How EV sales are losing momentum with US buyers

[AlexBailey]

People are beginning to identify the practical shortcomings of the available technology and the economic cluelessness behind the left-wing government mandates.

Maybe you can tell us;

What incentives would industry have had over the last several decades to reduce emissions without government mandates?

 

[Lazaran]

Lol @ Derpy.

View attachment 2300591

That ^ was EXACTLY what I was thinking.



Derpy

 

[AlexBailey]

you bring up a interesting point....In the farming days of the past, a person could only work so many hours, as the horse teams needed to be cared for(fed and watered and downtime to rest)....invention of the tractor....one could work as many hours as weather or fatigue allowed.....more production equaled more dollars in the pocket

It's fun to check out the implementation of new tech in different uses and how it affected labor.

For a logging operation:

Animals : Oxen, horses.... A whole team, including a main driver and helpers, someone bringing in feed, caring for the animals, including rest and dealing with injuries.

Steam: Yarders, cranes, locomotives.... A boiler crew, head engineer, firemen, fuel crew, the boiler had to be pre-heated, tended whenever pressure is above 15psi... Usually someone tended them 24hrs or nearly that long.

Early petro engines: rail car platform. Two man crew, fast start, fast shut down... fuel ....

 

[DeluxAuto]

left-wing government mandates.

Here are the 25 members of Congress who drive electric cars

https://www.politico.com/news/2023/07/30/lawmakers-drive-electric-vehicle-00108833

Conservative Rep. Thomas Massie (R-Ky.) is a longtime Tesla owner who takes credit for having the first electric charging stations installed on Capitol Hill. Green New Deal advocate Alexandria Ocasio Cortez (D-N.Y.) owns one too, though she’s thinking of switching to a brand made with union labor.

And GOP Sen. Ted Cruz is thinking of getting a Tesla too, noting that his daughters “think they’re cool.” Plus, Elon Musk moved the company’s headquarters to Texas.



You tried

 

[deltablues65]

It's fun to check out the implementation of new tech in different uses and how it affected labor.

For a logging operation:

Animals : Oxen, horses.... A whole team, including a main driver and helpers, someone bringing in feed, caring for the animals, including rest and dealing with injuries. I

Steam: Yarders, cranes, locomotives.... A boiler crew, head engineer, firemen, fuel crew, the boiler had to be pre-heated, tended whenever pressure is above 15psi...

Early petro engines: rail car platform. Two man crew, fast start, fast shut down... fuel ....

even look at the rail industry alone.....the 70s.....40 cars....3 or 4 man crew.....now 15000 feet, even 18000 feet, maybe a two man crew, in some cases one person

 

[deltablues65]

It's fun to check out the implementation of new tech in different uses and how it affected labor.

For a logging operation:

Animals : Oxen, horses.... A whole team, including a main driver and helpers, someone bringing in feed, caring for the animals, including rest and dealing with injuries.

Steam: Yarders, cranes, locomotives.... A boiler crew, head engineer, firemen, fuel crew, the boiler had to be pre-heated, tended whenever pressure is above 15psi... Usually someone tended them 24hrs or nearly that long.

Early petro engines: rail car platform. Two man crew, fast start, fast shut down... fuel ....

I still think in the transportation of dangerous goods on rail, they should still be using a three man crew, with a person being at the tail end, just for a additional set of eyes to access problems.....but again everything comes back to dollars and cents

 

[AlexBailey]

even look at the rail industry alone.....the 70s.....40 cars....3 or 4 man crew.....now 15000 feet, even 18000 feet, maybe a two man crew, in some cases one person

Now container carriers instead of labor intensive boxcars....

Oh my G! They got rid of boxcars!

 

[AlexBailey]

I still think in the transportation of dangerous goods on rail, they should still be using a three man crew, with a person being at the tail end, just for a additional set of eyes to access problems.....but again everything comes back to dollars and cents

Or self-drive delivery trucks?

 

[deltablues65]

Or self-drive delivery trucks?

I was wondering about that one! lol.....wonder how that would work in bad weather conditions!

 

[deltablues65]

I was wondering about that one! lol.....wonder how that would work in bad weather conditions!

I have not figured out how those trucks put on chains in ice road conditions lol

 

[deltablues65]

I have not figured out how those trucks put on chains in ice road conditions lol

and believe me, you don't want to see a truck with a 66,000 lb payload or more sliding backwards or forwards in your direction lol

 

[Fuzzy1975]

and believe me, you don't want to see a truck with a 66,000 lb payload or more sliding backwards or forwards in your direction lol

Been there,done that. What you really don't want to see is the trailer sliding out from behind the tractor and trying to pass the tractor on a curve. Especially when the curve is on a mountain pass with a 3000 foot drop and the choice is hitting the trailer or taking the drop....

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Better be careful with this kind of statement, ninnygirl might chase after you on her bicycle shaking her finger and yelling shame on you for driving a car and needing a parking space and a road for it.

She really lives in your head now eh Carbon water boy? *chuckles* How long before you run and hide from her with the ignore feature?

 

[AlexBailey]

People are beginning to identify the practical shortcomings of the available technology and the economic cluelessness behind the left-wing government mandates.

Come on bozo, I'm calling you out. @Rightguide


What incentives would industry have had over the last several decades to reduce emissions without government mandates?

 

[deltablues65]

Been there,done that. What you really don't want to see is the trailer sliding out from behind the tractor and trying to pass the tractor on a curve. Especially when the curve is on a mountain pass with a 3000 foot drop and the choice is hitting the trailer or taking the drop....

lol.....yes you bet.....I have seen truck trailer combo's hauling logs...as in triaxle drive truck/tria axle bridge/ rear triaxle set.......which equate to 47,300 lbs on each axle set max.....but I know this is off the EV topic...so I will shut up now

 

[Fuzzy1975]

lol.....yes you bet.....I have seen truck trailer combo's hauling logs...as in triaxle drive truck/tria axle bridge/ rear triaxle set.......which equate to 47,300 lbs on each axle set max.....but I know this is off the EV topic...so I will shut up now

No worries, threads go off topic a lot around here!

 

[deltablues65]

Been there,done that. What you really don't want to see is the trailer sliding out from behind the tractor and trying to pass the tractor on a curve. Especially when the curve is on a mountain pass with a 3000 foot drop and the choice is hitting the trailer or taking the drop....

that would be very frightening.....I have a friend whom had the trailer trying to pass the truck, and he was coming up on a two lane bridge......nothing oncoming thank god!

 

[AlexBailey]

lol.....yes you bet.....I have seen truck trailer combo's hauling logs...as in triaxle drive truck/tria axle bridge/ rear triaxle set.......which equate to 47,300 lbs on each axle set max.....but I know this is off the EV topic...so I will shut up now

Not a badly off topic...

Regenerative braking not only recovers energy otherwise lost to friction, but it also allows for AI enabled brake controls. So a car or truck that starts sliding on ice can have braking control on individual wheels far better than older ABS systems - and it works for traction at the drive wheels also.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Saying we're going to save energy by going all electric from centralized production is just like the daylight savings con where you take an hour from the morning and give it to the evening. Or, as some native American is credited with saying; it's like cutting off 1/3 from one end of a blanket and sewing it back onto the other end and saying you've got more blanket.

Ok first, DST has never claimed to add an hour to the standard 24 hour day. It is just a timeshift, allowing more evening hours in a day.

Energy costs money to produce, be it centralized or decentralized.

True,but one is cheaper than the other....

It also produces pollution in the same amount when you factor in everything from bigger and more generators (which require pollution to mine and manufacture) to upgrading transmission lines (again, more pollution to manufacture) to charging stations (even more pollution).

The maths been done, by smarter people than you. Rare earth minerals are cheaper to mine, than oil from deep well. Most REM's come from open pit mines, which are the cheapest mines to run. The manufacturing process uses less Greenhouse gasses than the petroleum industry.

However there is a cost which is hard to define, and that is the environmental aspect of the whole life cycle of say a Lithium battery, verses a 45 gallon barrel of raw crude.

Still Newtons laws of Thermal Dynamics show using batteries to produce electricity vs chemical reactions to produce heat has a lower energy loss. That means EV's are inherently more efficient than ICE's.

Once again Arpy, you're on the wrong side of the equation.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

that would be very frightening.....I have a friend whom had the trailer trying to pass the truck, and he was coming up on a two lane bridge......nothing oncoming thank god!

Happened to me and the family in BC in the winter, just on the western side of Osoyoos on Hwy #3. To this day I don't know how I threaded the needle between the trailer and the cliff.

 

[deltablues65]

Not a badly off topic...

Regenerative braking not only recovers energy otherwise lost to friction, but it also allows for AI enabled brake controls. So a car or truck that starts sliding on ice can have braking control on individual wheels far better than older ABS systems.

most time those dam ABS systems.......throw a few rocks at the electrical cables or ice and snow, and they don't work anyway.......a truck repair shop nightmare, as well as the owner/operator paying the bill lol

 

[deltablues65]

Happened to me and the family in BC in the winter, just on the western side of Osoyoos on Hwy #3. To this day I don't know how I threaded the needle between the trailer and the cliff.

is that the highway coming from Castlegar.....the hill with all the switchbacks?

 

[deltablues65]

correct me if I am wrong.....east to Castlegar or west to Princeton/Hope

 

[RobDownSouth]

People are beginning to identify the practical shortcomings of the available technology and the economic cluelessness behind the left-wing government mandates.

Changes to teh status quo upset aging boomers like Rightguide.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

is that the highway coming from Castlegar.....the hill with all the switchbacks?

Yep, but this was on the western side, I was coming from Princeton travelling east towards Osoyoos, but still on the western side of Osoyoos. Not the hill coming into Osoyoos from Castlegar.