A technical question about computers

[Deprived_in_AZ]

Hey everyone, forgive me for putting a non-sexual question on here -

I would like to know how to erase old data from an old computer. I'm typing on the new one right now and shudder to think of the sort of chats and emails that were sent from the old machine..... rather incriminating stuff!

So, before the old computer leaves the house I would like to get rid of the information stored on it, something about cleaning off the hard drive I believe it's called?

Anyone know how to do it? It's a Windows 95 system. Oh and once it's all safe and clean, what does one do with an ancient piece of machinery like that? Surely there are more green ways than just throwing it in the garbage?

Thanks for taking the time to read and reply!

 

[SubNebGuy]

You'll need to download or purchase a program that cleans the hard drive.

what this means is that it will erase and write data over the entire hard drive numerous times. this makes it harder, but not impossible, to recover the data.

If you really don't want the info on the hard drive to EVER be recovered, you'll need to physically destroy the hard drive platters inside. that means opening the whole thing up, or using a strong torch or big ass firearm to destroy it.

I hang on to old memory, drives, sound and video cards. the cpu's usually aren't worth it, nor are the motherboards.

then find a place to recycle the rest.

 

[Deprived_in_AZ]

Thanks. A friend told me to attack the hard drive thingy with an ice pick..... The program you mention seems less extreme.

 

[SweetErika]

We deal with all sorts of questions, so there's no need to apologize for posting something non-sexual.

As you've been told, your best (and cheapest) bet is to physically destroy the hard drive. Don't do something stupid, like shoot it, though (a guy in my state just seriously injured his legs by taking a shotgun to a stubborn lug nut ). If you can open it up, it should be relatively easy to destroy. If not, I'm sure you can come up with some safe ways to make it unusable.

As for green ways to get rid of the computer, check with your local waste management and hazardous materials program. Here, it's against the law to throw away monitors and TVs; they must be taken to one of many collection sites that can dispose of them properly. We also have computer recycling programs and events. Google things like 'computer recycling Arizona' (or your city, county) and 'CRT disposal Arizona' to find out how you're supposed to deal with it in your area.

 

[Weird Harold]

I would like to know how to erase old data from an old computer. I'm typing on the new one right now and shudder to think of the sort of chats and emails that were sent from the old machine..... rather incriminating stuff!
...
Anyone know how to do it? It's a Windows 95 system. Oh and once it's all safe and clean, what does one do with an ancient piece of machinery like that?

If you're going to recycle the computer, then just take it to the recycler -- they're very unlikely to power up a computer before feeding it to the shredders so that the component materials can be salvaged.

If that is still too "risky" for you, then choose "reboot to MSDOS Prompt" and type "Format C: /U" and hit enter. (do all other partitions before doing the C: partition because Format.exe resides on the C: drive and formatting C: will erase it.)

When it tells you that any data on the disk will be destroyed, tell it to continue.

Doing an unconditional format will overwrite every sector on the disk with a format pattern that eliminates 99% of the possibility that the contents can be recovered by a casual computer user or commercial data recovery software -- doing three or more consecutive unconditional formats makes the chance of recovering anything with commercial software even less.

Unless you have reason to believe some FBI or CIA tech is going to be processing you hard-drive with specialized, non-commercial hardware and software, an unconditional format will destroy all information beyond any risk of casual recovery.

If your old computer isn't completely inoperable, Once you've done an unconditional format or three, run the Recovery Disk or reinstall Windows 95 and donate the computer to a thrift shop or second hand-store so someone who can't afford a new computer can have a computer of some sort.

 

[Deprived_in_AZ]

We deal with all sorts of questions, so there's no need to apologize for posting something non-sexual.

As you've been told, your best (and cheapest) bet is to physically destroy the hard drive. Don't do something stupid, like shoot it, though (a guy in my state just seriously injured his legs by taking a shotgun to a stubborn lug nut ). If you can open it up, it should be relatively easy to destroy. If not, I'm sure you can come up with some safe ways to make it unusable.

As for green ways to get rid of the computer, check with your local waste management and hazardous materials program. Here, it's against the law to throw away monitors and TVs; they must be taken to one of many collection sites that can dispose of them properly. We also have computer recycling programs and events. Google things like 'computer recycling Arizona' (or your city, county) and 'CRT disposal Arizona' to find out how you're supposed to deal with it in your area.

SweetErika, thanks for your reply. I don't own a gun and won't stab it with the kitchen knife (nor the aforementioned ice pick) so not to worry there, I don't intend to end up in the emergency room. I was thinking a recycling center too, or maybe donate it to someone who doesn't mind a slow computer.

 

[Deprived_in_AZ]

If you're going to recycle the computer, then just take it to the recycler -- they're very unlikely to power up a computer before feeding it to the shredders so that the component materials can be salvaged.

If that is still too "risky" for you, then choose "reboot to MSDOS Prompt" and type "Format C: /U" and hit enter. (do all other partitions before doing the C: partition because Format.exe resides on the C: drive and formatting C: will erase it.)

When it tells you that any data on the disk will be destroyed, tell it to continue.

Doing an unconditional format will overwrite every sector on the disk with a format pattern that eliminates 99% of the possibility that the contents can be recovered by a casual computer user or commercial data recovery software -- doing three or more consecutive unconditional formats makes the chance of recovering anything with commercial software even less.

Unless you have reason to believe some FBI or CIA tech is going to be processing you hard-drive with specialized, non-commercial hardware and software, an unconditional format will destroy all information beyond any risk of casual recovery.

If your old computer isn't completely inoperable, Once you've done an unconditional format or three, run the Recovery Disk or reinstall Windows 95 and donate the computer to a thrift shop or second hand-store so someone who can't afford a new computer can have a computer of some sort.

WeirdHarold, you're right, you DO have lots of answers! Thanks for your suggestions, I don't think the fuzz wil be too interested in me but maybe a few disgruntled wives with no sense of humor...... heehee. Some of your technical instructions wash right over me but I will keep your notes and use them for when I'm ready to, well, use them. By the way, I love your av!

 

[Weird Harold]

Some of your technical instructions wash right over me but I will keep your notes

Just remember the words unconditional format -- and that Win 95's help file does help explain how to do an unconditional format.

By the way, I love your av!

The Dirty Ol' Man troll doll was a birthday gift from my daughters some 20 years ago. I thought he would make a good avatar because my daughters explained they chose it because it looked just like me.

 

[SubNebGuy]

A co-worker of mine got 3 people at Geek Squad fired a couple weeks after he started there, because they were stealing home made porn off customer's machines they were repairing.

Moral is: don't assume Joe the recycle center guy isn't interested in the contents of your hard drive. maybe not for porn, but any stored passwords for financial records (including PayPal) should not be taken lightly.

 

[brazhunter]

The only absolutely sure way to secure a hard drive is to physically destroy it. Drill some holes through it. Other software solutions provide varying levels security but you need a multi-pass fdisk wiper program. Simple erasing or reformatting will protect your content from simple access but that's all.

 

[Weird Harold]

Simple erasing or reformatting will protect your content from simple access but that's all.

Simple formatting won't overwrite anything except the alloction table, which is why it is important to do an UNCONDITIONAL format if you intend to destroy data.

An unconditional format does a write/read/write surface verification of every byte on the disk and whenit finishes, every byte on the data area of the disk contans the Hex value EFEF (for Windows Format.exe; other formatting program may leave a different value, but it will be a specifc value written to every byte)

Moral is: don't assume Joe the recycle center guy isn't interested in the contents of your hard drive. maybe not for porn, but any stored passwords for financial records (including PayPal) should not be taken lightly.

Very true. A computer should never be recycled or donated without at least deleting every file on it, including the operating system which stores and uses personal information.

A factory provided "Restore" or "Recovery" disk will give the appearance of completely destroyed personal data, and in most cases, that will be sufficient to deter "Joe Recycler" from looking further or "Sam the Thrift Shop Guy" from digging past the obvious.

Neither Joe nor Sam have the time to dig out personal information for nefarious purposes unless you rub their noses in it's availability.

For all but the most diligent and high-tech searches, an unconditional format with write/read surface verification will completely destroy all information on the disk -- do it three times, and it will satisfy DOD secure erase requirements for overwriting deleted files.

There is a huge paranoia fueled market for "security programs" that relies on -- and perpetuates -- the general ignorance of how computers store and retrieve information. Every operating sytem comes with the means to destroy every bit of information on a data disk -- if the formatting utility doesn't do it, there is usuall disk maintenance/diagnostic or secure erase utility that can.

Those basic tools won't hide very much from specialized equipment that can read between the cyclinders for "ghost images" of old data, but they are more than adequate to send Joe Recycler and Sam the Thrift Shop guy browsing for easier targets.

Unless you have some specific reason to believe that some agency with high-tech data recovery equipment will have a reason to invest the time and effort to recover information from "ghost images" there is no reason to go to the time and trouble of physically destroying a drive -- and every reason NOT to; physically destroying a drive looks like you've got something to hide and just might draw the attention of someone with the technology to see if they can out find what it is you so desperate to hide.

I doubt that there are very many people in this forum who have the capability to destroy a hard drive beyond the ability of forensic data recovery to recover something personal from the remains.

I have a shredder that will eat CD/DVD/floppie disks like they were toilet paper -- I do NOT consider that a truly secure way of disposing of information, it's just an annoyance to deter casual snooping and make data miners work harder to get anything useful. But then I'm NOT paranoid enough to believe that I need any better security measures for my trash.

 

[Guest]

Deleted

 

[Weird Harold]

I have an old laptop and I would like to destroy the hard drive. What does the hard drive look like?! How do I know what to damage?

The harddrive is generally the largest single component inside a computer that isn't accessible from outside the case -- CD Drives and the Power supply are usually larger, but they have outside access or connections.

However, typing "Format C: /U" at a DOS prompt is just as effective for most purposes and doesn't expose you to the risk of flying metal shards or smashed fingers when youswing at the drive and miss.

 

[O2]

Not too much I can add....if there are no recycling centers maybe a High School could use it for instruction....

This site was on the local news some time ago for erasing data from a hard drive....

http://www.heidi.ie/eraser/

 

[Deprived_in_AZ]

The Dirty Ol' Man troll doll was a birthday gift from my daughters some 20 years ago. I thought he would make a good avatar because my daughters explained they chose it because it looked just like me.

Funny! The lady in my avatar looks just like me, too

 

[Deprived_in_AZ]

A co-worker of mine got 3 people at Geek Squad fired a couple weeks after he started there, because they were stealing home made porn off customer's machines they were repairing.

Moral is: don't assume Joe the recycle center guy isn't interested in the contents of your hard drive. maybe not for porn, but any stored passwords for financial records (including PayPal) should not be taken lightly.

That's pretty much why I want to have it as clean as possible before I pass it on.

Stealing home made porn off of someone's computer, that's just sad..

 

[Deprived_in_AZ]

Thanks everyone for your replies. So basically I need to first clean it off, then take that ice pick to it after all.

 

[Weird Harold]

Thanks everyone for your replies. So basically I need to first clean it off, then take that ice pick to it after all.

pretty much.

I wouldn't bother with the icepick though -- you're more likely to hurt yourself than you are the drive and nothing short of melting the drive down and casting into into a "three wise monkeys" curio will positively eliminate any possibility of some information being retrieved.

(I was going to refer you to my profile Pic for a comparison with the troll doll, but it seems to have vanished. )

 

[necroerotica]

If the Computer isn't going to be used by anyone else, there are two methods you can consider.

1 - the physical method. Simply take the hard-drive out of the PC, open it up with a screwdriver (doing so will invalidate your warrenty ) and take the disks out. Then bend, break, burn, drill, whatever. Trying to put them back together, if even possible, will require an EXTREME amout of specialised work, and possibly an entire episode of CSI.

2 - look on the website for the manufacturer of the hard-drive, and see if they have any tools. Often, as one of the support options to deal with dodgy disks, they'll ask you to do a complete 1's and 0's reformat of the disk, and provide a program to do so. Basically, and it can take hours, this reformats the disks back to their factory-fresh state overwriting/removing *everything*, including the boot sector.

 

[Weird Harold]

2 - look on the website for the manufacturer of the hard-drive, and see if they have any tools. Often, as one of the support options to deal with dodgy disks, they'll ask you to do a complete 1's and 0's reformat of the disk, and provide a program to do so. Basically, and it can take hours, this reformats the disks back to their factory-fresh state overwriting/removing *everything*, including the boot sector.

That is known as a "low level format" and can often be performed via a utility built into the BIOS chip (the motherboard's SETUP function)

However, it's NOT always as sure a method of destroying sensitive data as it appears -- since a low-level format recalibrates the servo-motors that physically move the drive heads, it often writes new tracks between the old tracks and the old data is forever preserved for forensic software that can read between the drive's tracks for "ghost data".

A low level format woould definitely make forensic software necessary to recover data, but it makes the data much more complete if it is recovered.

The only positive non-physical method of destroying data is a "degauser" (electromagnet) of sufficient strength to penetrate the drive housing -- such degausers do exist, but they're big, expensive, and in the hands of the very people you're least likely to want interested in your hard-drive; the government. (believe it or not, a junkyard's electromagnet probably isn't powerful enough to completely erase a hard-drive through the drive housing.)

 

[sutherngent985]

Thanks. A friend told me to attack the hard drive thingy with an ice pick..... The program you mention seems less extreme.

If this has been mentioned forgive me but something along these lines is the best. Take the HD out, open it and run a big magnet around the platters or basically do something to damage the platters....sandpaper I have heard works good as it damages the iron coating.

 

[Deprived_in_AZ]

pretty much.

I wouldn't bother with the icepick though -- you're more likely to hurt yourself than you are the drive and nothing short of melting the drive down and casting into into a "three wise monkeys" curio will positively eliminate any possibility of some information being retrieved.

(I was going to refer you to my profile Pic for a comparison with the troll doll, but it seems to have vanished. )

The three wise monkeys, now there's a thought! Or maybe a mini chastity belt....

Please do let me know if you get that picture back up

 

[Deprived_in_AZ]

If the Computer isn't going to be used by anyone else, there are two methods you can consider.

1 - the physical method. Simply take the hard-drive out of the PC, open it up with a screwdriver (doing so will invalidate your warrenty ) and take the disks out. Then bend, break, burn, drill, whatever. Trying to put them back together, if even possible, will require an EXTREME amout of specialised work, and possibly an entire episode of CSI.

2 - look on the website for the manufacturer of the hard-drive, and see if they have any tools. Often, as one of the support options to deal with dodgy disks, they'll ask you to do a complete 1's and 0's reformat of the disk, and provide a program to do so. Basically, and it can take hours, this reformats the disks back to their factory-fresh state overwriting/removing *everything*, including the boot sector.

Bend, break, burn, drill, sounds like good activities for when the in-laws come to visit

 

[Deprived_in_AZ]

If this has been mentioned forgive me but something along these lines is the best. Take the HD out, open it and run a big magnet around the platters or basically do something to damage the platters....sandpaper I have heard works good as it damages the iron coating.

Nope no-one's mentioned magnets or sandpaper yet so thanks for your ideas!

 

[dkak001]

DBAN (Dariks Boot and Nuke) disk...

Dunno about green recycling....

But for a good wipe, check out:
http://dban.sourceforge.net/

Read their FAQ. It will point you to a lot of good information.
Also look for any papers by Peter Gutmann... ...he's studied this a bit.

As an FYI, if you so concerned about what you've used your old computer for, you shoud really look at making your current computer more secure also...
...After all, chances are that if someone walked into your house and stole your computer, you'd be in the same boat, or worse...

-Dan

P.S. I'm very anal about protecting data. Raid drives, Encryption, Virtual PC's, External backups, and offisite backups are all good...