kinked_a_bit
Nah
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whatever
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yeah...
- Thread starter kinked_a_bit
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schism666
cold and ugly
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we're not going to major war with anyone anytime soon.
if we did, it would end existence as we know and there would be nothing to fight for, people would stay with there families until the lights go out for good.
fatalists like you bring absolutely nothing to the american table.
fuck off.
if we did, it would end existence as we know and there would be nothing to fight for, people would stay with there families until the lights go out for good.
fatalists like you bring absolutely nothing to the american table.
fuck off.
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The O.P. seemed to be on the right track for a good discussion, before he had to let his typically bigoted and xenophobic "Down with immigrants!" views creep in.
To sum up, I believe plenty of Americans would fight for our country if it was attacked or threatened by an external threat, as it was in World War 2, or in 2001 when recruitment was off the charts, loyal Americans wanted to fight back against what had been done to their country.
But, understandably, relatively few people want to join the military to fight in meaningless wars halfway across the globe against countries that were never a threat to the U.S., who never attacked the U.S., and which, even defeating these countries militarily changes nothing for the better in the U.S. America's over-ambitions adventures in Vietnam, Iraq, or even Afghanistan (20 years later, after the initial rout of the Taliban in 2001) was not really a great selling point for new military recruits.
To sum up, I believe plenty of Americans would fight for our country if it was attacked or threatened by an external threat, as it was in World War 2, or in 2001 when recruitment was off the charts, loyal Americans wanted to fight back against what had been done to their country.
But, understandably, relatively few people want to join the military to fight in meaningless wars halfway across the globe against countries that were never a threat to the U.S., who never attacked the U.S., and which, even defeating these countries militarily changes nothing for the better in the U.S. America's over-ambitions adventures in Vietnam, Iraq, or even Afghanistan (20 years later, after the initial rout of the Taliban in 2001) was not really a great selling point for new military recruits.
schism666
cold and ugly
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that's because the sane part of his post (first paragraph) is lifted from the link. when he used his own words is when the ignorance and xenophobia kicked in
RoryN
You're screwed.
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schism666
cold and ugly
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there's literally dozens of movies about hippies protesting just vietnam alone.
YDB95
Literotica Guru
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that's because the sane part of his post (first paragraph) is lifted from the link. when he used his own words is when the ignorance and xenophobia kicked in
Typical, wingnuts always read their pet issues into everything. (And yes, it happens on the left too. The difference is, the far left is all but powerless while the far right is not.)
Chernosoth
sothiness
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The nation's cracks are widening. Loyalties are becoming more regional, partisan, classist, etc. And home/mobile electronic entertainment has replaced many activities that kept people close enough to soldier fitness and outdoor competence.
BabyBoomer50s
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Some of America’s smartest, most fearless, and strongest young people serve in the US armed services. We need more of them. Grateful to all who serve and served in the past.
schism666
cold and ugly
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we're refuting you because you're a liar.
ll74
Your Best Friend
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They need better incentives. A free college ride was the way they did it in the 80s and 90s. Someone needs to get creative and find something that is modern and works in the Internet age.
Certainly better marketing.
Either way, RG posts about this about once a week
Certainly better marketing.
Either way, RG posts about this about once a week
Sean Renaud
The West Coast Pop
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Neither Hitler nor Hirohito had any intentions of attacking the American Mainland and neither would have any realistic chance of conquering us. I won't argue that was a war that was worthy of us getting involved with, I'm just saying that pretending that war was defensive for the US is absolute revisionist history.
There are other factors keeping people from joining the military and these things were evident. Players weren't mandated to be on the field for the National Anthem until 2009. This isn't some ancient tradition. Its the exact same reason why almost every Transformers movie turns into the US Army teams with the Autobots to save the world. Which honestly going as far back as the 80s is why we have G.I. Joe. Gotta get that liberal media indoctrinating children when they are still having very real debates on if Lord Zedd would beat Skeletor in a fight.
Its also the economy real or perceived. We have done so much stigmatizing of retail and fast food that kids who probably would be well served in those or even things like warehouse work so not just trade school stuff or college join because there is an honor in serving. I'm gonna once again tell you all about that liberal media but you already know how that whole things works in reality.
Seriously can you remember the last time a movie made the military look bad? Full Metal Jacket doesn't look like it was fun. Apocalypse Now, Hamburger Hill, more recently Saving Private Ryan if you want to call that recent.
I however outright reject the idea that US citizenship is worthless because the upper class want cheap labor. I mean we do know that migrants, legal or no come here for opportunities and often security that aren't available where they come from. If terrorists were coming in we'd know by having been hit in say the last 20 years. They wouldn't even need anything complex. They either don't care about us or are terrible at their jobs. That's something for the millionaires and billionaires to solve and until they address it the rest of this is just hoping like hell the Right never figures out how loud the dog whistles are.
PS: If you vote Republican don't thank a troop for their service. You don't give two shits about them. You voted for Trump who at least attempted to end citizenship being granted to people who served in our military. They were good enough to die for the nation but not good enough to be part of the country. That is who you are. I have an entire thread that isn't near complete of how often the Right votes against anything that would make life better for vets.
These people cut from the same cloth as Kim Jong, Saddam, Stalin and Ghadaffy. They like to dress up in uniforms parade their weapons around but nothing more. My personal favorite in recent months has been "Why are we spending X in Ukraine (the rest of the time its just foreign aid as a whole) instead of getting homeless vets the help they need.
Do I really need to point out how little we spend on foreign aid, that nothing is stopping us from doing both or best of all pointing out that the deficit only matters when a D is in office? In defense of Trump for a quick second he didn't ask for Covid (he just fucked up his handling of it) but he managed in 4 short years to fall just 2 trillion shy of Obama's 8. Which were artificially high since he put the wars on the budget. Either way the Ds were not screeching about the debt under Bush or Trump. Its almost like the two parties do not behave the same.
YDB95
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No, but they should have been. The only reason why people think the Republicans are better on deficits (when the truth is the exact opposite) is that they've been saying so for 40 years with far too little pushback from the Dems. I suspect the Dems are guilty of assuming people will see the truth on their own...but history has proven they won't.
Sean Renaud
The West Coast Pop
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When you look a media as a whole one of the great tricks the right managed to pull off is convincing people the media collectively is liberal. They might skew left when it comes to social/culture issues. You can reasonably trust MSM to champion minorities, LGBT, that video games won't make you kill everybody. Last year almost this exact time the rail workers were threatening to go on strike for a whopping 7 sick days a year. Biden was largely silent but the media didn't phrase the situation as "These billionaires are threatening to cancel Christmas if the guys who put out their backs, who sweat, cry and sometimes even bleed so you can have your iPhone.
Instead it was framed as these commies are going to deny little Jimmy his Playstation if they don't get their way. There is a right way to petition for higher wages. They should get to work now and negotiate after the holidays. You know when the fat cats will care so much less because it won't affect them nearly as much.
They really didn't seem supportive over any of the recent strikes at best they were neutral which despite what other people think I don't really believe their job is to be neutral.
As am I. Thank you to all who have served.
schism666
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you're a trump supporter.
YDB95
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Yes, that has had the effect of the media often overcorrecting and actually displaying a conservative bias. Of course, the Republican establishment knows this, and every now and then one of them says so out loud.
cdstefi
CDTV
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Societal attitudes have definitely changed. I read a lot of 20th century military history, and when you know, as one example, the horrifying stats on the likelihood of any crew member surviving a tour in a B-17 over Germany it seems highly unlikely anybody in their right mind now would sign up to be literal MK-108 cannon fodder. But they did back then, and I honestly don't know why.
The more I know about wars, their motivations and methods, the more pacifist I become, and wish for a less destructive way for nations to resolve their differences. I did a trip to the WWI memorials in France and Belgium and the sheer, stupid waste of life and potential written in the countless names engraved on the Menin Gate was one of the most moving experiences of my life. Stood for what seemed like hours, tears streaming, reading names, imagining who that person may have become before they were snuffed out in mud and horror.
War has become more technological and remote now in some ways but as Gaza and Ukraine show, it's still a bloody horrible business that doesn't belong in the modern world.
The more I know about wars, their motivations and methods, the more pacifist I become, and wish for a less destructive way for nations to resolve their differences. I did a trip to the WWI memorials in France and Belgium and the sheer, stupid waste of life and potential written in the countless names engraved on the Menin Gate was one of the most moving experiences of my life. Stood for what seemed like hours, tears streaming, reading names, imagining who that person may have become before they were snuffed out in mud and horror.
War has become more technological and remote now in some ways but as Gaza and Ukraine show, it's still a bloody horrible business that doesn't belong in the modern world.
Chernosoth
sothiness
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An army recruiter asked the pair of questions and had the predictable answers in my high school government class: Would you join the military, and would you join if the US was being invaded. Nearly all raised their hands for the second question. That angle has always been known by everyone military from probably the first recruiter in military history to the guys in schools today. When they want more soldiers, all they need is a way to make people feel threatened.
YDB95
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Keep in mind that 1) they think everything is a Dem problem, and 2) they think Trump is a superhero. Not so ironic when you consider how far off their image of the man is from reality.
