DH's Astrobiology Discussion Thread

[driphoney]

This is such a diverse group who love to debate, argue, and generally think (or pretend to think, depending,) so I thought this would be a great place to get help.

I'm taking an astrobiology course for dummies (or so it's billed.) As hard as it is to believe, I have never, ever, ever taken a biology course. So, I'm a complete novice in this class. We're required to bring two researched discussion topics to the table in a few weeks, one to please the physics prof and one to make the bio prof happy. I haven't a clue where to begin with regards to the bio topic. I think I have one for the astronomy discussion group which I'm going to ask about today.

So, after the sex has occurred, the cigarette is lit and you're sitting around pondering the universe, what questions regarding life in the universe, yet outside of earth, float through your mind?

 

[Saucy_Sage]

This is such a diverse group who love to debate, argue, and generally think (or pretend to think, depending,) so I thought this would be a great place to get help.

I'm taking an astrobiology course for dummies (or so it's billed.) As hard as it is to believe, I have never, ever, ever taken a biology course. So, I'm a complete novice in this class. We're required to bring two researched discussion topics to the table in a few weeks, one to please the physics prof and one to make the bio prof happy. I haven't a clue where to begin with regards to the bio topic. I think I have one for the astronomy discussion group which I'm going to ask about today.

So, after the sex has occurred, the cigarette is lit and you're sitting around pondering the universe, what questions regarding life in the universe, yet outside of earth, float through your mind?

I swear to God, when I first read the title I thought this was about robots and astrology. That would be astrobotology, though, wouldn't it? But this is about alien sex, isn't it? Perv.

 

[john-the-author]

The red supergiant star, Betelgeuse, has shrunk by 15% in the last 20 years or so. With our current understanding of stellar physics, this would suggest that the core is collapsing. I don't know if we know what phase of nuclear fusion it's undergoing (hydrogen to helium, helium to lithium, and up the chain), but there is a chance that a supernova is imminent in the next 500-1000 years. There will probably be at the very least a huge new burst of activity when the fusion cycle kicks over to the next phase (each time a star switches to a new fusion cycle, it tends to burst forth anew). (Note: a star burns for billions of years on hydrogen, millions of years on helium, and for shorter and shorter periods on increasingly heavy elements until it gets from, uh, neon to iron I think it is, which is a fusion cycle that lasts for maybe a DAY, after which, the star collapses totally and Things Happen, but we aren't entirely sure what.)

If Betelgeuse does go supernova, it's far enough away that we aren't going to be killed by radiation (safe distance is generally considered to be 100ly or so; Betelgeuse is ~500ly). We would, however, see greatly increased background radiation, heavier particle radiation, and a night sky that wouldn't be dull for the rest of human history. This won't be the first supernova in Earth's history that's in the cosmic neigborhood, but it'll be the closest in eons. What effects will this have on life on earth and the potential for life on other planets here and in other solar systems?

 

[Handley_Page]

So, after the sex has occurred, the cigarette is lit and you're sitting around pondering the universe, what questions regarding life in the universe, yet outside of earth, float through your mind?

To my mind, there IS life out there somewhere. Maybe even sentient life. It's probably not the bi-pedal upright type, but with the discovery of 'planets' of sorts round distant suns, there cannot be nothing.
Surely the Almighty Creator didn't leave us to muck it about alone ??

 

[R. Richard]

Let's assume that we discover that there's alien life on the planet of at least one other sun. Let's further assume that the aliens can travel through interstellar space and visit us. Then what happens?

Use the experiences we gained from the European discovery of the polynesians to project the probable course of events.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

The chances of contact with OTHERS is so remote speculation about THEM is a waste of time and effort. It's like watching a silent movie from the early 20th Century and construing how things are now.

 

[TE999]

*beep* There is no intelligent life elsewhere in the universe *beep* Do not bother searching for it *beep* Nothing out there at all *beep* No need looking *beep* Your planet is it *beep* Stay home *beep beep*

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Do something that matters today.

 

[jomar]

So post the alien bits already!

 

[voluptuary_manque]

I subscribe to what I believe is the middle road. Yes, there is life out there, most of it microbial. If you look at all the things that go to make "higher" life on Earth possible, the odds are so long that it happened elsewhere that I have this terrible fear that when, sometime in the next century, we take off for the stars we will find the most advanced planet mostly in the Carboniferous Age. Consider, why is the Earth's climate (that we think is so changeable) really so stable over millenia? It has a very stable axis. Why does it have a very stable axis? Because it has the largest moon for its size in the Solar System. Why does it have this giant moon? Because in the early stages of the Solar System a planet the size of Mars hit us dead center and knocked enough spalled material out the other side that it could eventually form the Moon. Now what are the odds of that? And we're not even talking about such little details as an ideal distance from the Sun, etc. I believe irony to be the humor of God and I'm afraid that He did, in fact, set us up alone and is still waiting for us to learn to get along with each other, let alone some other intelligent species.

 

[michchick98]

So, after the sex has occurred, the cigarette is lit and you're sitting around pondering the universe, what questions regarding life in the universe, yet outside of earth, float through your mind?

I don't know the question, but the answer is 42!

 

[TxRad]

I don't know the question, but the answer is 42!

6x7=42

6x9=54

Can there possible be two correct answers?

I wonder if this applies to the question.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

http://originoflife.net/cairns_smith/index.html

If you want to make both perfessers happy check out A.G.Cairns-Smith.

Crystals are your oldest ancestors.

And remember that DNA is a crystal.

 

[TxRad]

Deoxyribonucleic acid (DNA) is a nucleic acid.

Acid - Crystal? Did I miss something in chemistry class?

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

TEX

Do your homework.

Cairns-Smith suggests that the grandpappy of life was a crystal of some sort...like clay. Clay reproduces itself, as do most oxides. He goes on to speculate that in time an inorganic crystal became something like a virus.

 

[Austin8]

Yep crystal... where's the hot alien chicks?

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

AUTIN

STELLA is the hot alien chick. Makes you wanna stay home.

 

[Austin8]

AUTIN

STELLA is the hot alien chick. Makes you wanna stay home.

hahaha, awww, poor Stella...

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Its her lips. Nature designed them to suck farts out of dead bears, preventing the methane gas from destroying this planet as her home world was destroyed.

 

[michchick98]

6x7=42

6x9=54

Can there possible be two correct answers?

I wonder if this applies to the question.

Nope. In this particular instance, 42 is the answer to Life, the Universe and Everything, but the question is unknown. At least up to the 4th book.

 

[driphoney]

Wow! I ran in from class to see if my thread had grown or died. I'm so thrilled to see all the activity. Even JBJ, after all that grumbling, you give me a gem. Now, if I can understand any of it! If john-the-author's idea doesn't get accepted as a discussion panel topic, I'll try to figure out a question from this material. Problem is I'm still at the 'what's a petri dish?' stage. The problem for me in the course is there is more assumed knowledge with the biology portion of the course, either that or I have to go with the concept that size does matter and bigger is better

The red supergiant star, Betelgeuse, . . . If Betelgeuse does go supernova, it's far enough away that we aren't going to be killed by radiation (safe distance is generally considered to be 100ly or so; Betelgeuse is ~500ly). We would, however, see greatly increased background radiation, heavier particle radiation, and a night sky that wouldn't be dull for the rest of human history. This won't be the first supernova in Earth's history that's in the cosmic neigborhood, but it'll be the closest in eons. What effects will this have on life on earth and the potential for life on other planets here and in other solar systems?

Perfect! Thank you so much! I didn't know this, but it's actually very interesting to me.

Let's assume that we discover that there's alien life on the planet of at least one other sun. Let's further assume that the aliens can travel through interstellar space and visit us. Then what happens?

Use the experiences we gained from the European discovery of the polynesians to project the probable course of events.

This is just too scary to speculate on. Way too scary. I never watch those alien-come-to-earth movies (well, except for E.T. ) Great idea for discussion though, even if it does creep me out.

I subscribe to what I believe is the middle road. Yes, there is life out there, most of it microbial. If you look at all the things that go to make "higher" life on Earth possible, the odds are so long that it happened elsewhere that I have this terrible fear that when, sometime in the next century, we take off for the stars we will find the most advanced planet mostly in the Carboniferous Age. Consider, why is the Earth's climate (that we think is so changeable) really so stable over millenia? It has a very stable axis. Why does it have a very stable axis? Because it has the largest moon for its size in the Solar System. Why does it have this giant moon? Because in the early stages of the Solar System a planet the size of Mars hit us dead center and knocked enough spalled material out the other side that it could eventually form the Moon. Now what are the odds of that? And we're not even talking about such little details as an ideal distance from the Sun, etc. I believe irony to be the humor of God and I'm afraid that He did, in fact, set us up alone and is still waiting for us to learn to get along with each other, let alone some other intelligent species.

I think I'm going to come down with you on this by the time this course is over.

But my anti-God, super-atheistic evangelist (yet super sweet and wonderful) bio prof is already working to blow the notion that we're unique out of the water. We hear daily how life is easily created, the conditions don't have to be too perfect, that "living systems are natural products of cosmic evolution and just a subset of studies of planetary geochemistry," "that sentience of meat-based beings may simply be an artifact, or useless offshoot, of cellular adaptations to selective pressures of scarce resources in changing terrestrial environments," and on and on. Having this as a topic would be depressing, but I'm sure Dr. T would relish me bringing it up! Given that, Dr. T agrees that what we're going to find will be something we can recognize and probably microbial.

Speaking of meat, if you haven't seen this, you science-types might find this amusing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaFZTAOb7IE

Thanks everyone. And I think the answer is 36.

 

[driphoney]

Nope. In this particular instance, 42 is the answer to Life, the Universe and Everything, but the question is unknown. At least up to the 4th book.

I stand corrected.

 

[amicus]

]This is such a diverse group who love to debate, argue, and generally think (or pretend to think, depending,) so I thought this would be a great place to get help.

I'm taking an astrobiology course for dummies (or so it's billed.) As hard as it is to believe, I have never, ever, ever taken a biology course. So, I'm a complete novice in this class. We're required to bring two researched discussion topics to the table in a few weeks, one to please the physics prof and one to make the bio prof happy. I haven't a clue where to begin with regards to the bio topic. I think I have one for the astronomy discussion group which I'm going to ask about today.

So, after the sex has occurred, the cigarette is lit and you're sitting around pondering the universe, what questions regarding life in the universe, yet outside of earth, float through your mind? [/I]

~~~

"...(¦as·trō·bī′äl·ə·jē)

An approach to the scientific study of the living universe which seeks to understand the origin and evolution of life on earth, to determine if life exists elsewhere in the universe, and to predict the future of life on earth and in the rest of the universe..."

I was wrong about the definition of astrobiology, I thought it was ongoing research on how humans will fare in long durations of being in space, the future Mars voyage in particular, as to exercise, food intake, even conception and child birth in zero gravity, along with bone loss and the development of the fetus. There is also a field that studies human psychology during long term isolation and how to protect the voyages from solar and cosmic radiation and whether suitable materials could be created to shield them without adding excess weight to the vessel.

Interesting...

Amicus

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

DH

The crystal theory is fascinating. All you need know is that crystals naturally self replicate under the right conditions...clay, rust, gems. sugar. So the replication mechanisn already exists, and with mutations you might possibly end up with something like a proto-virus...and the race is on.

Life is probably inevitable if the environment has crystals.

Rosalind Franklin discovered the crystalline nature of dna using x-rays.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aso/databank/entries/bofran.html

 

[voluptuary_manque]

Wow! I ran in from class to see if my thread had grown or died. I'm so thrilled to see all the activity. Even JBJ, after all that grumbling, you give me a gem. Now, if I can understand any of it! If john-the-author's idea doesn't get accepted as a discussion panel topic, I'll try to figure out a question from this material. Problem is I'm still at the 'what's a petri dish?' stage. The problem for me in the course is there is more assumed knowledge with the biology portion of the course, either that or I have to go with the concept that size does matter and bigger is better



Perfect! Thank you so much! I didn't know this, but it's actually very interesting to me.



This is just too scary to speculate on. Way too scary. I never watch those alien-come-to-earth movies (well, except for E.T. ) Great idea for discussion though, even if it does creep me out.



I think I'm going to come down with you on this by the time to course is over.

But my anti-God, super-atheistic evangelist (yet super sweet and wonderful) bio prof is already working to blow the notion that we're unique out of the water. We hear daily how life is easily created, the conditions don't have to be too perfect, that "living systems are natural products of cosmic evolution and just a subset of studies of planetary geochemistry," "that sentience of meat-based beings may simply be an artifact, or useless offshoot, of cellular adaptations to selective pressures of scarce resources in changing terrestrial environments," and on and on. Having this as a topic would be depressing, but I'm sure Dr. T would relish me bringing it up! Given that, Dr. T agrees that what we're going to find will be something we can recognize and probably microbial.

Speaking of meat, if you haven't seen this, you science-types might find this amusing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaFZTAOb7IE

Thanks everyone. And I think the answer is 36.

Like I said, I fully expect microbes. However if you look at a DNA based web of life, plants and animals are 'way up on one corner, and from either a numbers or a biomass standpoint, insignificant. You might also spring Catching Fire on ol' proffie. The basis is that we are what we have become because some distant ancestor started dropping food in a fire before eating it. Humans are evolved to eat cooked food. Our digestive tracts can't extract enough energy from raw food to stay fertile. Intelligence requires cooking, it seems. So figure the odds of that happening. Most astronomers, as far as I am able to determine, agree that the galaxy is full of life but that there might barely be one other intelligent species out there. And even that is unlikely.