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policywank said:
I am quite familiar with the history. And you are quite right that the seeds of this conflict were sown a long time ago, by people who probably shouldn't have been fucking around with it at all. But a big part of the history is also the observable fact that the Palestinians have repeatedly rejected a two state solution and even when more moderate factions engage in that discussion groups like Hamas throw a wrench into the works.

Meanwhile no matter how the past unfolded we cannot expect the Jews of Israel to simply slit their own throats and that of their children and throw themselves into the sea.

The only viable solution in my mind is diplomacy. But I think that will continue to fail until the Palestinians can get their extremists under control. To be sure Israel has extremists as well who will actively resist a two state solution. But Israel is a democratic society that is equipped to hear those voices without letting them rule by terror. And Israel's allies are prepared to bring pressure to bear on them.

As long as Hamas can derail any peace initiative by blowing someone up diplomacy will fail. They have to be eliminated then both sides need to be forced to the bargaining table by their citizens and their allies.
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Fuzzy1975 said:
Then you know the Palestinians were promised one thing, and given another.

Terrorism stems from dissatisfaction or authoritarianism. Remove the cause the terrorism ends.

Where did I ever say to do that? I am pointing out this cycle needs to end. US and western policy needs to change, drastically.

Yep,but not by the west.

See my second answer,it's the same here.

No Hamas doesn't need to be eliminated, any more than the Israels. What needs to happen is the supporters of both need to be removed, the heads of both tried for crimes against Humanity. Then and only then can they move towards a negotiated peace.
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silky52 said:
Total BS!! You really do not understand the situation. I recommend looking things up before you write!
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Fuzzy1975 said:
You have your opinion,and I have mine. Nothing I wrote is BS, it is an opinion. Look at the history, it doesn't lie.

If both sides don't pay a price, then one side will hate the other side that didn't pay a price. If both do pay a price, both sides members of the public are stuck who to hate? Plus if the penalties come from a third party, then you hate the third party, not the other side.

You are a shinning example of the hate. I am not saying it isn't deserved, but for you, nothing short of destroying Hamas, Hezbollah etc is going to satisfy you. The other side feels the exact same way.

Explain to me then, how you think permanent peace will be achieved. For an example of my opinion, look to Hitler and Stalin, and how Poland views the two.
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silky52 said:
Poland is your example? Seriously, some of the most anti-semitic people on earth!

All I am saying is that anti-semitism has reared its ugly head again, it was only dormant, and that is what this is all about. It's about killing Jews!! Full stop. I know that's perfectly acceptable for most people, but I don't have to like it or condone it. Many people are anti-semitic whether they realise it or not. Anti-semitism is alive and well, and really is abounding in the US. Plus in Europe, and IMHO it was never dead. So, okay guys let's go ahead and kill all the Jews.

Many solutions have been offered to the Arabs, but as stated above that is not their agenda. They simply want to kill all Israelis, as demonstrated on October 7th, or anyone associated with the Jews, and Israelis. Point for your information,which I'm sure you all know, since you all seem to know so much here, is that over 40 foreign workers, non-Jews were working on our farms and kibbutzim on our southern border on October 7th. They were either murdered or taken hostage. So yes we are forced to try and obliterate Hamas-ISIS.

There are so many examples of what HI is doing in Israel on the West Bank, through the Palestinian Authority, and I know you guys don't believe it. So, I won't bother to list them here, but I know nothing, only you guys know everything.

I invite you all to get on a plane and come and see!
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silky52 said:
There really is no point in responding to these twits. They have no idea what they are talking about. They are using wokeism to say that people who know the truth are bigoted, genocidal nazis, and all the rest of it. Plus the fact that they are extremely rude about it. They can't hold a reasonable discussion without making it personal. My advice just ignore them. IMHO they are Hamas-ISIS trolls!
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Yes, we can all see by the back and forth sharing of opinions between myself and another eloquent person, and how much of an independent voice you are in this when you decide to jump in and ignore the history.
 
As much noise as was made about the Shifa operation, most civilians had already evacuated the area and that seems to have resulted in less civilian casualties. That will be more difficult to execute as they head south.

ISRAEL

Israeli troops withdraw from Shifa Hospital in Gaza: IDF​

Around 350 patients and medical staff were evacuated by the IDF

International law states that a medical facility is a protected site in conflict, but loses that status if it is used for military activity.

Israeli officials have said Hamas uses these facilities as cover for terror operations and that the group takes humanitarian supplies for its fighters, which deprives civilians of aid.
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I'm curious where they are evacuating civilians to.
The military has said more than 500 members of terror groups have been captured and roughly 200 have been killed, including several top commanders, throughout the operation at the medical center. More than 900 suspects were detained for questioning and more than 6,000 civilians were evacuated from the compound amid the operation, Israeli army radio GLZ Rado reported.
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Posting this as this is relevant information from an expert in Urbane Warfare - The Dispatch - Interview with John Spencer

One statement he makes, which I agree with (though many may not believe that I do) - Israel is not deliberately targeting civilians.

I believe they (and Hamas) can and should be doing more to avoid civilian casualties. I also believe they need to do more to assist on getting aid to civilians in Gaza.
 
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AIPAC Says We’re Not Starving In Gaza. How Dare They?​

Starvation is everywhere you look here. Denying that is beyond shameful.
Israel and some of its supporters are working hard to pretend that none of this is happening. Benjamin Netanyahu says there is no starvation in Gaza. Palestinian Israeli politician Ayman Odeh was forcibly stopped from speaking in the Knesset after he referenced the hunger crisis. And, in the United States, the lobby group AIPAC has been pushing talking points saying that “reports that people are starving in Gaza are false.”

How dare they? At least 23 children have died from malnutrition in northern Gaza. Even the US State Department says that famine could be setting in. It is a hideous lie to say otherwise.
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AIPAC continues it's jihad to suppress coverage unfavorable to the Israeli Ethnic Cleansing occurring in Gaza, but the truth keeps slipping out.
 
throughout the war, Mr FAFO was all over social media with tales of woe and destruction........now of course we know the truth!
 
jaF0 said:
This does not sound like a brilliant move.


Syria says an Israeli airstrike has destroyed Iran's consulate building in Damascus, with deaths​

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/ip3/abcnews.go.com.icoABC|2 hours ago
Syrian state media says an Israeli airstrike has destroyed the consular section of Iran's embassy in Damascus, killing or wounding everyone inside


Seems like outright escalation seeking all out war to me.
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Israel and the Zionist lobbies going rogue on the Biden's administration's electoral desires, then.

This brings up a question. Who is controlling who?
 
jaF0 said:
This does not sound like a brilliant move.


Syria says an Israeli airstrike has destroyed Iran's consulate building in Damascus, with deaths​

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/ip3/abcnews.go.com.icoABC|2 hours ago
Syrian state media says an Israeli airstrike has destroyed the consular section of Iran's embassy in Damascus, killing or wounding everyone inside


Seems like outright escalation seeking all out war to me.
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Iran is behind the attacks on Israel. Hamas, Hezbollah, are both creatures of Iran. So it looks like this is Israel going after the head of the snake. What happens next is on them. Note: Israel already has nuclear weapons. I think they will use them if the alternative is the loss of their country. Iran may already understand this.
 
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ll74 said:
It's been a while since I posted on the topic, but I do believe the best outcome for this conflict is for Hamas to surrender. Along that note, I found this sub stack. I think Biden should continue to push for aid to Gaza but also pressure Arab nations to push for Hamas to surrender

From. February

Where’s the Arab pressure on Hamas to surrender?
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I can agree, because allowing those "terrorist overlords" to remain in place will not stand.
 
snailspace said:
Don't cry for Gaza

https://twitter.com/x/status/1775287973325463634
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Those who bitch about the government ruining their lives on the daily telling others whose government failed them to "deal with it, you chose this" is always fun.

Can you imagine if the government of 2006 was still in place here and elections were not held since then? Can you imagine if the state of Texas was blockaded and supplies limited?

But sure.... They're animals.... Right? Not human beings deserving any empathy or understanding.

Palestinians are people.... Sorry you don't like that.

And no, I don't support any attacks on civilians.. at all. Doesn't matter what background they are or what armies hide behind them or in front of them.
 
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ll74 said:
Those who bitch about the government ruining their lives on the daily telling others whose government failed them to "deal with it, you chose this" is always fun.

Can you imagine if the government of 2006 was still in place here and elections were not held since then? Can you imagine if the state of Texas was blockaded and supplies limited?

But sure.... They're animals.... Right? Not human beings deserving any empathy or understanding.

Palestinians are people.... Sorry you don't like that.

And no, I don't support any attacks on civilians.. at all. Doesn't matter what background they are or what armies hide behind them or in front of them.
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Can you imagine the state of Texas retaliating by withholding energy supplies to the rest of the nation?
 
Rightguide said:
Can you imagine the state of Texas retaliating by withholding energy supplies to the rest of the nation?
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Sadly, you believe this is a proper response.

It actually would address one of the major shortcomings of my comparison, but you wouldn't recognize that if it slapped you on the face... So I'll leave it at that
 
ll74 said:
Sadly, you believe this is a proper response.

It actually would address one of the major shortcomings of my comparison, but you wouldn't recognize that if it slapped you on the face... So I'll leave it at that
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I can imagine you idiots trying to start a civil war and losing on every level.
 
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