Training New Dominants

[SweetGigi]

We all talk about training new pyls and helping them 'find their inner submissive/slave/bottom, but rarely do we speak to the training of new PYLs.

I personally feel Old Gaurd training is best for most people; it allows for the inexperienced to gain knowledge in the lifestyle from the bottom up and helps them see both sides to the pyl/PYL coin.

My question is can a new PYL be trained to the lifestyle by an experienced pyl? Can a senior bottom show a freshman Top the ropes and help them 'find their inner Dominant/Master/Top'?

 

[the captians wench]

With in limits, yes.

I have actually helped guide some one new to being a top. I could teach him about toys and their various effects, and technical things, but I couldn't teach him how to get in my head, or to take charge of the situation. That he had to learn on his own.

 

[naxalite0906]

We all talk about training new pyls and helping them 'find their inner submissive/slave/bottom, but rarely do we speak to the training of new PYLs.

I personally feel Old Gaurd training is best for most people; it allows for the inexperienced to gain knowledge in the lifestyle from the bottom up and helps them see both sides to the pyl/PYL coin.

My question is can a new PYL be trained to the lifestyle by an experienced pyl? Can a senior bottom show a freshman Top the ropes and help them 'find their inner Dominant/Master/Top'?

My question was always "Would the experienced pyl's want to bother with an inexperienced PYL?" I think a bottom could train a PYL with no experience, but it is always a case of whether they are willing to bother and be patient to show them what to do etc. I can see why they wouldnt want to as all the experienced pyl's usually want someone with some experience in order to keep them satisfied.

For me especially, a lot of the learning had to be done myself in terms of reading about the subject in order to at least have an understanding of how it works. I always think that the PYL should make some effort to learn what to do and how to act etc, but obviously experience will be needed at some point too.

 

[Homburg]

We all talk about training new pyls and helping them 'find their inner submissive/slave/bottom, but rarely do we speak to the training of new PYLs.

Two reasons, I'd guess. The first is that inexperienced PYL's don't tend to enjoy admitting their inexperience. So you are not likely to hear too awful much from that crowd. And two, the language, however realistic and practical, does not fit the fantasy that far too many pyl's have.

I personally feel Old Gaurd training is best for most people; it allows for the inexperienced to gain knowledge in the lifestyle from the bottom up and helps them see both sides to the pyl/PYL coin.

Meh. No offense to the Old Guard, but I don't see it. I'm not saying it's a bad idea, but I don't see a need to completely warp my role and do something that I find completely against my grain in order to learn to be a better Top. Not to say that I would not bottom for specific purposes, but that I am not of the opinion that some extended period of service is necessary to be a good Top.

My question is can a new PYL be trained to the lifestyle by an experienced pyl? Can a senior bottom show a freshman Top the ropes and help them 'find their inner Dominant/Master/Top'?

Absolutely. As wenchie said, a seasoned bottom can certainly teach a potential Top the ropes vis a vis toys, techniques, etc. The all-important mental and emotional side needs to come from within though.

 

[rida]

From a pyl point of view:

My question is can a new PYL be trained to the lifestyle by an experienced pyl? Can a senior bottom show a freshman Top the ropes and help them 'find their inner Dominant/Master/Top'?

Yes, I think it is possible. Not only an experienced pyl can teach technical elements when it comes to how to use implements. But I think it can also teach some element of how to get into a pyl mind. Of course each pyl is going to be different, but I would expect an experienced pyl that is willing to take on the role of mentor/teacher to a PYL (see next asnwer for details on this) to have quite some knowledge in relationships and how
submissive tick.

My question was always "Would the experienced pyl's want to bother with an inexperienced PYL?"

In my view, there comes a moment where as a pyl is time to move to a mentoring role. For one reason or another you don't feel like submitting (as in committed power exchange dynamic) anymore because your long term PYL is no longer around or any other reason. Or the demographic is such that it is hard to find a PYL with whom build a committed relationship. Or physical reasons make it harder to play as hard as we used to. In either case, chances are that the itch to be scratched remains. So I would imagine a mentoring role in helping a PYL learn to be something worth considering and perhaps even deeply satisfying on a different level.

This is the way I see my future developing at the moment. I could be totally wrong and time for sure will show me.

 

[SweetGigi]

Meh. No offense to the Old Guard, but I don't see it. I'm not saying it's a bad idea, but I don't see a need to completely warp my role and do something that I find completely against my grain in order to learn to be a better Top. Not to say that I would not bottom for specific purposes, but that I am not of the opinion that some extended period of service is necessary to be a good Top.

For some PYLs, this is certainly understandable. These PYLs are what I refer to a 'naturals'. However, for those who are not naturally dominant, I think serving some time at the bottom can be beneficial to understand that place and what it takes to not only be there but to put someone else there.

 

[MsToriJones]

We all talk about training new pyls and helping them 'find their inner submissive/slave/bottom, but rarely do we speak to the training of new PYLs.

I personally feel Old Gaurd training is best for most people; it allows for the inexperienced to gain knowledge in the lifestyle from the bottom up and helps them see both sides to the pyl/PYL coin.

My question is can a new PYL be trained to the lifestyle by an experienced pyl? Can a senior bottom show a freshman Top the ropes and help them 'find their inner Dominant/Master/Top'?

The new PYLs get trained also. I turn to many for learning. I asked a veteran PYL to be my teacher/mentor.....he said yes, thus I am learning. I also learn from everyone I meet in the lifestyle in one form or another. I listen, thus I learn. I watch, thus I learn. I bottom, thus I learn. I ask questions, thus I learn. And when I top, I let the bottom know that I want feedback and that is my way to continue to learn.

As for Old Guard - that style of training is not for everyone. I respect the men of past that we now call Old Guard. I respect their traditions, which I am working on learning myself. But it is true that if someone does not respect those traditions or wish to learn that way, it won't work. You can be a GREAT PYL with out having gone from the bottom up, I know a few. I think the key is, PYLs who don't seek knowledge and training may not be the best for pyls to want to be with.

 

[intothewoods]

For some PYLs, this is certainly understandable. These PYLs are what I refer to a 'naturals'. However, for those who are not naturally dominant, I think serving some time at the bottom can be beneficial to understand that place and what it takes to not only be there but to put someone else there.

I personally don't like the term "naturally dominant" for a variety of reasons, but primarily because natural, nature, etc. is such a loaded term and one which means different things to different people. People tend to put a whole lotta everything under the term natural, sometimes to the point where it's the explanation for everything.

That said, some people in the Old Guard, or heavy lifestylers I guess you might say, seem to utilize a lot of rules, formality and ritual. I can appreciate that on some level, but it's not what I prefer in a PYL for a D/s relationship. For casual play, you betcha! (sorry, bad Sarah Palin reference...) But anyway, while I have never gleaned enough of all that to be able to train someone, and I don't enjoy training or being trained in general, I know bottoms who easily could and would probably enjoy it. I know plenty of bottoms who Top as part of service to their PYLs, and I don't see it as all that different.

 

[Homburg]

For some PYLs, this is certainly understandable. These PYLs are what I refer to a 'naturals'. However, for those who are not naturally dominant, I think serving some time at the bottom can be beneficial to understand that place and what it takes to not only be there but to put someone else there.

I can understand why some would. I just don't the mentality that says it is THE way.

In my own case, I've helped a number of nascent Tops, but only really trained one, my buddy AP. He picked up the basic toppy skills okay, but never could wrap his brain around the intricate stuff, or around the psychology of the experience. He's got the right smell, which excites inexperienced pyl's, but lacks that emphemeral whatever that really makes the whole thing come together. This is why I say that there is something that has to come from within.

 

[intothewoods]

I can understand why some would. I just don't the mentality that says it is THE way.

In my own case, I've helped a number of nascent Tops, but only really trained one, my buddy AP. He picked up the basic toppy skills okay, but never could wrap his brain around the intricate stuff, or around the psychology of the experience. He's got the right smell, which excites inexperienced pyl's, but lacks that emphemeral whatever that really makes the whole thing come together. This is why I say that there is something that has to come from within.

Smells like Dom spirit? Nice.

 

[SweetGigi]

I personally don't like the term "naturally dominant" for a variety of reasons, but primarily because natural, nature, etc. is such a loaded term and one which means different things to different people. People tend to put a whole lotta everything under the term natural, sometimes to the point where it's the explanation for everything.

I am not a big fan of the generalizations either. Labels are for mason jars I say. However you have to admit some things come to people more naturally than others. Just as H said above, his friend AP has most of it down pat, but the fine points are missing. While Hommie may not be the person to show him how to obtain those finer details, I personally believe someone else might be able to.

 

[SweetGigi]

I can understand why some would. I just don't the mentality that says it is THE way.

In my own case, I've helped a number of nascent Tops, but only really trained one, my buddy AP. He picked up the basic toppy skills okay, but never could wrap his brain around the intricate stuff, or around the psychology of the experience. He's got the right smell, which excites inexperienced pyl's, but lacks that emphemeral whatever that really makes the whole thing come together. This is why I say that there is something that has to come from within.

Agreed, it isn't the best route for all, but for some it is a good way to gain an understanding they otherwise can't obtain.

as to your friend, you sorta proved my point. While you, as another dom, can't show him the finer details, he might be able to learn that from a pyl who he cares for and can 'get inside of'. Or he might find some useful information from serving as a bottom occasionally to 'see the other side'.

 

[WriterDom]

Of course, if the desire is there you can teach anything. But taking a completely vanilla guy who is alien to the lifestyle and converting him, well, that usually fails.

 

[SweetGigi]

.....But taking a completely vanilla guy who is alien to the lifestyle and converting him, well, that usually fails.

Of course, hun, but that is not what I am referring to here.

 

[Netzach]

First of all, which Old Guard? What club? What region?

A guy who mentored me, and I've been mentored by different people for different things, was actually brought up that way, and it's really not possible in this climate to BE "Old Guard Trained" because you need a core constituency of people in your own city who share the same understanding of the same "rules." Also, if you don't have a penis, you're in your own club. Sometimes OG Leathermen would have polite and distanced encounters with Pros from the era, to learn from them or share bits and pieces with them, but these would be very particular, trusted, and vetted women of the fetish scene for a long time, and that was about as "mixed" as that scene would get.

If you mean "should a Top bottom" IMO, yes. Just like I think a serious student of Italian Renaissance art should at some point go to Florence. I'm pretty unpopular for that POV in the current climate, but so what. I have a better sensory understanding of almost all the implements in my arsenal than I would have had I not bottomed a bunch, I have a more gut-level understanding and empathy than I would have had I not when I'm out there destroying an ego erotically - than I would have had I never played my own edges.

This really has nothing to do with anyone else. If they want to take some other path to get these kinds of results that's up to them, but I honestly think this is what "fast tracked" me to an extent - this is a physical and emotional game and sense memory and emotional things are probably best absorbed on physical and emotional levels.

"But you're a switch, you like bottoming you got something out of it I never would because I hate bottoming."

I'm a human being with a functional brain and endorphins. Chances are, you are too.
Also, I don't "like" it. I think a lot of experiences I dislike have been very good for me though.
I probably hate being out of control more than anything I can think of. I also recognize "growth experience" when one is holding out its hand to me saying "come on man, try it."

It's a tempremental thing. If you're kind of an experiential junkie, if you're a novophile, if you've had a daredevil impulse that's never had any other outlet and something you believe to be as safe as a good roller coaster ride is available to you you'll say "fuck it" and climb on at least once.

I can describe a Mark Rothko painting and what it does to me for pages and you will be bored. You WILL not "get it." If I stand you in front of Mark Rothko's paintings in the Museum of Modern art, some people will go "oh, God, whatever, dull" some people will break out crying and not know why (it's documented this happens often) and most people will find themselves oddly, emotionally, somewhat - affected, they'll be engaged, they'll stick around and look even if they hate modern art. But you have to stand in front of one and a reproduction and a ten paragraph description will not get you there.

I know that sounds terribly arrogant, but enough people have dispensed enough surprise at how much I know and how young I am and how good I am at X Y and Z that I think it's a good, reliable "fast tracking" mechanism that most Dominants will do anything now to avoid, and even be pooh poohed at if they admit this was how they learned.

The whole scene has gotten very disrespectfully AGAINST bottoming as a learning strategy.

 

[Netzach]

The best teachers I've had though, the people I've listened to most have been experienced bottoms.

I really feel like casual play has worked well for me, not empty play, but the experience to play hard with a vast variety of individuals and to talk to some really special and talkative men (mostly) about their experiences. I've been very humbled by a lot of the men I worked with as a pro - I think the best teachers a top will ever have are their bottoms to a large extent, particularly the very experienced ones.

Two of the best ones I've had were Tops in the scene who had gotten restless and wanted to experience something else, they were very much "I'm a masochist and I like to make pretty ladies smile, I'm not submissive" types. "I'm not submissive" in the pro scene is pretty much code for "I'm not a caricature of a submissive and I have a brain and I bring it here."

 

[SweetGigi]

*swoons*

Yet another FINE example of why I often crush on you, Netz.

To answer your question, I was not refering to any specific club or location. More-so I was referring to the idea/concept/therory of Old Gaurd. I understand some PYLs don't have the necessary equipment to be a member an Old Gaurd club and I think frankly most wouldn't have what it takes to be part of one whether they wanted to be members or not. Mostly the concept is what is important to me. There is a tight knit group of kinksters here in ATL who take pride in raising 'their own'; I suppose this is what I was referring to. I agree, though, for a lot of people starting at the bottom is a beneficial way to gain insight and control.

Thank you, N.

 

[Homburg]

Smells like Dom spirit? Nice.

*shrug* Smell was the best euphemism that I could think of at the moment.

--

Agreed, it isn't the best route for all, but for some it is a good way to gain an understanding they otherwise can't obtain.

as to your friend, you sorta proved my point. While you, as another dom, can't show him the finer details, he might be able to learn that from a pyl who he cares for and can 'get inside of'. Or he might find some useful information from serving as a bottom occasionally to 'see the other side'.

I agreed with the initial post. For all I know, a good pyl might just teach. I don't really think so, not because of any great respect for my own abilities, but because more than one experienced pyl has said "He's a Dom?" when I mentioned him in conversation. It's the idea that not everyone has it in them to do this.

That said, he is an aggressive, toppy sort of person, and is really into rough sex. That does it just fine for some people *shrug*.

--

If you mean "should a Top bottom" IMO, yes. Just like I think a serious student of Italian Renaissance art should at some point go to Florence. I'm pretty unpopular for that POV in the current climate, but so what. I have a better sensory understanding of almost all the implements in my arsenal than I would have had I not bottomed a bunch, I have a more gut-level understanding and empathy than I would have had I not when I'm out there destroying an ego erotically - than I would have had I never played my own edges.

See, i can understand it from this specific perspective. I have no major problem with bottoming, and would do it with the right person. The issue I have is the common tale, however accurate, of having to serve as a submissive for a year and a day, or whatever, prior to learning to top. No thank you. I may stand still for a flogging, but I have no desire to kneel before anyone, for any reason. This is the issue I have.

Hell, I've bottomed for needleplay while I was learning. Was it a lot of needles? No, but I still did it. Will I serve? Mmm, no.

 

[Netzach]

See, i can understand it from this specific perspective. I have no major problem with bottoming, and would do it with the right person. The issue I have is the common tale, however accurate, of having to serve as a submissive for a year and a day, or whatever, prior to learning to top. No thank you. I may stand still for a flogging, but I have no desire to kneel before anyone, for any reason. This is the issue I have.

Hell, I've bottomed for needleplay while I was learning. Was it a lot of needles? No, but I still did it. Will I serve? Mmm, no.

We're gonna agree to disagree on this. I'm not exactly a person who pines to kneel at the feet of anyone either. But I think there's something about humility, dignity, and service, there's something about polishing shoes and being *down* that's expansive and important, and I'm glad I made myself try it. If you think your slave/bottom etc. isn't in a state of just as much struggle between the image she/he holds of her/himself as a strong independent upright respectable person and a lowly bootlicker as you are, you're kidding yourself. We're all given massive injections of "up good down bad". And I felt like I owed it to the people I was going to take on, to be able to say "I have been where you are right now, yes, it's very hard what I ask of you."


I do agree though on the "year and a day" kind of thing, or that you must do this BEFORE you ever dare top or something. I was playing top and bottom concurrently and I think this was good, it screwed with my head enough for people to see that I could bottom and pigeonhole me as slave in denial.


Kudos on the needles though. Didja like it? I got really freaking high, giggly even.

 

[Homburg]

We're gonna agree to disagree on this. I'm not exactly a person who pines to kneel at the feet of anyone either. But I think there's something about humility, dignity, and service, there's something about polishing shoes and being *down* that's expansive and important, and I'm glad I made myself try it. If you think your slave/bottom etc. isn't in a state of just as much struggle between the image she/he holds of her/himself as a strong independent upright respectable person and a lowly bootlicker as you are, you're kidding yourself. We're all given massive injections of "up good down bad".

Eh. And I say that for a very specific reason, and that is my view on power structures is different due to my upbringing. I was a military brat from day one, and you are positively immersed in power structures in that sort of life. When you ar ein the military, you know the rank of everyone you deal. When you are a military dependent, you know the rank of any other dependent's sponsor. That's just how it went.

I was raised to say sir and ma'am, and to offer respect where it was due, and "due" was a pretty broad range. Now, find me a Top that wants a salute instead of a bended knee and I might be more flexible. The bottom line for me is that I understand my psychology. Deeply ingrained from a young child forward were rules on how you treat authority. It's a different mindset.

Hell, I left the SCA because I couldn't take the idea of kneeling at court.

I do agree though on the "year and a day" kind of thing, or that you must do this BEFORE you ever dare top or something. I was playing top and bottom concurrently and I think this was good, it screwed with my head enough for people to see that I could bottom and pigeonhole me as slave in denial.

I guess I feel like I don't need it because I understand being on the bottom from that perspective of rank.

Kudos on the needles though. Didja like it? I got really freaking high, giggly even.

Nope. It burned a bit. Didn't much care for it. Then again, I dont even feel smaller gauge needles at all, and my skin is more than a bit thick. So certain types of pain just don't do it for me. That said, as I've mentioned, deep tissue stripping on my neck just melts me into a pile of endorphin-happy goo. This is another reason why I "get" the bottom mindset. I would do a lot to get that particular pain/sensation. Fortunately, "a lot" in that case, meant beating, tying, etc on the massuese that was working on me. It was an equitable arrangement in my eyes.

 

[Netzach]

Eh. And I say that for a very specific reason, and that is my view on power structures is different due to my upbringing. I was a military brat from day one, and you are positively immersed in power structures in that sort of life. When you ar ein the military, you know the rank of everyone you deal. When you are a military dependent, you know the rank of any other dependent's sponsor. That's just how it went.

I was raised to say sir and ma'am, and to offer respect where it was due, and "due" was a pretty broad range. Now, find me a Top that wants a salute instead of a bended knee and I might be more flexible. The bottom line for me is that I understand my psychology. Deeply ingrained from a young child forward were rules on how you treat authority. It's a different mindset.

Hell, I left the SCA because I couldn't take the idea of kneeling at court.




I guess I feel like I don't need it because I understand being on the bottom from that perspective of rank.



Nope. It burned a bit. Didn't much care for it. Then again, I dont even feel smaller gauge needles at all, and my skin is more than a bit thick. So certain types of pain just don't do it for me. That said, as I've mentioned, deep tissue stripping on my neck just melts me into a pile of endorphin-happy goo. This is another reason why I "get" the bottom mindset. I would do a lot to get that particular pain/sensation. Fortunately, "a lot" in that case, meant beating, tying, etc on the massuese that was working on me. It was an equitable arrangement in my eyes.

Yeah, these are good examples of extrapolation. I also think it's fair to remember that I was 23 at this point and had led a fairly weird existence, in a lot of ways had never been exposed to normal social contract at home for sure, and learned most social skills in my academic setting. For this reason, hierarchy and approval weren't terrifying or humiliating things to me in and of themselves, provided the authority was a deserving one and not a beaurocratic one.

One can draw on life experience like this and do nicely. I think, though that when you're dealing with experience vacuums on life and SM levels, rather than telling people "come back when you're older" it's a good idea to foster valid experience. At this point, I don't need to feel out of control for the sake of wisdom, I had the lesson drilled into me by my immune system quite marvelously.

In a lot of these old guard examples, you had people entering the scene at 19 and 20 and staying in it till death. It makes sense that some people's orientations and desires would change over that long a trajectory. It wasn't just a question of sexuality, it was a way for men to take care of their own and create families who had no biological familial support - Daddy/boy is a kind of rift-healing when you are looking at this through the lens of gay history, and in a lot of ways the notion of responsibility coming with maturity is organic and reasonable. The timeline doesn't mesh with a lot of the scene now, where you have people getting formally involved much later in life for the most part.

I don't think you can overlay the contemporary straight leather experience over the gay leather experience of 45 years ago and make sense of anything much by doing so. Yeah, we may not win popularity contests, but after the seventies we're in a whole other world of acceptance and legitimacy. Daddy/boy and Daddy/girl may function as psychic balm for some people with familial problems, but you don't have entire communities with the experience of universal family rejection.

 

[LFO]

Yes, I know this is a serious topic for good reasons but...

The subject line gave me a horrible mental image of a bunch of sweaty guys in black leather in some sort of bizarre boot camp....

 

[the captians wench]

Nope. It burned a bit. Didn't much care for it. Then again, I dont even feel smaller gauge needles at all, and my skin is more than a bit thick. So certain types of pain just don't do it for me. That said, as I've mentioned, deep tissue stripping on my neck just melts me into a pile of endorphin-happy goo. This is another reason why I "get" the bottom mindset. I would do a lot to get that particular pain/sensation. Fortunately, "a lot" in that case, meant beating, tying, etc on the massuese that was working on me. It was an equitable arrangement in my eyes.

Gotta love the bartar system. Anytime I can get 5 one hour long heavy pain sessions for a few hours work in making a kilt, it's a good trade...even better when they take pics.

 

[Homburg]

Yeah, these are good examples of extrapolation. I also think it's fair to remember that I was 23 at this point and had led a fairly weird existence, in a lot of ways had never been exposed to normal social contract at home for sure, and learned most social skills in my academic setting. For this reason, hierarchy and approval weren't terrifying or humiliating things to me in and of themselves, provided the authority was a deserving one and not a beaurocratic one.

For my first 18 years, I lived in authority-land. Every once in a while I get these bizarro-world moments of cognitive dissonance when dealing with people that can't even comprehend the military life. Examples would be young folks raised in an environment like you are talking about. There are very few military bases in the NYC area, so a kid raised there is just not going to have a concept of that life beyond what they se ein the movies, or when grandpa talks about the war.

To be honest, I think that the environment had a strongly positive effect on me, and is probably the only reason why I'm not as much of an insufferable prick as I otherwise would be. I have all these great role models of strong, willful, effective men, warriors, that obey, serve, and lead as part of a whole. I don' tlook down on people that serve any more than I venerate those that lead, as each is needed for the other to fucntion, and I recognise that people can move from one role to the other and it is neither inherently progression nor regression, simply change.

One can draw on life experience like this and do nicely. I think, though that when you're dealing with experience vacuums on life and SM levels, rather than telling people "come back when you're older" it's a good idea to foster valid experience. At this point, I don't need to feel out of control for the sake of wisdom, I had the lesson drilled into me by my immune system quite marvelously.

In a lot of these old guard examples, you had people entering the scene at 19 and 20 and staying in it till death. It makes sense that some people's orientations and desires would change over that long a trajectory. It wasn't just a question of sexuality, it was a way for men to take care of their own and create families who had no biological familial support - Daddy/boy is a kind of rift-healing when you are looking at this through the lens of gay history, and in a lot of ways the notion of responsibility coming with maturity is organic and reasonable. The timeline doesn't mesh with a lot of the scene now, where you have people getting formally involved much later in life for the most part.

This is a sensical view. I hadn't really thought of the leather family as a surrogate family. Makes perfect sense though. One of these days I'll get off my butt and read more into that side.

I don't think you can overlay the contemporary straight leather experience over the gay leather experience of 45 years ago and make sense of anything much by doing so. Yeah, we may not win popularity contests, but after the seventies we're in a whole other world of acceptance and legitimacy. Daddy/boy and Daddy/girl may function as psychic balm for some people with familial problems, but you don't have entire communities with the experience of universal family rejection.

*nod* Probably another reason why it doesn't directly resonate with me. The whole D/lg thing is a non-starter for me, regardless of how much nurture and indulgence I might put into my relationships.

--

Gotta love the bartar system. Anytime I can get 5 one hour long heavy pain sessions for a few hours work in making a kilt, it's a good trade...even better when they take pics.

If I didn't know better, I'd think that you were doing the message board equivalent of waving your lacey underthings out the window at me.

 

[DVS]

I'm not into the old guard thing at all. I just lost the chance to be with a great submissive woman, because she was looking for an old guard relationship. Using old guard style in teaching someone? I guess it's possible, if you are into that style of things in the beginning. But, not everybody is. It's just not me. OK, maybe I'm a bit weird, but I don't do a lot of things like other Doms. But, I get the job done.


Can an experienced pyl teach a newbie PYL, with or without old guard? Yes, to a point.

Like the captians wench said...

With in limits, yes.

I have actually helped guide some one new to being a top. I could teach him about toys and their various effects, and technical things, but I couldn't teach him how to get in my head, or to take charge of the situation. That he had to learn on his own.

The basics can be learned, but certain things must be there from the beginning. You can train a Dom, if he has the basic desires, but you can't can't create those desires.