Books on rape

[Handley_Page]

There's a protest about these; http://www.amazon.co.uk/Roosh-V/e/B00649OS0O
From what I can see,, the protest is worthy of support.

https://www.change.org/p/amazon-com-amazon-stop-selling-rooshv-daryush-valizadeh-rape-books?tk=1WD_xiUNJk1ypNqwMB_btE-LIB2tTbDLEFxiR0Sdnso&utm_medium=email&utm_source=signature_receipt&utm_campaign=new_signature

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Doesn't freedom of speech come into play here.

So, when they come to ban your books for being to lurid...what do you do?

 

[Handley_Page]

Doesn't freedom of speech come into play here.

So, when they come to ban your books for being to lurid...what do you do?

From what I read, it seems that the author does not rate "rape" as a crime.
Lurid is one thing, to express a view as 'real' is another, perhaps?

 

[sr71plt]

Doesn't freedom of speech come into play here.

So, when they come to ban your books for being to lurid...what do you do?

No, and we have covered this a million times. Amazon is a private business. It can choose what is in its inventory and what isn't. This has nothing to do with freedom of speech.

 

[Bramblethorn]

From what I read, it seems that the author does not rate "rape" as a crime.
Lurid is one thing, to express a view as 'real' is another, perhaps?

Yeah, Roosh is a repulsive piece of work who wants rape legalised:

http://wehuntedthemammoth.com/2015/02/17/pickup-guru-roosh-v-end-rape-by-making-it-legal/

Given that Amazon have already chosen to set limits on what they will and won't sell, it seems reasonable enough to ask they make this one of those limits.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

From what I read, it seems that the author does not rate "rape" as a crime.
Lurid is one thing, to express a view as 'real' is another, perhaps?

This message is hidden because sr71plt is on your ignore list.

Well that would be between him and the police.

I bet pilot is saying something along the lines of amazon being a business and free speech doesn't enter into the picture. But, when a group of people band together to limit someone else's speech, it does.

 

[HandsInTheDark]

Publishers are private. They can chose to reject or carry what they wish.

It gets more interesting if the writing gets defined as a hate crime, which is conceivable for espousing rape.

 

[MatthewVett]

Doesn't freedom of speech come into play here.

So, when they come to ban your books for being to lurid...what do you do?

Unless Amazon is your government, no, freedom of speech does not come into play here. There's no petition for the government to censor his books.

 

[HandsInTheDark]

Having skimmed a little, I'm maybe 75% sure he means it, but 100% certain he's after publicity, and being banned by Amazon will aid that. Shrewd business move. And I doubt it will impact his sex life much.

 

[DirtyAllie]

Amazon has already caved to things like this in the past. Its why they do not allow incest anymore and its why they were very quick to yank confederate merchandise. So they have a history of catering to public opinion and like to avoid controversy.

And in this case amazon has left themselves open to having to take note of this. Incest was banned because of a "pedophile handbook" that handbook was not technically a work of fiction, it was not a novel, it was a manual to molest children.

These Roosh books-and this is not the first controversy this animal is facing-are not fiction. They are how to manuals to stalk and abuse and rape women.

Again this is where people who tout freedom of speech seem to get misled in thinking FOS justifies actual criminal activity and things that can be deemed dangerous.

This also shows a double standard. No one complained about the pedo book being banned. But there will be issues with this one especially from MRA groups.

Why?

Because the victims are only women.....

 

[sr71plt]

This message is hidden because sr71plt is on your ignore list.

Well that would be between him and the police.

I bet pilot is saying something along the lines of amazon being a business and free speech doesn't enter into the picture. But, when a group of people band together to limit someone else's speech, it does.

My goodness you're psychic about what I posted.

And continuing to be more than a little dumb in your views on this (as some others are pointing out).

 

[Everyday_Man]

As of right now Literotica has 17,908 on nonconsent and reluctance ... hmmm, hmmm .... from what I read on Roosh's books, they are 'how to pick up women' not ... how to rape women. Men and women spend much of their time meeting people, getting to know them, trying to figure out how to sleep with them or get into a relationship with them (sleep with them) ... this guy seems to offend everyone.

He claimed his legal rape remarks were satire .... I don't know, I don't care ... feminist and critics who think he's insulted their country seem to hate him the most.

Rape books? No .... unlikable guy, yeah .... now if someone has excerpts of his books where he details how to actually commit rape, print them out, I'll read and judge, otherwise it's just advice and advice is what people give their friends constantly when it comes to hooking up with other people.

 

[HandsInTheDark]

Again this is where people who tout freedom of speech seem to get misled in thinking FOS justifies actual criminal activity and things that can be deemed dangerous.

Careful. Writing about horrid and criminal things is not illegal and is not a free speech issue. Raping women is illegal. Freedom of speech still covers writing about it. Criminalizing his writing doesn't lead in any helpful directions.

 

[someoneyouknow]

Amazon has already caved to things like this in the past. Its why they do not allow incest anymore and its why they were very quick to yank confederate merchandise. So they have a history of catering to public opinion and like to avoid controversy.

From Snopes, quoting the designer of the Second Confederate national flag:

As a people, we are fighting to maintain the Heaven-ordained supremacy of the white man over the inferior or colored race; a white flag would thus be emblematical of our cause.

http://m.snopes.com/2015/06/28/confederate-flag-history/

 

[DirtyAllie]

This message is hidden because sr71plt is on your ignore list.

Well that would be between him and the police.

I bet pilot is saying something along the lines of amazon being a business and free speech doesn't enter into the picture. But, when a group of people band together to limit someone else's speech, it does.

He did and he's right.

neither amazon nor any other private business needs to uphold "freedom of speech" they can choose-and have in the past-what they will accept.

For an example this site preaches freedom of speech. The owner upholds it to the point some of these forums have turned into cesspools of bullying and abuse, but its okay because its Freedom of speech

But yet....she does not allow under age stories.

Now underage stories are legal, there is no law against writing them and people do in works of fiction all the time, why? Because of freedom of speech...

But yet Literotica does not allow it

Why? because the person who owns this site chooses not to carry them for her own reasons and guess what? She can because she owns the site.

But yet you don't question that do you?

Why? Because you probably don't care for under age sex stories yourself and you'd be in the majority

But let's face it Zeb you have proven yourself sexist many times over. So you are my example from my prior post

Its only rape and its only women.

meanwhile please take your freedom of speech argument and take it where its relevant which is not here.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

He did and he's right.

neither amazon nor any other private business needs to uphold "freedom of speech" they can choose-and have in the past-what they will accept.

For an example this site preaches freedom of speech. The owner upholds it to the point some of these forums have turned into cesspools of bullying and abuse, but its okay because its Freedom of speech

But yet....she does not allow under age stories.

Now underage stories are legal, there is no law against writing them and people do in works of fiction all the time, why? Because of freedom of speech...

But yet Literotica does not allow it

Why? because the person who owns this site chooses not to carry them for her own reasons and guess what? She can because she owns the site.

But yet you don't question that do you?

Why? Because you probably don't care for under age sex stories yourself and you'd be in the majority

But let's face it Zeb you have proven yourself sexist many times over. So you are my example from my prior post

Its only rape and its only women.

meanwhile please take your freedom of speech argument and take it where its relevant which is not here.

Me sexist? What a fucking dingbat you are. Link any post where that is true. You can't because it's not. I sincerely think you as a woman should have the same right as I to fuck up the world. So have at it, I won't stop you.

And, why does everyone think I was talking about Amazon? There is another group expressing their right to freedom of speech that would limit the freedom an individual. They may not be a government, but they are wanting to limit the free speech of others, in this case one...who maybe an asshole, but still has a right to express his opinion on anything he wants.

And as no one here is a legal expert, although I'm sure there is one who would claim he is, whose to say who is violating whose freedoms?

Even as an individual you can still be sued for violating someones rights...read the articles on the cake fiasco ruling. It would seem the courts are leaning toward private business violating individuals rights.

 

[LadyVer]

Zeb is a sexist??? Right. Out of all the male commenters on this thread, Zeb is the sexist.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Zeb is a sexist??? Right. Out of all the male commenters on this thread, Zeb is the sexist.

She may think I was advocating the assholes writing, but I was just asking a question which no one seems to have picked up on. Oops, should have probably put a ? at the end of that first sentence. My bad.

 

[sr71plt]

And, why does everyone think I was talking about Amazon? There is another group expressing their right to freedom of speech that would limit the freedom an individual. They may not be a government, but they are wanting to limit the free speech of others, in this case one...who maybe an asshole, but still has a right to express his opinion on anything he wants.

By your reasoning, the ones petitioning are just exercising their full rights to freedom of speech as well.

But that's all irrelevant. Several of us have now pointed out that this isn't a freedom of speech issue at all. It's a freedom of a business to sell what just what it chooses to sell based on whatever reason it wants to have issue. Which any true reactionary conservative like you should be rah rahing.

What you have is a glaring inconsistency problem.

 

[Bramblethorn]

As of right now Literotica has 17,908 on nonconsent and reluctance ... hmmm, hmmm .... from what I read on Roosh's books, they are 'how to pick up women' not ... how to rape women.

Some of the rapey things Roosh promises to teach readers on his website (and I'm sorry I looked this up while eating dinner):

How to deal with the dreaded 'R' word: resistance. I teach you an effective strategy to steamroll her resistance so you don't go home blue-balled.

Seven very detailed steps to taking off her clothes that includes tactics to fight any late-minute resistance she might throw at you.

My aggressive strategy for sleeping with virgins.

From one of his books:

Next comes her panties... you may get firm resistance at this point, even if she didn't resist prior steps. Just treat it like any other form of resistance and start over if she stops you, making a panty removal attempt every 10-15 minutes. At this stage you can use raw persistence to break down any remaining resistance.

Does that sound consensual to you?

BTW, here's how Roosh behaves to women who criticise him.

Careful. Writing about horrid and criminal things is not illegal and is not a free speech issue.

That's not entirely true, even under US law. The First Amendment is very powerful but it's not absolute; SCOTUS has long acknowledged some categories of unprotected speech e.g. threats and incitement to violence. See Rice v Paladin Enterprises for a case where a business that published a how-to for hit-men was held liable for murders committed by somebody following that book.

Whether this would fit in those categories, I have no idea - but as has already been noted, the First Amendment doesn't require Amazon to sell them.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

By your reasoning, the ones petitioning are just exercising their full rights to freedom of speech as well.

But that's all irrelevant. Several of us have now pointed out that this isn't a freedom of speech issue at all. It's a freedom of a business to sell what just what it chooses to sell based on whatever reason it wants to have issue. Which any true reactionary conservative like you should be rah rahing.

What you have is a glaring inconsistency problem.

I just had to see what kind of dumb shit you were writing and I was right.

Learn how to read and comprehend what you read.

You are such a blowhard dumbshit.

Back on iggy.

 

[Handley_Page]

For the benefit of those not quite in tune with this "rape" thing (as opposed to comments on "freedom of speech"), take a look HERE.

 

[someoneyouknow]

One has to wonder how he would react if the same were done to him. Find some bug, burly gay guys to talk him, catch him alone on the street, then forcibly rip his pants off and have a go at him.

 

[Everyday_Man]

Some of the rapey things Roosh promises to teach readers on his website (and I'm sorry I looked this up while eating dinner):



From one of his books:



Does that sound consensual to you?

How many guys or gals for that matter, have attempted to get someone to go out with them more than once? .... From skimming it, he never says go past the 'no' ... but this continuous flirtation, asking someone out or 'wearing them down' as normal, as non Roosh readers have done to others in the past ...

He's not raping anyone, he has a plan and he's a bit scummy when he talks about it, but you calling it rape is out of distaste for the author.

If his tactics were rape in his writing, then I'd say a high percentage of men and women would be in jail right now for using them without ever reading his books. Separate fact from distaste ... but this is one of those topics where extreme dislike has given a certain group of people an opinion that can't be changed.

 

[Everyday_Man]

One has to wonder how he would react if the same were done to him. Find some bug, burly gay guys to talk him, catch him alone on the street, then forcibly rip his pants off and have a go at him.

What you have there is sexual assault scenario ... more appropriately would be to say, "How would he - Roosh - like it if a gay male took his tactics and attempted it on him." ... He would either get up and actually leave the place and the man's presence or he might get seduced ...