteries. Then the next day you get enough to run the house and charge the batteries. Now, I am on top of a hill, so it might not work as well for somebody that can't get enough south facing sun, because you do need a full-exposure spot for your system. But I think most folks if they're in a partial shade area put them on the roof. Mine's just on a little wooden thing me and my cousin built a little bit more up the hill. If I'm getting enough in rural Appalachia in the middle of the Danial Boone National Forest, I'd say you'd be hard pressed to find a spot where you can't get enough.

The battery bank is actually the most expensive part, and my house is actually pretty big, in the sense that it's not a tinyhouse like I wanted because I just kinda... kept building because I kept getting more people so I went over the 1K sq ft limit, so that's why my system was so much more expensive than what you're thinking of with the tiny house/RV kits. I know people are getting 12V kits for like $2K but that just wouldn't work for my situation. Everyone is different. I've got a deep freeze and shit. That just wouldn't work for me. If I had done that, I would have to run a generator at night because I wouldn't have enough to charge the bank coming in. So you do have to choose the best fit for your specific situation.

But come the situation me and mine'll have power. And food. And ammo if my brother would stop fucking wasting it all.

Right. The grid is grid that interconnects the rest of us. But the grid connected systems don't use batteries, so you appeared to be saying contradictory things. It was terminology, that's all.

Yours is an appropriate application of solar energy. But it doesn't "scale" to a national or worldwide level.

The guy that mentioned night was talking about grid systems, NOT single home off grid systems. Since solar farms don't generate at night, something else has to pick up the load when it's dark. That's coal or natural gas. The batteries don't work on that scale. (there are ways to store some of the power, like pumping water during the day and generating with hydro at night but it's inefficient and hard on the fish)

 

[cowslinger64]

All that work, nothing witty about it.


You really have fallen down the shit hole since laurel ripped off your tiny balls.


Sad.

 

[Conager]

It doesn't cost anything to store past the investment. I included that in my cost. It'd just be in Euros or whatever gay-ass rainbow colored currency they use to pay for power banks over there.

Like... you know how if you buy cloud storage you have to pay for it every month, but if you buy a harddrive you just own it until you break it? That's how solar do.

Edit: Also, if you want a backup I got my generator for next to nothing because I helped the guy do some roof shit. I mean, you gotta put gas in it, but check whatever your equivalency of craigslist is. You can find used shit on there all the time. I'd rather have propane but real talk I am basing that exclusively on the fact that I want to be Hank Hill.

When he started deflecting it was from the basis of discussing what it costs to generate solar power. Not what it counts to store it. He did not include the cost of storage in his assertion that solar is as cheap as he claims that it is.

I have no idea what the number of cycles that you will have in your battery I assume that you've got some sort of power management system which maximizes the durability of those batteries by likely not quite charging them all the way or discharging them all the way.

Regardless, at some point they will have to be replaced. In the end you'll have to calculate what it actually cost you per kilowatt hours stored based on the replacement cost of the batteries versus how much energy did you get back out of those batteries. I have no idea what that number is neither does dribble and he didn't include that in his cost of how cheap solar is.

He's talkin about powering Society with the cost that major utilities incur with large solar plants per kilowatt-hour for those powers that they are able to generate. He ignored what it cost to generate electricity when they're down or the store that energy. No one disputes that once you have a solar panel and it's up and running electricity is free.

 

[Conager]

 

[gunthernehmen]

Not really. What provides the energy for all the mining, construction and maintenance of plants (refuelling), and decommissioning?

Then there is all the wonderful nuclear waste we can't figure out what to do with and sits in giant concrete pools at stations all over the country.

You're right though, it DOES have a fantastic green glow!

https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/b/nuclear-waste-barrel-glowing-10514535.jpg

You can thank Peanut Boy for that.

The reason spent nuclear fuel is stored and not reprocessed into new fuel or useful products is a matter of LAW, not a matter of necessity.