Crimes of Passion

[dolf]

my lack of faith in humanity summed up in one thread...

sexual abuse is wrong unless the person committing it is fun to be around, but being a lame alt is a heinous crime and the perp must be persecuted to the ends of the earth. burn him, burn him, etc.

the creation of the distraction ploy is less ugly than the enthusiasm and relief with which most people leap at it.

 

[bg23]

I find the turns of this thread shocking, which must make me a bg23 minion.

It started with an outrageously glib description by Recidiva about how she had a sexual online relationship with a 14 year old boy, continued with some scatty and illogical back-tracking and finished with a jolly old knees-up.
All along, sprinkled with lots of Recidiva's pseudo-analysis of Recidiva.

I know that sexuality is rarely clear-cut and that people can have fantasies or behaviour that I personally might find shocking or just plain icky, but my feelings on what others do is of absolutely no consequence as long as it takes place between consenting adults.

But this thread was not a debate on what constitutes consent or at what age consent can be given - it was a thread about confessions and Recidiva made one.

She made it pretty clear in her first few posts that she knew that what she'd done overstepped acceptable and even legal behaviour.
But what I found really objectionable in her confession was her almost instant attempts at painting the boy as a co-conspirator. He was 14 when she first knew him and he had been "doing it for years" before that so she knew she was talking to someone very young and vulnerable. Her integrity went rapidly downhill from there and hasn't recovered.

A very sad thread.

This is a spot on summary.

I don't understand the rationalizations being made or how people can reconcile two completely contrary statements made by the same person, "it was a crime" and "i did nothing wrong or illegal".

Nor do I understand the reasoning, "He was a 14 year old boy who'd been doing it for years so therefore this showed that he was healthy and well-adjusted and therefore I was only doing him a favor by perpetuating and engaging in that behavior with him."

And I find most disappointing - and disturbing - the people who defend the behavior. The ones who say, "How can we judge, we're on a porn board!" Or the ones that say, "Well it happened 20 years ago."

You know, people make mistakes. They definitely do. And if the confession made had been followed with, "I made a huge mistake and it was completely unjustified and at the time I just didn't consider what my actions might potentially do to this child. And while I hope he didn't get hurt I realise I could have hurt him and I will never do it again," as opposed to "I actually did him some good and he was totally not your average 14 year old" I don't think there'd have been this much of a backlash. Because people make mistakes and you can't go back in time to undo them.

But what's been displayed has not been that, I think what's been displayed is an utter and total lack of regret and seems to indicate that, were she placed in the exact same situation again, she'd just do it again.

And that people think that is OK is awful.

 

[Recidiva]

I find the turns of this thread shocking, which must make me a bg23 minion.

It started with an outrageously glib description by Recidiva about how she had a sexual online relationship with a 14 year old boy, continued with some scatty and illogical back-tracking and finished with a jolly old knees-up.
All along, sprinkled with lots of Recidiva's pseudo-analysis of Recidiva.

I know that sexuality is rarely clear-cut and that people can have fantasies or behaviour that I personally might find shocking or just plain icky, but my feelings on what others do is of absolutely no consequence as long as it takes place between consenting adults.

But this thread was not a debate on what constitutes consent or at what age consent can be given - it was a thread about confessions and Recidiva made one.

She made it pretty clear in her first few posts that she knew that what she'd done overstepped acceptable and even legal behaviour.
But what I found really objectionable in her confession was her almost instant attempts at painting the boy as a co-conspirator. He was 14 when she first knew him and he had been "doing it for years" before that so she knew she was talking to someone very young and vulnerable. Her integrity went rapidly downhill from there and hasn't recovered.

A very sad thread.

Is there anything I could say to anybody to make myself seem like a better person that wouldn't be called immediately pandering and crowd pleasing and essentially bullshit?

I think people want me to show remorse, and that's fine.

However, remorse for what? For poor judgment, doing something stupid, being flippant about doing something stupid, breaking site rules? Yes. I admit and have admitted several times to that in many ways. I've learned lessons, but I also learned these lessons about 20 years ago. People looking for a light bulb from me now are missing a critical logical error. This is happening in real time for you guys, it is extraordinarily old news to me.

Remorse for...doing stuff I didn't do that is criminal and life wrecking? No, that I didn't do. It resembles so closely something criminal and life wrecking that I really can't blame anybody for going that way out of internal moral choices they believe to be true. They're consulting their inner compass instead of taking my word for it and I've also done that, right or wrong. It's up to them.

It is of interest to me why people make their choices, and I don't mind being the formaldehyded frog tacked open and having their guts probed, I really don't, and I will do that willingly.

Yes, my attitude is very Alice's Restaurant.

"I'm sittin' here on the Group W bench 'cause you want to know if I'm moral enough to join the Army, burn women, kids, houses and villages after bein' a litterbug?"

You want to know if I'm moral enough to post on Lit? Yeah, I think I am.

Does anybody else want to bare their soul and be the formaldehyded frog? No, not really. And that's okay. But really, although I understand exactly why people are repelled, I also know that it is the smoke and not the fire. You don't, and you do what you want. I don't want to talk to anybody on Lit that doesn't want to talk to me.

If anybody wants a "Reci Please Put Me On Ignore" out here, let me know. I won't respond to you and I will know that I'm simply too low of a human being to post, probably in a thread that has underaged people in it, about Rainbow Skittles poop, with the upright citizens that have done no wrong and see no evil unless it's tacked to a board and admitting it freely.

 

[bg23]

So about 20 years ago I ran over this dude and he kinda broke his spine and now he doesn't walk any more. But meh, whatever, it was like 20 years ago! He's like 30 now! AND JUST THINK - instead of having to WALK LIKE A CHUMP he has this awesome chair that he just sits in and it TAKES HIM PLACES.

I can't really show any remorse over it cos well, it happened 20 years ago so I'm like basically over it now.

That's cool, right guys?

Since we're apparently all making false equivalencies here now.




Actually, what I mean is, I didn't run him over. He walked out in front of my car. I wasn't actually driving it. Somebody else was.

How dare you people accuse me of running over somebody when that's not even what I said?

This is terrible mob mentality.

 

[SalviaDivinorum]

Is there anything I could say to anybody to make myself seem like a better person that wouldn't be called immediately pandering and crowd pleasing and essentially bullshit?

I think people want me to show remorse, and that's fine.

However, remorse for what? For poor judgment, doing something stupid, being flippant about doing something stupid, breaking site rules? Yes. I admit and have admitted several times to that in many ways. I've learned lessons, but I also learned these lessons about 20 years ago. People looking for a light bulb from me now are missing a critical logical error. This is happening in real time for you guys, it is extraordinarily old news to me.

Remorse for...doing stuff I didn't do that is criminal and life wrecking? No, that I didn't do. It resembles so closely something criminal and life wrecking that I really can't blame anybody for going that way out of internal moral choices they believe to be true. They're consulting their inner compass instead of taking my word for it and I've also done that, right or wrong. It's up to them.

It is of interest to me why people make their choices, and I don't mind being the formaldehyded frog tacked open and having their guts probed, I really don't, and I will do that willingly.

Yes, my attitude is very Alice's Restaurant.

"I'm sittin' here on the Group W bench 'cause you want to know if I'm moral enough to join the Army, burn women, kids, houses and villages after bein' a litterbug?"

You want to know if I'm moral enough to post on Lit? Yeah, I think I am.

Does anybody else want to bare their soul and be the formaldehyded frog? No, not really. And that's okay. But really, although I understand exactly why people are repelled, I also know that it is the smoke and not the fire. You don't, and you do what you want. I don't want to talk to anybody on Lit that doesn't want to talk to me.

If anybody wants a "Reci Please Put Me On Ignore" out here, let me know. I won't respond to you and I will know that I'm simply too low of a human being to post, probably in a thread that has underaged people in it, about Rainbow Skittles poop, with the upright citizens that have done no wrong and see no evil unless it's tacked to a board and admitting it freely.

If you had learned those lessons 20 years ago, I don't believe you would or could have written about what happened the way you did. You were flippant and almost grandstanding when you told your story. "Oh. Yeah, I thought I hadn't. Carnal involvement with a minor, I imagine, in my case."

I think you still don't get it.

 

[Recidiva]

If you had learned those lessons 20 years ago, I don't believe you would or could have written about what happened the way you did. You were flippant and almost grandstanding when you told your story. "Oh. Yeah, I thought I hadn't. Carnal involvement with a minor, I imagine, in my case."

I think you still don't get it.

And you're thinking that my admissions about how things looked and what someone could charge me with, was what happened and what I could have been convicted of doing. And that's okay. I can clarify and people can say "bullshit, you're backpedaling"

Does any of my behavior look like backpedaling? I'm standing my ground and being knowingly offensive to those who are getting carried away with their imaginations.

However, I'm in exactly the same spot as I started. But I explain the funny and I explain the stupid and I explain what was real and how it could be perceived.

The only people that I did harm to were his parents. To them I owe an apology for meeting him without their permission. Though they did actually know about me. He announced to them that he wanted to marry me. They were, of course, absolutely appalled. He wanted to be an upstanding Christian man and stand by his woman or something. He didn't ask me first.

He didn't want to marry me and announce it to his parents because I was a good cyber partner. He wanted to take me to Church with him and not hide the fact that he cared for me as a person. It was in its way very brave and heroic and so out of character I did not expect it. When I met him it was partly to return the wedding ring he'd sent me in the mail in person.

Think what you want, this kid, now a man, was/is awesome and smart and brave and I don't regret getting to know him.

No, not even for random people on the interwebs who think I just don't get it.

 

[bg23]

bullshit deflection is bullshit.

i've played online games with minors before. i've even formed friendships with some of them.

but because it was never sexual, never once have i ever considered that as "oh, i might be charged with a crime for this!" and i wouldn't consider posting it on lit and calling it "carnal involvement with a minor".

i've hugged minors before. friends of my siblings that i've known for years, students i've tutored in congratulations or to wish them luck.

i'd never consider that as something i might be charged as a crime before, either.

when i was 13, 14, 15, i was giving and receiving hugs all the time, with friends, co-workers. not teachers, because ew who hugs a teacher. but hugs are innocuous.

you know why? because i never fucking cybered with any of them.

backpeddler is backpeddling.

 

[Wings]

What people want is for you to stop bumping this thread with your jokes and flippancy. You said what you said and people will make their conclusions from it. The heinous part now is you grandstanding and laughing about it in the same thread that people attempted to eviscerate you in.

You in here poking fun at those who are concerned and upset about your confession makes you no better than a guy in here laughing about raping a girl in college. "Ha ha. Isn't that funny? Don't you enjoy how I'm showing you that I feel no remorse, that I feel no shame, that I enjoy making a joke of something incredibly disgusting?"

That is what people want. You keep asking and there's your answer.


I'll wait while you compose a 1000 word essay on why I'm assigning you guilt.

 

[Recidiva]

What people want is for you to stop bumping this thread with your jokes and flippancy. You said what you said and people will make their conclusions from it. The heinous part now is you grandstanding and laughing about it in the same thread that people attempted to eviscerate you in.

You in here poking fun at those who are concerned and upset about your confession makes you no better than a guy in here laughing about raping a girl in college. "Ha ha. Isn't that funny? Don't you enjoy how I'm showing you that I feel no remorse, that I feel no shame, that I enjoy making a joke of something incredibly disgusting?"

That is what people want. You keep asking and there's your answer.


I'll wait while you compose a 1000 word essay on why I'm assigning you guilt.

No, I know what people want. If they want to talk to me and keep checking in on this thread and telling me that I'm forcing them to read this thread and relive this horror and I'm doing it on purpose, I do find that a tad disingenuous.

Unsubscribe, ignore me, don't speak to me, ask me to ignore you, these are all reasonable internet requests and actions.

To tell me I'm doing additional harm by typing words about it, no, I also don't accept that narrative.

 

[Adre]

You and bg just bumped it as well. Oops, I did too. Clearly she revels in the attention.

 

[Wings]

You asked what people wanted and I told you. That you already knew that says more about you than it does about "people".

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

So about 20 years ago I ran over this dude and he kinda broke his spine and now he doesn't walk any more. But meh, whatever, it was like 20 years ago! He's like 30 now! AND JUST THINK - instead of having to WALK LIKE A CHUMP he has this awesome chair that he just sits in and it TAKES HIM PLACES.

I can't really show any remorse over it cos well, it happened 20 years ago so I'm like basically over it now.

That's cool, right guys?

Since we're apparently all making false equivalencies here now.




Actually, what I mean is, I didn't run him over. He walked out in front of my car. I wasn't actually driving it. Somebody else was.

How dare you people accuse me of running over somebody when that's not even what I said?

This is terrible mob mentality.

The question I usta ask is, WHERE'S THE BLOOD?

I've mentioned this case before, but many years ago I had a case involving a 17 year old lesbian who wanted to live with her teacher-lover. Mama said NO FUCKING WAY! And the local GLBT mob went crazy.

The report I got charged mama with running the daughter over with a Cadillac, and charged dad with sexually abusing daughter for like 10 years. The sheriff jumped aboard with plenty of animus but no one had any evidence of anything. No one was charged with anything but the state insisted on filing a civil action against the parents, to terminate parental rights. In Florida the DCF is larded with GLBT activists.

My job was to prepare the petition and shepherd it thru court. As it was political I couldn't derail it, so we went to trial. Actually we didn't go to trial. We went to court. The judge read my petition, looked at the parents and the girl, and dismissed the case. There was nothing. No marks, no bruises, no broken bones, NO BLOOD. The sheriff tagged dad as a drug lord, but dad's entire criminal history was a pot possession charge in 1968. Dad was so disabled he could barely walk to the bathroom much less chase a 17 year old athlete (track).

The whole deal was bullshit, and had mom let Sis live with the teacher mom woulda been exposed to several felonies.

So STFU already.

 

[Recidiva]

You asked what people wanted and I told you. That you already knew that says more about you than it does about "people".

Okay, then speak for yourself. You want me to stop talking. My answer to that is "no" in the sense that if people talk to me on this subject, I will talk back to them.

I can stop talking to you if you wish. But to do that we have to come to some agreement, such as Wings does not want to hear from Recidiva, in which case you put me on ignore. You can also ask me to put you on ignore because my presence offends you, I will do so respectfully.

What I will not do is accept the narrative that I'm doing "harm" to anybody by talking about something on an entirely voluntary thread on a board where you were warned some people might say things you do not personally like.

I think you like me and you would like me to conform, so you can continue to like me conditionally and ignore this and go on as if nothing happened, and if that's the case, that is admirable. If not, I'm reading you wrong. Maybe you should type more than one paragraph to explain a complicated issue.

But I am not necessarily an admirable person, and I've made clear that if you thought I was an Angel, then I am sorry to disappoint you, but I can't imagine how anybody could have thought that. If you think I'm the Devil incarnate, no, I can see how you might think that, but I don't agree.

I'm a human. I talk a lot. Altering that isn't really in the cards.

 

[bg23]

The question I usta ask is, WHERE'S THE BLOOD?

I've mentioned this case before, but many years ago I had a case involving a 17 year old lesbian who wanted to live with her teacher-lover. Mama said NO FUCKING WAY! And the local GLBT mob went crazy.

The report I got charged mama with running the daughter over with a Cadillac, and charged dad with sexually abusing daughter for like 10 years. The sheriff jumped aboard with plenty of animus but no one had any evidence of anything. No one was charged with anything but the state insisted on filing a civil action against the parents, to terminate parental rights. In Florida the DCF is larded with GLBT activists.

My job was to prepare the petition and shepherd it thru court. As it was political I couldn't derail it, so we went to trial. Actually we didn't go to trial. We went to court. The judge read my petition, looked at the parents and the girl, and dismissed the case. There was nothing. No marks, no bruises, no broken bones, NO BLOOD. The sheriff tagged dad as a drug lord, but dad's entire criminal history was a pot possession charge in 1968. Dad was so disabled he could barely walk to the bathroom much less chase a 17 year old athlete (track).

The whole deal was bullshit, and had mom let Sis live with the teacher mom woulda been exposed to several felonies.

So STFU already.

No u.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

No u.

U FIRST

 

[butters]

gross (and potentially very damaging) errors of judgement - fair enough, there's ample room for people to get morally affronted and appalled. my own post further back states how i feel on the issue.

having said that, i find equal room for moral disgust at false accusations i've read here. rapist, pedo, 'fucking a minor' . . . all these charges have been leveled at recidiva. what i find hard to stomach (beyond reci's own very real admissions to what honestly happened) is the righteous indignation of those who choose to believe the mud-slinging of the false accusations.

ok, i'm off this thread now. it's a sorry mess.

 

[bg23]

U FIRST

no u!!

 

[unregistered]

 

[bg23]

gross (and potentially very damaging) errors of judgement - fair enough, there's ample room for people to get morally affronted and appalled. my own post further back states how i feel on the issue.

having said that, i find equal room for moral disgust at false accusations i've read here. rapist, pedo, 'fucking a minor' . . . all these charges have been leveled at recidiva. what i find hard to stomach (beyond reci's own very real admissions to what honestly happened) is the righteous indignation of those who choose to believe the mud-slinging of the false accusations.

ok, i'm off this thread now. it's a sorry mess.

i think people got confused when she said she "fooled around" with him when he was 16 in the front seat of a car.

i know she didn't fuck him. outside the first couple of pages of that misunderstanding which i think was cleared up reasonably quickly people have only been talking about the cybering the 14 year old thing.

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

If this is true................................

Sad.
Criminal.
Pathetic.

As a parent, had any adult, especially an adult well into their twenties, had even touched one of my children, I would ensure your arrest, public humility, family shame, and God willing, your conviction for raping my child.

No way, no how, can you justify this position or your actions. You have no idea whatsoever what impact you have had on this person. You committed a heinous human crime.

You should turn yourself in. Seriously. Had any man raped a 14 year old female, well, of course you know the outcome.

Shame on you and may God help you.

Speaking of false accusations and mud slinging..

 

[Recidiva]

Speaking of false accusations and mud slinging..

I can give him time to catch up or I can write off someone else to play with.

But I'm not starting all over. I do have some work to do and the trash to get out on time.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

If this is true................................

Sad.
Criminal.
Pathetic.

As a parent, had any adult, especially an adult well into their twenties, had even touched one of my children, I would ensure your arrest, public humility, family shame, and God willing, your conviction for raping my child.

No way, no how, can you justify this position or your actions. You have no idea whatsoever what impact you have had on this person. You committed a heinous human crime.

You should turn yourself in. Seriously. Had any man raped a 14 year old female, well, of course you know the outcome.

Shame on you and may God help you.

Liar

When youre faced with it the bear looks a lot worse at your door than it does in the museum.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Is it time to review this matrix again?
http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff502/Soonyigump/matrix_zpsd91cf943.jpg

 

[eyer]

Speaking of false accusations and mud slinging..

Here we go again...

...the pedomates back spin controlling.

And, looky there...

...they got butters in their corner, now.

Hey, butters!

You got a 14-year old daughter I can BDSM role play with online?

 

[HOW_DUMB_R_U]

Is there anything I could say to anybody to make myself seem like a better person that wouldn't be called immediately pandering and crowd pleasing and essentially bullshit?

I think people want me to show remorse, and that's fine.

However, remorse for what? For poor judgment, doing something stupid, being flippant about doing something stupid, breaking site rules? Yes. I admit and have admitted several times to that in many ways. I've learned lessons, but I also learned these lessons about 20 years ago. People looking for a light bulb from me now are missing a critical logical error. This is happening in real time for you guys, it is extraordinarily old news to me.

Remorse for...doing stuff I didn't do that is criminal and life wrecking? No, that I didn't do. It resembles so closely something criminal and life wrecking that I really can't blame anybody for going that way out of internal moral choices they believe to be true. They're consulting their inner compass instead of taking my word for it and I've also done that, right or wrong. It's up to them.

It is of interest to me why people make their choices, and I don't mind being the formaldehyded frog tacked open and having their guts probed, I really don't, and I will do that willingly.

Yes, my attitude is very Alice's Restaurant.

"I'm sittin' here on the Group W bench 'cause you want to know if I'm moral enough to join the Army, burn women, kids, houses and villages after bein' a litterbug?"

You want to know if I'm moral enough to post on Lit? Yeah, I think I am.

Does anybody else want to bare their soul and be the formaldehyded frog? No, not really. And that's okay. But really, although I understand exactly why people are repelled, I also know that it is the smoke and not the fire. You don't, and you do what you want. I don't want to talk to anybody on Lit that doesn't want to talk to me.

If anybody wants a "Reci Please Put Me On Ignore" out here, let me know. I won't respond to you and I will know that I'm simply too low of a human being to post, probably in a thread that has underaged people in it, about Rainbow Skittles poop, with the upright citizens that have done no wrong and see no evil unless it's tacked to a board and admitting it freely.

Kiddie fiddler and your enabler hubby