Are labels a help or hindrance in BDSM?

[Daddy2mylilgirl]

Think about it:

Are you a sub?
Are you a slave?
Are you a collared sub/slave?
Are you an owned sub/slave?
Are you a little girl?
Are you a bottom?
Are you a switch?
Are you a Top?
Are you a Dom?
Are you a Master?
Are you a DaddyDom?
Are you in a M/s relationship?
Are you in a D/s relationship?
Are you in a TPE relationship?
Are you in a 24/7 relationship?
Are you in a Daddy/little girl relationship?
Etc..

Why is there such a need to label everything and everyone? I understand it helps people find each other and to help identify the feelings they have.

But why can't the individual stay an individual and just tell the other person how they feel without having to put a label on themselves? Why can't the people who are in relationship just go on how they feel and not have to label what they are or each other?

Would that make them less of a "Dom/Master/sub/slave/etc." if they did?

I think the problem is, especially with beginners in the lifestyle, that people feel the need to fit perfectly into one label. That you can't mix and match as your feelings dictate but you must pick one and try your best to be perfect at it when you might identify with multiple labels.

 

[OregonGal]

Labels in relationships are universal, what is difficult when it comes to BDSM style relationships is there isnt a generalized accepted definition of labels...

They exist everywhere, the hang up comes when we try to fit into others definitions of said labels rather than learning the nuances of each and yes, accepting that we/they/he/she likely fits in more than one category. It is human nature to categorize, to judge by what we believe is true and accurate and then apply said judgements to others.. the downfall comes when we refuse to accept that our judgements are inaccurate... that some how because we tried labeling without full knowledge... that we are flawed in either an unacceptable manner or that said flaw of judgement defines our whole self instead of being open to the idea that 1. others may have different views on definitions and 2. we ARE human and can make mistakes.

I personally dont think that anyone, including myself is 'less of...' anything by using or not using labels that others try to apply and apply several to myself when helping others understand who and what I am.. if they are truly interested in that and not looking 'just' to label me... if that is the case, anything I say wouldnt matter anyway, those that seek only that aspect of knowledge about me arent interested in me, only an aspect of themselves.

 

[FurryFury]

Yes and no.

 

[angelspassion4u]

To me labels are just a starting point. But they can be a double edge sword, too. They don't totally define a person. I am a person, mother, sub, little girl, and a kitten. I label myself as a sub only so when someone looks at first they will know that I am not a Domme or a slave. I would hope they would continue to read and get to know the full me.
When starting out looking I will look for one la bled Dom instead of Domme or switch. But I will continue to read and find out more about the person. To see if they have aspects of what I am looking for. I don't let that one label totally define the person however.

 

[Kajira Callista]

hinderance and only because the majority thinks slaves are mindless morons who cant think for themselves... if at all.

 

[NALA CAYENNE]

hinderance and only because the majority thinks slaves are mindless morons who cant think for themselves... if at all.

Don't forget that there are also those that think submissives/slaves are weak...

 

[BiBunny]

And that Dom/mes are assholes. And that switches can't make up their minds. The prejudices aren't just limited to the pyl side of the equation, I assure you.

 

[Keeper_of_Fi]

OregonGal nailed it.

Labels in and of themselves are not a hindrance or a help, it all depends on the usage.

 

[rgraham666]

Both, as is usually the case.

 

[YourCaptor]

They are helpful, and only become a hindrances when people take them as definitions instead of as a class.

The labels are not what identify us, we identify as a label.

You just got to leave the human element in, you know what I mean.

Anyway, I think they are helpful because they are convenient.

How does that old saying go,
“meaning are in people, not in words”

 

[ultramarineblue]

Labels are somewhat similar to first impressions. Often people rely solely on their first impression of someone, never taking the time to get to know that person. Then months later they are disappointed when that person doesn't live up to that first impression. I think the same could be said when someone labels another person.

They can help as a starting point if everyone had the same definitions but we do not. We each bring different experiences to the table that color our definitions. I just make it my hope that the people I choose to spend my time with are open minded enough to consider possibilities and are willing to hear someone else's viewpoint and discuss it.

 

[EmpressFi]

I think it's back to depending upon the person.. some people need to have a label, a security blanket they can cling to, that they identify with ... some people need the label to tell them which group they belong to. I think the hinderance is when we allow other to apply the labels to ourselves. If someone thinks.. I am a <label> and someone comes along, especially if they have more experience or even if they carry themselves with a level of confidence that it lends to the appearance that they speak more authoritatively.. and this person says, "No, you're not a <label>, you do x,y,z and dont do a,b,c. Therefore, you are a <alternative label>. Then the label no longer identifies who we think we are, where we belong, but where we allow someone else to pigeonhole us. And unless that person is your PYL, then they dont really have the right to do that, to apply the label.

 

[subbie_333]

Why is there such a need to label everything and everyone? I understand it helps people find each other and to help identify the feelings they have.

But why can't the individual stay an individual and just tell the other person how they feel without having to put a label on themselves? Why can't the people who are in relationship just go on how they feel and not have to label what they are or each other?

Labels are a good place to start, specifically when it comes to "personals", and, to narrow down a search and discussions. But, yeah, labels can be too narrow or broad, and, sometimes people intentionally pick something for themselves that is misleading. Perhaps labels are best used by a person as a shorthand to describe themselves to others, at least as an icebreaker. People seem to get upset when they are labeled something else by others and they feel that they have to prove that they are what they label themselves to be.

 

[Yasashii_Kaze]

I agree with the general idea that labels can be a good place to begin. When I first started out in the lifestyle, it was so important for me to have a label, to know where I fit in and who I was. I'm not saying that was a bad thing, but now it's just not necessary. I know who I am and I don't need that distinction anymore.

 

[00Syd]

Labels have been really bothering me lately.

For the last few months I've been dipping my toes into the lifestyle and testing the waters. I can't even begin to count the amount of times I've already been asked "so, are you a sub or a slave?" which, for some reason, really, really bothers me. I figure my "label" or "status" or whatever the fuck is going to fluctuate depending on who I'm with, y'know? I know that people only ask so that they can get some feel of where I stand, and I don't fault them for it, but for some reason the question just really bothers me.

Also when people ask me "well, what do you like?" And I can give some pretty general answers to that, but everyone wants specifics, and, you know, I just don't know because I haven't tried it all yet. "But what do you think you'll like?"

Gah!

 

[cherokee_dove]

If we apply the labels to ourselves, knowing our own ways and wants; then they are ok as a first hand glimpse for another to see of us.

But after that initial glimpse or date, meet, chat; etc...it takes talking from both sides to get to know each other. And to see if each others ways and wants, along with their individual personalities; tells both parties involved that the other person is someone they want to take the time to get to know.

 

[rida]

Labels are just words. As a tool for communicate in a quick and efficient way, they are a necessary evil.

But as cherokee_dove said, after the initial glimpse, you need to take the time to talk and to really get to know each other. And since we still need words to talk with each other, sometimes it can be important to define what each word mean to us.

To me is something akin to the fact of speaking with someone whose mother tongue is different than ours or in a language that is different than ours. We might use words meaning different things and the only way to understand each other is to come clean with the definitions.

I guess that because different languages is something I have seen and dealt all my life, I am used to it and it does not frustrate me that much.

 

[minx1]

Labels can be helpful and equally a hinderance. Its good to have something that people can understand a relate too. Yet at the same time I think generally people (me included) place too much emphasis on trying to put everything into a box...ok I have these feelings so I must fit neatly into that category. We all know it isn't that simple eh. As people we aren't necessarily neat..we are complex and need to be less rigid and more fluid.
Thats why as labels go I prefer pyl. I know I fit roughly into that category. Though I'm not sure how switches fair with that...perhaps there should be a pyl, PYL and a pYl *smiles*

 

[the_mgp]

**********

 

[catalina_francisco]

Labels are what you make them. If you want to use them as a tool for negative judgment, you will find another way to do that if the label isn't there. Personally I find in a forum such as this it gives some help in understanding where a person is coming from, what their approach may be to particular discussions, what might make them tick. Similarly I also find at times that gender, age and location can also lend to reading the words as they are perhaps meant more so than interpreted from the reader's reality, not the posters. Let's face it, if it didn't matter or hold any relevance as to which label fit us best, we perhaps wouldn't be posting on a BDSM forum.

Catalina

 

[Netzach]

Labels have been really bothering me lately.

For the last few months I've been dipping my toes into the lifestyle and testing the waters. I can't even begin to count the amount of times I've already been asked "so, are you a sub or a slave?" which, for some reason, really, really bothers me. I figure my "label" or "status" or whatever the fuck is going to fluctuate depending on who I'm with, y'know? I know that people only ask so that they can get some feel of where I stand, and I don't fault them for it, but for some reason the question just really bothers me.

Also when people ask me "well, what do you like?" And I can give some pretty general answers to that, but everyone wants specifics, and, you know, I just don't know because I haven't tried it all yet. "But what do you think you'll like?"

Gah!

This is where they're really really annoying.

They're helpful for some people, and for some people I really think they do a lot more harm than good. If you fit the really stock definitions of things they may feel very great in a gee whiz I finally have words for this way - if you do NOT it's more annoyance than anything, as the SM world promptly tends to forget about the really basic facets of being human and the fact that most of us anyway, are stuck with the grind of keeping a roof overhead and food on the table to the extent that it means we've got to be flexible and diverse and sexuality isn't the be all end all of existence. This is also part of what lends interest to people - in a lot of ways the least interesting aspect of my time with H is that he's my slave - it's all the other stuff that makes the interaction rich.

Some people HAVE to have the label upfront.

I set a date with my husband honestly having no idea if he was even another Dom/Top type of person. I wanted to spend more time with him, he was attractive and interesting as hell. Eventually, yes, there had to be a comparing of notes and some compatibility across categories, but I don't think that everything descends into mass chaos if you can't pigeonhole each other immediately.

 

[madetotakeit]

I think labels are helpful in an introductory sense. It lets the person I am talking to know I am not a slave, a switch, or a Domme. (Although for some reason I am still approached by male pyls. *shrug*) Fortunately I define myself. I do not rely on someone else's definition to determine who I am. I apply what I can associate with and what appeals to me and incorporate it into my own identity. I anticipate evolving, adding some things and removing others. I know who I am as a person. I know who I am as a woman. I also have a good grasp of who I am as a submissive. If someone cares to know what that means to me, they will ask questions and be given answers. Identifying with the label of sub simply gives them a jumping off point.

I look at it similar to filling out a standardized form. Sex: male or female-check female. That one is easy. Race: Do I check Caucasian because by the governments definition I would fall into that category? Do I chose Native American because under the Cherokee definition that is what I fall into? Or do I chose what I associate myself as? I base my answer on who created the form and what its purpose is. If it is a government form I go with Caucasian because I can not prove to the satisfaction of the BIA that I have enough blood to label myself as a Native American in their eyes. If it is something related to Native Americans I go with Eastern Band because I do qualify in their eyes. Do I view myself differently because I chose one label? No, I don't. I have just made it easier for the concerned entity to know where to place me. If they want to know about who I am to me, I'll be glad to answer anything they ask.

 

[kinkyknickers]

I like labels. They help me choose which clothes I will buy.

Not very useful when people shopping however. Sizes are usually false and care instructions are always wrong. Sometimes I have bought men by what they said on their label and when I get them home they are much smaller than the label said.
Also, I do not like dry clean only people. They are too high maintainance.
I do like people who are 50% spandex. Very useful.

KK

 

[the_mgp]

**********

 

[kinkyknickers]

Yeah like that one (show off)!