Car troubles

[MichiganBiker27]

I'm an ASE certified master mechanic. Are there any lit chicks or lit dudes with automotive repair questions? Maybe someone other than myself could also lend advice. Let's fix it!

 

[ToysAreUs]

Great idea for a thread, Biker. I'm offering to help others, too. Let's fix it!

 

[TheOldWidow]

OK guys, I have a problem with a 2004, F150 2wheel drive with the check engine light on. Over 350K miles, and the Ford garage says 'I dunno."

The code reader says something like, the cold smoke return is mal funct. But all the components check out good. The pickup probably has a top value to 1800.00 to 2000.00 and I don't want to put any more than I have to, into repairs. But the light has to come off to pass inspection. Thanks, TheOldWidow.

 

[pplwatching]

The code reader says something like, the cold smoke return is mal funct. But all the components check out good.

I used to drive a similar year/model but I'm not familiar with "cold smoke return". It would be very helpful to have the actual code. If you don't have it written down then take it by a neighborhood auto parts store. Most will read the code from the computer for free (ask first). Write down the code's number, not just the name.

If the dealer mechanics say that the parts corresponding to the code are fine then you could have a dirty or faulty sensor. It would really surprise me if the dealer doesn't know that, but stranger things have happened.

Anyway, post the code. It will help puzzle it out.

 

[TheOldWidow]

OK,
I wont be able to get it to a parts store until Sun. aft. But I will get the code. Thanks.

 

[pplwatching]

OK,
I wont be able to get it to a parts store until Sun. aft. But I will get the code. Thanks.

Also, let us know the engine size (e.g. 4.6L / 5.4L) if you happen to know it.

 

[SaraBaras]

OK guys, I have a problem with a 2004, F150 2wheel drive with the check engine light on. Over 350K miles, and the Ford garage says 'I dunno."

The code reader says something like, the cold smoke return is mal funct. But all the components check out good. The pickup probably has a top value to 1800.00 to 2000.00 and I don't want to put any more than I have to, into repairs. But the light has to come off to pass inspection. Thanks, TheOldWidow.

OMG. I have no help to offer - just wanted to say I'm sorry you're dealing with this crap. Car inspection is generally total bullshit. Hope you get a solution.

 

[ReadyOne]

Help yourself a bit

First, get a smart phone.

Second, get a code reader. They are cheap, under $5 including shipping. Search E-bay for "ELM327 OBD2 V2.1".

Third, get an app for your phone. For Android, search for "Torque Lite (OBD2 & Car)". For iPhone, search "FourStroke". (Nice Instructable for Apple with lots of pictures.)

It can take a bit of patience to make it connect the first time, but that's life in the world of bluetooth.

Now you can
1. Pull your codes.
2. Look them up before you call your mechanic or search the internet.
3. Reset the Check Engine light.

 

[TheOldWidow]

Thanks all for the info.
I don't have a smart phone, I still use an old flip phone....I know, nobody does that but me.
I will take the pickup to friendly neighborhood parts store, and see if they have a reader. Will also get engine size. Will do that after church.

 

[TheOldWidow]

OK, got info.
The pickup is a 4.2 little V6 Heritage style.
It now has 2 codes. 1st. code on bank 1 PO171 too Lean
2nd. code on bank 2 PO174 too lean

It's a 2004 F150 Thanks in advance for any info you can share

 

[pplwatching]

Hi,

The short version is that the computer thinks that the engine is getting too much air and not enough fuel. This doesn't mean that it really is (it could be a sensor), but your truck is older so it is possible. Some of the fixes that can take care of this problem are inexpensive, such as cleaning the air flow sensor or changing the fuel filter. If it hasn't ever been changed then it could be clogged.

If you have a friend who is mechanically inclined, they can eliminate most of these. Otherwise you may want to go ahead and pay the diagnostic fee that a mechanic will charge to find the problem. Most good shops will give you a discount on the fee if you have them do the work to fix the problem.

It doesn't sound like you are technically inclined, but it would be worth your while to read this page
so that you will know what you are talking about when you talk to a mechanic.

Good luck!

 

[pplwatching]

My guess, since you said that you have been to a mechanic and they couldn't find a problem, is the bad DPFE sensor near the bottom of the page that I linked. The part is easy to replace and costs about $60 depending on where you look.

 

[TheOldWidow]

HEY,

thank you for the diagnosis and the information. I will read the page you linked, and I appreciate the time you took to give me instruction. I know enough about pickups/engines etc. to be absolutely dangerous. This gives me a good place to start. I'm asking around for an independent mechanic, I was totally unimpressed by the first garage I visited. I felt like I was getting a schmoozy hustle on the repair. Thanks. TOW.

 

[pplwatching]

The fact that a Ford mechanic (who is supposed to be trained and certified) said "I dunno" or words to that effect is simply inexcusable. Any certified mechanic knows that sensors get dirty and/or go bad all of the time. I would never return to that mechanic. In addition, if he actually used the words "smoke return" then I would call their service department manager and complain. That is absolutely unforgivable.

Anyway, read the page so that you are educated about the codes. Ask the mechanic that you choose how much their diagnostic fee is. Most reputable shops charge one these days, even though it annoys me to even say it. Ask how much they will charge you to clean or replace the MAF sensor and/or replace the DPFE sensor. Just the fact that you even know what they are (and are likely to be the problem) should keep them honest with you.

ETA: Keep in mind that it could actually be the fuel filter or pump that is the problem. If the mechanic says that's the case, ask them how they know. If they say "low fuel pressure" or "low voltage", then they are being honest with you.


Good luck!

 

[TheOldWidow]

Many thanks for the additional explanation of the codes.
Now that I have read the info, I believe the mechanic said 'unmetered air', or 'cold air'
and I misinterpreted.
This old pickup may have all of those sensors bad. The spedo stopped running 3 years ago at 350+ and it was a ranch work truck all it's life.
I'm searching for an independent mech. I'll let you know what I eventually find out. TOW

 

[phil_o]

OK guys, I have a problem with a 2004, F150 2wheel drive with the check engine light on. Over 350K miles, and the Ford garage says 'I dunno."

The code reader says something like, the cold smoke return is mal funct. But all the components check out good. The pickup probably has a top value to 1800.00 to 2000.00 and I don't want to put any more than I have to, into repairs. But the light has to come off to pass inspection. Thanks, TheOldWidow.

Remove the bulb that showing a problem, then get it tested

 

[TheOldWidow]

Thanks, will put that as a note on my page of instructions. TOW

 

[phil_o]

Thanks, will put that as a note on my page of instructions. TOW

Your welcome. TOW. ?

 

[TheOldWidow]

TOW == TheOldWidow

 

[ToysAreUs]

I had a lean-mixture error message on a 2001 Explorer and a rubber hose had perished, allowing additional air to be drawn. The hose was completely out of sight, located (roughly) underneath cylinder 1 (right bank).

The guys on the Ford Explorer Forum suggested it was probably the cause and they were right.

 

[MichiganBiker27]

OK, got info.
The pickup is a 4.2 little V6 Heritage style.
It now has 2 codes. 1st. code on bank 1 PO171 too Lean
2nd. code on bank 2 PO174 too lean

It's a 2004 F150 Thanks in advance for any info you can share

The computer thinking the engine is too lean can be so many things. How long has it been since you had a tune up? New plugs and air/fuel filter might (and I say might) solve the code.

Your exhaust has sensors that measure the oxygen, when there is too much oxygen in the exhaust, it sets a lean code. But that doesn't necessarily mean the engine is lean, for instance if your spark plugs aren't hot enough to turn all the gas and air into carbon dioxide and water vapor, too much oxygen will be in the exhaust. And a lean code will set.

In short, you have to have your basic tune up situation up to date before you start chasing codes. But your local garage that you took it to should know this. Maybe you should find another shop?

 

[TheOldWidow]

Both independent shop mechanics, suggested I go to the Ford garage. So I made an appointment for next Wednesday. Thanks everyone.

 

[ToysAreUs]

Please let us know what they determine the problem is.

 

[TheOldWidow]

I will, I appreciate the help. Thanks.

 

[ReadyOne]

A little testing Got'cha!

There are two types of emission tests. The older one uses a tail pipe probe to measure what the engine is actually doing. The new one uses the computer in the car to report what it "thinks" is happening.

(This leads to a BIG potential for emission test fraud. Ask the fox if all the chickens are still in the hen-house...)

Anyway, if you reset the check engine light, then the car also clears its memory of the emissions test data. You will have to drive the car for a while to let it collect the performance data the testing station wants to read.

I don't know exactly what that window is, sorry.

And in Texas (plus probably all the other states) a tail pipe test won't be done if the check engine light is on, even for the most trivial reason.