When to not have a safeword

[Primalex]

There are some situations where I would say that a safeword is good idea. Waterboarding for example.

But what about activities where the fun is especially dependant on the psychological blur of lines and not physical interaction? Humiliation, degradation, coercion, ...

Does a safeword spoil the fun?
Does offering a safeword already spoil the fun?

If nobody initiates the topic of safeword, is it okay to take this as an implicit agreement that both parties don't see it as necessary? (It is assumed that both parties are not completely clueless dumbfucks.)

 

[faithlessmaiden]

There are some situations where I would say that a safeword is good idea. Waterboarding for example.

But what about activities where the fun is especially dependant on the psychological blur of lines and not physical interaction? Humiliation, degradation, coercion, ...

Does a safeword spoil the fun?
Does offering a safeword already spoil the fun?

If nobody initiates the topic of safeword, is it okay to take this as an implicit agreement that both parties don't see it as necessary? (It is assumed that both parties are not completely clueless dumbfucks.)

It depends on the parties involved. It can be a comfort to have a safeword and know that you have the power to use it. Couples who have been involved for a long time have learned to read body language and don't require a safeword.

I'm of the mindset that if you initiate play for the first time without discussing a safeword or at least discussing a scene and setting limits makes you a dumbfuck. That's how people get hurt or traumatized.

I don't think safewords ruin the fun. They just make the fun comfortable.

 

[Kim_Burly]

To me, if I had a safeword, I wouldn't actually be submitting, I would be playing a sex game with an equal partner. Again, this is for me only, but it seems painfully simple (pun intended) .

 

[kinkkey]

For me personally, I consider "Yellow" to be a way of merely informing the other person that things have gotten way too intense to handle, and I feel that at that point, it is entirely up to the other person to decide if they want to listen and ease up a bit, or just keep on pushing well beyond the point of comfort and enjoyment. I consider "Red" to be for emergency use only and everything should immediately stop at that point because something has gone very wrong.

 

[malefica]

I always have a safeword, and will continue to always have one in place even with my play partner and any other relationships of that nature that I get into. A safeword is there to ensure that it doesn't go past fun and into physically or mentally harmful. Safe-gestures are also a thing that me and my Dominant have, which is particularly vital during breathplay or when I'm gagged - two taps means 'steady and okay', whereas rapid tapping means 'LET GO'. I'd approach any relationship warily if they informed me that they didn't have or didn't think that they/we needed a safeword.

 

[Primalex]

For me personally, I consider "Yellow" to be a way of merely informing the other person that things have gotten way too intense to handle, and I feel that at that point, it is entirely up to the other person to decide if they want to listen and ease up a bit, or just keep on pushing well beyond the point of comfort and enjoyment. I consider "Red" to be for emergency use only and everything should immediately stop at that point because something has gone very wrong.

Thank you for not reading the question.

 

[xxxSubSamxxx]

Only the very inexperienced would not have safe words or a couple that's in a long term relationship wanting to experiment and want something different to what they have already.

I am very inexperienced in BDSM, and would never have sex with a stranger that didn't respect my hard limits. I would want to take things slowly and have rules and protocols in place.

Sam xx

 

[Primalex]

I always have a safeword, and will continue to always have one in place even with my play partner and any other relationships of that nature that I get into.

The question is: Do you bring this topic up on your own if he does not?

And follow-up question:
You identify as prey and pain slut - so your play is usually fairly physical?

 

[IrisAlthea]

There are some situations where I would say that a safeword is good idea. Waterboarding for example.

But what about activities where the fun is especially dependant on the psychological blur of lines and not physical interaction? Humiliation, degradation, coercion, ...

Does a safeword spoil the fun?
Does offering a safeword already spoil the fun?

If nobody initiates the topic of safeword, is it okay to take this as an implicit agreement that both parties don't see it as necessary? (It is assumed that both parties are not completely clueless dumbfucks.)

I don't have enough experience with non physical play, to answer your first question about whether it would spoil the fun.
If I think of times when I've behaved like an asshat, there is this picture of one second "happily" fighting and giving as good as I got and the next second seeing the other persons face falling and feeling my stomach sinking, if that makes sense.
I don't think any safeword in the world could have prevented it. I had seen it, been careless enough to call it and there was work to be done.
Personally, I cringe when people talk about the safeword as some magic that will turn risky stuff into a trip to Disneyland.

As for the second part of your question, I will bring it up when I think a safeword is needed.
Assuming people will bring it up if they feel the need, seems risky to me but that might be because assuming non-dumbfuckery is hard.

 

[Netzach]

There are some situations where I would say that a safeword is good idea. Waterboarding for example.

But what about activities where the fun is especially dependant on the psychological blur of lines and not physical interaction? Humiliation, degradation, coercion, ...

Does a safeword spoil the fun?
Does offering a safeword already spoil the fun?

If nobody initiates the topic of safeword, is it okay to take this as an implicit agreement that both parties don't see it as necessary? (It is assumed that both parties are not completely clueless dumbfucks.)

Never really impinged on my fun in that regard.

In fact I felt much *more* empowered to say appalling things than if I hadn't been able to trust the person to let me know through that channel if/when all productive pain and suffering had left the proverbial building.

I may be the only person around who finds edgeplay more rewarding with than without - *I* feel safer and freer.

This is only when I know that the bottom and I share the same outlook on the safeword, and that they're not reluctant to use it. (I've never had a non-reluctant person stop a scene with a safeword on me, interestingly enough - they tend to have a very good self-awareness.) If they're reluctant about it I'm more likely to play "no safeword, english communication only" and "stop" means "stop and take a look around."

For all my playing with randoms and unknowns in my life, I'll say that most have actually *not* been dumbasses, and have a pretty good idea of where they're at. I almost always ask "what if anything would be a non-productive topic for you" - emotional painsluts usually know exactly what I mean.

And someone can look/be/act crestfallen or even cry and still have a very productive time. I guess I trust the other person to be a relatively together grown-ass adult, and I tend to believe that responsibility while largely mine is not exclusively mine just because I'm the top. Their landmines are theirs to warn me about, and should I detonate one, it's my job not to freak out and run, but to stick around and see what's needed.

 

[cascadiabound]

And someone can look/be/act crestfallen or even cry and still have a very productive time. I guess I trust the other person to be a relatively together grown-ass adult, and I tend to believe that responsibility while largely mine is not exclusively mine just because I'm the top. Their landmines are theirs to warn me about, and should I detonate one, it's my job not to freak out and run, but to stick around and see what's needed.

I think this is a very good point regarding emotional stuff. IMHSO, it is absolutely the pyl's responsibility to warn/ inform the PYL of land mines and other hot buttons. This is in addition to any negotiation of use of or not of safe words.
I have to agree with IrisAlthea that it is difficult to safeword in a verbal humiliation kind of scene. The edge can be crossed in an instant and the line can be invisible. This is very different than physical play.

 

[CutieMouse]

Does a safeword spoil the fun?
Does offering a safeword already spoil the fun?

I don't personally use safewords in my relationships, because *for me* - it does ruin things. Not because it somehow gives me power over whatever is happening, but because

A) It's one step too many for me in communication. My brain is thinking "stop", so "stop" is going to come out of my mouth instead of "red". And as stupid as it sounds, I have had situations where my brain is thinking stop, but can't remember if I'm supposed to say stop, or red, or something else. Or wait... just because I want this to stop do I want it to stop badly enough to say red? Or is it a yellow sort of stop? I can get caught up arguing in my own head, to the detriment of communicating what's happening - especially if someone accidentally hits a [bad] trigger.

and

B) I end up reserving a percentage of my thought-process to remembering the damn safeword "just in case" is distracting. I'm not fully present if I have to be processing what's physically happening to me, AND analyzing if XYZ activity = green, yellow or red.

If nobody initiates the topic of safeword, is it okay to take this as an implicit agreement that both parties don't see it as necessary? (It is assumed that both parties are not completely clueless dumbfucks.)

Generally speaking, I try not to engage in yummy kinky things with men who ignore words like stop, no, wait a sec, hang on, that's bad hurt, etc. And because of that, I've learned it's best to have a conversation re: approaches/attitudes about sex & boundaries, safewords, etc. I bring it up the same way I'd bring up non-monogamy when I wasn't interested in a monogamous relationship.

If I don't bring the awkward stuff (at least on a cursory level) and allow assumptions to be made, is the other person really fully consenting to ending up in bed with me?

I had a lover at one point who was... bothered... by my attitude re: safewords. He felt it was irresponsible for me to engage in anything sexual/kinky without the standard green/yellow/red in place. We discussed it a lot, and never reached a place of mutual agreement. So I tolerated his (IMO cumbersome - for me) game of green/yellow/red, with the caveat of "enthusiastic participation = green, I need a minute/wait also = yellow, and no and stop also = red".

His textbook insistence of safewords and the distraction/difficulty I had with them (instead of using words I'd normally use if I wanted something to slow down or stop) was one of the factors in my decision to end the relationship. It was too big of a communication issue for me to continue.

Only the very inexperienced would not have safe words or a couple that's in a long term relationship wanting to experiment and want something different to what they have already.

I am very inexperienced in BDSM, and would never have sex with a stranger that didn't respect my hard limits. I would want to take things slowly and have rules and protocols in place.
Sam xx

I'm not inexperienced, and do not wait until a relationship is well established/long term to explain that I don't use the standard green/yellow/red system of safewords. (Reasons explained, above)

If someone has an issue with me simply saying "stop" or "leg cramp" or "wait" or "bad ouch" or otherwise using words other than the standard green/yellow/red to communicate... I've come to realize that person is not a good fit for me.

 

[Primalex]

I don't personally use safewords in my relationships, because *for me* - it does ruin things.

[..]

Generally speaking, I try not to engage in yummy kinky things with men who ignore words like stop, no, wait a sec, hang on, that's bad hurt, etc. And because of that, I've learned it's best to have a conversation re: approaches/attitudes about sex & boundaries, safewords, etc. I bring it up the same way I'd bring up non-monogamy when I wasn't interested in a monogamous relationship.

I would summarize this as:
Yes, you use safewords as in "words to stop the play" and you bring this topic up on your own if you think it's necessary. Also, you use regular communication, as the play you choose usually does not involve ignoring regular communication (like rape play).

Correct?

 

[CutieMouse]

I would summarize this as:
Yes, you use safewords as in "words to stop the play" and you bring this topic up on your own if you think it's necessary. Also, you use regular communication, as the play you choose usually does not involve ignoring regular communication (like rape play).

Correct?

Yes; exactly.

So many people I've met see safewords as a specific code word (green, yellow, red), that I've stopped referring to my communication style as a form of safewords. I've actually had people argue that "no" or "stop" can't be a safewords.

Re: rape play - my sex life probably falls under the primal label, but I generally try to avoid "rape play" because most men I e met who are into that want their partner to fight back, say no/stop (without meaning it), etc... That's not something I'm willing to do because I never want to give the impression that no/stop/fighting back = permission to keep going. Even if it's scripted. For me, it's too risky.

 

[faithlessmaiden]

I'm not inexperienced, and do not wait until a relationship is well established/long term to explain that I don't use the standard green/yellow/red system of safewords. (Reasons explained, above)

If someone has an issue with me simply saying "stop" or "leg cramp" or "wait" or "bad ouch" or otherwise using words other than the standard green/yellow/red to communicate... I've come to realize that person is not a good fit for me.

This how my relationship works. Instead of using 'pineapple' or green/yellow/red, I say 'stop' or exactly what is wrong. It's much easier in terms of communication and quickly identifies the issue.

 

[oOMinxOo]

Maybe it's just me, but I don't use safe words. I don't think (for me) they're necessary. I like the feeling of being completely at the whim of the other person.

 

[CoercedAnon]

There are some situations where I would say that a safeword is good idea. Waterboarding for example.

But what about activities where the fun is especially dependant on the psychological blur of lines and not physical interaction? Humiliation, degradation, coercion, ...

Does a safeword spoil the fun?
Does offering a safeword already spoil the fun?

If nobody initiates the topic of safeword, is it okay to take this as an implicit agreement that both parties don't see it as necessary? (It is assumed that both parties are not completely clueless dumbfucks.)

a friend i were debating about this the other day...i believe, in certain context, the use of a safeword could spoil the fun...and does, in certain contexts, wreck the fun before it begins. negotiated before hand, strictly, dropping a safeword enhances said certain contexts.

she believes a safeword is necessary at all times, in all contexts, and would never consent to doing anything without it.

if nobody initiates a conversation about it, i can't see how that makes it unnecessary *or* makes them dumbfucks. clueless, yes. it depends, right? for some people it *could* mean an implicit agreement...or it could mean lack of experience and cluelessness...or it could mean one of the two is dodgy...etc.

morally, once consent has been established (and one hopes that includes a pretty thorough discussion of what is going to happen..or at the very least a general outline) then people should be free to use or not use a safeword.

personally: there are definitely scenarios where dropping the safeword would almost be necessary.

it goes without saying that in those cases you really need to know and trust your partner.

 

[malefica]

The question is: Do you bring this topic up on your own if he does not?

And follow-up question:
You identify as prey and pain slut - so your play is usually fairly physical?

Sorry for the delay, Literotica does not notify when there is a quote.
I do, yes. We discussed it very, very early on into the relationship.

And yes. There is some mental submission involved but it is definitely more physical. Hence the combination of words and gestures depending on what is going on. But we never *not* have something in place.

 

[ShadowXX]

I've never set a safeword, and nobody has ever told me that they needed to stop during play. I have stopped several scenes though, when I could tell that they weren't comfortable.

At the end of the day, a safeword is useful, but not always necessary. If my partner didn't bring it up, I wouldn't bother - though I would respect "red" if they used it.

 

[Trademark47]

Me and my wife don't have any safe words, she just says stop and tells me what is uncomfortable or if she needs to catch her breath. Makes life easier doing it that way.