I have access to firearms

[islandman]

Don't try, you can't. It's a concept developed by better men.

Sanctimonious bullshit. You change your spots as it suits your needs.

You're the same in R/L as what we see here. Don't go pretending otherwise.

 

[PoppingTom]

Don't try, you can't. It's a concept developed by better men.

That's how the German nazis thought about themselves. Better men.

 

[Exquisition]

Have not been to speak to the police at a station...no. I have taken a course offered by the police, yes. My husband was a gun enthusiast. He taught me how to break down a gun, clean it, put it back together and store it. He owned many different guns at different times. I didn't particularly like those that he had. I have gone to a shooting range and shot some.

So the answer to the above was yes and no.

If your husband was an enthusiast I'm sure a little of his knowledge rubbed off on you so why you asking strangers for advice?

 

[Exquisition]

In your country maybe, here our rights are inalienable. Not granted by society or by government. The Second Amendment's own words suggest the right to keep and bear arms predates the Constitution itself.

Hang on. Your Constitution is a product of society. You make no sense whatsoever.

 

[unregistered]

 

[unregistered]

 

[julybaby04]

If your husband was an enthusiast I'm sure a little of his knowledge rubbed off on you so why you asking strangers for advice?

He wanted me to know how to handle a gun safely. If he were here, I would ask him for his advice.

 

[Exquisition]

Read the Declaration. Then read the Second Amendment, it says, "the right of the people...," which clearly means the right already exists and should not be infringed. The language doesn't say the people should have the right, but that it already exists and that it shall not be infringed by the main body of the new Constitution. Being British you are genetically predisposed to not understanding the right, George didn't understand it either.

The people clearly suggests the specific identifier of a group, which clearly refers to a society.

And being British we have the oldest rights enshrined in the Magna Carta drawn up in 1215. Dude, when it comes to democracy and rights you really dont want to go there in a nationalistic vein.

 

[Exquisition]

He wanted me to know how to handle a gun safely. If he were here, I would ask him for his advice.

And in all the time you knew him you never picked up any of his knowledge with him being such an enthusiast?

 

[julybaby04]

And in all the time you knew him you never picked up any of his knowledge with him being such an enthusiast?

Nope. Didn't really care to. It was an interest for him...not my interest.

 

[PoppingTom]

Read the Declaration. Then read the Second Amendment, it says, "the right of the people...," which clearly means the right already exists and should not be infringed. The language doesn't say the people should have the right, but that it already exists and that it shall not be infringed by the main body of the new Constitution. Being British you are genetically predisposed to not understanding the right, George didn't understand it either.

Understand what?

Any right is made, given and can be taken by the society. Not by God.


That's a fact you ignore. We understand that.

 

[PoppingTom]

Our men were better than theirs too.

You're not convincing.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Any right is made, given and can be taken by the society.

That premise holds no validity in our society nor legal system....we believe our rights to be inherent and inalienable.

 

[Exquisition]

Understand what?

Any right is made, given and can be taken by the society. Not by God.


That's a fact you ignore. We understand that.

He's just not getting it Pop.

He seems to be suggesting that the Right To Bear Arms pre-existed before they were even there.

It's an interesting philosophical debate though. Did 'man' have a right to bear arms before arms were invented?

Like even in Biblical times we had that right we were just waiting for man to invent guns.

 

[BotanyBoy]

He's just not getting it Pop.

He seems to be suggesting that the Right To Bear Arms pre-existed before they were even there.

It's an interesting philosophical debate though. Did 'man' have a right to bear arms before arms were invented?

http://fitfemaleforty.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/paleo-man-and-spear.jpg

See what's in his hand? We have proof of this....

Like even in Biblical times we had that right we were just waiting for man to invent guns.

Are sling shots, bow and arrow, sword and shield not armaments? Or are you just completely brain damaged?

 

[Exquisition]

http://fitfemaleforty.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/paleo-man-and-spear.jpg

See what's in his hand? We have proof of this....



Are sling shots, bow and arrow, sword and shield not armaments? Or are you just completely brain damaged?

So what do you need guns for if a spear is just as good at enabling you to exercise your rights?

 

[unregistered]

 

[PoppingTom]

He's just not getting it Pop.

He seems to be suggesting that the Right To Bear Arms pre-existed before they were even there.

It's an interesting philosophical debate though. Did 'man' have a right to bear arms before arms were invented?

This answer can easily be answered - if we know what "right" means.

Our gun nuts may be dying for their "right" . Their fault. Like it's everybody's fault if he dies of "the right to piss on the law and society and do what I want". There's no difference.

To me, right is given by society. It only makes sense in this context. You can rely on it like everybody in the society, because it's given by them.

Whoever makes his own "right", needs the power to prevail it to everybody.

 

[Exquisition]

This answer can easily be answered - if we know what "right" means.

Our gun nuts may be dying for their "right" . Their fault. Like it's everybody's fault if he dies of "the right to piss on the law and society and do what I want". There's no difference.

To me, right is given by society. It only makes sense in this context. You can rely on it like everybody in the society, because it's given by them.

Whoever makes his own "right", needs the power to prevail it to everybody.

Agreed.

The right as enshrined by the individual is surely anarchy?

 

[islandman]

http://fitfemaleforty.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/paleo-man-and-spear.jpg

See what's in his hand? We have proof of this....

Your silly point aside, you should understand that that's not an actual a pic of Neanderthal man holding a spear.

 

[PoppingTom]

Agreed.

The right as enshrined by the individual is surely anarchy?

Kind of. But anarchy can be a right, too, if society gives that right.

Some people here calling "a right" what means "a demand to society".

 

[Byron In Exile]

Understand what?

Any right is made, given and can be taken by the society. Not by God.

That's a fact you ignore. We understand that.

No you do not understand.

Human rights are inherent, not granted by men.

The laws men make do not affect them.

 

[Byron In Exile]

To me, right is given by society.

And that is where you err.

You're talking of laws, not rights.

Or perhaps you equate them.

Nothing could be more wrong.

 

[Byron In Exile]

Kind of. But anarchy can be a right, too, if society gives that right.

Some people here calling "a right" what means "a demand to society".

Society does not grant rights.

What you mean is "permission."

Rights are inherent. Permission is what authority grants.

 

[islandman]

Society does not grant rights.

What you mean is "permission."

Rights are inherent. Permission is what authority grants.

If rights are inherent, then anything can become one so long as an individual can claim and defend it.

And since we're talking about guns, this becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.