A Warning for All You True Believers Out There in LitLand

[Rex1960]

...There are only 3 people that I had ever told what his company was and only one of those 3 hates me....

I don't want to judge here, but

Hates you ? What for ? Any idea ?

WAIT - before your start answering in public,
PM me or keep it, it's none of my business anyway.

Just read my sig line. It should tell ya something.

 

[estevie]

I don't think so Rex...I have NO idea who did this...but I do have my suspicions. There are only 3 people that I had ever told what his company was and only one of those 3 hates me.

Therefore..******* is not the place for me to meet "friends". I cannot nor will I ever trust anyone again.

Ok, I don't want to sound like I'm arguing the excellant post made by Muff on being safe on the net.



You did not post this info on the board for public consumption, Cat. This was something you told privately. Not the same thing. Some creepy freak didn't pick this up from off the board to use against you. You know this person.

My whole point, somehow not evident here, is that the warning will not be heeded by those that need it most. If it never crossed your mind before today that maybe its not a good idea to post your name and address here, whether this thread had anything to do with Hanns or not, he has definately been a stopper for private info being posted here, you'll never get it. Do you see what I'm saying or am I being completely misunderstood?

 

[intrigued]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: A Warning for All You True Believers Out There in LitLand

Oh wait one second there...you edited out that you got the info from Trail before you edited out that whole section. I just said that wasn't a good example because all that info can't be found on the board. You got it from someone else.

I don't have a problem, KM. You've never done anything to me, why are you getting so defensive?

never mind.

 

[*bratcat*]

 

[Cherry]

I always sing in the car with the stereo blaring.


OH! sorry ... wrong thread.

 

[Cheyenne]

I say very few words to him...but I clicked the link. Did you?

Nope, I didn't. Had no interest in all in whatever he might be posting on another site. Also, I trust him even less than Indigo Rose. Why would I risk clicking on anything Hanns posts?

 

[intrigued]

Correct me someone PLEASE...but am I to gather from all this that refers to me, that someone told KM (personally) info about me???

 

[*bratcat*]

 

[Rex1960]

Correct me someone PLEASE...but am I to gather from all this that refers to me, that someone told KM (personally) info about me???

How about asking that directly in PM ????

 

[intrigued]

KM, thanks for your PM, all is cool.

Excellent thread!

 

[estevie]

Also, I trust him even less than Indigo Rose. Why would I risk clicking on anything Hanns posts?

Good point! Me and 449 others forgot that fact. Damn, how quickly I forget. *shaking head* I truly have to question how my mind works sometimes! Would you mind posting everyday "este, don't click the links!!!!"

 

[Lancecastor]

Correct me someone PLEASE...but am I to gather from all this that refers to me, that someone told KM (personally) info about me???

Intrigued, PM Net has nearly as much traffic as the Board some days, particularly between the oldies.


Lance

 

[Cheyenne]

Would you mind posting everyday "este, don't click the links!!!!"

hehe... be careful what you ask for...

 

[Sandia]

KM: There's hundreds of people who know exactly what you look like, what your name is, where you live... they're students where you go to school, administrators, classmates, co-workers, neighbors, and people who pass you on the street. The guy from Dominoes who brings you your goddam pizza. Open the phone book. It's full people's names, addresses, and telephone numbers.

Paranoia. It's not just a river in Egypt.

 

[KillerMuffin]

Sandia, just because my guy brings me a drink at the family reunion doesn't mean you're buying me one at the bar.

It's called common sense. If you don't like it, don't use it. However, don't sit there and tell people online to flash personal information because some people have access to it already.

That would be stupid.

 

[Azwed]

Re: Re: Re: A Warning for All You True Believers Out There in LitLand

You know what? I've never seen a case in the Canadian media of something bad happening to someone IRL from using the Web.

Do you have anything beyond anecdotes that backs up your statement?

Did you even read the link about the Robinson case she posted?

http://news.findlaw.com/court_tv/s/20020923/23sep2002182820.html

There it is again for you.

There have been several cases of children, young teenagers mostly, being tricked by online predators. There have also been multiple sting opperations where online predators have been caught using police officers posing as young teenagers. Look around some do some research you will find it.

I have an interesting story about a friend of mine that deals with this type of situation. He ended up just fine but things could have gone very differently.

A guy I knew all through Middle School and High School got into an online relationship with a 30 some year old woman sometime during the end of his Senior year. He never told anyone about this woman while they were getting to know each other online.

Sometime near the end of his fall semester freshman year they decided to meet. He never told anyone what was going on. Instead of going home for winter break he took a flight to see this woman.

No one knew what happened to him. He was gone for almost a month and never called anyone to say where he was or what was going on. He came back towards the end of the first week of Jan. like nothing had ever happend. He was 19 foolish, immature, stupid, dumb and rebelling against his overprotective mom.

Everything turned out fine in this situation and they actually stayed in a relationship for several months but things could have easily gone very bad instead.

 

[Sandia]

I'm just saying use common sense. Seriously, you're way more likely to get splatted by a car than get stalked by an evil internet stalker. I mean, if you are a stalker, aren't there any real people where you live?

I'm not claiming the internet is totally safe. Just safer than real life is all.

 

[Debbie]

Just few words from a person who was naive when it came to the net. Being here at lit and seeing people post personal info, trusting others and then having that personal info and PM's posted makes me really weary about who I trust.

I trust only a few. Nope, I'm not paranoid, just realistic after seeing this happen again and again here and elsewhere on the net.


As for cyber stalking? After doing some reading and watching the news it is becoming a serious issue.

"Cyber stalking is one of the most prevalent problems, as we earlier made claim. Have you even realized the full impact yet of the idea that one in ten will become the victim of a cyber stalker? Let’s look at what that really means.

According to the United States Department of Justice, in a study done in 1999 the figure is actually a little higher than 1 out of ten.

Stalking is more prevalent than previously thought: 8.1 percent of surveyed women and 2.2 percent of surveyed men reported being stalked. Source – USDOJ

This shows a total of 10.3% have been stalked. Again, not a statistic that really hits home. The big shock comes when you apply these figures to the total Internet population.

In a 1999 Commerce-Nielson report the total Internet population for the United Sates and Canada was 92,200,000. If we adjust that figure for a modest (many sources say it is much higher) 8% growth since that report, the figure has now exceeded 100,000,000.
( http://www.commerce.net/research/stats/wwwpop.html )
This means that based on the DOJ study there are now 10,300,000 current and future cyber stalking victims on-line. Over ten million in the United States and Canada alone! "

From this link.

http://www.theguardianangel.com/internet_safety_cyberstalking.htm

 

[Sandia]

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Sorry. The link didn't make it.

 

[Byron In Exile]

As for cyber stalking? After doing some reading and watching the news it is becoming a serious issue.

From this link.
http://www.theguardianangel.com/internet_safety_cyberstalking.htm

It may or may not be a serious issue, but this link is no indication one way or the other.

According to the United States Department of Justice, in a study done in 1999 the figure is actually a little higher than 1 out of ten.

Stalking is more prevalent than previously thought: 8.1 percent of surveyed women and 2.2 percent of surveyed men reported being stalked. Source – USDOJ (http://www.ncjrs.org/txtfiles1/nij/183781.txt).

This shows a total of 10.3% have been stalked. Again, not a statistic that really hits home. The big shock comes when you apply these figures to the total Internet population.

If you have a population of 50% women and 50% men, and 8.1% of women and 2.2% of men report being stalked, that is 5.15% of the total population, not 10.3%. If whoever wrote it can't manage simple math like that, the article is undoubtably of little value. Note too, that these are percentages of people who say they had been stalked, at any point in their lives, by anyone.

Plus, the DOJ report cited has nothing to do with the Internet -- the survey is about stalking in real life. The figure is simply applied to a completely different situation with no evidence for it. This is just another local-newscast Scary Thing of the Week feature, designed to elicit a visceral response and sell toothpaste.

 

[Byron In Exile]

I'm not claiming the internet is totally safe. Just safer than real life is all.

...quietly stalks Sandia...

 

[KillerMuffin]

Why are we even debating about how dangerous the 'Net is? The only purpose in doing so would be to prove that it's not dangerous.

I maintain, without statistics or otherwise, that dangerous people hang out on the 'Net and that people should think about what they post before they do.

Contradict me if you will, but when you contradict me, you're a stating that the 'Net is not dangerous and that people should not practice safe posting at places like Lit.

The only reason for this debate is to try to put the burden of proof on people asking others to post personal info with some forethought that the 'Net has predators. Anyone who thinks otherwise is either extremely sheltered, amnesiac, or just plain stupid.

I never said that the 'Net was overrun by these people, or that by posting your personal information here that you would get hunted down and brutalized in someway. I did--very clearly--state that there is a slim possibiilty of it and to exercise some thought while posting. Nothing more.

I really don't see why anyone would think this is bad advice. Unless, of course, you're a predator.

Debating the existence of predators on the 'Net is futile. They exist and everyone here knows it.

 

[Debbie]

I am just stating I believe the net is a place where people
post personal information and assume they are safe because they are sitting in their home, or at the library, at work etc and that they will continue to be safe.


Living is dangerous.
The link didn't cut the mustard, I get that.
It was just one that I read and thought,
it had some valid points.

I agree common sense when on the net
is a good idea.

 

[april-wine]

I agree common sense when on the net
is a good idea.

That and good sex.......


Sorry Muffy this is an excellent thread, made me think twice about profiles and such......

 

[Byron In Exile]

Why are we even debating about how dangerous the 'Net is?

Because we use it and think it's an important subject? Just guessing here...

The only purpose in doing so would be to prove that it's not dangerous.

...or to judge whether it is more or less dangerous than real life situations like bars, etc.

I maintain, without statistics or otherwise, that dangerous people hang out on the 'Net and that people should think about what they post before they do.

Contradict me if you will, but when you contradict me, you're a stating that the 'Net is not dangerous and that people should not practice safe posting at places like Lit.

Azwed, above, posted a link to a current case, Kansas v Robinson, which proves your assertion. He's not John Wayne Gacy, but he did use the Internet. And he apparently murdered several women (he hasn't been convicted yet, but they're dead). Note, though, that he didn't go after them, he lured them to where he was. And their purpose for meeting him was apparently to engage in BDSM sex -- this is some serious high-risk behavior.

The only reason for this debate is to try to put the burden of proof on people asking others to post personal info with some forethought that the 'Net has predators. Anyone who thinks otherwise is either extremely sheltered, amnesiac, or just plain stupid.

Without calling anyone stupid, my opinion is that posting one's address and/or phone number on the Internet is unwise. But if you've registered a domain name, you've effectively posted your address on the Internet. There are worse things you can do with your address, I think it would be less wise to post it at a local bar, for instance, where the person doesn't have to possibly arrange an airline flight to get there. Also, there is the chance of bunk info -- that a stalker on the Internet wouldn't know if the 19-year old cheerleader from Santa Monica he'd been cybering with wasn't secretly a 49-year old gay physical fitness trainer with an extensive gun collection. It just doesn't seem like a promising venue for a criminal, compared with the real world.

I never said that the 'Net was overrun by these people, or that by posting your personal information here that you would get hunted down and brutalized in someway. I did--very clearly--state that there is a slim possibiilty of it and to exercise some thought while posting. Nothing more.

I agree with that, and I don't think Sandia disputed it. He said only that it is not as dangerous, which I agree with also. One thing that makes it safer are ISP log files, which leave a trail if a crime is actually committed. A highly vocal troll that threatens people is probably not a real-life concern. In fact, I think it is probably more stupid to threaten people with physical harm than it is to post one's address. If something does actually happen to them, one has made oneself a prime suspect.

It's a powerful way to communicate, but posting to a message board is like making a radio broadcast, and it's not just common users who can eavesdrop, but ISP employees, and various government agencies as well. It is a public, not a private, medium, and that should always be considered (especially when posting one's own personal information or threatening people).