the marks of a slave

[eastern sun]

I wish it was actually that easy to convince him of my worthiness.

He left the house without telling me. I was not invited.

 

[Aurelia_Malys]

And then a moment of grace -

With kids in the house from a sleepover last night, I take bagel orders before I leave for the corner store. He calls out, "Can you get me a cup of coffee." I ask, "Black? Small?" - knowing the answers, but just making sure I get it right.

When I return, he opens the bag of bagels and asks, "where's the plain?" I'm confused, instantly aware that I didn't get a plain bagel; and my opportunity for reprieve is lost.

I start to say - "Did you ask for one?" - and then switch . . . "There isn't one. I'll go back." And whatever the reason for my mistake - whether he ever voiced his wishes or not - no longer matters.

I return with a plain bagel, having gone to two stores because the first one was sold out - and I could not settle.

He is happy. And my skin suddenly fits more comfortably.

I enjoy reading your thread and my master and I have often discussed issues you raise. I was just wondering ... did you ask your husband if he wanted a bagel when you took orders?

I hope things improve for you! ((HUGS))

 

[eastern sun]

I enjoy reading your thread and my master and I have often discussed issues you raise. I was just wondering ... did you ask your husband if he wanted a bagel when you took orders?

I hope things improve for you! ((HUGS))

Thanks. No, I did not ask him directly. He called out to me from another room while I was calling out to the girls in the basement. None of us were in the same room, and everyone was yelling simultaneously from different parts of the house. It doesn't wholly surprise me that I screwed up in those circumstances.

It seems obvious that a calmer more conscientious approach to such a simple task would yield better results. I was rushing things, prioritizing food for the kids, and that is exactly the moment when I'm likely to mis-step.

As an observer to the situation, it's really clear to me how I should change my behavior. So why don't I "do the right thing" when I'm in the middle of my life?

 

[Aurelia_Malys]

Well, that is one of the things I admire about you and enjoy about your thread - your introspection.

I can only speak from my own experiences about how I end up in circumstances like your bagel/coffee situation. I tend to speed through life. I have a habit of rushing through things and I know I need to slow down, take a breath and then think about what I need to do. I was so bad about it that I actually got a tattoo saying "Breathe" on the inside of my wrist as a reminder to slow down and be thoughtful before acting.

 

[Red Sonja]

As an observer to the situation, it's really clear to me how I should change my behavior. So why don't I "do the right thing" when I'm in the middle of my life?

Boy, do I resemble that remark... I think of it as a knowing-doing gap. I know what to do, but doing it is somehow a struggle. I can only think that in some way there is a pay-off for not changing, or that I was getting a pay-off before hand.

I would try to think what that pay-off is... and then eliminate it as a pay-off. I'm definitely working on figuring out some of mine. Lately, I keep thinking that I have more information than ddh does on *insert topic here* so instead of simply obeying, I attempt to educate him. It's not going over well.

I'm definitely keeping you in my thoughts...

 

[eastern sun]

I would try to think what that pay-off is... and then eliminate it as a pay-off.

I gotta think about this . . . .

 

[eastern sun]

The question I keep asking myself is . . . Do I have to sacrifice my slavery to achieve my career goals? or, do I have to modify my goals in order to maintain my slavery?

and the most daunting question of all . . . within the context of slavery, do I have to allow him to define my career goals when my goals potentially conflict with his?

He has had tremendous influence over my work career in the 28 years we have lived together. This current project is the first truly independent work I have ever taken on; it is solely my own creation.

There are many creative types who would willingly put their artistic self-expression before everything else. I can understand why.

But, I have never chosen to live that way. I want to believe that it is possible for me to pursue my own interests and still be the slave he enjoys and relies upon.

 

[Aurelia_Malys]

What does he say? In his mind is it going to be a choice of slavery vs career goals?

 

[Keroin]

The question I keep asking myself is . . . Do I have to sacrifice my slavery to achieve my career goals? or, do I have to modify my goals in order to maintain my slavery?

Well, I'm dead curious to see how this unfolds.

My situation/relationship structure is completely different than yours, ES, so I won't bother offering advice or anything close to it.

I can say that, with my own projects, if I had let L direct them the way he thought best, (he is very vocal about his opinions), the result would have been a disaster and I would have been heartbroken and discouraged. I've had to really stand my ground at times, especially when the issue in question was one for which I had no tangible "proof" that my way was the right way. I've just learned that I have excellent instincts in certain areas. He has excellent instincts in others. They don't always cross over, to say the least. There's no way I could have been in a M/s relationship and successfully done what I've done. Just me, though.

Having said that, I have chosen to give up one of the big arts projects when the current season is over. I loved it and I know I did a lot of good for a lot of people but I need to have time for hubs again. So I'm not a completely selfish artist. (Just mostly selfish).

 

[eastern sun]

What does he say? In his mind is it going to be a choice of slavery vs career goals?

He doesn't think it's a choice of one vs. the other. The problem is not that I am overly attached to my career goals, it's that I'm "protecting" everything.

It's true. I've run into this problem before, when my self-defenses kick-in and I "instinctively" fight him off before I have even processed what's going on. I've done it during sex. I've done it during play. I've done it with regard to the kids (though then I think I'm protecting them). And I've done it in regard to these work projects, even when I know his input is valuable.

It makes me think of KC's recent thread, in which she describes how her reaction to bondage changed. What used to give her pleasure became traumatic and frightening.

I read another slave writing about a similar reaction to her set of protocols, the ritual gestures that she has adopted with respect to her master. After awhile, every time she took her position, she'd feel overcome with anxiety and fear.

Maybe there's something similar going on. Does anyone recognize this psychological event in slaves?

It feels like part of my animal nature when it happens. Frightened. Territorial. Aggressive.

 

[Netzach]

I realize I do not dwell in the land of subtlety.

I don't give a red velvet rat's patoot about the state of the bagel. I'm easy.

I DO have a frat paddle for childish behavior, as it arises. Recalcitrant about the gym? Spank. Mouthed back? Spank.

I used to be violently opposed to this. Now I like it so much, I'm considering the benefits of a non power based spanko idea, where The Rules are the Master of us both...hm.

People change in weird ways. I think that's my input. Also, do you think you are creating complexity as a way to control things where there might not be so much? Like: work at work, pay attention at home.

Don't I know how hard this is, when home is work is home.

 

[eastern sun]

do you think you are creating complexity as a way to control things where there might not be so much? Like: work at work, pay attention at home.

Yes, that's what I was thinking too. My ego-brain is willing to set up labyrinths around the simple truth - and I run them like a rat looking for the answer to the universe. (a rat with a red velvet ass, btw - I laughed at that image)

The fact that I'm creating the business does make it a little more difficult to set boundaries, but hardly impossible. That's where my focus will be in the coming weeks.

I'm also a fan of the paddle, spank or slap for bad behavior. I like it a lot more than this kind of behavioral angst - which he resorts to when he's fed up with me, and doesn't want to be bothered with more engaged corrective measures.

 

[Keroin]

LOL, every time I think I’ll jump in and interact on this thread I walk away with an “epic fail” feeling. I should know by now where I do and do not fit in. I’ll leave this to those who understand.

Best wishes, as always, ES.

 

[eastern sun]

LOL, every time I think I’ll jump in and interact on this thread I walk away with an “epic fail” feeling. I should know by now where I do and do not fit in. I’ll leave this to those who understand.

Best wishes, as always, ES.

Oh, Keroin! Please don't go. There's short-term and long-term issues here; and your perspective is more valuable than you think.

As of last night, I have been accepted back as slave, due to a quick and utter turn-around in my behavior. But in the last few days, with this storm shutting down our city, it hasn't been so hard to demonstrate my commitment.

As the city gets back on its feet, and we all go back to work, I am going to have to figure out how to balance my slavery and my career - either by compartmentalizing my work or allowing him to define my goals. The challenge has just begun.

P.S. I feel the same "fail" over in the cafe, by the way. That's why I hang out over here.

 

[Red Sonja]

Oh, Keroin! Please don't go. There's short-term and long-term issues here; and your perspective is more valuable than you think.

As of last night, I have been accepted back as slave, due to a quick and utter turn-around in my behavior. But in the last few days, with this storm shutting down our city, it hasn't been so hard to demonstrate my commitment.

As the city gets back on its feet, and we all go back to work, I am going to have to figure out how to balance my slavery and my career - either by compartmentalizing my work or allowing him to define my goals. The challenge has just begun.

P.S. I feel the same "fail" over in the cafe, by the way. That's why I hang out over here.

I'm so glad, Eastern Sun! I'm very happy for you. I'm sure you will figure this out, and yes, it is a challenge. One, in my personal experience, that doesn't seem to have an end point in sight. There's always something that changes in a relationship dynamic in one way or another.

Balance isn't something that is simply achieved and allowed to be static. It's an ongoing process.

 

[eastern sun]

The first crack in the foundation of my obedience is caused by jealousy, one of my greater character flaws. And it's petty.

He wakes me up in the middle of the night to sounds that don't include me; and all I want is to be included. There's no one in our bed but us; he wants to be left alone with his fantasies; and I can't let it go.

If I felt more confident . . . if I didn't feel so isolated . . . I try to honor his wishes, give him his privacy, remain calm, untouched, unmoved, but the jealousy burns like sizzling flesh on a fire I am convinced I didn't light. And I say the thing he has asked me not to say.

This time, it's petty. It's nothing. He even made a joke about it afterwards. But I am struck by the force of that feeling.

I used to let that fire ignite me, and I'd incinerate whoever was near. But every time I sit still in the midst of that jealousy now, refraining from action, from commentary, from narrative, the heat diminishes. And I wonder, in time, if I'll be able to sit in that fire without moving at all. Without trying to run away. Or douse it with tears.

It's petty. But these little cracks in the foundation have to be monitored.

Obedience only means one thing.

 

[eastern sun]

I've mended the crack, by fixing a long-standing problem with our tv and choosing a movie he liked.

I usually dread choosing movies, because when I'm given the choice my mind flies to movies he would never choose himself. Well before our kids were born, I took myself to "The Little Mermaid" and cried and cried at Ariel's plight. And now that my youngest is entering high school, I can't find anyone to go to "Brave" or "Moonrise Kingdom" with me.

If I'm focussed, though, it isn't hard to figure out something we would both enjoy. It's funny how much concentration it takes, though. And the right frame of mind.

 

[intothewoods]

Curious about what you said about your creative work and his past control over it.

That might reveal my true nature because I don't think I've ever had someone else control my creative work. I suppose that just happened. I definitely have had a lot of guidance and input from others of course, but I've never had anyone direct my creative work globally.

 

[sexymom]

In going through the older posts on this thread, one thing strikes me over and over. There are many things we do (or don't do) which we classify as master/slave, or D/s; which many other people don't see in that light. Choosing a seat in a restaurant is one. My husband knows I don't like to sit facing a wall, so he never puts me in that position. It has nothing to do with m/s; in his case it's a very male thing - or maybe a southern male thing: a man is judged by how well he takes care of his woman. I think it's neat how some guys can delegate on whatever issues they wish, and still be very dominant.

 

[DamianCain]

If I'm focussed, though, it isn't hard to figure out something we would both enjoy. The right frame of mind.

.....

 

[Netzach]

Curious about what you said about your creative work and his past control over it.

That might reveal my true nature because I don't think I've ever had someone else control my creative work. I suppose that just happened. I definitely have had a lot of guidance and input from others of course, but I've never had anyone direct my creative work globally.

I'm trying to decide how I would feel about a hire who was dancing to the tune of their spouse and I can't come up with anything good.

If it makes them happier I guess that's good but I sure the hell do NOT want to have ANY insight into that. If I'm writing a check, I'm putting a name on it for a reason.

 

[eastern sun]

Originally Posted by eastern sun
If I'm focussed, though, it isn't hard to figure out something we would both enjoy. . . . The right frame of mind.

Yeah. I get it.

 

[eastern sun]

In going through the older posts on this thread, one thing strikes me over and over. There are many things we do (or don't do) which we classify as master/slave, or D/s; which many other people don't see in that light. Choosing a seat in a restaurant is one. My husband knows I don't like to sit facing a wall, so he never puts me in that position. It has nothing to do with m/s; in his case it's a very male thing - or maybe a southern male thing: a man is judged by how well he takes care of his woman. I think it's neat how some guys can delegate on whatever issues they wish, and still be very dominant.

You're right. It's one of the reasons I started writing this thread. There are a whole lot of behaviors that look pretty mundane from any outside perspective, but have much deeper significance within the context of our relationship.

Once in a while, more overt behaviors - like playful hits and slaps - or brash verbal admonishments - draw people's attention when we're out in the neighborhood, but it's still well within the range of "normal" behavior.

If he's really serious, the corrective measures will be virtually invisible to anyone other than me.

(One of my favorites was when he discovered he could step on my foot to make me shut up in a social situation. It hurt, and I was immediately responsive; but no one standing next to us had any indication that anything out of the ordinary had taken place at all.)

 

[intothewoods]

I'm trying to decide how I would feel about a hire who was dancing to the tune of their spouse and I can't come up with anything good.

If it makes them happier I guess that's good but I sure the hell do NOT want to have ANY insight into that. If I'm writing a check, I'm putting a name on it for a reason.

Well, I can see where someone maybe fell in love with their mentor and then had that kind of relationship -- where creativity and love intertwined. I just never had anyone like that.

 

[eastern sun]

Curious about what you said about your creative work and his past control over it.
I definitely have had a lot of guidance and input from others of course, but I've never had anyone direct my creative work globally.

I'm trying to decide how I would feel about a hire who was dancing to the tune of their spouse and I can't come up with anything good.

So, running the risk of too much information, I'll just explain that we met at work about 28 years ago, and he was in charge of training me. So from the very first days we knew each other, he has been involved in "how" I do what I do.

In fact, my first major project as a young woman was a wedding gift he gave to me (i.e. he booked a program that only I would be able to direct).

When we moved to NYC, I did not take jobs that he did not approve of (one of which would have probably launched an independent career for me, and which he readily admits made him feel insecure at the time).

In the business we created together, he was Artistic Director, and I was Executive Director. He was the idea man, I handled logistics.

At one point right before our children were born (coinciding with my trip to "The Little Mermaid" and the depth of my identification with a heroine who had given up her voice for the love of her prince), I decided that I needed to find out what my own creative vision was.

Within a couple of years, I was pregnant with a group of funded grants that demanded his time and energy in the service of creative projects he ultimately had no interest in.

Crisis. After a serious power struggle, we resolved ourselves in this M/s framework.

And, here we are today.

Within the M/s framework, we have experienced a wide range of variables when it comes to "my career." I have stopped working altogether. I have worked on my own projects during my own time (which kept them small). I have worked under his direction; and I have assisted him in his work, even directing him in a theatrical production.

But, last year, I created a new business of my own. And I have been protecting it against his influence with a vehemence that doesn't really make sense, given the respect I have for him as both an artist and a director.

Keeping "the right frame of mind" to sustain the M/s relationship has already cut into time and focus I would otherwise turn towards this new business. Now - maybe that's all right. He's very supportive of the work I do; the hurricane has disrupted everyone's lives; and it's hard to know where all this will ultimately settle.

Maybe the scope of my work will be defined by the time I have to give to it. Maybe I'll emphasize one aspect over another because of his perception of which one will be a better business choice (i.e. more profitable - that is one of my weak points, and his input could be very valuable). Maybe a portion of the time I am spending on this project of mine will be spent on that project of his - so we can both develop simultaneously.

These are not bad choices. But they all require me to let go of my own agenda, and allow him to influence the course of my work. I used to do that without hesitation, but in the last few years, I have grown attached to my own projects. And I'm protecting them with territorial ferocity.