Unreasonable Attacks

[Magnetron]

The only writer who doesn't crave attention is the writer who never displays his work. Would that not be true?

True.

Most writers are also willing to share space on a bookshelf with other authors.

Some writers want the shelf all to themselves. Drama can be used to distract attention away from the other authors.

Not saying that this is the case here.

Just an example tis all.

 

[littlecordelera]

There was a discussion a while back (which I can't find in the search for some reason) between myself and people on both sides of the LW argument. I was considering recategorizing the BTB/revenge stories because, like you said, they aren't precisely in the spirit of the category's initial purpose. But it was also pointed out to me that there were many facets to the LW discussion and that the category is more complex than our original description. We've decided for now to allow the factions to coexist. We believe the Story Tags and other forms of navigation will help those seeking the "right" stories for them within this category.

Thank you. At least now I know. On the other hand, I am disappointed that I missed that argument.

 

[littlecordelera]

Some writers want the shelf all to themselves. Drama can be used to distract attention away from the other authors.

I got ya. Some people crave attention and some people crave ATTENTION!

Yes they do.

 

[Laurel]

Thank you. At least now I know. On the other hand, I am disappointed that I missed that argument.

You know, I'm not saying it was a flame-free discussion, but it was surprisingly civil considering the topic.

 

[littlecordelera]

You know, I'm not saying it was a flame-free discussion, but it was surprisingly civil considering the topic.

I wasn't interested in the discussion for entertainment purposes. I am disappointed that I missed an opportunity to provide my opinion in the debate. But it's done and over with.

 

[twelveoone]

There is not a published writer alive who has not received blistering, hurtful criticism. Whenever you show your art publicly - be it music, writing, dance, whatever - you are risking criticism and insult. This is true on the Internet and in real life. Successful artists are those who learn to filter criticism, to learn from the constructive and disregard the stupid and cruel.

That said, Literotica provides authors with all the tools they need to tailor their experience.

Not all authors come to Literotica for the same reasons.

Some authors welcome all private and public comments - even negative ones.

Other authors want only private contact, and voting.

Still authors want neither comments, contact, nor voting.

You have the right and ability to delete any and/or all comments on any of your work for any or no reason.

Authors have the option to accept or not accept anonymous comments on the Public Comments Boards on each story.

If you go here:
http://www.literotica.com/members/main_options.php
you will see a option labeled "Accept Anonymous Feedback?"

If you click the "Yes" radial button, then anyone can leave public comments on your stories.

If you click "No", then only logged in Literotica users will be able to leave public comments on your stories.

If you don't want any comments on any of your stories, then click "Yes" under "Turn Off All Feedback?"

Do note that it may take a few hours for changes on posted stories to take effect.

You have the ability to turn off commenting on a story-by-story basis.

You can turn off voting on each of your stories. (Do know that doing so at any given time will make your story ineligible for all contests.)

You have all the tools you need to stop and/or remove feedback on your work. If you choose to not use these tools, that is your choice. However, to expect us to "do something" about negative anonymous comments is futile. We do not possess special supernatural powers required to preemptively stop negative comments. We have no magic wand we can wave over your story that will magically make the tens of thousands of people who read it slather it in praise.

On Literotica - just like every single site on the Internet that allows commenting - there will be people who say critical, stupid, and rude things. Only you can choose to allow or disallow these things, using the tools above.

If you have any questions on this or anything else, let me know!

An analogy:
In America (more correctly the US) any asshole can pretty much say what the fuck he wants, however, they cannot vote without registering.*
This may mean little here, however, it is a devastating tool in poems, where you are lucky to get five comments. Ten comments with votes, can be undone with one asshole anon vote. Fortunately, they also can't resist the comment. So at least I get some amusement out of it. (and fucking inspiration!)

*Unless, of course, you are Global Election Systems

The world is not a nice play, however, why give the hidden too much power?

 

[Magnetron]

An analogy:
In America (more correctly the US) any asshole can pretty much say what the fuck he wants, however, they cannot vote without registering.*
This may mean little here, however, it is a devastating tool in poems, where you are lucky to get five comments. Ten comments with votes, can be undone with one asshole anon vote. Fortunately, they also can't resist the comment. So at least I get some amusement out of it. (and fucking inspiration!)

*Unless, of course, you are Global Election Systems

The world is not a nice play, however, why give the hidden too much power?

I agree that anonymous voting could and should be disabled simply because Anons can still indicate in their comments what they would have rated a piece.

Stories would get less ratings, but ..... boo fucking hoo.

Anyhoo, the number of Anon comments you receive would likely increase, so it would probably be an even trade.

 

[Magnetron]

As for the forum aspect of things .....

If you are tired of the same ole nobgoblins hiding behind Freedom of Speech to say nasty and idiotic things, then don't just put them on Ignore ......

..... put ALL the other Lit members who incessantly rebuke them on Ignore as well.

Yes, it may result in putting a crimp into the amount of feedback you get on your submissions both outside and within the forum and the amount of people here you socialize with on a daily basis.

You will do it if you are sincerely tired of the bullshit.

 

[sr71plt]

I agree that anonymous voting could and should be disabled simply because Anons can still indicate in their comments what they would have rated a piece.

I think this brings up (again--it comes up most of the times we get into this discussion) a good point and points to, I think, a shortfall in the current system. I can't see the downside of permitting only logged-in members the right to vote. The system gives the author so many other controls on responses (which is a good thing). Why not this too? Whether or not the malicious could just open multiple accounts, it would be more steps they would have to go through and many wouldn't bother doing so, I think--which would cut down on the unfair power malicious voting currently has.

 

[MrRandyWatson]

I agree that anonymous voting could and should be disabled simply because Anons can still indicate in their comments what they would have rated a piece.

Stories would get less ratings, but ..... boo fucking hoo.

Anyhoo, the number of Anon comments you receive would likely increase, so it would probably be an even trade.

I would get rid of Anonymous comments as well. In my experience, the knuckle-dragging fuckwads always post Anonymous. It may make comments a lot more polite, but it's sure as hell going to make criticism a lot more honest and constructive.

This is a site full of people who know how to write and are often better at it than the writers on, say, Yahoo or MSN. I hate the idea that a group of troglodytes can effectively turn the comments section for a top-quality story into Yahoo Comments simply by posting anonymously.

 

[SecondCircle]

And I'll vote no. Do not get rid of anonymous voters or anonymous comments.

I understand the reasoning and that trolls abuse the system in place to harrass and bully and stalk and bomb. The shit can get downright frustrating.

But honestly? Reach down and grab a pair.

Trolls will relentlessly abuse whatever system you put in place. There is no fix for stupid fucking people. Assholes are everywhere. Idiots are everywhere. Bullies are everywhere. There are so many ways to strip their power on Lit already. Turn off voting. Turn off anon comments. IGNORE them. It honestly takes me zero effort to ignore a troll.

I thought this was a reading site not a critique site or an author site? I thought these guys weren't worth our time? How many times do we tell folks "don't feed the trolls, ignore the petty bullshit"? How many times have we given the thick skin sermon? How many times do we always say "red Hs aren't everything, the story and the fans matter most" or "write because you love it"? Now we want to do away with the reader's right to just breeze in to Literotica for a few moments anonymously because our feelings are hurt by stupid people?

I've had my share of stupid hateful people. Anonymous as well as NOT. I've also had great critical comments from anon, and anymouses who say they enjoy my work and wanna read more. I take the bad with the good. Nothing's perfect, and I don't need to be pampered. If a reader wants to remain anonymous or not create an account for whatever reasons, so be it. I can handle criticism and trolling and stupid people.

Look, life will always have fucking trolls. The secret? It's not a secret. Fuck em! Don't let them get to you! If they are so insignificant to you, why even waste time worrying about them? Because they bomb stories and post hateful shit? Dude it's a number! You know how well your story does. Your fans tell you when they like it, and if a bouncing number and vanishing red H is that important to you, then in my opinion you've lost sight of why you write in the first place.

I just don't see why we stress so much about stupid people. Let them sit and be stupid. Getting rid of anonymous is not going to free you from the woes of idiotic behavior. Only you can do that for yourself.

 

[MrRandyWatson]

Reach down and grab a pair.

It's not my own precious feelings I worry about. I can distinguish between a legitimate criticism that should be addressed and someone who decides to act like a shithead.

My concern is that trolls can end up turning the Comments section into a warzone through which only people hardened by weeding through the fuckwads on Yahoo, Youtube, etc. can stomach - thereby eliminating not just positive feedback but the best kind - constructive feedback.

Besides, if you're willing to make a comment about a story that is the product of another's hard work designed to give other people a little bit of joy, then stand behind your comment.

 

[sr71plt]

And I'll vote no. Do not get rid of anonymous voters or anonymous comments.

I understand the reasoning and that trolls abuse the system in place to harrass and bully and stalk and bomb. The shit can get downright frustrating.

But honestly? Reach down and grab a pair.

Would you then say that anyone who comes on the forum and denigrates a writer here on the basis of their story ratings was just one of the trolls? (Because, well, you've supported such a poster in the past.)

 

[sr71plt]

It's not my own precious feelings I worry about. I can distinguish between a legitimate criticism that should be addressed and someone who decides to act like a shithead.

Well, here I'd agree with Second Circle. "Legitimate criticism" doesn't "need" to be addressed by a story author here--or paid any attention to at all. This is a reading site which gives the author tools just to blot out any/all comments they want to. It's legitimate here to post just to be read without critique whatsoever. And those who post stories on that basis have no obligation to entertaining critique at all.

 

[twelveoone]

And I'll vote no. Do not get rid of anonymous voters or anonymous comments.

I understand the reasoning and that trolls abuse the system in place to harrass and bully and stalk and bomb. The shit can get downright frustrating.

But honestly? Reach down and grab a pair.

Trolls will relentlessly abuse whatever system you put in place. There is no fix for stupid fucking people. Assholes are everywhere. Idiots are everywhere. Bullies are everywhere. There are so many ways to strip their power on Lit already. Turn off voting. Turn off anon comments. IGNORE them. It honestly takes me zero effort to ignore a troll.

I thought this was a reading site not a critique site or an author site? I thought these guys weren't worth our time? How many times do we tell folks "don't feed the trolls, ignore the petty bullshit"? How many times have we given the thick skin sermon? How many times do we always say "red Hs aren't everything, the story and the fans matter most" or "write because you love it"? Now we want to do away with the reader's right to just breeze in to Literotica for a few moments anonymously because our feelings are hurt by stupid people?

I've had my share of stupid hateful people. Anonymous as well as NOT. I've also had great critical comments from anon, and anymouses who say they enjoy my work and wanna read more. I take the bad with the good. Nothing's perfect, and I don't need to be pampered. If a reader wants to remain anonymous or not create an account for whatever reasons, so be it. I can handle criticism and trolling and stupid people.

Look, life will always have fucking trolls. The secret? It's not a secret. Fuck em! Don't let them get to you! If they are so insignificant to you, why even waste time worrying about them? Because they bomb stories and post hateful shit? Dude it's a number! You know how well your story does. Your fans tell you when they like it, and if a bouncing number and vanishing red H is that important to you, then in my opinion you've lost sight of why you write in the first place.

I just don't see why we stress so much about stupid people. Let them sit and be stupid. Getting rid of anonymous is not going to free you from the woes of idiotic behavior. Only you can do that for yourself.

a pair of what? anon heads. They amuse me, almost as much as my balls.
If this is a reading site, that should have no bearing on whether it has comments or voting. It would also cut down on the number of good writers, writers do want some feedback, don't they? In the absence of dollars...
I (and you) can very well write and leave it on a hard disk.

Why do we have top lists? Why do we have comments, why voting? What is the purpose? A feedback system, a reward system?

In the US, the KKK once had a considerable amount of power, some of that power was taken away when states passed laws against covering your face in parades. You could still hold those views.
I also can't show up and vote without being known (voter ID). That is the issue.
One person, one opinion, one vote.
Ignore too much, the stupid, the evil take over.
Yes, my H's meant something, yes, I risk them constantly, and yes I consider it unfair that the work of ten can be that uneasily be undone by one without any accountability.

 

[Magnetron]

a pair of what? anon heads. They amuse me, almost as much as my balls.
If this is a reading site, that should have no bearing on whether it has comments or voting. It would also cut down on the number of good writers, writers do want some feedback, don't they? In the absence of dollars...
I (and you) can very well write and leave it on a hard disk.

Why do we have top lists? Why do we have comments, why voting? What is the purpose? A feedback system, a reward system?

In the US, the KKK once had a considerable amount of power, some of that power was taken away when states passed laws against covering your face in parades. You could still hold those views.
I also can't show up and vote without being known (voter ID). That is the issue.
One person, one opinion, one vote.
Ignore too much, the stupid, the evil take over.
Yes, my H's meant something, yes, I risk them constantly, and yes I consider it unfair that the work of ten can be that uneasily be undone by one without any accountability.

Your balls amuse me as well.

 

[sr71plt]

writers do want some feedback, don't they?

Well, there's a false sweeping generalization. Well-grounded, experienced writers don't all (or even most, I think) look for feedback from anonymous readers with no established credentials to give constructive critique on an Internet story site. That's an amateur belief about "good" writers--as well as about the advertised purpose of this Web site. Being given the privilege of either voting or critiquing here doesn't have a thing to do with the reader's validity as a story critic. (And most readers here, I dare say, don't have any expertise in that realm.)

This certainly isn't where I come to for assessment of my writing. It's where I post stories I want to share with a broader range of readers than the marketplace accords me (and, usually, posted here several months after they have gotten a play in the marketplace).

 

[DeYaKen]

I got ya. Some people crave attention and some people crave ATTENTION!

Yes they do.

And these people who crave ATTENTION, would they be the people who try to use other authors comments page to start their own private war?

Someone tried to do that to me once. What was her name now? Oh yes I remember, it was littlecordelera.

 

[SecondCircle]

Would you then say that anyone who comes on the forum and denigrates a writer here on the basis of their story ratings was just one of the trolls? (Because, well, you've supported such a poster in the past.)

It's not my intent to speak for any "denigration" or individuals that participate in that stuff. Supporting a poster? This is part of the problem we have here. We come up with these little grudges and groups and try to "outdo" any other poster that doesn't agree with them. I dunno who your "anyone" is, but I'm guessing at some point I agreed with them on one topic or another that opposed your view.

Because I agree with something someone says, does not make me a part of some movement or club. As a matter of fact, I've agreed with you, Pilot, many many times. Does that make me a part of "Team Pilot?" No, though some think that way. If I agree with something, I'll say it and discuss it. If I disagree, same thing. I don't participate in petty grudge matches, and I don't smile upon any poster taking shots at another's scores or stories.

This is a part of our "troll" problem as it relates to the forum. These little grudges and finger pointing gripes and nastiness in general start becoming worse and become trollish immature behavior. It gets personal and people take shots and troll each other. I do not understand why grown men and women resort to hateful shit when they have disagreements or differences of opinion. That's childish.

We have to let shit go. Dont encourage idiotic immature behavior. We can all do that right here on the forum without needing moderators or protective lasers or hate groups.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

It's not my intent to speak for any "denigration" or individuals that participate in that stuff. Supporting a poster? This is part of the problem we have here. We come up with these little grudges and groups and try to "outdo" any other poster that doesn't agree with them. I dunno who your "anyone" is, but I'm guessing at some point I agreed with them on one topic or another that opposed your view.

Because I agree with something someone says, does not make me a part of some movement or club. As a matter of fact, I've agreed with you, Pilot, many many times. Does that make me a part of "Team Pilot?" No, though some think that way. If I agree with something, I'll say it and discuss it. If I disagree, same thing. I don't participate in petty grudge matches, and I don't smile upon any poster taking shots at another's scores or stories.

This is a part of our "troll" problem as it relates to the forum. These little grudges and finger pointing gripes and nastiness in general start becoming worse and become trollish immature behavior. It gets personal and people take shots and troll each other. I do not understand why grown men and women resort to hateful shit when they have disagreements or differences of opinion. That's childish.

We have to let shit go. Dont encourage idiotic immature behavior. We can all do that right here on the forum without needing moderators or protective lasers or hate groups.

Team Pilot, huh? I knew that.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I would get rid of Anonymous comments as well. In my experience, the knuckle-dragging fuckwads always post Anonymous. It may make comments a lot more polite, but it's sure as hell going to make criticism a lot more honest and constructive.

In my 2+ years here, I've had one or two obnoxious anon comments and dozens of lovely ones. I would be sorry to lose those people, and forcing them to register would discourage many of them.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Well, there's a false sweeping generalization. Well-grounded, experienced writers don't all (or even most, I think) look for feedback from anonymous readers with no established credentials to give constructive critique on an Internet story site. That's an amateur belief about "good" writers--as well as about the advertised purpose of this Web site. Being given the privilege of either voting or critiquing here doesn't have a thing to do with the reader's validity as a story critic. (And most readers here, I dare say, don't have any expertise in that realm.)

This certainly isn't where I come to for assessment of my writing. It's where I post stories I want to share with a broader range of readers than the marketplace accords me (and, usually, posted here several months after they have gotten a play in the marketplace).

God cant practice law or medicine or preach or be a nail tech any place I know of.

 

[SecondCircle]

It doesn't matter what you do, people are going to troll. Anytime you put your work out there in any form of art, stupid hateful people are going to waste their own time attacking you and making you feel like shit. People send hate mail to TV shows and musicians all the time. People trash works of entertainment publicly all the time. Essentially, people vote shit down all the time.

Put as many precautions in place as you want, they'll still find a way to troll you. That's actually what a troll does. They relentlessly try to drag others down through any means necessary. Who knows why they do it? Self esteem and all that yada yada. But you don't have to put up with it. You're the one who decides how much attention you'll show for that activity. Troll commenters are going to try to bait you in to turning your comnents field into a battle field. Dont. They are going to vote stories down. Whether you make them sign in or not. Ignore it. Fans love your stuff, and no bombing will change anyone's mind when they click on a good story and read it. It doesn't affect my reading of stories.

You wanna write right? Then write. Take all that shit on the chin and let it make you stronger. Dont sink to those bastards level. You're going to come across naysayers and dumbasses. You know the difference between good feedback and stupidity. You know how honest people think about your story.

Yes, it's mainly a reader site. But it's not just a reader site. It's a site for everyone. I'm not daft, I know authors want to know how their stories are doing and they want it without all the bullshit. Authors want their stories to do well. This is also an AUTHOR's site. But even we may not like it, monkeys are going to fling poo. We're gonna have to put up with idiots. I mean what if you put out a novel one day and it hit the New York Times Bestseller? You know what will happen? People will make YouTube videos about how garbage your book was. You write a song? They'll call it trash and make fun of it. You do literally anything in life and some dumbass is going to shit on it.

Many honest readers are anonymous. Many trolls have usernames and accounts. You're never going to win the battle of protecting your feelings against idiots. Every one of us is capable of filtering bullshit like that ourselves. Lit has tools for you to adjust your experience here. But you can't hope to silence stupidity. You can just choose to not listen to it.

 

[policywank]

Why does this site allow stories in Loving Wives that intentionally violate the very theme of the category? I can see that the term "Loving Wife" was understood when the category was created, or at least, some time in the past. It is defined by this site as "Married extra-marital fun: swinging, sharing & more," and yet stories are allowed that aim to change that very definition.

What gives?

What stories do you believe intentionally violate the theme of the category? That is a sincere question.

I write slut wife/cuckold stories. I get all kinds of nasty feedback, but I feel as though LW is the correct category - the story focus is on loving but kinky wives. I know they go beyond what some find desirable so I make the content abundantly clear in the title so those who don't care for the content can move on. That seemed like a sensitive and reasonable trade-off since there is no category specific to my content.

Many still attack as though I am a trespasser and they are the self appointed guardians keeping out my loathsome notions. Some are self-evidently the same people coming back each time, seemingly taking a personal interest in getting rid of me. Of course that makes me all the more determined to stay.

I am not crying the blues. I don't expect to appeal to more than a small portion of readers and I have learned that the content really sets off some others. Fuck it - I'll write what I want, argue with the commentators if I feel like it and delete the ones I don't like. Personal attacks far outweigh any kind of thoughtful comment on the story, but I can't do anything about that.

I do find it fascinating that sexual activity between consenting adults can raise such extreme feelings among people even in this forum. Makes me want to keep stirring up the issue to be honest.

 

[Vanadorn]

@ Policywank - 100% agreement. One of the things I like about Lit is the categories are BROAD so that even though you are in a defined area, you can still find a wide gamut of choices and options that you might not normally find or read.

If you don't like it, move on. If you do like it, read it.

People who bitch and moan and whine and complain that it's not in the right area, or it wasn't erotic enough, or it was too much this or not enough that or learn to tell a story or fuck a duck and die - just do your damnedest to ignore them. Are they unreasonable? Sure. Can you stop it? Nope. Can you ignore the crap out of them? Yes you can.

-V