Racial Fatigue?

[PoppingTom]

What did I say that is not true?

Please read again. I never accused you of lies, and that's not the point.

 

[The_Trouvere]

Thing is that America never enslaved Asians. They did it with Indians and Blacks, two groups facing nearly the same amount of racism and lack of identity with white America.

I don't know any other reason why Blacks aren't that much of a problem here in Germany and anywhere else in Europe.

If slavery is responsible for black shortcomings, why has black crime and illegitimacy increased since the civil rights legislation was signed? Why are blacks in the United States better off than blacks in Africa? Why do blacks have a high crime rate in Africa? Why has independence for African countries been so disappointing? Why is Haiti such a mess?

The reason blacks are not more of a problem in Europe is because there are not many of them there yet. Also, European countries often have laws and taboos against reporting demographic differences in behavior and achievement. Therefore it is difficult to know how the black crime rate compares with the white crime rate.

Why do those laws and taboos exist? Why are European governments afraid their electorates will learn the truth?

I admire Orientals. In the United States they have a lower crime rate than whites. I want more people to know that.

I want more attention to be drawn to how the races differ in average behavior and performance. Races I admire, like Orientals and Ashkenazi Jews, will benefit from the attention.

 

[The_Trouvere]

Please read again. I never accused you of lies, and that's not the point.

Then what is the point? What have I done wrong?

 

[PoppingTom]

Then what is the point? What have I done wrong?

This:

I admire Orientals. In the United States they have a lower crime rate than whites. I want more people to know that.

I want more attention to be drawn to how the races differ in average behavior and performance. Races I admire, like Orientals and Ashkenazi Jews, will benefit from the attention.

If this is not racism, what is racism?

 

[Bad_Doggie]

What did I say that is not true?

Differences between blacks and whites overlap. Most blacks are not criminals. Some whites are. Some black men marry the mothers of their children. Some white men do not. Some blacks are more intelligent than some whites.

Nevertheless, average differences exist. They have a durability and degree that indicates genetic causation.

Where in the world is there a black majority country with a high standard of living, a low crime rate, and regular, honest, and contested elections?

Nowhere.

Where in the United States is there a black neighborhood that is safe after dark?

Same answer.

Shouting "Racist!" at me is the only response those of your persuasion have to what I have posted in this comment.

And all of that is true only if you deliberately ignore all historical, social and economic context and start from the mistaken premise that each race start(ed) from the same point (back-ground) and has the same opportunities.

Woof!

 

[PoppingTom]

If slavery is responsible for black shortcomings, why has black crime and illegitimacy increased since the civil rights legislation was signed?

So slavery was just to protect you from the Blacks and their nature driven criminal mind?

Why are blacks in the United States better off than blacks in Africa? Why has independence for African countries been so disappointing? Why is Haiti such a mess?

There is a difference between historical build structures and natural given things. That Africa in general has a lot of development to do to better its structures is right. That they will never do because they're all Black is racism.

The reason blacks are not more of a problem in Europe is because there are not many of them there yet. Also, European countries often have laws and taboos against reporting demographic differences in behavior and achievement. Therefore it is difficult to know how the black crime rate compares with the white crime rate.

Because it's useless to point that out. 86% of foreigner crime in Germany is done by people clearly NOT Black. And though 33% of that crime is done by Turks, I would never say that a Turk is criminal by default.

 

[Bad_Doggie]

Because it's useless to point that out. 86% of foreigner crime in Germany is done by people clearly NOT Black. And though 33% of that crime is done by Turks, I would never say that a Turk is criminal by default.

Hardly useless, it's kinda the point; he's using a limited set of metrics to come to a predetermined conclusion whilst at the same time ignoring all context and background.

Confirmation bias at its best.

Woof!

 

[The_Trouvere]

This:

If this is not racism, what is racism?

Your question illustrates why I wish people stopped discussing racism. It implies that the problem is racism, rather than black social pathology.

I believe that race is not a social construct; it is a biological reality. The races differ significantly in average behavior and ability, although individuals overlap.

Now if you want to condemn bigotry, I agree that is a problem. There are people who dislike people of different races simply because they belong to different races.

In the United States there are people who dislike Orientals and Jews because they tend to be intelligent. They have spent their lives watching Orientals and Jews get better grades in school, into better colleges, and better salaries with better corporations.

Now it's your turn. You tell me what racism is.

 

[The_Trouvere]

Hardly useless, it's kinda the point; he's using a limited set of metrics to come to a predetermined conclusion whilst at the same time ignoring all context and background.

Confirmation bias at its best.

Woof!

Despite laws and taboos against compiling and reporting data there does seem to be evidence that Negroes and Muslims in Europe have high crime rates.

Negroes have high crime rates everywhere they live. Muslims only have high crime rates in non Muslim countries. This is probably because they think that non Muslims are legitimate targets for crime, but Muslims are not.

 

[The_Trouvere]

There is a difference between historical build structures and natural given things. That Africa in general has a lot of development to do to better its structures is right. That they will never do because they're all Black is racism.

"That they will never do because they're all Black," is a reasonable hypothesis when we consider the history of black majority countries. What have over two centuries of black run independence done for Haiti?

Because I take a long view of things I do not believe that Negroes will never equal whites. Nevertheless, the Negro race has a lot of evolving to do: at least a thousand years, probably more.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Black run countries are mostly in Africa and Africa kinda sucks.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I admire Orientals. In the United States they have a lower crime rate than whites. I want more people to know that.

You admire furniture because it has a lower crime rate than white people?

Black run countries are mostly in Africa and Africa kinda sucks.

Kinda?

Well I guess if you have an army of well armed/trained merc's and you're going in with some bucks to exploit natural resources for a profit it wouldn't be so bad.

 

[The_Trouvere]

And all of that is true only if you deliberately ignore all historical, social and economic context and start from the mistaken premise that each race start(ed) from the same point (back-ground) and has the same opportunities.

Woof!

Ten thousand years ago the races were at roughly the same point. Then agriculture and later civilization developed in parts of the world, and spread from there.

The ancestors of American Negroes only began to practice agriculture about four thousand years ago. They began to practice metallurgy two and a half thousand years ago. Large numbers of them only began to live in cities in the twentieth century.

Black urban neighborhoods are not known for civilized behavior. They are appropriately called "asphalt jungles." Public schools in black neighborhoods are blackboard jungles. White liberals avoid sending their children to those schools, even while they complain about the persistence of school segregation.

The hypocrisy of upper middle class white liberals on racial issues has long been noticed by white blue collar workers. These blue collar workers cannot afford to send their children to private schools. They often cannot afford to move away from black neighborhoods, where they are often the victims of black criminals. They are forced to live with the effects of liberal ideals.

 

[The_Trouvere]

So slavery was just to protect you from the Blacks and their nature driven criminal mind?

My point is that slavery cannot be blamed for black shortcomings. Slavery ended a long time ago. Those shortcomings have not ended. They have become worse since the civil rights legislation was signed, and since the War on Poverty expanded the welfare system.

 

[Sean Renaud]

You admire furniture because it has a lower crime rate than white people?



Kinda?

Well I guess if you have an army of well armed/trained merc's and you're going in with some bucks to exploit natural resources for a profit it wouldn't be so bad.

Well I was more talking natural resources and that pesky desert in th eway.

 

[The_Trouvere]

Because it's useless to point that out. 86% of foreigner crime in Germany is done by people clearly NOT Black. And though 33% of that crime is done by Turks, I would never say that a Turk is criminal by default.

No one "is criminal by default." Nevertheless, crime rates differ between the races. I want more study done of these differences. I want the results of the studies to be widely reported. I am confident that races I admire without belonging to one of them will look good in those reports.

 

[PoppingTom]

Your question illustrates why I wish people stopped discussing racism. It implies that the problem is racism, rather than black social pathology.

So you voluntarily admit you're a racist and that's no problem?

I believe that race is not a social construct; it is a biological reality.

Off course it is. That's why you should keep that out of any political discussion. The social constructs people are in could always be overcome, it happened to white people like to asians like to orientals. There was a time when Arabs were more progressive than white European people.

In the United States there are people who dislike Orientals and Jews because they tend to be intelligent. They have spent their lives watching Orientals and Jews get better grades in school, into better colleges, and better salaries with better corporations.

The question is not if there are people who are jealous about other people. The question is: what's the reason they are better? Racism is if you make this a biological question.

Now it's your turn. You tell me what racism is.

I told you much more about what I think what racism is than you told me what it is.

It seems like you can't imagine something like racism exists, though you're the best example.

 

[PoppingTom]

My point is that slavery cannot be blamed for black shortcomings.

Really?

There coudn't be such a thing like mistrust in a society that once broke their families and remains their racist behavior after freeing them? Thus, there couldn't be such a thing like reversion of the roots, which worked to their social disadvantage?

I don't want to excuse the behavior of black people you don't like, but shit like that works even with white people, even in a more trustful environment like Germany is today.

 

[Littlefinger]

This is what a Motion Picture Member suggested as to why "Selma" got zero nominations. Does this mean he thinks folks in general are tired of angry black folks, and the notion that people are entitled to be honored on the basis of their race? Just askin'.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/django-unchained-producer-selma-oscar-764888

Okay, so, it is pretty clear that blacks in this country do not feel safe, they do not feel respected. There IS an issue, vette. Although I do not personally agree the Mike Brown case was an example of such treatment, I do not believe you'd have so many people all crying out the same message if the issue were fake. It's real. As a race, black people in this country feel threatened and mistreated.

However, I also understand that a lot of times, government instituted "fairness" doesn't actually make people feel like things are fair. Although it's ignorant of small girl to deny the existence of a problem while being a white woman in her 40's and somewhat successful, she does bring up the point that it does not foster a sense of respect to watch someone be handed rights and dignities based on their skin color rather than merit. Two wrongs don't make a right and I don't believe in continuing to foster animosity with a "do unto you what you did to me, see how you like it" attitude.

I admit there's a lot I don't know. I'm not black. I've not grown up with that struggle. How do we achieve peace? How do we encourage respect for people and unite everyone? Because even with the system in place to give blacks an even playing field, it's not enough. The tension is growing on both sides of the fence, as shown by the protests during the past few months. I genuinely would like to hear people's thoughts on how we might heal relations. Quit denying that there is an issue. There is, so, I don't want to hear that. Just turn on the fucking news and quit telling people to "get over it" like a callous prick. How do we unite and heal people and relationships between the races that have been wounded and hurt to this point? Where do we go from here?

 

[The_Trouvere]

Okay, so, it is pretty clear that blacks in this country do not feel safe,

This is why blacks in the United States should not feel safe:

There is nothing more painful to me at this stage in my life than to walk down the street and hear footsteps and start thinking about robbery. Then look around and see somebody white and feel relieved.... After all we have been through. Just to think we can't walk down our own streets, how humiliating.

- Jesse Jackson


Blacks who are more afraid of white police officers than black criminals have been reading too many history books, and not enough newspapers.

 

[Sean Renaud]

This is why blacks in the United States should not feel safe:

There is nothing more painful to me at this stage in my life than to walk down the street and hear footsteps and start thinking about robbery. Then look around and see somebody white and feel relieved.... After all we have been through. Just to think we can't walk down our own streets, how humiliating.

- Jesse Jackson


Blacks who are more afraid of white police officers than black criminals have been reading too many history books, and not enough newspapers.

Not really. Though "more afraid" isn't the point. The point is the police are supposed to protect you and when you've got a nagging doubt that aren't that stems from a very real place it makes life complicated.

 

[The_Trouvere]

Okay, so, it is pretty clear that blacks in this country do not...feel respected.

If blacks in this country want to feel respected they should begin to behave respectably. They should stop committing all those crimes. They should stop having all those illegitimate children. They should begin to behave and perform as well as whites do.

 

[The_Trouvere]

I genuinely would like to hear people's thoughts on how we might heal relations.

I doubt it. For decades people like you have suppressed an honest discussion of the black problem in America. Then you have the nerve to call for a conversation on race.

I would love to have an honest dialogue. I want geneticists to discuss what they have learned about the importance of genes to the human situation. I want ordinary whites to express the way we really feel. I think there should be no taboos and inhibitions against telling the truth.

 

[The_Trouvere]

Not really. Though "more afraid" isn't the point. The point is the police are supposed to protect you and when you've got a nagging doubt that aren't that stems from a very real place it makes life complicated.

I am a white man. I have been stopped and frisked by the police a number of times. They inspected packages I was carrying. It did not bother me. I hadn't been doing anything wrong. I did not have anything to worry about.

When this happens I behave respectfully. I move slowly. I keep my hands in sight.

I have also been followed and questioned by security guards. When this happens I ask, "Excuse me. Am I trespassing?" If they tell me I am, I apologize and leave.

If Trayvon Martin had acted that way when he was questioned by George Zimmerman he would still be alive. Instead he acted like the black ghetto thug he was, and attacked George Zimmerman from behind.

 

[The_Trouvere]

So you voluntarily admit you're a racist and that's no problem?

I believe on the basis of personal experience and what I can easily document that blacks have a much higher crime rate than whites. If that is your definition of "racist" I do not see anything wrong with being one.

Moreover, I do not think whites are responsible for black social pathology. I know I am not. I think blacks are born that way - not all of them, just a high percentage of them.