A technical question about computers

[mjl2010]

Is anyone listening to Harold?

Anyone?

1. Boot your computer. Press F8 during startup to bring up the menu.
2. Choose MS-DOS Prompt only.
3. Type Format C: /U [Enter]

The message will come up asking if you want to proceed, that all data on the disk will be destroyed. If you're sure, press Y and go ahead.

If you want to be really, really sure. Do it twice but you'll need a disk with the format program on it.

If you want to be anal about it, Do it three times. When I worked for the government, that was enough to satisfy most security requirements. You're talking about needing equipment that costs tens of thousands of dollars, specialized software that costs almost as much and a team of trained personal working for a month to get at any data on that disk. Joe Blow Job down at the recycle center or Ed the geek from the geek squad isn't going to be able to do it, no matter how good he claims to be.

If you're so paranoid that you're not happy yet, take the drive out after the third format. Go to your service panel on your house and take the cover off. Inside there are three great big wires that come in from the outside. Don't touch these. instead, use jumper cables to connect them to your hard drive. Leave attached for say, oh, until it catches fire. Then disconnect. If you haven't electrocuted yourself, I promise the drive will never give up any data again.

MJL

 

[dkak001]

Is anyone listening to Harold?

Anyone?

1. Boot your computer. Press F8 during startup to bring up the menu.
2. Choose MS-DOS Prompt only.
3. Type Format C: /U [Enter]

The message will come up asking if you want to proceed, that all data on the disk will be destroyed. If you're sure, press Y and go ahead.

If you want to be really, really sure. Do it twice but you'll need a disk with the format program on it.

Hmmm... ...don't be so sure. I've recovered data from drives formatted with the format command. Don't know if the unconditional switch was used or not.
Free from the internet software did it. The only good wipe is psuedo random data write several times over to all bits on the drive. Book and Nuke is pretty good, and the price is right (free)... ...why not use it?

-Dan

 

[Weird Harold]

Hmmm... ...don't be so sure. I've recovered data from drives formatted with the format command. Don't know if the unconditional switch was used or not.
Free from the internet software did it.

If you recovered data from a re-formated drive, it was NOT an unconditional format -- at least if yourecovered anything with software except &hEFEF in every byte of the data area.

An Unconditional Format is what is used to mark and lock out bad sectors -- similar to scandisk's surface test, but using a destructive overwrite of any existing data with the &hEFEF

A regular format -- what used to be called a "Quick Format" when it first appeared to save time installing 40MB+ drives -- only rebuilds the FAT and relies on the manufacturer's low level format for the data area prep. REformating in that mode does leave data that can be recovered by downloadable software and even by some of Windows built-in features -- like enabling "Unformat" when a drive is reformated in "quick" mode.

The only good wipe is psuedo random data write several times over to all bits on the drive. Book and Nuke is pretty good, and the price is right (free)... ...why not use it?

If you have any reason to believe a drive is going to be recycled intact and there is any truly sensitive information on it, a program like Boot and Nuke or Norton's Wipedisk is a a reasonable bit of paranoia indulgence. It NOT necessary following an Unconditional Format

I can't say about Boot and Nuke, but Norton's WipeDisk (in the version I last used) leaves the appearance of a freshly formatted data area, eg the &hEFEF value in every unused byte of the drive -- including unused areas of the boot sector.

Reformatting with the quick format and /s switch (load bootable system) followed by Norton's WipeDisk (run from a floppy or CDROM) is functionally the same as an Unconditional Format with the /S switch to leave the drive bootable.

Of course, you can always use a "poor man's wipe" by creating a batch file named Wipe.bat as follows.

Begin:
echo 'nothing here to see, move along" >>wipe.txt
Goto Begin

Put that batch file in the root directory, drop to DOS an type C:/WIPE and go away for a good long while -- eventually you'll check back to find a disk full error.

Type echo '1' > wipe.txt
type C:/Wipe

And go away for a long while again while it writes the disk full shifete one bye to the right.

Repeat until you get tired of playing and your disk is as securely wiped as if you used WipeDisk or some other security utility.

Which brings us back to unconditional formatting -- it's a program that every computer has installed, it's a program that is simple to use; either the windows version or the DOS version, although I personally prefer the DOS version.

It does what most security programs do and unlike some security utilities it doesn't require any preparation or file deletions before making your hard-drive practically unrecoverable -- more unrecoverable than most people are willing to invest the time and money to get beyond unless they have some specific notion that there is valuable information there to be recovered.

Boot and Nuke may be good and the price is right, but it is just one more program that has to be acquired, installed, and learned -- in the time you can download it and get it working, I can have your system wiping the drive and nearly finished -- and leave you with a usable, resalable/donateable bootable harddrive.

 

[sailboatracer]

Harold is correct. Almost no one has the time, desire or resources to "recover" info from your hard drive after a low level format.
When I worked for a research lab that did some supposedly secret government work, they had a pretty darn good, if not paranoid way to dispose of hard drives with potentially sensitive data. The security chief would bring the drive to the electronics shop, and would watch one of the technicians with secret or top secret clearance dismantle the drive. Then he took the drive platters to the machine shop and had the magnetic coating sandblasted off the platters before they cut them into small pieces.

Is it paranoia if someone really is watching you?

 

[Weird Harold]

Harold is correct. Almost no one has the time, desire or resources to "recover" info from your hard drive after a low level format.

Just to be clear...

There is a difference between a "Low Level" format and an "Unconditional Format" Either will make data more difficult to recover than casual snoopers usually have the resources to manage.

The main difference is that everyone with a computer has the capability to perform and Unconditional Format, while access to Low Level formatting requires diagnostic/repair software or a Motherboard BIOS with Low Level Format capability.

A minor difference is that a Low Level format may actually preserve data by writing new tracks betweenthe old tracks instead of writing over the old tracks.

Any program or procedure that writes new information to each byte of a disk's data area will suffice to deter casual and non-specialized scrutiny. Repeating the program or procedure at least three times is usually sufficient to meet most organizations' "secure erase" requirements.

Sandblasting the platters and/or melting the drive down to cast souvineer knick-knacks is the only satisfaction for true paranoids or those with truly sensitive information, but those two classes are a very small minority of people who are disposing of old computers.

 

[LukkyKnight]

...
Sandblasting the platters and/or melting the drive down to cast souvineer knick-knacks is the only satisfaction for true paranoids or those with truly sensitive information, but those two classes are a very small minority of people who are disposing of old computers.

Interestingly enough, an old fashioned bulk mag tape eraser does a serious scramble, too, since it approaches the problem from an entirely different angle (literally.) It also can make it impossible to reformat the drive, which can be a plus or a minus depending how you look at it. Used on the heels of reformatting it's a reasonably potent combination. Umm... don't ask. ~LOL~

Meanwhile, take Harold's advice.

 

[luv2lick001]

Hey Deprived,

No doubt you've sorted this by now, but if you haven't, as most other people have suggested the only sure fire way destroying the data is to damage the hard disk surface.

However, this is not absolutely necessary as writing blank information (a number of times) over the disk will ensure that only an organization such as the FBI/CIA would be able to realistically retrieve the data.

If you erase the data in this way (writing blank data), at least you can sell (or give away) your old computer in-tact and fully working. If you require some software and a walk through on how to do this, feel free to PM me.