How to introduce BDSM to a "good girl"

[DeepGreenEyes]

As it happens, I've been giving my wife a full-body massage at bedtime for the last three nights. I've given her the proviso that I'm not looking for sex afterwards, so that she can just enjoy the sensual experience and drift off to sleep without any sudden awakenings.

My wife has really enjoyed that, but last night about half-way through the massage she decided to jump on me instead. That was great. She's not normally the initiator, and I've been feeling some loss of self-esteem that it always seems to fall to me to start things off. As well as being a great session for both of us, it also felt like a big release of sexual tension for the two of us.

....

Many thanks to all for your thoughts so far. Any further input is still very welcome, of course!

I'd work the massage angle. Push it. Move it ever so slowly, into the territory you want it to go. The kneading gets a little harder. The fingernails dig just a little deeper into her asscheeks. Her hands go over her head one night, where you pin them there, gently at first. Hold her wrists in place while you're fucking her, or eating her pussy. Start to touch her head more when she goes down on you, until she's used to a firm hold.

Remember the frog who was happily boiled alive because the pot of water was heated so gradually he didn't even realize it was happening.

 

[Mindfondler]

9 1/2 Weeks is OK, but I don't really classify it as BDSM.

Having watched it again with my wife last night (for the first time since 1986), I must agree. I guess I remember the film from back then as racier and pushing more boundaries. But then, all of my boundaries were untested at that time.

The perception of mine that is unchanged from back then, though, is that Kim Basinger looks incredibly hot in dark stockings. The scenes where she lifts up her legs whilst (not really) watching the slide show, and the one where she's lying on the bed in the shop and Mickey Rourke commands her to spread her stockinged legs still blow me away. Encouragingly, my wife was perfectly happy to assist me in getting blown away by those bits when she sensed how I was feeling. What a lovely woman she is!

My wife seemed happy watching the film and discussing it afterwards. I teased her about the blindfolding and she responded with a smile and an ambiguous roll of the eyes ("You're not going to make me do that, are you?"). She also agreed that the feeding scene in the kitchen probably isn't too bad to reproduce (so I'm off to buy some squirty syrup tomorrow!).

I don't think my wife understood the underlying theme of dependency and submission. Mickey Rourke's character made her feel very uncomfortable from the start, and she regarded his games as underhand manipulation of a vulnerable woman. She found it difficult to understand how Kim Basinger's character could fall for him so easily and not get away quickly when she saw what was happening. I have to say that my own take on this is much less black-and-white, and I feel that I recognise some of the character attributes that make this a plausible scenario on both sides.

I'd work the massage angle. Push it. Move it ever so slowly, into the territory you want it to go. The kneading gets a little harder. The fingernails dig just a little deeper into her asscheeks. Her hands go over her head one night, where you pin them there, gently at first. Hold her wrists in place while you're fucking her, or eating her pussy. Start to touch her head more when she goes down on you, until she's used to a firm hold.

I think you're absolutely right that massage is the key, whether it's light playful fondling during the day (which my wife really enjoys), or firmer and more purposeful massage in the evenings.

It's unfortunate that my wife doesn't seem to enjoy me going down on her (and, indeed, is uncomfortable about going down on me). It's not that she hates it, but rather that she seems to freeze up when I try it and, at best, says that it's giving her good feelings, but not great ones. I don't think my physical technique is at fault -- it's seems more that the mental aspect of the game is missing for her.

I can see that this type of extended massage could be a stepping-stone towards light bondage games, though. If I could help her to overcome her negative feelings (or, at least, indifference) about oral sex, then I imagine that it could be incredibly tantalising and rewarding for her to be tied up, blindfolded and then to feel my tongue and lips arrive down there and start operating.

 

[where]

Can anyone suggest some well-written stories on this site which "sell" light BDSM from a female perspective? I'm thinking of romantic descriptions of sensual massage whilst blindfolded and tied up, which lead to arousal and fulfilment. I've looked on the site index but there's a bewildering array of titles and I've not found any way to filter them down by any relevant criteria.

Many thanks.

Mindfondler

PM EnglishLady (or check out her sig... I think there are links to her work there as Victoria Bisset?. She writes erotica which I think sometimes has a BDSM bent to it, plus she's a practicing christian which might give your wife some comfort that it's not anything really terrible

 

[where]

EL's member page with links to her books

http://forum.literotica.com/member.php?u=156197

 

[BiBunny]

I think you're absolutely right that massage is the key, whether it's light playful fondling during the day (which my wife really enjoys), or firmer and more purposeful massage in the evenings.

It's unfortunate that my wife doesn't seem to enjoy me going down on her (and, indeed, is uncomfortable about going down on me). It's not that she hates it, but rather that she seems to freeze up when I try it and, at best, says that it's giving her good feelings, but not great ones. I don't think my physical technique is at fault -- it's seems more that the mental aspect of the game is missing for her.

I can see that this type of extended massage could be a stepping-stone towards light bondage games, though. If I could help her to overcome her negative feelings (or, at least, indifference) about oral sex, then I imagine that it could be incredibly tantalising and rewarding for her to be tied up, blindfolded and then to feel my tongue and lips arrive down there and start operating.

Ok, the you going down on her thing is not something you have to "fix." It's not necessarily a sign of a sexual hang-up. Some women just don't like it, and that's ok. I know some women here who hate it, and I personally am more into penetration and g-spot/cervical stimulation than oral. I can tolerate it, and sometimes I enjoy it, but usually the problem is that my clit is too sensitive to put up with it for long. I *really* have to be in the mood for it, and that doesn't happen very often.

Your wife may have the same problem. Some people just don't like it, and there's nothing necessarily wrong with them.

 

[Mindfondler]

EL's member page with links to her books

http://forum.literotica.com/member.php?u=156197

Thanks very much for that. I'll check it out.

Ok, the you going down on her thing is not something you have to "fix." It's not necessarily a sign of a sexual hang-up. Some women just don't like it, and that's ok. I know some women here who hate it, and I personally am more into penetration and g-spot/cervical stimulation than oral. I can tolerate it, and sometimes I enjoy it, but usually the problem is that my clit is too sensitive to put up with it for long. I *really* have to be in the mood for it, and that doesn't happen very often.

Your wife may have the same problem. Some people just don't like it, and there's nothing necessarily wrong with them.

Thanks. I'll bear that in mind. I'm certainly not intending to coerce my wife into accepting it if she really doesn't want it, but it's complicated...

I think there may be some clues that, for my wife, it's a taboo rather than a physical issue. When I've offered to give her oral sex, her first response is usually to say that she doesn't feel clean down there (at any time of the month, and even if she then goes and washes there). She's also made other comments about "dirtiness" which I suspect don't entirely relate to germs.

There have also been times when I've seemed to break through my wife's apparent indifference and made her squirm with pleasure orally. In mid-passion, she's moaned things about loving the coolness of my tongue against her hot spot. Afterwards, though, she blushes and acts all embarrassed if I mention what she said.

As you can probably imagine, these conflicts are a real frustration for me. In many ways, I'd just like to tie my wife up and inflict oral sex on her so that she feels released from all responsibility for it -- and then take the rap for it later if need be. Indeed, this is a recurring and powerful fantasy for me with its suggestions of opening up hitherto unexplored avenues of passion. I have a hunch that my wife would really respond to that, but I don't feel comfortable about employing that level of coercion without a clearer green light to proceed.

 

[NomadLady]

Thanks very much for that. I'll check it out.


As you can probably imagine, these conflicts are a real frustration for me. In many ways, I'd just like to tie my wife up and inflict oral sex on her so that she feels released from all responsibility for it -- and then take the rap for it later if need be. Indeed, this is a recurring and powerful fantasy for me with its suggestions of opening up hitherto unexplored avenues of passion. I have a hunch that my wife would really respond to that, but I don't feel comfortable about employing that level of coercion without a clearer green light to proceed.

ok....that is my new fantasy...even though I love it, being tied up for it would be COOL!!!!!!!!!!

 

[richard_daily]

EL's member page with links to her books

http://forum.literotica.com/member.php?u=156197

Also check out Violet Blue's compilations... they're generally filled with a bunch of light-to-heavy BDSM.

http://www.amazon.com/Best-Womens-E...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1280459776&sr=8-1

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Ok, the you going down on her thing is not something you have to "fix." It's not necessarily a sign of a sexual hang-up. Some women just don't like it, and that's ok. I know some women here who hate it, and I personally am more into penetration and g-spot/cervical stimulation than oral. I can tolerate it, and sometimes I enjoy it, but usually the problem is that my clit is too sensitive to put up with it for long. I *really* have to be in the mood for it, and that doesn't happen very often.

Your wife may have the same problem. Some people just don't like it, and there's nothing necessarily wrong with them.

Yes, some women just don't like oral, and there's nothing wrong with that (except that it makes my mouth painfully sad ). But it does sound like it's part of a larger inhibition on her part.

 

[Mindfondler]

ok....that is my new fantasy...even though I love it, being tied up for it would be COOL!!!!!!!!!!

I'm glad to be able to give you some new mind fodder!

I think the blindfolding is a nice touch as well -- not being able to predict exactly what will happen and when. I can imagine doing a lot of teasing with that.

Also check out Violet Blue's compilations... they're generally filled with a bunch of light-to-heavy BDSM.

http://www.amazon.com/Best-Womens-E...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1280459776&sr=8-1

Thanks -- added to my list!

Yes, some women just don't like oral, and there's nothing wrong with that (except that it makes my mouth painfully sad ). But it does sound like it's part of a larger inhibition on her part.

I'll continue to work on it with my wife, tiny step by tiny step, and see whether I can reach a proper understanding eventually. I'll be happy to leave it alone if it becomes clear that my wife really doesn't desire it but, as I've said, I'm tantalised by her ambiguity at the moment.

 

[FreakMyWhatNow]

Mindfondler,

I actually have heard this before. I have a friend who was desperate to get his wife to loosen up in the bedroom.

His last ditch effort was to create a list of ideas. He made cards out of the ideas. His wife then placed the cards into 2 piles. The "no" and the "maybe".

Anything in the "no" pile was a definite "forget about it".

The "maybe" pile was then narrowed down into "we could try it" and the "im not sure" piles.

Eventually, he had some idea about what his wife really did want sexually.

The list was quite varied. I think I have it somewhere... if you want it...

Maybe she's shy? Maybe she just isn't into it. You won't know until she tells you.

 

[Mindfondler]

That sounds like a great idea. I've tried discussing various ideas with my wife and I typically get a coy rolling of her eyes or an assertion from her that she's not doing that which, however, lacks some conviction and finality. I'm honestly doing my best to read her right and not make assumptions, but all that I'm seeing is ambiguity. I think she's genuinely not sure what she wants.

The list was quite varied. I think I have it somewhere... if you want it...

That would be great if you can find it.

Thanks.

Mindfondler

 

[FreakMyWhatNow]

ok, now you have the list. and the more i think about it the more i think you should really add a lot more to it... really!

 

[Mindfondler]

Received -- many thanks.

As you suggest, I'll do a bit of editing and add some of my own imagination. That should be fun in itself. It's great to have a starting point.

All the best.

Mindfondler

 

[MasterPhoenix]

OK, I originally clicked on this thread to make a smart ass comment... but instead I was found it an entertaining and enlightening thread...

It sounds like you are making the right moves... however, here is one thing to consider, perhaps that "minx" inside your wife doesn't want you to always be checking with her to be sure its OK, and wants YOU to take the responsibility to push the envelope a bit. Now, mind you I am not suggesting totally diving in with inverted suspension, single tails, and fireplay.

You mentioned early in the thread that you felt she wanted YOU to shoulder the responsibility. Well, perhaps, she wants you to kind of push the envelop forward a bit. Perhaps instead of cuffing her to go down on her, cuff her to fuck her... as you do it, keep whispering in her ear that she is "your good girl" and watch her reactions...

I may be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time, won't be the last, but I wanted to throw you some food for thought.

I know with the submissives that I have been with, they like when I take what I want... maybe she wants a bit of that 'taken' feeling...

Anyway, I wish you the absolute best of luck on your continued journey.

 

[sweepthefloor]

If I were a man, which I am not, and had a "good girl" for a wife, I would just take her and rape her. When I was done, I would tell her: "You are a good girl", and then kiss her cheek.

*this is not advice, I know nothing.

 

[Mindfondler]

OK, I originally clicked on this thread to make a smart ass comment... but instead I was found it an entertaining and enlightening thread...

I'm delighted to hear that!

Perhaps instead of cuffing her to go down on her, cuff her to fuck her... as you do it, keep whispering in her ear that she is "your good girl" and watch her reactions...

I'd certainly like to do that. I'd need to feel happy, though, that I'm not going completely against the tide. I'm not cruel, and I'd rapidly lose my urge and feel ashamed if I got the message that I was way out of line. On the other hand, I'd enjoy fighting against resistance that is clearly only a token offering.

Ideally, I'd like to have an agreement set up with my wife beforehand, including a safe word. Maybe I could introduce this in a tantalising sort of way -- for example: "Later on I want to do something to you without checking that it's okay. If you find yourself uncomfortable with it and definitely want me to stop, then say the emergency word 'XXX'. If you do that, then everything will stop, and you won't be able to change your mind and start it again. So, unless that's the case, shut the fuck up. I'm really hot for this and, even if you're not sure at first, I think you'll find yourself liking it after a while. Do you understand?".

If I were a man, which I am not, and had a "good girl" for a wife, I would just take her and rape her. When I was done, I would tell her: "You are a good girl", and then kiss her cheek.

See above. I'm uncomfortable about using that particular "r" verb, though. Perhaps "ravish" would be a better choice -- better still in the sense of "fantasy ravish".

 

[WriterDom]

Even "good girls" tend to know they have the bdsm gene long before they lose their virginity. But dealing with human nature anything is possible.

 

[NomadLady]

{"MasterPhoenix OK, I originally clicked on this thread to make a smart ass comment... but instead I was found it an entertaining and enlightening thread...

I know with the submissives that I have been with, they like when I take what I want... maybe she wants a bit of that 'taken' feeling.

Anyway, I wish you the absolute best of luck on your continued journey."}

I have to agree 110% here with MasterPhoenix on this one.....I also like it when they just take what they want....no questions, no comments. You've been with her long enough that you will instinctively know is something goes too far.

It does sound like you are making some good progress as well

 

[VelvetSin]

It sounds like you are making the right moves... however, here is one thing to consider, perhaps that "minx" inside your wife doesn't want you to always be checking with her to be sure its OK, and wants YOU to take the responsibility to push the envelope a bit. Now, mind you I am not suggesting totally diving in with inverted suspension, single tails, and fireplay.

You mentioned early in the thread that you felt she wanted YOU to shoulder the responsibility. Well, perhaps, she wants you to kind of push the envelop forward a bit. Perhaps instead of cuffing her to go down on her, cuff her to fuck her... as you do it, keep whispering in her ear that she is "your good girl" and watch her reactions...

I may be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time, won't be the last, but I wanted to throw you some food for thought.

I know with the submissives that I have been with, they like when I take what I want... maybe she wants a bit of that 'taken' feeling...

Anyway, I wish you the absolute best of luck on your continued journey.

This was exactly how B started me off. Cuffs can be intimidating (in a good way now, but then I would've told him to go to hell), I'd suggest starting with something like silk scarves.

I don't know if I qualified as a "good girl" but inhibitions are hard to break and move beyond even if you really want to deep inside. For me, I just flat out wouldn't. It helped to have someone known and trusted push the inhibitions aside when I had no control over that, knowing he would stop if I really meant for him to.

Watch her signals. If she tightens up, slow down. If she freezes, stop. If she's hesitant but complaint, consider it a green light to keep exploring. Then talk the next morning after she's had time to sleep on it and start figuring out what she really thought. For me, the next morning I said I did not want to go anywhere beyond what happened the night before, then months later that little seed took root and curiosity got the better of me to see what else was down that road.

I agree completely with the advice, though. She sounds open to it (behind the inhibitions).

 

[Jaded_One]

Hey Mindfondler....I'll throw in a couple of my thoughts. I would describe myself as a baby sub, just starting down this path. I will say as a newbie, I WANT to be told what to do. I WANT the control taken away. You seem to me as having the potential for being Dominant. I've included a link that has really helped me from a Sub point of view understand better why I'm drawn to BDSM and I think it would be a great resource for you as a newbie Dom.

http://www.literotica.com/stories/showstory.php?id=310676

From what you've written about your wife, I sense a curiosity there, but she needs the freedom of not having to decide. Take the control out of her hands and into yours... in small steps. I think perhaps a place to start would be with the vibrator, which she is already comfortable with. You be in control of it... and tell her this is how it's going to be.

Take her by the hand, lead her to the bedroom. TELL her you are going to undress her, and that she is not to move. She how she responds. If her lips part, and her breathing comes quicker.. you're on the right track. Praise her if she does well. Have her lay on the bed and instruct her not to move. Tell her that if she moves, there will be consquences. Using the vibrator, touch her nipples, her clit, her pussy. If she moves, take the vibrator away, instruct her again not to move. You are in charge. All the while, praising her when she does well. Telling her how much she pleases you, what a good girl she is.

If this goes well... I would think it wouldn't take much to move to actual physical restraints. Continue, as well, on YOUR education into being dominant. You can have her read until her eyes cross, but if you don't take charge, she'll never get to the point of letting go.

good luck, and keep us posted.

 

[where]

Ideally, I'd like to have an agreement set up with my wife beforehand, including a safe word. Maybe I could introduce this in a tantalising sort of way -- for example: "Later on I want to do something to you without checking that it's okay. If you find yourself uncomfortable with it and definitely want me to stop, then say the emergency word 'XXX'. If you do that, then everything will stop, and you won't be able to change your mind and start it again. So, unless that's the case, shut the fuck up. I'm really hot for this and, even if you're not sure at first, I think you'll find yourself liking it after a while. Do you understand?".

OK, i get that this is a kind of fantasy scenario, but the 'use the safe word and it's all over', in reality is not a great idea.

I think a better idea is to have a safe word, but very very carefully watch her reactions, don't push her to use it. In fact make it so she ends up thinking 'why bother with a safe word?' and then you can incrementally increase whatever hard play you are into.

This way you are giving security, comfort and some degree of control to her and the biggest thing (I think) that scares the shit out of someone is not having that control. You need to show her that she can give up control and trust you.

 

[MasterPhoenix]

{"MasterPhoenix OK, I originally clicked on this thread to make a smart ass comment... but instead I was found it an entertaining and enlightening thread...

I know with the submissives that I have been with, they like when I take what I want... maybe she wants a bit of that 'taken' feeling.

Anyway, I wish you the absolute best of luck on your continued journey."}

I have to agree 110% here with MasterPhoenix on this one.....I also like it when they just take what they want....no questions, no comments. You've been with her long enough that you will instinctively know is something goes too far.

It does sound like you are making some good progress as well

That is where communication comes into play. As you said knowing your partner and being able to read her reaction is paramount. That is where it is up to me, where I can ignore the word "no" as long as I can read that her body says anything but... Unless we have the built in dynamic, wherein I don't have to even care whether she means no or not, she has surrendered that right to me.

 

[Mindfondler]

Many thanks to WriterDom, NomadLady, VelvetSin, Jaded_One, Kybele and MasterPhoenix for your further contributions -- much appreciated!

Things are moving forward in a very good way for us now, thanks to the ideas that I've been given here.

The first thing that I did was to draw up a list of expectations for my wife to be a "good girl" in my eyes. I was quite pleased with the result: whilst being fairly concise (a dozen or so bullet points), it covered both the non-sexual and sexual aspects of our relationship and, whilst being prescriptive in some areas, it generally had a warm, positive and supportive feel to it.

Last night, I gave my wife the list to read. Her first reaction was that she wouldn't be able to fulfil them all. I then ran through them with her point-by-point ("You can do that, can't you?", "You already do that, don't you?" etc) and my wife discovered that she didn't really have any objections to any of them. I left it at that; we just had a cuddle and went to sleep.

This morning, I pounced on my wife in the kitchen while she was washing up. I grabbed her from behind and fondled her back, breasts and tummy in quick succession. She gave a little "Oh!" of shock and surprise but didn't object any further and quickly lost interest in the rest of the washing up as I went on. I gave her quite a bit of attention up top, but didn't stray below her waistline, before giving her a passionate kiss and telling her that I'd really enjoyed that. Once again, I left things brewing at that point.

It didn't take long for the seeds that I'd sown to germinate. A couple of hours later, my wife pounced on me and virtually tore her clothes off in front of me, insisting on a quickie and being very precise (and dirty) about what she wanted me to do for her. It probably goes without saying that this was great fun and light years away from the familiar situation in which I'd have to take the lead in everything. I told my wife afterwards that she'd been a very good girl, and also a very bad girl. She grinned.

I'm feeling confident enough now to try taking complete control of her without worrying, because my wife gave me the impression today (while I was biding my time) that she was aching for me to do just that. I think I'll be able to recognise the signs that it's going down well (or, conversely, that it's not -- although hopefully that's not going to be the case).

I think I may also be able to introduce some "naughty play" elements much faster than I imagined (though I'll still tread a bit carefully). I mentioned to my wife this morning the "refrigerator game" from the film 9 1/2 Weeks that we watched together a few days ago, and she rolled her eyes with the appearance of indignation that, on this occasion, was clearly mock.

While we were out shopping this afternoon, I bought some grapes and suggested to my wife that we play a variation of the game. In my version, she has to specify, whilst blindfolded, whether I've just fed her a green grape or a red one. If she gets the answer right, then she gets a kiss; if she gets it wrong, then she receives a spank. I was delighted that my wife latched on straight away and with some glee to the idea that either of us could cheat: I might lie about the correct answer in order to get the outcome that I want; and, perhaps significantly, my wife suggested that she might deliberately give the wrong answer in order to get spanked.

Oh... I think things are looking up! Many thanks to everyone who has contributed suggestions in this thread. I'd be happy to report further progress on here if it's of any interest to people.

 

[NomadLady]

Congratulations I believe are in order here!!!!!!!!!!!!