One Night In Detroit...The Series?

[MelissaBaby]

I really enjoyed writing my contribution to the One Night In XXX author's event. I am considering the possibility that when I finish my current series, "Mary and Alvin", that I may expand it into a multi-story series, focusing not just on Elizabeth and Raymond, but on other denizens of the Alley Cat Saloon as well. Something like "Tales From The Alley Cat".

I just thought I'd toss that out here for feedback. All comments about the story, and the possibility of a spin off would be appreciated.


One Night In Detroit


P.S. You need not point out that I inadvertently called Elizabeth "Mary" twice, LoquiSordidaAdMe already caught that, and I have submitted an edit.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Your writing in Detroit is grittier and darker than Mary and Alvin, informed by your own experiences no doubt. Finding the balance between urban realism, the seedier side of humanity, and redemption would be a fascinating exercise. Elizabeth is the other side of Mary in a way, but equally celebrates humanity, and Maine in a bar would definitely work. You've got the ability to handle it, and are smart enough to avoid cliche. Go for it, I'd say.

 

[gordo12]

I'll just reiterate the comment I left on the story

"Awesome

Well done 5* It's the kind of story that makes me want to see the next chapter. What happens between them?"

Nuff said?

 

[MelissaBaby]

Your writing in Detroit is grittier and darker than Mary and Alvin, informed by your own experiences no doubt. Finding the balance between urban realism, the seedier side of humanity, and redemption would be a fascinating exercise. Elizabeth is the other side of Mary in a way, but equally celebrates humanity, and Maine in a bar would definitely work. You've got the ability to handle it, and are smart enough to avoid cliche. Go for it, I'd say.

Thank you.

When I finished My Fall and Rise, I considered writing a series telling the stories of women I had met in prison. But I wanted to get away from that darkness, and so, I began Mary and Alvin, because as I said at the time, the drama in the lives of ordinary people is as marvelous as the lives of kings and queens, let alone drug addicts and convicts.(Not that addicts and convicts are not ordinary people, but I think you'll get what I mean.)

I can envision the "Tales from the Alley Cat" as crossing the divide between the two worlds.

 

[MelissaBaby]

I'll just reiterate the comment I left on the story

"Awesome

Well done 5* It's the kind of story that makes me want to see the next chapter. What happens between them?"

Nuff said?

Thanks, gordo, your comment was one of the reasons I started the thread. I appreciate your kind words about my story.

 

[gordo12]

Thanks, gordo, your comment was one of the reasons I started the thread. I appreciate your kind words about my story.

Does that mean you'll share royalties when it hits the best seller list

 

[yukonnights]

I'll just reiterate some of the comment I made on the story; "...Like most of the stories entered into this event, this one seems like a great start to something more...I'm going to write in my version of that "more" to be a happy love story between the lady of the night and the artist."

I'd definitely agree that this group of people would make a great series. And I totally agree with your statement about "ordinary people" having a story to tell. Actually, some of those 'everyday folks' would have a more interesting story than the rich and famous. It's something not often written about in an intentional, in depth, way.

Drug addicts; if that was a character that Elizabeth was close to and cared about it could probe and reveal that indeed these are people with a story. Having brushed up against that myself, it's hard to watch someone you care for get caught up in that whirlpool.

Anyway, nice story and a great idea.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I can envision the "Tales from the Alley Cat" as crossing the divide between the two worlds.

Another thing to consider, rather than one long, sequential story, is a whole series of inter-connected but internally complete stories (which may or may not be multi-chapters in themselves) where there are common threads weaving in and out, binding them together. That's what my Floating World series is turning into - so far it's a common protagonist moving through his world but interacting with different people, different themes; but I can envisage other characters moving off into separate stories of their own (back stories, side stories, off shoots) as I get to know them. I get the impression that's what you're envisaging?

The thing to watch, though, is the naming conventions of the individual parts. I did myself no favours with my latest piece, which was the sixth through tenth "chapters" overall in the Floating World, but readers passed it by because it wasn't clear it was a self-contained story set. I need to figure out a way of linking parts together in a way that makes it clear it's not one long, endless shaggy dog story.

 

[Hypoxia]

Another thing to consider, rather than one long, sequential story, is a whole series of inter-connected but internally complete stories (which may or may not be multi-chapters in themselves) where there are common threads weaving in and out, binding them together.

IIRC that's how non-serial broadcast stories were built. A common setting and main or supporting cast, but each episode a standalone, independent of previous events. These are easily distinguished, keeping in mind that LIT's titles sort alphanumerically.

One Night In Oxnard: 4th of July
One Night In Oxnard: 9th of Never
One Night In Oxnard: August Sweat
One Night In Oxnard: Cinco de Mayo
One Night In Oxnard: Friday the 13th
One Night In Oxnard: Hallowe'en
One Night In Oxnard: June's Moon
One Night In Oxnard: Monday
One Night In Oxnard: September Song
One Night In Oxnard: Tuesday​

The order in which these not-chapters are written and posted is irrelevant.

 

[MelissaBaby]

I'll just reiterate some of the comment I made on the story; "...Like most of the stories entered into this event, this one seems like a great start to something more...I'm going to write in my version of that "more" to be a happy love story between the lady of the night and the artist."

I'd definitely agree that this group of people would make a great series. And I totally agree with your statement about "ordinary people" having a story to tell. Actually, some of those 'everyday folks' would have a more interesting story than the rich and famous. It's something not often written about in an intentional, in depth, way.

Drug addicts; if that was a character that Elizabeth was close to and cared about it could probe and reveal that indeed these are people with a story. Having brushed up against that myself, it's hard to watch someone you care for get caught up in that whirlpool.

Anyway, nice story and a great idea.

Drug addicts with stories to tell? That's an interesting angle.

Seriously, I appreciate your comments. I feel gratified that you seem to really get what I am trying to do. Thanks.

 

[MelissaBaby]

Another thing to consider, rather than one long, sequential story, is a whole series of inter-connected but internally complete stories (which may or may not be multi-chapters in themselves) where there are common threads weaving in and out, binding them together. That's what my Floating World series is turning into - so far it's a common protagonist moving through his world but interacting with different people, different themes; but I can envisage other characters moving off into separate stories of their own (back stories, side stories, off shoots) as I get to know them. I get the impression that's what you're envisaging?

The thing to watch, though, is the naming conventions of the individual parts. I did myself no favours with my latest piece, which was the sixth through tenth "chapters" overall in the Floating World, but readers passed it by because it wasn't clear it was a self-contained story set. I need to figure out a way of linking parts together in a way that makes it clear it's not one long, endless shaggy dog story.

You are on point with what I envision. I am thinking of a tapestry of characters whose stories weave in and out of each other, all connected by their sharing a place of refuge at the Alley Cat Saloon. One of the first concepts I had was Willie Roses selling his damaged flowers all night, saving the one perfect bloom to take home to his wife. And who is this Carla or Marla that Liz asks Ray about? So many possibilities and I have just touched the surface.

Thanks for the tip on naming.

I still have another eight or ten chapters of Mary and Alvin to get through, but come summer I ought to have more writing time.

 

[MelissaBaby]

IIRC that's how non-serial broadcast stories were built. A common setting and main or supporting cast, but each episode a standalone, independent of previous events. These are easily distinguished, keeping in mind that LIT's titles sort alphanumerically.

One Night In Oxnard: 4th of July
One Night In Oxnard: 9th of Never
One Night In Oxnard: August Sweat
One Night In Oxnard: Cinco de Mayo
One Night In Oxnard: Friday the 13th
One Night In Oxnard: Hallowe'en
One Night In Oxnard: June's Moon
One Night In Oxnard: Monday
One Night In Oxnard: September Song
One Night In Oxnard: Tuesday​

The order in which these not-chapters are written and posted is irrelevant.

Exactly the format I'm thinking of. Thanks for the example.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Exactly the format I'm thinking of. Thanks for the example.

Copy that. I came unstuck using sequential Part Nos. Alpha titles solves the problem. I couldn't see the wood for the trees. Duh!

 

[AwkwardMD]

One Night in Detroit gives me a feeling akin to the Uncanny Valley. It’s almost a story, but a story should be more than a series of things. I saw a comment call this gritty realism, but that’s a compliment should only apply to works of fiction and One Night in Detroit reads more like made up Non-Fiction.

You clearly know some things (or have been told some things). You have some great details in this, but none of the details inform the character or the story. ‘I took the elevator because stairs are hard in heels.’ Okay. ’Heels are an occupational necessity’ Okay. ’Not a lot of snow this year.’ Okay. And? Another comment mentioned how the locations felt real and painted a clear picture in their minds. Okay.

I see this a lot in stories that are based on real life details or experiences. Too much effort is made to be honest and true to the moment as you experienced it, and not enough effort is made to bring it all together into something that is more than the sum of its parts. Fiction is more than the sum of its parts because it uses those parts to say something. Non-Fiction, by comparison, is always worth exactly the sum of its parts.

None of your details matter. It’s like you tagged a series of buildings with graffiti that said ‘Elizabeth was here’, and then asked the reader to go to the same buildings in the same order. Okay, but why? Why these buildings? Why these experiences? Why these moments? What are you, the author, trying to tell us except that maybe you used to work as an escort or knew someone who did?

It lacks soul.

A very talented writer once said that “The only time story ever comes alive is through characters”, and they were right. Imagine a planet that has a dense atmosphere of a specific isotope of Oxygen. Okay. That’s an empty detail. Now imagine the awe of the first human who sets down on that planet and sees the bright green sunrise. Oh. Yes, details are important, and I go to great length to get them right in my stories too, but they also have to matter and that requires restraint and forethought.

Details matter when they inform the plot or the character. In ONID there is no plot, and Elizabeth is completely and immediately forgettable. The most I can say about her is that she is present in every scene. All the details you added informed the moment, or the location, and never her feelings. Never her experiences. Nothing is foreshadowed that doesn’t immediately come to pass.

Hello. You have dom equipment. I charge extra to top customers.
But I want to top you.
Oh no.

Tina, he had dom equipment.
You charge extra to top.
Other way around.
Oh no.

Tina I need another job for the money.
Elizabeth I will call you back
Elizabeth I am calling you back to offer you a job for money
Yay. Thank you, Tina.

With the exception of not immediately fucking Ray (a situation we had to wait half a Lit page for), there’s no setup for anything. Without setup, there’s no tension. Without tension, there’s no payoff. Without tension, a story is simply a series of things linked by sequential order.

Fiction is capable of SO MUCH MORE, and so are you. This is the third story of yours that I’ve read, and I continue to have the feeling that you are under-delivering on your talent. You can do better, and every story you write before you really challenge yourself to do more is a waste.

 

[AwkwardMD]

If you took a 4K camera, pointed it down at the sidewalk, and filmed yourself walking four blocks, it could be said that you captured the journey from point A to point B with a lot of detail. Some might even describe the details as gritty, but nobody would call that a story.

 

[GroverLang]

If you took a 4K camera, pointed it down at the sidewalk, and filmed yourself walking four blocks, it could be said that you captured the journey from point A to point B with a lot of detail. Some might even describe the details as gritty, but nobody would call that a story.

This is not a specific reference to the story in question, and not a criticism of yourself, but sometimes a story is just a series of unconnected events with a fragile link. As longs as it’s enjoyable. Surely that’s the intent of every writer?

 

[Hypoxia]

One Night in Detroit gives me a feeling akin to the Uncanny Valley. It’s almost a story, but a story should be more than a series of things.

...sometimes a story is just a series of unconnected events with a fragile link. As longs as it’s enjoyable. Surely that’s the intent of every writer?

My stories and series are often merely "strings of things," especially tales in a journal-type format. Main character does stuff, narrates it, or is observed. There's no plot really, just fuck after fuck after fuck because smut. Sometimes I start with an ending and make the story go there, fuck after fuck after fuck. Sometimes it's a tricky ending or those are tricky fucks. But once Mom sits in Sonny's lap in the back seat on a hot day, we know what to expect.

I purposely missed the "One Night In..." deadline but I can imagine a story cycle set in Bisbee AZ, or the Sellwood district of Portland OR, or Disneyland, or Antigua Guatemala, the old cultural capitol of Central America. Locations are players in the stories, which can only take place Right There.

Idea: One Night In Room 103. A motel mirror tells of events over decades. Fuck after fuck after fuck, with kinks, comedy, and tragedy. And gerbils.

 

[AwkwardMD]

Randomly generated letters might sometimes create a word, and on rare occasions two in a row. I think we can all agree that the difference between a pile of letters and a story is intention.

All of the elements of a storytelling are tools, to be wielded in different combinations to make different end products. Every part of a specific story that exists, or is lacking, is either a conscious or unconscious choice by the writer. Ideally, every element should be a conscious choice, but we all have aspects to our writing that we're not aware of until someone points it out.

For example, after my 20th story, someone pointed out that my stories often contain older women who are either impossible to please or whom the protagonist jumps through hoops for. I, like a lot of women, have a complicated relationship with my mother. After I became aware of this, I was able to better control what kinds of stories I made.

Yes, some stories are exercises in rambling racontouring or character pieces that explore psychology, sociology, or physiology. Some bad movies are bad on purpose, like Sharknado, and some movies fail at being good movies.

I will gladly withdraw my criticism if the point was to write Sharknado.

 

[AwkwardMD]

My stories and series are often merely "strings of things," especially tales in a journal-type format. Main character does stuff, narrates it, or is observed. There's no plot really, just fuck after fuck after fuck because smut. Sometimes I start with an ending and make the story go there, fuck after fuck after fuck. Sometimes it's a tricky ending or those are tricky fucks. But once Mom sits in Sonny's lap in the back seat on a hot day, we know what to expect.

I purposely missed the "One Night In..." deadline but I can imagine a story cycle set in Bisbee AZ, or the Sellwood district of Portland OR, or Disneyland, or Antigua Guatemala, the old cultural capitol of Central America. Locations are players in the stories, which can only take place Right There.

Idea: One Night In Room 103. A motel mirror tells of events over decades. Fuck after fuck after fuck, with kinks, comedy, and tragedy. And gerbils.

Hypoxia is writing Sharknado.

 

[NotWise]

Hypoxia is writing Sharknado.

His story of the mirror is very similar to a classic porn flick, in which someone watching a large antique mirror could see the events that it saw. It was a mechanism for creating a feature-length film out of a series of unrelated, historical shorts. It's been a long time since I saw the flick, but I think the only thing that made it a story was the involvement of the woman who was watching the mirror; she eventually became one of the mirror's stories.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Idea: One Night In Room 103. A motel mirror tells of events over decades. Fuck after fuck after fuck, with kinks, comedy, and tragedy. And gerbils.

Didn't we mention the 1995 movie Four Rooms once? One hotel but different rooms, all on the same New Years' Eve. It wasn't a mirror, but the bellhop character that ties it together.

I've considered a fan fiction version of part of it. Anyway, yes, hotel/motel themes have potential.

 

[AwkwardMD]

His story of the mirror is very similar to a classic porn flick, in which someone watching a large antique mirror could see the events that it saw. It was a mechanism for creating a feature-length film out of a series of unrelated, historical shorts. It's been a long time since I saw the flick, but I think the only thing that made it a story was the involvement of the woman who was watching the mirror; she eventually became one of the mirror's stories.

Okay.

 

[AwkwardMD]

Just so we're all clear, I argued that Melissa did a thing wrong. The response has been 'she doesn't have to do it right' instead of 'she did it right and I just missed it'.

If that were me, I'd be insulted.

EDIT: Obviously, mine is not the only opinion on whether or not a piece of art achieves any specific, subjective goal. More people weighing in is always better.

 

[Hypoxia]

Hypoxia is writing Sharknado.

No, it's Snakes On A Plane aka One Night In A Boeing 737 Max where phallic snakes crawl amongst sweaty passengers. Everyone has their own story to tell. Especially in tourist class. Meanwhile, in the cockpit, the pilot has fainted and a stewardess is blowing up the inflatable autopilot. You say Airplane, right? She's okay with that until a snake... does something. It's a Dublin to Havana flight so expect the unexpected.

What's a pr0n story? Stuff happens, preferably sexual. Eventually stuff stops happening. The end. Or... to be continued. Or... long ago in a urethra far, far away... How does a story end? A neat wrap-up? A cliffhanger? A weak fade-out? No finale till the heat death of the universe? Infinite episodes are possible.

I'll cite picaresque novels, long popular. Among their characteristics:

• There is no plot. The story is told in a series of loosely connected adventures or episodes.
• There is little if any character development in the main character. Once a pícaro [rogue], always a pícaro. His or her circumstances may change but these rarely result in a change of heart.
• The pícaro's story is told with a plainness of language or realism.
• In the English-speaking world, the term "picaresque" is often used loosely to refer to novels that contain some elements of this genre; e.g. an episodic recounting of adventures on the road.

Plots are nice but unnecessary for entertainment. Just figure out when to stop. Explode the planet if needed; that always works.

 

[AwkwardMD]

If the Picaresque style was her goal, then she nailed it. Of course, if that wasn't her goal and you're just putting words in her mouth...