The 'ethics' of casual 'bdsm'

[rida]

Words are cheap, deeds are not.

When words and deeds disagree, trust the deeds, not the words.



Behave in a mature manner, rather than enraged bullies in the schoolyard.

I believe I did. And yet I got lumped with the rest.

And if it is because I did not police other's post, I believe in free speach and discussions with the occasional joke and highjack. I simply ignore the rest.

 

[BLoved]

I worry that you are so caught up in your message that you might have lost sight of the fact that empathy is a very large component of love.

~smile~

Despite all the insults hurled at me, and about me, I still offer my truth to anyone who wishes to listen.

In what way does that not demonstrate empathy for those who would avoid abuse, for those who would choose love?

 

[BLoved]

And if it is because I did not police other's post, I believe in free speach and discussions with the occasional joke and highjack. I simply ignore the rest.

~smile~

And yet here you are, policing my posts.

Your blind side is showing.

 

[Lizzie_Borden]

Whereas I blame the individual's low self-esteem for feeling the need to deceive and manipulate me.

I do not blame love for having the faith in another to give her the chance to rise above such behaviour. If no one is ever given a chance, there would be no love and we'd be a poorer species for the loss.

Love requires having the courage to risk it all. In many ways it is a much greater challenge than anything casual 'bdsm' can offer, and the rewards for success are so much greater.

Neither love nor life offer guarantees to anyone. They only offer us opportunities to grow and to learn, to be better people.

We either embrace those opportunities, or we run from them. But running from them does not produce growth, nor do we learn, nor do we become better people.

Running means giving up, it means embracing fear and all that entails.

Running erodes our self-esteem.

In this particular case, giving up and running saved my self esteem.

 

[BLoved]

Working out assumed consequences.

Every paradigm has predictable consequences.

Understand the paradigm and the consequences become obvious.

The only question, when it comes to an individual, is how much of an influence the paradigm has over the individual.

 

[Daddy2mylilgirl]

Have I gloated over anyone's loss, as has Daddy2mylilgirl?

Only cause I correctly predicted it after only one post from your "beloved" and you didn't see coming after "weeks" of getting to know her.

~smile~

 

[rida]

Whereas I blame the individual's low self-esteem for feeling the need to deceive and manipulate me.

.

I blame neither when I've been hurt by love.
Sometimes things are not meant to be. Sometime the time is not right. And others ... Circumstances gets in the way.

 

[BLoved]

In this particular case, giving up and running saved my self esteem.

Actually, from the sounds of it, you embraced the opportunity and your partners did not.

Leaving was a wise choice, under those conditions.

However, that shouldn't stop you from looking for another opportunity, with another person.

Allowing your past to interfere with your future ... I think that's a mistake.

Refusing love from another because the last two guys failed to overcome their dysfunctional attitudes is only doing yourself harm.

 

[Netzach]

~smile~

Welcome back to the discussion, ES.

Your absence has been noticed



I agree that there are immature people in both camps.

I've yet to come across a "mature" casual player, and many many people have participated in discussions such as this one.

My feeling is that if indeed there are mature casual players, they should have appeared by now. I'd recognize them because they'd be the ones policing the others.

Consider this post.

Rida was the only one to speak out against it.

That is exceptionally rare in discussions like this. You did it for a while, then backed off from it.

Situations where I am treated as a human being, such as chy_girl a few days ago and Lizzie today, they almost never happen.

It is that scarcity that paints such a bleak picture of those who participate in casual 'bdsm'.



Treating someone as a human being is indicative of maturity.

Treating them as someone's personal punching bag, not so much.

Compare the behaviour of the examples I just cited with the ubiquitous posts from Netzach, Graceanne, Daddy2mylilgirl, Stella_Omega ...

The difference is obvious.



Which is what I did in "Casual 'BDSM' and Emotional Abuse: The Case for Love".



That's because low self-esteem is a pandemic in western society.



I disagree, as I associate all of those qualities with romantic love.

Love is not love if not selfless with the one loved.



If indeed they felt such things I'd question whether they are practising casual 'bdsm' at all.

You gave up your right to be handled respectfully when you failed to show respect to other people, their love-relationships and their autonomy.

You gave up the right to respect when you decide to pathologize other people's lives and decisions to their face.

You gave up the right to respect when you tell rida, the only person with the patience for your repulsive personality "that she has nothing of substance and merits no response" you dont' deserve to kiss her ass.

You gave up your right to be handled respectfully when you spew intentionally misleading lies about things other people have enough direct experience with to know you are lying. You continue to lie. You impugn them.

Respect is given, then it is earned or unearned quickly. You unearned it.

Because you did all these things, long before I even began engaging in this waste of time on any level, demanding full respect while offering none, I really don't care to get on high ground when it comes to you. I fault no one else who doesn't care to either. A person who can't handle themselves with a modicum of respect for other people's choices is a liability.

I respect tons of people whose SM activity never sees the light of day and is done with a life partner. Unlike you, they respect other people.

 

[Daddy2mylilgirl]

I've been analyzing the Love paradigm since I was 13, forty years now.

And yet, what happened when you thought "Love" would cure your "beloved's" issues?

How did that work out for you?

~smile~

 

[BLoved]

Only cause I correctly predicted it after only one post from your "beloved" and you didn't see coming after "weeks" of getting to know her.

~smile~

Anyone can be a pessimist. Proves nothing.

 

[rida]

~smile~

And yet here you are, policing my posts.

Your blind side is showing.

Policing your posts?

Engaging in logical discussion is policing your posts???

I'm sorry you live in such a scary world that enemies are everywhere.

 

[BLoved]

~smile~

Sorry folks, have an errand to run.

As someone pointed out, it is a beautiful day (at least here). I hope you get out and enjoy some of it.

I'll be back.

 

[Lizzie_Borden]

Actually, from the sounds of it, you embraced the opportunity and your partners did not.

Leaving was a wise choice, under those conditions.

However, that shouldn't stop you from looking for another opportunity, with another person.

Allowing your past to interfere with your future ... I think that's a mistake.

Refusing love from another because the last two guys failed to overcome their dysfunctional attitudes is only doing yourself harm.

Oh, it was only the one.

I'm definitely not daft enough to get involved in something like that again. It took me some time, but I'm really trying hard now, to not let it interfere. Sometimes though, the instinct to withdraw is strong, but he's patient and has a solid bloody grip.

 

[BLoved]

I'm sorry you live in such a scary world that enemies are everywhere.

~smile~

I don't think anyone reading this discussion would confuse any of you for "friends".

Be well

 

[BLoved]

Oh, it was only the one.

I'm definitely not daft enough to get involved in something like that again. It took me some time, but I'm really trying hard now, to not let it interfere. Sometimes though, the instinct to withdraw is strong, but he's patient and has a solid bloody grip.

~big smile~

I wish you well.

Now stop distracting me. I'm out of smokes and really need to go

 

[Daddy2mylilgirl]

Anyone can be a pessimist. Proves nothing.

LOL

Whatever helps you sleep at night. I know you feel dumb for missing such obvious issues and not addressing them properly when you had the chance.

Plus, with your forty years of analyzing love that must make you feel even dumber.

Love is not a cure all. It does not heal deep emotional scars. It's at best a band-aid to cover deeper issues. It sits on the surface making you feel good and like all those past issues are magically gone, but deep down those issues are waiting to come to the surface again. If those deeper issues are not taken care of then eventually they will break through the "love" and ruin your relationship. There is a reason people seek third party professionals (whom they don't Love) to help heal those wounds.

If you have to put that much weight into love in order to free yourself from past issues then you are turning a blind eye to deeper problems that will continue to hurt you and others in the future.

You can "Love" an abuse victim as much as you want, but that still won't stop them from flinching when you go to give them a hug.

Pessimist?

My Beloved just left.

She won't be coming back.

Apparently two weeks ago, while away at the funeral of her grandfather, she fell out of love.

She says she never had a childhood. That she just wants to be a kid with no responsibilities.

That's not who she said she was three months ago.

So here I am: betrayed, manipulated, broken-hearted.

My only consolation is that I did what Love would have me do. .

It wasn't enough to overcome the damage her past has done to her.

Sometimes Love isn't enough, and that is a bitter pill to swallow.

~smile~

That's called hitting the nail on the head.

If you need anymore advice on a new "beloved" in the future, please don't hesitate to ask.

~smile~

 

[Netzach]

Smokes.

Smokes?

You have to be kidding me.


Before you crusade for the mental health of all the submissive women in your immediate vicinity, why don't you take a look at that log in your eye. What could possibly make a person suck carcinogens off flaming leaves all day? I can't fathom.

 

[Bette_coquette]

This guy leads such a busy life he spends hours and hours perusing his own thread. The only thing that drags him away is his addiction.

I'm so glad I'm sane.

 

[BLoved]

Very cool

I've a bunny on the property.

Been years since I last saw one here.

 

[BLoved]

To my many detractors:

Yes, you hate me. We can all see this.

You hate me, and you're going to go on hating me.

You are going to go on hating me because your hatred means nothing to me but a further confirmation of the things I've said about casual 'bdsm' and those who exploit others for their own personal gain.

Every time you voice your hatred, no matter how cunning you are in the wording, you simply add more evidence to suport what Ive been saying all along: casual 'bdsm appeals to those who suffer from low self-esteem.

Now whether anyone else wants to buy into your hatred is their business. Some will. Hopefully most won't.

Hopefully most will see you as you are. Hopefully they will pity you your blindness, your hatred and your need for approval.

Hopefully they will recognize that diversity is not served by insisting everyone must see casual 'bdsm' as you do.

Hopefully they will see that there are good and honest people who have good and honest reasons for rejecting that which you insist we must all agree upon.

Hopefully they will see that forcing us to pay lip-service to you and your beliefs does no one credit, and simply prevents anyone from improving anything for themselves or others.

That's what I'm trying to do: improve things.

You have my pity that you cannot see that.

 

[WriterDom]

Smoking appeals to those who suffer from low self-esteem.

 

[Daddy2mylilgirl]

Smoking appeals to those who suffer from low self-esteem.

Exactly.

Smoking is the epitome of doing something stupid because you want to fit and be cool.

 

[sb2009]

I"m trying to see how pointing out that MY personal experience in a public BDSM setting (for example) differs from what you say ALL experiences are, is "policing."

What is policing a thread anyway? Was it deleted? Did someone say "don't say that or I will point at my keyboard really hard?"

 

[chy_girl]

~smile~

Despite all the insults hurled at me, and about me, I still offer my truth to anyone who wishes to listen.

In what way does that not demonstrate empathy for those who would avoid abuse, for those who would choose love?

One could say that the inability to even temporarily see things from another's point of view lacks empathy. As an example, you've continued to insult and demonize me and my own relationship because I choose not to label it as love. Yet there are many positive component that mirrored the examples you and your last partner posted as examples of love. A relationship that works beautifully for me because the love and commitment I have for my two special needs/high needs children.

Be that as it may, I was actually referring to the lack of empathy you demonstrate for yourself. It makes me a little sad.

~smile~

I don't think anyone reading this discussion would confuse any of you for "friends".

Be well

And you're right. I don't confuse her for a friend. I know she's a friend who shares enough respect with me to agree to disagree in a mature manner. As are many others here.