closed Thread

[deckardB26354]

UNRWA supports Hamas. UNIFIL supports Hezbollah. UN organizations should not be collaborating with terrorists. It undermines the mission of the United Nations and endangers all UN workers worldwide.

There's no evidence that the International Red Cross has collaborated with Hamas, but they certainly haven't applied any pressure to ensure the health and safety of the Israeli hostages during their year of captivity.

So any agency that provides aid to Palestinians is evil—right, gotcha.

So a little internet searching and voila, facts (if you believe in that sort of thing). If you read everything Jewish, you’ll come to the scorching conclusion that UNRWA is in league with Hamas. If you read other news sources, you might find that it’s not quite the way it was (or is).

First, let UNRWA ‘splain for themselves…

UNRWA: CLAIMS VERSUS FACTS​

https://www.unrwa.org/unrwa-claims-versus-facts-february-2024

The Claim: Citing alleged intelligence estimates, several media have relayed claims that around 10% of all UNRWA staff in Gaza, or about 1,200 people, have links to Hamas or the Palestinian Islamic Jihad.
The Facts: UNRWA has not received any information, let alone any evidence, from the Israeli Authorities or any other Member State about the above claim. UNRWA became aware of this claim first from international media and later from a press briefing by an Israeli government official.   
Like any other UN organization, UNRWA carries out detailed reference checks on any staff the Agency recruits. In addition, UNRWA shares the names, employee numbers, and functions of all staff members every year in all five areas of operations with the host authorities (Lebanon, Jordan, Syria, and the Palestinian Authority) and, for the West Bank, including East Jerusalem, and Gaza, with Israel as the occupying power.  This means that at all times, host states and Israel are fully informed and aware of the details of all staff members working for UNRWA. Other UN Member States also receive these lists upon request.

Now a not-quite-biased news source…

An independent review finds no evidence for Israel's claims about UNRWA and Hamas​

https://www.npr.org/2024/04/28/1247...ence-for-israels-claims-about-unrwa-and-hamas

RASCOE: So late January until this past week - this review took about nine weeks. What are some of the key findings?
NORTHAM: Well, the review found that, in fact, UNRWA was doing everything in his power to ensure its neutrality. However, it also found some employees had expressed political views and said critical breaches of neutrality could include the discovery of weapons and tunnels, which the agency always protests. I spoke with William Deere, and he heads UNRWA's Washington representative office, and he felt that the report was fair and balanced. Here he is here.
WILLIAM DEERE: Foreign Minister Colonna said - you know, confirmed that we actually have procedures and mechanisms in place to address neutrality better than any other U.N. agency or NGO, and that's because of the politically challenging part of the world in which we operate. But like anyone, you can do better, and hence the recommendations that she included in the report.
NORTHAM: You know, and some of the recommendations include better training, a more robust screening of employees. You know, until just recently, Israel received lists of UNRWA employees, but without Palestinian identification numbers. And then in March, the list did have ID numbers, and that's when Israel says a significant number of employees were members of terrorist organizations. But, you know, Ayesha, the report said Israel has yet to provide supporting evidence of that. Israel, for its part, dismissed the findings of the review, saying it doesn't deal with the, quote, "scope of Hamas' infiltration" into UNRWA.

Now, just to show that I’m not cherry picking facts…

Nine UNRWA staff members were possibly involved in attack on Israel, UN says​

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...olved-oct-7-attack-israel-says-un-2024-08-05/

"For us, any participation in the attacks is a tremendous betrayal of the sort of work that we are supposed to be doing on behalf of the Palestinian people."

The United Nations launched the investigation after Israel charged in January that 12 UNRWA staff took part in the Hamas-led Oct. 7 attacks that triggered the Gaza war. Seven more cases were brought to the U.N.'s attention in March and April.

Israel stepped up its accusations in March, saying over 450 UNRWA staff were military operatives in Gaza terrorist groups. UNRWA employs 32,000 people across its area of operations, 13,000 of them in Gaza.

Shortly after the U.N. announcement, Israeli military spokesperson Nadav Shoshani posted on social media platform X, saying "Your 'relief' agency has officially stooped to a new level of low and it is time that the world sees your true face."

The U.N,'s Haq said the United Nations investigation had made findings in relation to 19 UNRWA staff members. Apart from those who may have been involved in the attack, no evidence was obtained to support allegations of one staff member's involvement, while in the other cases the evidence was insufficient to support their involvement.

The numbers seem to vacillate between reports as time passed, but I’ve not seen anything that indicates the numbers involved in the attack that the Israelis are pushing (over 400). It can’t be that difficult to infiltrate an organization like this to do harm against Israel, but to make a blanket statement like the entire organization is against Israel is reckless at best.

 

[lessOHmo]

So any agency that provides aid to Palestinians is evil—right, gotcha.

So a little internet searching and voila, facts (if you believe in that sort of thing). If you read everything Jewish, you’ll come to the scorching conclusion that UNRWA is in league with Hamas. If you read other news sources, you might find that it’s not quite the way it was (or is).

First, let UNRWA ‘splain for themselves…

UNRWA: CLAIMS VERSUS FACTS​

https://www.unrwa.org/unrwa-claims-versus-facts-february-2024


Now a not-quite-biased news source…

An independent review finds no evidence for Israel's claims about UNRWA and Hamas​

https://www.npr.org/2024/04/28/1247...ence-for-israels-claims-about-unrwa-and-hamas


Now, just to show that I’m not cherry picking facts…

Nine UNRWA staff members were possibly involved in attack on Israel, UN says​

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...olved-oct-7-attack-israel-says-un-2024-08-05/


The numbers seem to vacillate between reports as time passed, but I’ve not seen anything that indicates the numbers involved in the attack that the Israelis are pushing (over 400). It can’t be that difficult to infiltrate an organization like this to do harm against Israel, but to make a blanket statement like the entire organization is against Israel is reckless at best.

STFU with these BS sources from anti JEW sites

fuck off freak degenerate putz

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

If Netanyahu had listened to Biden and hadn’t sent troops into Rafah, Sinwar would still be alive.

 

[lessOHmo]

CamelHO studied the maps

 

[lessOHmo]

Of Course: Sinwar's Bodyguard Was a UNRWA Teacher​

https://twitter.com/x/status/1846982392147595503

go run to NP etc and say the UN is innocent

FUCK YOU DIRTBAG

 

[RobDownSouth]

If Netanyahu had listened to Biden and hadn’t sent troops into Rafah, Sinwar would still be alive.

If Netanyahu had concentrated on finding Sinwar instead of running up the civilian body count in Gaza, there would be a lot more civilians alive in Gaza right now.

But he didn't, so they aren't.

See? I can do that too!

 

[lessOHmo]

If Netanyahu had concentrated on finding Sinwar instead of running up the civilian body count in Gaza, there would be a lot more civilians alive in Gaza right now.

But he didn't, so they aren't.

See? I can do that too!

^^^In mourning

 

[lessOHmo]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1847058531150606369

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

If Netanyahu had concentrated on finding Sinwar instead of running up the civilian body count in Gaza, there would be a lot more civilians alive in Gaza right now.

But he didn't, so they aren't.

See? I can do that too!

Under what city was he killed?

 

[lessOHmo]

If Netanyahu had concentrated on finding Sinwar instead of running up the civilian body count in Gaza, there would be a lot more civilians alive in Gaza right now.

But he didn't, so they aren't.

See? I can do that too!

good

 

[RobDownSouth]

Under what city was he killed?

Pfft...let's not do any more questions....let's just listen to some music...who the hell wants to hear questions?

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Pfft...let's not do any more questions....let's just listen to some music...who the hell wants to hear questions?

I’ll help you. The answer is Rafah.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I’ll help you. The answer is Rafah.

Well that certainly changes everything.
Seriously, you can't tell one pile of rubble from another in Gaza anymore.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Well that certainly changes everything.
Seriously, you can't tell one pile of rubble from another in Gaza anymore.

It does. Kamala Harris is right. Israel’s decision to ignore the White House and launch operations in Rafah represents a major change in the situation. Here’s what she said this week:

“Today, there is clear progress toward that goal. Hamas is decimated, and its leadership is eliminated.

“This moment gives us an opportunity to finally end the war in Gaza, and it must end such that Israel is secure, the hostages are released, the suffering in Gaza ends, and the Palestinian people can realize their right to dignity, security, freedom, and self-determination. And it is time for the day after to begin without Hamas in power.”


Here’s what she said in March:

“Any major military operation in Rafah would be a huge mistake. I have studied the maps – there’s nowhere for those folks to go. And we’re looking at about a million and a half people in Rafah who are there because they were told to go there.”

 

[Hel_Books]

Israel is officially fucked.

The Biden Administration announced through leaked diplomatic and military channels today that Israel had 30 days to get their act together and cease ALL embargos of humanitarian aid to Gaza, and oh, forget about bombing Lebanon.

If Israel does not comply with American dictates, the United States will halt ALL deliveries of offensive military aid to Israel.

Shit. Just. Got. Real.

Israel's "war cabinet" was apparently split on expanding the Gaza genocide into Lebanon so Biden opted to step in.

This is the beginning of the end for Netanyahu's murderous regime

The fact that a fixed thirty day notice was semi-publicly given to Israel did NOT go unnoticed by Iraq....if Israel doesn't comply with American demands, Iraq can bomb the hell out of Israel 30 days from now and Israel will soon have no offensive capacity to retaliate.

Make no mistake, there will be the potential for catastrophic casualties within Israel should the Israelis decide to "go it alone" as they have often threatened to do in the past. The United States has called their bluff.

Israel of course tried to talk their way out today, engaging in a PR stunt ("Look at us! We're letting in FIFTY trucks of humanitarian aid into Gaza") but it appears to be too little too late.

The United States government has also ordered the Israeli government (!!!!) to cease forced relocation of 150K to 250K Gazans from north Gaza to south Gaza. Don't do it, Bibi. Non-negotiable.

The US also declared that "Humanitarian aid" going forward would be redefined to include "dual use" items, i.e. items typically used by civilians but could also be used by military forces. Israel has blocked the importation of "dual use" items.

Israel had already complained that they have lost "negotiation leverage" with Gaza due to the US demands, but the United States basically responded with "yes, and?"

This is about as hardball as the USA has ever acted towards Israel.

Perhaps.

But 30 days later will be after the American election. Whoever wins, outgoing President Biden will have a ready excuse to change his mind on the "deadline." Besides, even if Israel allowed all the supply trucks to freely roll across the border, Hamas isn't going to stop shooting. The Israelis will shoot back. The resulting conflict will substantially hamper the delivery of those supplies to Hamas (and the supplies WILL be taken by Hamas first, because they are the ones with the guns!). As for Lebanon, same thing: Hizbullah will keep firing at Israel and nobody will expect Israel to do nothing in response.

Anyway, who in the diplomatic community really believes the American government is certain to stick to a "deadline" given their past history of confusion in dealing with the region?

 

[Hel_Books]

At some point, the bulldozers and architects will have to go in.

Everything will have to be rebuilt.

And the Israelis should pay for that, not the Pals.

Why not the Iranians? They've got all the oil money. Better they spend it on building roads and apartment buildings than on rockets and missiles to blow up those roads and apartment buildings!

 

[RobDownSouth]

Perhaps.

But 30 days later will be after the American election. Whoever wins, outgoing President Biden will have a ready excuse to change his mind on the "deadline." Besides, even if Israel allowed all the supply trucks to freely roll across the border, Hamas isn't going to stop shooting. The Israelis will shoot back. The resulting conflict will substantially hamper the delivery of those supplies to Hamas (and the supplies WILL be taken by Hamas first, because they are the ones with the guns!). As for Lebanon, same thing: Hizbullah will keep firing at Israel and nobody will expect Israel to do nothing in response.

Anyway, who in the diplomatic community really believes the American government is certain to stick to a "deadline" given their past history of confusion in dealing with the region?

President Biden is for all intents and purposes a lame duck president, he will suffer no political repercussions if he chooses to enforce his dictates upon the country of Israel. You are correct, we will have a new president come next January, and that president can choose a policy of her liking.

You are also correct, America has "drawn a bright line in the sand before" with other countries and not followed through, but they have lacked the ability to back up their demands without committing US troops and have been hesitant to do so.

The United States, however, possesses unpareralled leverage with Israel: Without United States backing, Israel as a country would soon cease to exist. The American pipeline feeds the Israeli war machine.

The Israeli military policy of the past year in Gaza appears to have been to first and foremost, minimize Israeli casualties, and secondly, kill as many Gazan civilians as possible to try to force the nebulous "Hamas" to surrender.

This is contrary to all rules of war, and exposes a horrific moral blind spot in the Israeli populace. Israel is content to drop American munitions on schools, mosques and hospitals from 20,000 feet in the air on a near-daily basis with no real danger of Gazan reprisal.

Evidently the Israeli government decision to starve all Gazans in the northern half of Gaza was too much for even the Americans to overlook. I believe the Israelis were counting on American obsession with the upcoming presidential election to ramp up their cruelty and count on the American public not noticing.

Deprived of American largesse, Israel would have to commit large quantities of ground troops to do actual fighting. Committing Israeli ground troops is deeply unpopular with the Israel populace.

No reasonable person thinks that the American deadline will stop Gazans and Israelis from killing each other, this is not at issue right now. The issue is minimizing civilian casualties. Virtually the entire world stands united against Israel (the United States being the last belated country to join) to condemn the indefensible killing of tens of thousands of civilians in Gaza.

This is not so much a "war" as a "continual war crime", and America has taken positive steps towards stopping this criminal activity.

 

[coati]

If Israel is going to be grossly irresponsible with offensive weapons and not set up guarded and adequately supplied safe zones for civilian refugees, Israel should only receive defensive systems from the USA.

Netayahu said "Fuck You" to his benefactors too many times. This narrative about him bringing about peace through beligerance is pure naive bullshit. This conflict is getting more entrenched by the hour.

 

[Rightguide]

When Hamas stops stealing the aid that Israel sends to Gaza, there won't be any danger of starvation. The death of Sinwar makes the liberation of the Palestinian people infinitely more likely. There is now a route forward to end the killing and suffering in Gaza.

The route is simple, hand over the hostages or die.

 

[Rightguide]

President Biden is for all intents and purposes a lame duck president, he will suffer no political repercussions if he chooses to enforce his dictates upon the country of Israel. You are correct, we will have a new president come next January, and that president can choose a policy of her liking.

Are you drunk like she is all the time?

You are also correct, America has "drawn a bright line in the sand before" with other countries and not followed through, but they have lacked the ability to back up their demands without committing US troops and have been hesitant to do so.

The United States, however, possesses unpareralled leverage with Israel: Without United States backing, Israel as a country would soon cease to exist. The American pipeline feeds the Israeli war machine.

You don't know much.

 

[Lazaran]

Are you dunk like she is all the time/

"Right"guide

 

[butters]

hezbollah increases its shelling of Israel

one drone was aimed at Netanyahu's residence (he wasn't at home) but another building took some damage

 

[Lazaran]

hezbollah increases its shelling of Israel

one drone was aimed at Netanyahu's residence (he wasn't at home) but another building took some damage

Just be sure to blame Russia, Iran, and Hezbollah when Lebanon ends up looking like Gaza.



Side note:

Those Hezbollah, (etc) idiots keep giving Netanyahu gifts.

As long as they keep attacking, Netanyahu will get increased military support from the U.S. and increased support from the Israeli people.

And now Netanyahu has even more justification for a major retaliation against Iran that will very likely result in the U.S. becoming more directly involved.

 

[butters]

Just be sure to blame Russia, Iran, and Hezbollah when Lebanon ends up looking like Gaza.



Side note:

Those Hezbollah, (etc) idiots keep giving Netanyahu gifts.

As long as they keep attacking, Netanyahu will get increased military support from the U.S. and increased support from the Israeli people.

And now Netanyahu has even more justification for a major retaliation against Iran that will very likely result in the U.S. becoming more directly involved.

my point is simply that the death of the terrorist sinwar has not quelled attacks by hezbollah

i am more than happy that piece of scum is dead. I fear it won't bring back the hostages.

the hopes that his death will provide a window for the end to the war can only be realised if Iran backs off (unlikely, since with russian interests in prolonging the conflict to deny Biden a political 'win' ahead of November)), hezbollah quits, hamas doesn't find its reduced numbers bolstered by civilians who now truly hate Israel, and netanyahu doesn't plan on trying to push into land he has no business being in. As for the hostages, how many are even still alive? The wife of one hostage and a former hostage herself has great fears for the safety now of any hostages still alive.

The U.S's direct involvement in a war with Iran isn't something to be glad about; there were restrictions in place before that kept Iran in a box but trump did away with those. They can and should be reinstated, not have young American men and women sacrificed in a war netanyahu desires so badly for his own political life.

 

[Lazaran]

my point is simply that the death of the terrorist sinwar has not quelled attacks by hezbollah

If only it could be limited to that observation…

For every action, a reaction…

Physics, and tit for tat…