The role of photographs in D/s relationships

[PDatura]

I've been thinking about the way photos are used in D/s relationships, mainly as a method of titillation and control. I'm referring to photographs of the actual members of the pairing in this discussion, not photos of others found in the surfing porn type thing.

What I've noticed on blogs is that a Dom will post photos of the sub, whether male or female, and the blogs about Dommes are mostly photos of the Domme and not the sub. This is just a thing I've noticed, and I've not actually done a count or accumulated the data quantitatively.

Based on another discussion here, I gather there is a contingent that is tired of the Femdom standard of Goddess In Latex And Leather Owns A Pathetic worm. As what is shown on blogs or is advertised does not always reflect the depth of opinion on a subject, I thought I'd ask here.

Personally, I have required a sub to produce photographs for me to arouse me, to post elsewhere on completion of a task, and to prove a task has been done. I have used photos of myself to titillate and tease and to give direction.

I have wondered if using photos of myself might be too much of a crutch; pleasing me should be enough. A sub ought not require any proof of my pleasure, and teasing with photos is just really too easy. I find I am more creative with the written or spoken word, and my descriptions (whether written or spoken) tend to be effective. Besides that, the goal is not for the sub to get off, but rather for me to be pleased; I find it's been very easy to have a male sub blow his wad and behave less desirably if I use photographs of myself.

How do you use photos in your D/s pairing? I'm interested in responses from either side.

 

[SpunThings]

We don't really use photos.

Think of it this way, the biggest audience for those photos is men. Both your examples would appeal to men.

 

[PDatura]

We don't really use photos.

Think of it this way, the biggest audience for those photos is men. Both your examples would appeal to men.

Exactly. If it appeals to men, why should a Domme provide it? Why bother appealing to what the sub wants? Yet that's a huge portion of what I see.

There's some very interesting gender politics going in this, and I find it intriguing. (also, just curious to find how others use photos, because I'm sure there are good ideas out there)

 

[SpunThings]

Exactly. If it appeals to men, why should a Domme provide it? Why bother appealing to what the sub wants? Yet that's a huge portion of what I see.

There's some very interesting gender politics going in this, and I find it intriguing. (also, just curious to find how others use photos, because I'm sure there are good ideas out there)

Because she wants attention or page views for her ads. Plenty of dominants appeal to what the sub wants. Frequently what the sub wants is what the Dom wants too. That is what makes the power exchange work. Both people have a vested interest in the actions involved. Otherwise why be driven to do it.

 

[FurryFury]

We used pictures mostly just between us but some were once posted here. I wrote on him too, things like My anal slut . . . it was a hard sell, pictures but it was fairly hot. I didn't do it to make money or increase fame. I did it for us and for fun.

 

[PDatura]

Because she wants attention or page views for her ads. Plenty of dominants appeal to what the sub wants. Frequently what the sub wants is what the Dom wants too. That is what makes the power exchange work. Both people have a vested interest in the actions involved. Otherwise why be driven to do it.

I always forget about the attention aspect, as I prefer to pull strings from the shadows myself. As for page views for the ads, certainly a way to sell things to men is to wrap it in pictures of boobs, but the business aspect isn't really what I'm referring to when I ask this. Of course, I'm certain that much of what I'm seeing is Dommes monetizing their activities, which is a point, but I'm more interested in actual D/s relationships, not sex biz.

I probably worded my question in a confusing manner, so I'll clarify: So many Dommes I know or have spoken to do not find the stereotypical Domme look or attitude to be of their taste. So my question is more why cater to the subs' taste if it is not her own? Photos seem to be a big thing, as I get asked for them from prospective subs almost immediately.

 

[PDatura]

i am not currently involved with a dominant, but when i was they dressed as they wanted. none of the typical leather and lace stuff. i was there for their pleasures and my ideas of a "dom" didn't really matter.
the pictures that were taken were of me in bondage for their pleasures later on.
i loved it this way and was happy to meet one on the same level as myself!

Oh, I absolutely love photos of subs in bondage, especially if the photos were taken specifically for me! You have a good attitude; I like it! (also, nice legs!)

We used pictures mostly just between us but some were once posted here. I wrote on him too, things like My anal slut . . . it was a hard sell, pictures but it was fairly hot. I didn't do it to make money or increase fame. I did it for us and for fun.

Ooooooh bodywriting is so hot. I loved that on my previous sub! I admit I'm curious if you used photos of yourself to rile up your sub; It could be that's more of a distance thing.

 

[SpunThings]

I always forget about the attention aspect, as I prefer to pull strings from the shadows myself. As for page views for the ads, certainly a way to sell things to men is to wrap it in pictures of boobs, but the business aspect isn't really what I'm referring to when I ask this. Of course, I'm certain that much of what I'm seeing is Dommes monetizing their activities, which is a point, but I'm more interested in actual D/s relationships, not sex biz.

I probably worded my question in a confusing manner, so I'll clarify: So many Dommes I know or have spoken to do not find the stereotypical Domme look or attitude to be of their taste. So my question is more why cater to the subs' taste if it is not her own? Photos seem to be a big thing, as I get asked for them from prospective subs almost immediately.

I suspect the people asking you for those photos look at a lot of porn, and don't spend a lot of time in power exchange relationships. They're looking to get their jollies off rather than find a partner.

 

[PDatura]

I suspect the people asking you for those photos look at a lot of porn, and don't spend a lot of time in power exchange relationships. They're looking to get their jollies off rather than find a partner.

Oh I don't doubt you're correct.

 

[inkyprimal]

I am far more the picture-taker than my Master is, but he has yet to give me tasks that require proof of completion.

 

[PDatura]

i was a little scared that the photos of me in bondage might show up elsewhere, like on some websites, but they said they would just keep them for their own use.

I personally am not interested in using a sub's photos for anything outside their limits, like posting somewhere without their knowledge or consent. That's abusive. But within those limits, there's plenty of fun to be had. After all, you have the nice legs to look at and mark up...

 

[Submissive1tou]

Photos

The majority of photos in our relationship are comprised of me to him. I'm required to send them for his pleasure and also to show completion of tasks and/or punishments. Occasionally I will send some on my own just to surprise him and hope they are pleasing to him. Master does send some to me periodically but they are reserved more as a treat he gives to me for good behavior and to show how well I've pleased him.

 

[Kim_Burly]

Sir loves to take pictures and videos of me and us, we very rarely watch the videos, but he has had me make several scrapbooks with varying levels of graphicness (is that a word?). The more sedate ones do get a bit of use being shown to friends. Sir is a great photographer and he has taken some very artistic nudes of me and some of both of us. It is wonderful to see people's reaction to the photographs. The questions are interesting "What does that tattoo say?". It doesn't happen often that we show anyone the "X rated" ones, but I do thrive on the humiliation of other people, particularly women, seeing me in settings of subjugation and bondage.

My former Dom has a ton of graphic pictures and a few videos of us, but he promised to keep them to himself, and to the best of my knowledge, he has. But be careful, because once they are on the internet, it's impossible to close Pandora's box.

 

[SeawitchSlave]

I use photographs to tease my Master. I also occasionally use them to show him that I have done a chore or task that he has set me. He very rarely - in fact, never has yet - asked for one outright. But he knows I enjoy being in front of a camera, and photograph exchanges featured heavily in our exchanges prior to meeting for the first time so they hold a special place.

 

[James1324]

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[PDatura]

I don't agree with this. The majority of subs, in my experience, are not altruistic -- they want something from the relationship, and if they do something correct and well, then they are surely going to want approval. This is what many subs 'get' from the d/s exchange, and it's important the domme/dom knows how to give it effectively.

My key word is "proof", implying that it would be independently verifiable. Letting a sub know that they have done a good job and that you are pleased is key; letting them walk away with physical evidence which could be wanked to or shown off at any time is another matter entirely. Hence, this thread.

I do agree with this -- as a dom, I prefer to express approval or pleasure with my sub through words, rather than photos. More room for innovation, maybe.

We are in perfect agreement here.

Because that's what d/s is -- each individual provides something that the other wants. What the sub wants is equally as important as what the domme/dom wants, and both parties (assuming there are only two) set limits and requirements together.

Absolutely what each party wants is important; I've run in to a lot of male subs who do not like a "no photos of me" limit, which I find intriguing.

If the sub specifically states that they don't want their own desires considered, or that they like having them denied or something like that, then you can disregard them, with constant monitoring.

Sounds like a sub I wouldn't get on with; I want to know my sub's desires and to consider them thoroughly.

If they haven't, then there's a good chance they'll expect to have them considered.

As well they should. But catering to those desires is another matter entirely, And photos seem to be a thing which specifically men want.

There's an interesting train of thought there. It's usually assumed that the domme/dom holds all the power in the relationship. But the domme/dom can only work within specific limits set by the sub. So where does the real power lie?

I've had dozens of discussions on this very subject. The answers I have come to have resulted in a limit of "no photos of me" and have recently pushed me to consider the possibility of restricting deep emotional connection to a sub or else leaving BDSM entirely if that is an untenable position to take.

My basic questions on this subject are these: Why give the sub more power when power exchange in the opposite direction is the point? and Why does it only seem to be male subs asking for photos? I've never once been asked for a photo by a female sub. There is no right or wrong answer. I'm curious to find out what others' positions are on the subject, and to discover what photos might be used for that I haven't thought of. Frankly, I was hoping for some subs to chime in with "photos of my Dom/me give me XYZ fulfillment for reasons ABC" but as of yet, those haven't happened.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[James1324]

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[PDatura]

Interesting point. But I wonder how far that distinction between hard "proof" and other kinds of approval could be maintained. If a sub is more turned on by, for example, worded approval than photos, then the written approval could be used in the way you describe above, as wanking material or something to be shown off. Rarer, I admit, but it throws interesting light on the topic of approval and how it can be undertaken in a way controllable by the domme/dom.

There are so many levels to this conversation, and that's one of the very interesting ones, isn't it?

Photos are an interesting contrast that seems generally to run along gender lines. My own sub, who is female, doesn't require many photos of me at all, whereas I base a lot of her tasks around sending photos. Not all, or even mostly, sexual, but I am much more focused on the visual than her.

Here's where things get funky: I require photo proof from my subs for tasks completed, personal wank fodder, etc., but I've only ever had male subs want photos. It seems to be 'dominants and males, including dominant males, like photos'.

I consider myself fairly enlightened in gender politics, but I wonder is the discrepancy rooted in the fact that I, as a male, have been conditioned to the so-called "male gaze" to be used a source of social or cultural power over women.

As you are a dominant, it would not surprise me that you would leverage the existing power structures, nor does it surprise me that dominant females would flip that same power structure. One can be enlightened in gender politics and still use the findings to one's advantage.

Again, there's a distinction here that might be tricky to maintain. After all, aren't we always catering to our sub's desires? If they say they enjoy pet play, for example, then there's little point 'considering' this and them demanding that they do something entirely different. But if we then start treating them as a pet, as we asked, are we then overly 'catering' to their desires?

It's definitely a delicate balance. For instance, if a sub wants to be treated as a pet, but I don't like that kind of play, withholding that can be powerful. If I do like that kind of play, but I only do it sporadically to keep the sub wound up and anxious for more, that is where I would say I'm using the desires of subs which happen to be in concert with my own. If I can take or leave that kind of play, but still do it, then I'd say that's more catering than dominating.

The domme/dom's power comes from a set of negotiated limits, in which the sub and domme/dom are equal. I don't think it's a case of 'giving' the sub more power in the power exchange. Rather, there are two kinds of power, one controlled solely by the domme/dom in the context of d/s activities, and the other a kind of meta-power to negotiate limits that's shared by both. That power exchange itself comes after the sub has already exercised their other power as an equal negotiating partner.

That's the most thorough and accurate blurb about power exchange that I've ever seen. Bravo!

The exchange I'm referring to (D providing photos to s) can be used as leverage in the world outside negotiated limits and kinks, which is where I'm referring to the problem. If the s uses photos of the D to say, break chastity or embarrass them at parties, isn't that a bit of a power imbalance?

As for uses of photos, I usually use them as a kind of diary. My sub chronicles her day to me, using a mixture of photos and log entries. It's a nice dynamic, though now I'm questioning if my liking for photos is a peculiarly 'male' trait of mine...

A lot of D's seem to use photos as a diary; that's one of my uses as well. I really enjoy that dynamic. I don't think your liking for photos is so much of a male trait in this case. If you were a sub, I'd concede the point, but as you are not, that must be taken into account.

 

[RISsey]

We have taken a few photos. Mostly of bruises and the results of play...a few naughty ones of him (GRIN). It is strictly to be able to enjoy them again after they (the marks) have faded and before we may have the chance to make some more! I don;t see anything wrong or right with it. It is just something any couple may do at any time?

 

[Que]

The role for me is I like taking them and having a memento to look back on. The fact that I can take them at all suggests to me that the person is both displaying trust in me and a form of submission to expose themselves in such a vulnerable way.

I have a favorite clip and where a fwb stops what she was doing, looks into the camera and says you're lucky you're Que, because I don't let anyone take pictures of me. No one but me has ever seen that clip and it amuses me to have it.

 

[James1324]

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