Help recalling some quote from a bdsm website?

[echoplex]

This is a long shot. Like throwing a football over a mountain and landing it hole-in-one on some golf course, kind of long shot.

But I was surfing around one day looking for some Kink video on the net when I came across some bdsm porn site. Don't remember if it was like a promotional blog, or a gallery, or what. But I don't think it was an original content kinda site. It had the usually kind of generic drivel written near the thumbnails to entice visitors.

Had some sorta quote in the text, not sure if it was the site punchline or what, but I thought it was simple and beautifully put. I won't really attempt to butcher it because that's the problem I don't remember it exactly. Something referring to the girls featured on the site about how they're "not sure" if the girls are either crying for help, or "just crying for more". Something along those lines. Not sure if it was crying or screaming or what. I just know I dug the quote. Now I can't find it. A search for anything similar yields a billion random webpages.

I really... REALLY need to learn that bookmarking is my friend.


Bonus question:

If a girl really does cry during rough treatment, would that indicate that bdsm play is probably not right for her? I don't see how literally breaking down could indicate anything sound or healthy.

 

[knot_sweet]

Bonus question:

If a girl really does cry during rough treatment, would that indicate that bdsm play is probably not right for her? I don't see how literally breaking down could indicate anything sound or healthy.

Some of us get off on pain. Some of us get off on people wanting to hurt us more than the pain itself.

For me, good pain = vulnerable = very affectionate (bad pain = I'm going to fucking beat you unconscious and you'd better pray I stop). Some dominants like it when they can make their sub go gooey.

So yeah, if I haven't safed, tears and flinching or not, it's ok to keep going.

You can generally apply the safe word principal to any even slightly experienced BDSM participant.

ETA there are some cases where pain will make people fall into sub space and sometimes those people forget about safe words. In those cases, it's up to the dominant to recognise and monitor the situation, or for the pair to have pre-arranged limits.

 

[echoplex]

So yeah, if I haven't safed, tears and flinching or not, it's ok to keep going

That's the part I can't get around. To me it seems like anyone brought to tears either doesn't know or recognize their own limits any better than their dominant figure. If they're literally breaking into an uncontrollable sob it's because the subconscious knows it's something they do not want and are not enjoying, while on the surface stubbornly fronting the opposite.

You may continue verbally giving consent, but your emotional brain is already "safed" a long time ago. I'd think someone who truly "enjoys pain" and enjoys being hurt, would not ever cry or breakdown in the face of abysmal treatment.

 

[knot_sweet]

That's the part I can't get around. To me it seems like anyone brought to tears either doesn't know or recognize their own limits any better than their dominant figure. If they're literally breaking into an uncontrollable sob it's because the subconscious knows it's something they do not want and are not enjoying, while on the surface stubbornly fronting the opposite.

You may continue verbally giving consent, but your emotional brain is already "safed" a long time ago. I'd think someone who truly "enjoys pain" and enjoys being hurt, would not ever cry or breakdown in the face of abysmal treatment.

Your opinion is entirely valid for yourself. That's how you roll, and that's cool for you.

But it's not valid for me, or for a lot of other people either. Sometimes, if my dominant needs me to feel pain, I will hurt for that person and it will give me emotional pleasure to do so. I don't necessarily enjoy the pain for it's own sake, I'm not a masochist. I enjoy that the person inflicting the pain is having their needs met. It's a fine line, and one I don't expect you to understand.

There are some kinds of pain I find arousing, almost orgasmic, although it will still bring tears to my eyes. The pain and pleasure centres of the brain are wired in funny ways sometimes and "Oh my good that hurt so good, do it again" is also something I don't expect you to understand if the whole pain thing doesn't turn you on.

It's ok if it doesn't do anything for you. There are a lot of people involved in BDSM who never play with pain and are completely turned off by it. Different strokes for different folks.

You are welcome to discuss your ideas and thoughts, ask for clarification or dismiss the whole thing as something you will never understand.

But please don't try to tell me I'm broken, or allowing myself to be broken by others just because what works for me doesn't work for you.

 

[wicked woman]

That's the part I can't get around. To me it seems like anyone brought to tears either doesn't know or recognize their own limits any better than their dominant figure. If they're literally breaking into an uncontrollable sob it's because the subconscious knows it's something they do not want and are not enjoying, while on the surface stubbornly fronting the opposite.

You may continue verbally giving consent, but your emotional brain is already "safed" a long time ago. I'd think someone who truly "enjoys pain" and enjoys being hurt, would not ever cry or breakdown in the face of abysmal treatment.

Clearly you've never cried tears of joy or relief or when you're overcome with emotion (not necessarily negative). Your definition of crying is negative. Might be true for you but that's where you're falling down in your logic. Crying doesn't always mean something negative.

 

[Scrubber]

Clearly you've never cried tears of joy or relief or when you're overcome with emotion (not necessarily negative). Your definition of crying is negative. Might be true for you but that's where you're falling down in your logic. Crying doesn't always mean something negative.

Agreed. I sometimes cry when about to orgasm, and during it.

 

[ecstaticsub]

I've copied the below from a writing on my profile on Fetlife. It includes a quote from "The Story of O" and it's one way I view tears and submission

From the Story Of O by Pauline Reage:

"...the fact is," said the other voice,"that if you do tie her up, or whip her a little, and if she begins to like it--then that's no good either. We've got to move beyond the pleasure stage. We must make her tears flow"

In some ways this is what submission means to me.

I am not a submissive because it is fun, because sex got boring and I wanted a little excitement, because I thought being tied up with rope was pretty or sexy. Nor did I become a submissive because I wanted to get spanked, or whipped. I'm not a pain slut.

I also am not a submissive because I have a naturally submissive personality. True, I have a natural tendency to be non-confrontational and to please the people I love. But that is a far cry from being submissive. I am strong willed. I am a smart confident woman who knows what I want and am willing to follow those wants with action.

So if all that is not why I am a submissive, why am I? Like many I have had dark fantasies for as long as I could remember. But as fantasies they were under my control. I was safe in my deviance. Then I met someone who has what it takes to not only "tie me up and whip me a little" but to move beyond the pleasure stage, to make my tears flow. Not necessarily in a literal sense but more in a emotional/mental sense. It is the ache, the internal craving for this vulnerable state that keeps me obedient, submissive to Him.

It is also what keeps me an ecstatic sub.

 

[echoplex]

Clearly you've never cried tears of joy or relief or when you're overcome with emotion (not necessarily negative). Your definition of crying is negative. Might be true for you but that's where you're falling down in your logic. Crying doesn't always mean something negative.

I think it might. People who are fragile in their emotions cry in inappropriate situations. It's believed that crying preceding a positive emotion is indicative to high levels of built up stress before the positive affirmation, the tears are the release of that bodily distress. So in a way, your body essentially does the same thing whether you feel happy, or sad, you cry for relief.

 

[echoplex]

Your opinion is entirely valid for yourself. That's how you roll, and that's cool for you.

But it's not valid for me, or for a lot of other people either. Sometimes, if my dominant needs me to feel pain, I will hurt for that person and it will give me emotional pleasure to do so. I don't necessarily enjoy the pain for it's own sake, I'm not a masochist. I enjoy that the person inflicting the pain is having their needs met. It's a fine line, and one I don't expect you to understand.

There are some kinds of pain I find arousing, almost orgasmic, although it will still bring tears to my eyes. The pain and pleasure centres of the brain are wired in funny ways sometimes and "Oh my good that hurt so good, do it again" is also something I don't expect you to understand if the whole pain thing doesn't turn you on.

It's ok if it doesn't do anything for you. There are a lot of people involved in BDSM who never play with pain and are completely turned off by it. Different strokes for different folks.

You are welcome to discuss your ideas and thoughts, ask for clarification or dismiss the whole thing as something you will never understand.

But please don't try to tell me I'm broken, or allowing myself to be broken by others just because what works for me doesn't work for you.

Like a vase that's taken a spill off of the ole' china. Besides it still makes you a masochist if you enjoy taking pain just to please a dominant.

I'm not condemning you, or anyone really. Just my view based on pieces of the puzzle that do not fit for me, and I don't just force pieces in where they don't fit well. "That's just the way it is" is not answer I ever accept, especially on topics like this. I don't think the brain is funny, I think brain is very rational, it's very black and white. Grey area is something we substitute for the truth.

Another story for another time I suppose.

 

[Desiremakesmeweak]

Sneezing, ejaculation/cumming, crying - all have to do with autonomic neurochemistry signals. Even an aspect of peeing does - a lot of little children initially find some difficulty in 'deliberately' pissing outside of an absorbing material and into the free space of a toilet!

It's not really that some masochists have the brain signal wiring crossed between autonomic convulsive actions that mimic cumming and those that are usually to do with crying. It's that in fact the arousal thresholds are the same in those people for anything to do with the autonomic systems. And these individuals will likely in the normal run of events also have extremely HIGH arousal thresholds compared to others. Unlike some people who have high thresholds for say, normal anxiety factors, but can orgasm and be sexually aroused rather normally, masochists have UNIFORM threshold levels for ALL fright/flight mechanisms.

Thus, it's not really fair to think that crying (as in the case of 'being broken') is the same as some actually DAMAGED state or thing in the case of those masochists who can accept these levels of arousal, or even SEEK such levels... In fact some masochists have even trained themselves to graduate their arousal levels over time upwards to where they now require to be 'broken.' And some are just naturally set at high combinatory sensatory arousal levels.

So I think we must make the distinction between 'damaged' and 'threshold broken.' Which is what I believe the word 'broken' in this case refers to.

 

[Stella_Omega]

If YOU don't like the idea of being stimulated until YOU cry-- if that seems wrong for you-- than make sure you've added that to your limits list.

However, never make the mistake of assuming how YOU feel is universal. Not around this forum, anyway.

Personally, I really appreciate being 'made' (or helped, more accurately) to cry, because it's such a release for me. I can cry easily when I am angry and upset, and I don't like that-- it's taken me decades to understand that crying is common and not unmanly, and may take me another decade to internalise that understanding completely.

On the other hand a lot of things that "Should" make me cry-- I don't. So being caned until I can let myself break down allows me to cry without feeling ashamed of myself.

I think brain is very rational, it's very black and white. Grey area is something we substitute for the truth.

Swear to me that you won't be practising brain surgery any time soon.

 

[Curious_in_Cali]

I think crying is a terribly beautiful release in all of its forms and occasions, and sometimes, in the right company, can be incredibly hawt.

As a side, am I the only one wondering why there isn't a dacryphiliac friendly pic thread around here?

 

[Bramblethorn]

That's the part I can't get around. To me it seems like anyone brought to tears either doesn't know or recognize their own limits any better than their dominant figure. If they're literally breaking into an uncontrollable sob it's because the subconscious knows it's something they do not want and are not enjoying, while on the surface stubbornly fronting the opposite.

You know what makes me cry most often? Stories about people being good to one another. I can read about horrible things in dry-eyed sorrow (usually) but tell me about a conservative grandma who embraces her gay grandkid and the tears start rolling down the face.

We teach small children that there's a thing called "sadness", being sad is bad, and tears are coupled to "sadness". But brains and emotions are far more complex than that. Just because it suits us to talk about "happy" and "sad" as simple opposing concepts doesn't mean they really function that way.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I think crying is a terribly beautiful release in all of its forms and occasions, and sometimes, in the right company, can be incredibly hawt.

As a side, am I the only one wondering why there isn't a dacryphiliac friendly pic thread around here?

There is this;
http://hotboyscrying.tumblr.com/

 

[Netzach]

Uhhh catharsis?


It's really not that complicated. Man, it's one thing to be black and white about stuff, but that's hardly a subtlety.

 

[desertslave]

Uhhh catharsis?


It's really not that complicated. Man, it's one thing to be black and white about stuff, but that's hardly a subtlety.

This! Sometimes I get so bottled up with so many things and just can't sort it out, find my calm place again, without help. That's when Master steps in, works me over with pleasure and pain until I can't tell the difference any more, and makes something in me magically "pop." He breaks me apart and puts me back together, and it always ends me up in tears....tears he enjoys and tears that I treasure. It's my very precious reset button.

 

[seven_of_nine]

I hardly ever cry. When I do, it's when I'm being subjected to a powerful mix of verbal humiliation and physical pain, from someone I trust with my body and my head. Sexual arousal isn't even really a factor a lot of the time. The tears are cathartic, as is every scream and sob when I'm being fucked roughly. My past has left me very closed off emotionally and kink can sometimes allow me to tap into the lost little girl I've shut the door on. I'll probably wind up in a padded cell one day but for now, kink gives me the outlet I need in order to be able to function day to day.

Except right now... because I'm newly single. Shit happens.

 

[echoplex]

If YOU don't like the idea of being stimulated until YOU cry-- if that seems wrong for you-- than make sure you've added that to your limits list.

However, never make the mistake of assuming how YOU feel is universal. Not around this forum, anyway.

Personally, I really appreciate being 'made' (or helped, more accurately) to cry, because it's such a release for me. I can cry easily when I am angry and upset, and I don't like that-- it's taken me decades to understand that crying is common and not unmanly, and may take me another decade to internalise that understanding completely.

On the other hand a lot of things that "Should" make me cry-- I don't. So being caned until I can let myself break down allows me to cry without feeling ashamed of myself.

Swear to me that you won't be practising brain surgery any time soon.

I'll practise on your brain any time Stella, just lemme know.

Aren't you assuming something here yourself? Like assuming that it would even be possible I could be "stimulated until I cry"?

 

[echoplex]

This! Sometimes I get so bottled up with so many things and just can't sort it out, find my calm place again, without help. That's when Master steps in, works me over with pleasure and pain until I can't tell the difference any more, and makes something in me magically "pop." He breaks me apart and puts me back together, and it always ends me up in tears....tears he enjoys and tears that I treasure. It's my very precious reset button.

I hardly ever cry. When I do, it's when I'm being subjected to a powerful mix of verbal humiliation and physical pain, from someone I trust with my body and my head. Sexual arousal isn't even really a factor a lot of the time. The tears are cathartic, as is every scream and sob when I'm being fucked roughly. My past has left me very closed off emotionally and kink can sometimes allow me to tap into the lost little girl I've shut the door on. I'll probably wind up in a padded cell one day but for now, kink gives me the outlet I need in order to be able to function day to day.

Except right now... because I'm newly single. Shit happens.

At least a few people are admitting it has to do with their emotional fragility. Good for you guys, err... gals.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I'll practise on your brain any time Stella, just lemme know.

No means no, mister black-and-white.

Aren't you assuming something here yourself? Like assuming that it would even be possible I could be "stimulated until I cry"?

"IF" is a conditional conjunction.

 

[Netzach]

Isn't "the subconscious" more or less agreed to be horse dookie since the seventies anyway? I mean it's kind of neat, but analytically kind of crap. If you want black and white, I call bullshit and won't take it seriously as an argument. Additionally, claims of never crying or "it's soooo hard for me to" by people who have full ocular/tearduct function, I also dispense with with a shrug of "ok, you're badass, whatever."

I guess the ancient greek theater was for the emotionally fragile. It's where the entire idea of catharsis comes from - creating an emotional experience outside of the high stakes of reality. IE consensual mayhem rather than non-con violent encounter.

Additionally - some people cry really really EASILY. Like, at anything. It's not that there's some deep defect, it's their way of blowing off the steam that other people do stupider shit to relieve, like drinking, swearing, or being dickweeds on message boards.

So saying that them crying is indicative of some kind of major breakdown or trauma, is pretty silly, no? If you were to poll all these girls on porn sites, you'd find a pretty lengthy mix of reasons for the crying, and the top of the list might be "acting."

 

[dexwebster]

If a girl really does cry during rough treatment, would that indicate that bdsm play is probably not right for her? I don't see how literally breaking down could indicate anything sound or healthy.

Sometimes I want to cry. More to the point, sometimes I want intense sensations that I know will make me cry; the crying itself is incidental. I don't really care if my subconscious thinks there's something wrong or not. I'm bigger than it is and what I say goes.

Asking if something is healthy is a slippery slope. Some people would argue that anyone who would voluntarily subject themselves to any kind of BDSM is doing something unhealthy.

Oh, and I am one of those people who cries easily as a rule. I don't do it in public much, but in private or around my partner, all the time. My impulse regarding a lot of strong emotions is either that or physical violence, and I learned by example as a kid that one of them causes a lot less damage, both to property and other people, so that's the one I stick with.

 

[blulilacgrl]

Like a vase that's taken a spill off of the ole' china. Besides it still makes you a masochist if you enjoy taking pain just to please a dominant.

I'm not condemning you, or anyone really. Just my view based on pieces of the puzzle that do not fit for me, and I don't just force pieces in where they don't fit well. "That's just the way it is" is not answer I ever accept, especially on topics like this. I don't think the brain is funny, I think brain is very rational, it's very black and white. Grey area is something we substitute for the truth.

Another story for another time I suppose.

I just want to point out that the brain is in no way rational. It is frequently confused and easily tricked. It is fragile and there is never any way to tell how it will be affected by trauma. It is in no way black and white, but instead it is grey matter.

 

[echoplex]

I just want to point out that the brain is in no way rational. It is frequently confused and easily tricked. It is fragile and there is never any way to tell how it will be affected by trauma. It is in no way black and white, but instead it is grey matter.

Just because that happens doesn't mean our brains aren't perfect. Modern science now tells us that our brains are much more powerful and infinitely more complex than they appear to be. Literally every second of your life is stored somewhere in your brain. The memory is not gone, it's there, you just cannot access it. Some people remember every single day of their lives. How magnificent is such a curse as that?

The fact is a brain is like a perfect masterpiece, we still don't know how it works, and don't know at this point how to utilize it's capabilities. I believe everything it does, it does for a reason, even if we cannot bring what it's doing to consciousness.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Just because that happens doesn't mean our brains aren't perfect. Modern science now tells us that our brains are much more powerful and infinitely more complex than they appear to be. Literally every second of your life is stored somewhere in your brain. The memory is not gone, it's there, you just cannot access it. Some people remember every single day of their lives. How magnificent is such a curse as that?

Got a citation for that? Because I've seen research that suggests that we jettison memories to make room for newer ones. Hypotheses are not facts.

The fact is a brain is like a perfect masterpiece, we still don't know how it works, and don't know at this point how to utilize it's capabilities. I believe everything it does, it does for a reason, even if we cannot bring what it's doing to consciousness.

Actually, we know quite a lot about how it works, and-- more importantly-- we are capable of learning even more.

We know that the brain has an anatomy, and that anatomy can vary pretty widely between individuals, just like every other bodypart can. We know that some brains, in fact are terribly faulty and don't do what they should, which in human terms would include rational thinking, emotions good and bad, communication, and empathy. We do NOT know that the brain does everything "for a reason. " Reasons are a product of human sentience, which is overlaid onto the physical structure of the brain.

it's best to refrain from saying "I believe" in the same breath which with you invoke "science." It's not a religion. There is NO SUCH THING as a "Modern science" that "tells us" anything with so much finality. Science is a process,not a product. Science is the method we use to explore our universe with the intent of understanding it better than we did.
Although plenty of scientists do fall in love with some pet theory of theirs and defend it long after it's become indefensible-- science on the whole is a pretty decent tool for learning.