Not yet convinced to avoid using credit cards?

Le Jacquelope

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Then this should help push you over the edge.
Pay down those balances and spend only what you earn, folks. Or become a consequence of this...

http://finance.yahoo.com/banking-bu...ow-to-Blow-Your-Credit-Limit-Without-Spending

How to Blow Your Credit Limit -- Without Spending
by Kelli B. Grant
Thursday, March 12, 2009
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If you haven't had the credit limit cut on your credit card recently, count yourself lucky. Risk-averse card issuers are getting slash happy. And while many cardholders gripe that such cuts slice razor-close to their balance amounts, for an unfortunate few the cuts go far deeper: below what they currently owe.

Under different circumstances, David Chaplin-Loebell wouldn't have minded that American Express cut his unlimited credit line to just $5,000. Except that when AmEx reduced his line in October, he had an outstanding balance of $10,000. "I found out by having a business purchase declined," he says. Repeated calls to AmEx failed to yield an answer about why the cut was made. Chaplin-Loebell, who lives in Philadelphia, is now paying the balance under his regular card terms, and presumes the line will free up for new purchases once he's below the limit. "For now, they've essentially frozen the account," he says, leaving him to juggle business expenses on his personal cards. American Express did not respond to requests for comment.

Nasty as it may be, the practice of cutting credit lines below the balance is legal -- at least, for now, says Chi Chi Wu, a staff attorney for the National Consumer Law Center, a consumer advocacy group. Federal Reserve rules requiring lenders to give cardholders 45 days notice before reducing a credit line to the point that it would trigger penalties won't go into effect until July 2010. "[Until] then, there are no federal protections," says Wu.

Congress is also hoping to rein in unscrupulous credit-card practices. In February, Sen. Chris Dodd (D., Conn.), chairman of the U.S. Senate Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs, reintroduced the Credit CARD Act, which among other things, offers cardholder protections like the ability to pay under the existing terms if an account is closed and requiring issuers to lower penalty rates within six months once a cardholder gets back on track with payments. Earlier this month, the House Committee on Financial Services chairman Barney Frank, announced a series of four hearings that will include discussions about credit card reform.

SmartMoney.com contacted both committees to see if they were aware of issuers' practice of cutting credit lines below balances, and if they planned to address it in upcoming hearings. Neither responded to requests for comment.

The motivation among issuers to make such deep cuts that they plunge below a cardholder's balance amount isn't very clear. Usually, issuers cut credit lines to reduce outstanding liabilities -- they sometimes may even chase the balance on riskier accounts with further limit cuts as cardholders pay down debts, explains Bill Carcache, an analyst with investment bank Fox-Pitt Kelton. But cutting below the balance doesn't reduce an issuer's liability: The cardholder still owes the outstanding debt.

One possibility is that this is yet another attempt by card issuers to get consumers to close their accounts (while bringing in a little fee income in the short term), says Dennis Moroney, research director and senior analyst for consulting firm Tower Group. "I can't rationalize in my mind what other motivation there would be," he says.

Paul Pensabene of Saratoga Springs, N.Y., received a statement from HSBC on Dec. 8 that said he had a $359.99 balance and remaining available credit of $8,640. But when he went online to pay the bill several days later, his online account showed that same balance put him over his newly-reduced credit line of $300. And that didn't include the $35 over-limit fee. Pensabene grappled with customer service until they agreed to remove the fee, and then paid the balance in full. "All I could think was, 'Good lord, what if this is happening to someone that couldn't pay their balance off in one shot?'" he says. "They'd end up in default with these fees piling up."

HSBC declined to comment on individual cardholder accounts. Spokeswoman Cindy Savio says the issuer has tightened its credit standards based on the economy. "As we have previously stated, in an effort to reduce credit risk and refine strategies for our card business, we have tightened credit standards, reduced or canceled higher risk credit lines, and closed a number of inactive accounts," she says.

While the fees, frozen accounts and default interest rates resulting from credit-line cuts can sting your finances, they can do some serious long-term damage to your credit score. Your credit utilization ratio -- the total amount of debt you owe in relation to the amount of credit available to you -- accounts for roughly 30% of your score. A credit line cut has the potential to decrease your score by 50 points or more if you don't have much other available credit, says Craig Watts, spokesman for FICO, the company that calculates and issues the credit score that most lenders use.

Even cuts that are close to the balance have the potential to devastate if they're not caught quickly. Luckily for Carol Gressett of Decatur, Miss., she noticed the reduction in her Discover-branded Sam's Club card limit just days after it happened. The limit was cut to within $100 of her $3,000 balance. The official letter notifying her of the reduction arrived three weeks later. "We could easily have gone over if I hadn't been paying attention," she says.

(A Discover spokesperson says GE Money issues the cards, and so is responsible for managing credit lines. GE Money did not respond to requests for comment.)
Copyrighted, SmartMoney.com. All Rights Reserved.
 
No,I'm not yet convinced to avoid using credit cards. Try to rent a car without one.

However, there are certainly dangers involved with the use of credit cards,especially if you carry a balance.
 
No,I'm not yet convinced to avoid using credit cards. Try to rent a car without one.

However, there are certainly dangers involved with the use of credit cards,especially if you carry a balance.
Okay, for some reason this sounded dirty to me coming from RR. I don't know how that happened.
 
I will continue using credit cards indefinitely. I always buy gasoline with one, since it is so much easier. I use them for other things too, but am paying them down now. :cool:

As long as you don't find yourself buying groceries with a CC, you are probably not in trouble yet. :eek:
 
Credit cards, like many other aspects of modern life

are a necessary evil. I believe that as long as I'm a viable corporate entity, the use of these items will be a necessity. It is true that these companies are waging a war on some card-holders but little can be done to change these tactics since they are quite legal if not ethical. Thank the past thirty-odd years of deregulation in the name of 'global competitiveness' for the lack of functional controls on these 'banks' and their policies.......
 
This article (the posting of which is a copyright violation, by the way) isn't about avoiding using credit cards; it's about running up debt on credit cards. Those are two different things. As long as you pay off your balances monthly, there isn't any problem in using credit cards--other than protecting them from thieves.
 
This article (the posting of which is a copyright violation, by the way) isn't about avoiding using credit cards; it's about running up debt on credit cards. Those are two different things. As long as you pay off your balances monthly, there isn't any problem in using credit cards--other than protecting them from thieves.

That's not entirely true either. If you use a credit card for purchases only and never get a cash advance and pay it off at the end of the month, they might cancel your account. Since you never pay interest, they never make any money on you and why should they keep the account active when there is no benefit for them?
 
That's not entirely true either. If you use a credit card for purchases only and never get a cash advance and pay it off at the end of the month, they might cancel your account. Since you never pay interest, they never make any money on you and why should they keep the account active when there is no benefit for them?


Hasn't happened to me in forty years. I've never run a charge over a month, have six credit cards with high limits, an 830 credit score, and get offers for new cards all of the time. Must be one of them thar urban myths or scare tactics.
 
That's not entirely true either. If you use a credit card for purchases only and never get a cash advance and pay it off at the end of the month, they might cancel your account. Since you never pay interest, they never make any money on you and why should they keep the account active when there is no benefit for them?

That has happened to thousands of card-holders in the UK.

The issuer claimed that it was "reviewing" their credit ratings, but the impact was to close thousands of accounts of people with good credit ratings because the issuer wasn't making enough money from them.

Og
 
No,I'm not yet convinced to avoid using credit cards. Try to rent a car without one.

However, there are certainly dangers involved with the use of credit cards,especially if you carry a balance.
There sure are dangers. I was stunned when I first heard about the intent to do this. I didn't believe it would happen.

I haven't rented a car in ages; you can't use your Visa bank card for that?

In any case, I suppose I should add, "if at all possible".

The shocker was that they did this to a business credit customer. It's bad enough that biz credit is flowing like molasses uphill in Siberia.
 
That's not entirely true either. If you use a credit card for purchases only and never get a cash advance and pay it off at the end of the month, they might cancel your account. Since you never pay interest, they never make any money on you and why should they keep the account active when there is no benefit for them?
Ooooh, Propeller Boy goes off without knowing what he's talking about. Again.

One has to wonder if this behavior is the prelude to several credit card companies going to the brink of bankruptcy?
 
Hasn't happened to me in forty years. I've never run a charge over a month, have six credit cards with high limits, an 830 credit score, and get offers for new cards all of the time. Must be one of them thar urban myths or scare tactics.

Hasn't happened to me either, with a similar usage pattern. Credit card companies charge the merchant for your purchases, so they make some money even if you never have a cash advance or interest charges.

I will only carry one that has no fees associated with it. I get plenty of good offers if I ever needed to replace one of mine.
 
To answer the thread title: No.

I use credit cards. I don't let them use me. There's a big difference between having and using a credit, and relying on it. The first is practical, the second is stupid.

ETA: I see sr71plt already made that point. Oh well, it bears repeating.
 
Ooooh, Propeller Boy goes off without knowing what he's talking about. Again.

One has to wonder if this behavior is the prelude to several credit card companies going to the brink of bankruptcy?


There's scare-tactic theory and then there's documented practice. In this case I'm quite comfortable going with documented practice and letting you go with the scare-tactic theory.
 
True - but it happened immediately after Egg was taken over by Citibank.

Og


OK. But I'll still go with what I've actually experienced over "My uncle Fred heard."

As Fresh Face said, they get fees off routine charges--I use my cards a lot; I just pay them off before there is any interest on balances, and I've never found one not interested in being there if/when I--with my credit rating--decided to suddenly max my cards out on a fling. In fact, they salivate over the possibility that I'll add another one of their cards to the ones I already have.
 
I haven't rented a car in ages; you can't use your Visa bank card for that?

You can, but the rental car companies have different rules for debit cards than they do for credit cards. They all put a hold for a certain amount of money on either type of card, however, many of them hold a much higher amount on a debit/bank card than they do on a credit card; for instance, Avis-Budget will hold $250 on your credit card, but that same hold is $400-$500 (depending on location) if you use your check card. Furthermore, you must have that $400-$500 IN YOUR CHECKING ACCOUNT AT THAT MOMENT, otherwise your card won't go through and they can't generate a rental contract for you. And then you've got several hundred dollars in your checking account that you can't access until sometime after you've returned your vehicle.

With the credit cards, the same rules apply regarding the availability of funds, but if you don't use your credit card to pay bills or buy your groceries or on much of any kind of a regular basis, then you're not really going to miss that $250 for the time that it's being held the way you'll miss that $400-$500 out of your checking account.

You also can't use those pre-paid pieces of plastic to rent a car, at least through Avis-Budget; the system won't accept them. When you return the car you can use any method you like to pay, but you must have a credit card with at least a $250 available balance, or a check card attached to an account with at least a $400-$500 balance, in order for the contract to generate.
 
No,I'm not yet convinced to avoid using credit cards. Try to rent a car without one.

However, there are certainly dangers involved with the use of credit cards,especially if you carry a balance.

I have done it. We have no credit cards. I paid them all off and closed them all out 3 years ago, and we get along with a bank card. True, it is a bit of a hassle renting a car because we have to bring a bank statement, but it's worth it not giving those bloodsucking shitweasels any of my business. Nor will I consider getting another credit card until those unscrupulous ratbastard credit card companies have been brought to heel. As far as I'm concerned, this is one beast that should be left to starve.
 
I have done it. We have no credit cards. I paid them all off and closed them all out 3 years ago, and we get along with a bank card. True, it is a bit of a hassle renting a car because we have to bring a bank statement, but it's worth it not giving those bloodsucking shitweasels any of my business. Nor will I consider getting another credit card until those unscrupulous ratbastard credit card companies have been brought to heel. As far as I'm concerned, this is one beast that should be left to starve.

Too many loopholes in Regulation Z, even with the new amendments. I like your approach. :D
 
True - but it happened immediately after Egg was taken over by Citibank.

Og
And sr71plt doesn't realize that there's no law in the United States that PREVENTS this from happening here.

With globalism, all the benefits go to the corporations and all the drawbacks are born by the rest of us.

You can, but the rental car companies have different rules for debit cards than they do for credit cards. They all put a hold for a certain amount of money on either type of card, however, many of them hold a much higher amount on a debit/bank card than they do on a credit card; for instance, Avis-Budget will hold $250 on your credit card, but that same hold is $400-$500 (depending on location) if you use your check card. Furthermore, you must have that $400-$500 IN YOUR CHECKING ACCOUNT AT THAT MOMENT, otherwise your card won't go through and they can't generate a rental contract for you. And then you've got several hundred dollars in your checking account that you can't access until sometime after you've returned your vehicle....
Yowzers. Times have changed, for the worse.

I have done it. We have no credit cards. I paid them all off and closed them all out 3 years ago, and we get along with a bank card. True, it is a bit of a hassle renting a car because we have to bring a bank statement, but it's worth it not giving those bloodsucking shitweasels any of my business. Nor will I consider getting another credit card until those unscrupulous ratbastard credit card companies have been brought to heel. As far as I'm concerned, this is one beast that should be left to starve.
I'll admit that this route is difficult.

On a side note, is it safe to say that just as subprime mortgages drove up the price of homes, the rampant use of credit has driven up the cost of living, and that the sudden cutback in the use of credit is helping to keep deflation going?
 
And sr71plt doesn't realize that there's no law in the United States that PREVENTS this from happening here.

There's no law against a band of monkeys stripping you in your backyard and making you one of the tribe, either. Doesn't make it happen, though. Which is sort of a pity.

I see you've got your "going postal" image back on your sig line. Suits you.
 
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