4000 men died on D-Day thanks to bad intelligence...

[Lost Cause]

Again, without having street level intel, you have no projected outcomes based on actual live data.

That is the simple fact in any venture from weather prediction to warfare~

There is no blame, there was just no cooperation between agencies and indigenous sources.

 

[bronzeage]

Who do you blame?

FDR or Hitler?

What was the situation on the beach, on D+4 years?

 

[MisterEdMe]

BTW, I think the amount of casualties on D-day was more like 10,000 wasn't it?

 

[scorpio4uok]

D Day saved us all and changed the world for the better, well thats what we learned at school, so Germany are still trying for a superstate, the Bloody EU wants to keep theitr snout out of our affairs enough said

 

[MakersandIce]

Ike for refusing to allow Patton to lead the invasion.

 

[bronzeage]

BTW, I think the amount of casualties on D-day was more like 10,000 wasn't it?

“Casualties” refers to all losses suffered by the armed forces: killed, wounded, missing in action (meaning that their bodies were not found) and prisoners of war. There is no "official" casualty figure for D-Day. Under the circumstances, accurate record keeping was very difficult. For example, some troops who were listed as missing may actually have landed in the wrong place, and have rejoined their parent unit only later.

In April and May 1944, the Allied air forces lost nearly 12,000 men and over 2,000 aircraft in operations which paved the way for D-Day.

Total Allied casualties on D-Day are estimated at 10,000, including 2500 dead. British casualties on D-Day have been estimated at approximately 2700. The Canadians lost 946 casualties. The US forces lost 6603 men. Note that the casualty figures for smaller units do not always add up to equal these overall figures exactly, however (this simply reflects the problems of obtaining accurate casualty statistics).

Casualties on the British beaches were roughly 1000 on Gold Beach and the same number on Sword Beach. The remainder of the British losses were amongst the airborne troops: some 600 were killed or wounded, and 600 more were missing; 100 glider pilots also became casualties. The losses of 3rd Canadian Division at Juno Beach have been given as 340 killed, 574 wounded and 47 taken prisoner.


The breakdown of US casualties was 1465 dead, 3184 wounded, 1928 missing and 26 captured. Of the total US figure, 2499 casualties were from the US airborne troops (238 of them being deaths). The casualties at Utah Beach were relatively light: 197, including 60 missing. However, the US 1st and 29th Divisions together suffered around 2000 casualties at Omaha Beach.

It seldom helps an argument when you are defending a great failure, if you compare it to a great success.

 

[Ham Murabi]

Admitting to getting a blow job versus presiding over the biggest security breach in the nation's history that kills 3000 Americans and starting a major war getting over 3000 Americans killed on cooked intelligence is two completely different worlds.

If it were only a blow job ...
Some might even argue that a bigger security breach happened at Pearl Harbor. Similar casualties, plus the loss of a significant amount of the Pacific fleet.
And some might recall regime change in Iraq was a priority - votes in Congress for it and everything - back when Clinton was president. Along with the vow to hunt down bin Laden after every attack, including the WTC. And some might even remember the offer to deliver bin Laden, one that was turned down by Clinton because it might have been messy in a diplomatic way.
Let me repeat: Democrats voted for regime change in Iraq when Clinton was president, and offered all sorts of quotes about Saddam having WMD before Bush took office.

 

[huskie]

If it were only a blow job ...
Some might even argue that a bigger security breach happened at Pearl Harbor. Similar casualties, plus the loss of a significant amount of the Pacific fleet.
And some might recall regime change in Iraq was a priority - votes in Congress for it and everything - back when Clinton was president. Along with the vow to hunt down bin Laden after every attack, including the WTC. And some might even remember the offer to deliver bin Laden, one that was turned down by Clinton because it might have been messy in a diplomatic way.
Let me repeat: Democrats voted for regime change in Iraq when Clinton was president, and offered all sorts of quotes about Saddam having WMD before Bush took office.

I guess it's easier to do nothing and then blame some one else who actualy does something?

 

[huskie]

BTW, I think the amount of casualties on D-day was more like 10,000 wasn't it?

yup...or more. It was about 4,000 Deaths that day and over 7,000 wounded I believe?

 

[The Mutt]

If it were only a blow job ...
Some might even argue that a bigger security breach happened at Pearl Harbor. Similar casualties, plus the loss of a significant amount of the Pacific fleet.
And some might recall regime change in Iraq was a priority - votes in Congress for it and everything - back when Clinton was president. Along with the vow to hunt down bin Laden after every attack, including the WTC. And some might even remember the offer to deliver bin Laden, one that was turned down by Clinton because it might have been messy in a diplomatic way.
Let me repeat: Democrats voted for regime change in Iraq when Clinton was president, and offered all sorts of quotes about Saddam having WMD before Bush took office.

Ah, the old "Clinton turned down Osama" chestnut. I never get tired of hearing that one. Tell us again how Al Gore claimed to have invented the internet.

 

[Ham Murabi]

I guess it's easier to do nothing and then blame some one else who actualy does something?

Always plenty of blame to go around.
No one is innocent here.

 

[huskie]

Ah, the old "Clinton turned down Osama" chestnut. I never get tired of hearing that one. Tell us again how Al Gore claimed to have invented the internet.

not so much what Clinton did but what he wouldn't do.....that's not the first time he ignored the Osama issue....the first WTC attack was basically ignored as well as many Iraqi violations to the UN sanctions.
This war on Terror and Iraq was coming......long before Bush took office.

 

[MisterEdMe]

Of course it is, but at the heart of both is an ego that just can't accept being wrong. And sure, we do want strength in the office, but there's strength in saying you made a mistake too. In fact, that might take more courage than standing up in the clear light of an obvious fuck-up, and denying reality until you're blue in the face.

With Clinton, its' more a matter of answering to his WIFE and the committment he has to HER. Not any of our business whatsoever. And we don't know what Bill and Hillary agreed upon within their marriage discussions. I don't see what it had to do w/national security, the economy, diplomatic relations, war, or the color of my socks. His guilt was more of a personal nature and didn't effect my life in any way.

Bush, on the other hand, has used Terrorism as a catalyst to drive Homeland Security down our throats for more than the agency was intended to be. Anyone who questions him is treated as a traitor. He and his coporate (oil) buddies clearly enjoy the war in Iraq. Our entire nation has been affected by many, many of his policies since he has taken office.


Then again, that's how things are in this country it seems. Americans appear more concerned about a President's blowjob than how he really does his job.

 

[MechaBlade]

Who do you blame?

FDR or Hitler?

The Nazis were really in Afghanistan?

 

[Ham Murabi]

Bush, on the other hand, has used Terrorism as a catalyst to drive Homeland Security down our throats for more than the agency was intended to be. Anyone who questions him is treated as a traitor. He and his coporate (oil) buddies clearly enjoy the war in Iraq.

I missed it. Who is treated as a traitor by Bush?

 

[MisterEdMe]

The Nazis were really in Afghanistan?

Not really. I think its' more like a war version of Fantasy Football.

 

[MechaBlade]

I missed it. Who is treated as a traitor by Bush?

Anyone anti-war:

"You're either with us, or against us."

 

[bronzeage]

I missed it. Who is treated as a traitor by Bush?

Colin Powell

 

[MechaBlade]

Not really. I think its' more like a war version of Fantasy Football.

Now I wish I knew more about fantasy football.

 

[MisterEdMe]

Now I wish I knew more about fantasy football.

Me too.

 

[MechaBlade]

Me too.

I hear the Fantasy City Chiefs are good this year.

 

[Ham Murabi]

Colin Powell

When does the trial start?

 

[Drixxx]

If it were only a blow job ...
Some might even argue that a bigger security breach happened at Pearl Harbor. Similar casualties, plus the loss of a significant amount of the Pacific fleet.
And some might recall regime change in Iraq was a priority - votes in Congress for it and everything - back when Clinton was president. Along with the vow to hunt down bin Laden after every attack, including the WTC. And some might even remember the offer to deliver bin Laden, one that was turned down by Clinton because it might have been messy in a diplomatic way.
Let me repeat: Democrats voted for regime change in Iraq when Clinton was president, and offered all sorts of quotes about Saddam having WMD before Bush took office.

I swear I've never heard one party doing so many flips and twists to not take responsibility for it's own actions. You ever hear Carter blame Nixon for his problems? Or Clinton blame Bush I for his problems? But let one person hold Bush II responsible for his own decisions and an avalanche of "Clinton did it too", "Clinton did this", "Clinton did that".

You can't have one conservation with a Bush defender without hearing Clinton's name endlessly. It's quite sad and telling.