The Woke Culture War is Making Americans Socially Conservative

[Chernosoth]

The culture wars are a surface manifestation of a much deeper rift in the psyche of modern Western people. You only get a culture war when you no longer have a culture.

The West Must Die, by Paul Kingsnorth

 

[SubzeroGirl]

The woke finally doing something for the good of the people.

 

[HisArpy]

You've got it completely backwards. Without making, distributing and selling, there is no real wealth at all (nor money to be paid), and society comes to a standstill. And the bosses are always trying to get people to work extra without more money, or shipping the jobs abroad to cheaper areas. Workers' labor creates the wealth, and the bosses take most of it for themselves. And then they say what you do, i.e. that "they" spend the money and make everything possible, rather than workers' labor creating all that wealth that they've stolen.

This is nothing more than another dose of socialism's lies.

You don't get sales or industry without someone investing in it. People invest because they seek a return on that investment. For those with little or no money, they invest their labor and sweat. Their ROI is a paycheck.

NOBODY does this out of altruism.

Socialism wants you to believe they do by ignoring and hiding the truth that the money has to come from somewhere FIRST before sales/making/distributing/etc can happen.

Socialism also ignores that money can be made in ways other than industry and labor. Usually because those who tout socialism as "the one true way" don't understand how finance or an economy actually work.

 

[RandyRebecca]

This is nothing more than another dose of socialism's lies.

No, it's the truth. Try reading Karl Marx sometime. That's Abraham Lincoln's pen pal during the Civil War.

You don't get sales or industry without someone investing in it.

Without workers' labor, there's no wealth, no investment, no mass production, no distributing.

People invest because they seek a return on that investment.

Capitalists, not "people". And what you say usually means exploiting workers' labor for profit. They also sit on hoards of cash while poverty goes through the roof worldwide.

For those with little or no money, they invest their labor and sweat.

Working to create all the wealth while making the rich even richer.

NOBODY does this out of altruism.

Oh, indeed. That's why revolutions happen.

Socialism wants you to believe they do by ignoring and hiding the truth that the money has to come from somewhere FIRST before sales/making/distributing/etc can happen.

Real money comes from industry. You seriously think that those suits in Wall Street create the wealth? In 2008, those types crashed the world economy and needed to be bailed out by taxpayers (i.e. our) money! And not content with that, they then demand that we pay again through austerity! Gerald Ford allegedly told them to "drop dead" in 1975 when they asked for a federal bailout.

Socialism also ignores that money can be made in ways other than industry and labor.

Money that doesn't come from industry and labor is called fictitious capital. When there's an economic boom, they assume that debts will always be paid and that it's real money. But in an economic slump, they suddenly don't trust that debt will become real money and demand cold, hard cash instead.

Usually because those who tout socialism as "the one true way" don't understand how finance or an economy actually work.

LOL. We know only too well, and we don't like how rich exploit us.

 

[Drivingto]

Wokeness rules America. In the last three years every element of public life from governments to corporations has been conditioned to impose a radical social agenda on the nation. Women have ceased to exist and the government is forcing schools to sexually indoctrinate children.

A new Gallup poll suggests that this culture war has backfired. Badly. This year the largest number of Americans has come out of the closet as social conservatives since 2012.

Biden has taken us back to Obama’s first term in more ways than one.

That’s all the more remarkable because even last year the country was nearly tied between social conservatives and the socially liberal. This year the number of socially conservative Americans shot up from 33% to 38% while the socially liberal fell from 34% to 29%.

That’s a massive inversion from 2021 when 34% claimed to be socially liberal and only 30% were socially conservative, and the end of American values seemed to be here.

The shift is driven by Republicans. By 2021, only 60% of Republicans described themselves as socially conservative while a third identified as moderate. This matched declines in religious belief and values recorded in other polls: some of which showed barely half of Republicans describing religion as being important to them. But what a faltering religiosity in a nation losing its values could not accomplish, the woke culture war did.

74% of Republicans now identify as socially conservative. What drove a 14% increase in a few years? Perhaps seeing the alternative socially leftist dystopia made up their minds.

Democrats met declining religiosity and values with a kulturkampf that was not satisfied with adult sexual license but became perversely obsessed with sexualizing children. The electoral consequences of that toppled Democrat rule in a number of statues. And as the Biden administration doubles down on sexualizing children, threatening to investigate schools that don’t serve pornographic materials to children, Republicans are realizing what they believe.

The growth among independents, a majority of whom identify as social moderates has been marked, but limited, with social conservatives rising from 24% to 29%. Equally importantly, the number of social liberals among independents has fallen from 27% to 23%.

More independents, by a narrow margin, are now socially conservative than socially liberal.

https://www.frontpagemag.com/the-woke-culture-war-is-making-americans-socially-conservative/

Okay your fear is valid. I understand that you might see these changes and additions of "new" freedoms as a danger. I will sa this too, as I understand that you do not like the left, which I say you have every right to feel that way, nay I ask for you to hear how I see some of this. You don't have to agree, or even believe, but I would like to have my voice heard, as do you.
I will start by admiting that I have a bias and like most people, whether or not the recognize their bias, it affects my opinion and views. I see the expansion of these freedms, for example, Gay marriage and abortion access, as being an important step to improving a country's or nation's community. I get hat you might not agree, but at least hear my arguments.
The reason I feel this way is that if we are more open, more kind, and more accepting of our neighbors regardless of one thing that is really small if you think about it (ex. Skin color) we can maybe see that they are a human. I am not saying that we need to sing and hold hands, but I am saying that we should see the other. Now I am interested in hearing more about your side, and what you think about my thoughts on this.
Sincerely
Drivingto

 

[Drivingto]

This is nothing more than another dose of socialism's lies.

You don't get sales or industry without someone investing in it. People invest because they seek a return on that investment. For those with little or no money, they invest their labor and sweat. Their ROI is a paycheck.

NOBODY does this out of altruism.

Socialism wants you to believe they do by ignoring and hiding the truth that the money has to come from somewhere FIRST before sales/making/distributing/etc can happen.

Socialism also ignores that money can be made in ways other than industry and labor. Usually because those who tout socialism as "the one true way" don't understand how finance or an economy actually work.

Can I point out that Canada is by some whi have studied it a strong and vibrant democracy, with a more left of center, or socialist culture. Socialism is different from communism, and I also understand that not every culture in this world would be a good fit for a more left of center government. I just hope that you ca see what I mean, as I understand that you are arguing against tyrany

 

[IrezumiKiss]

Okay your fear is valid. I understand that you might see these changes and additions of "new" freedoms as a danger. I will sa this too, as I understand that you do not like the left, which I say you have every right to feel that way, nay I ask for you to hear how I see some of this. You don't have to agree, or even believe, but I would like to have my voice heard, as do you.
I will start by admiting that I have a bias and like most people, whether or not the recognize their bias, it affects my opinion and views. I see the expansion of these freedms, for example, Gay marriage and abortion access, as being an important step to improving a country's or nation's community. I get hat you might not agree, but at least hear my arguments.
The reason I feel this way is that if we are more open, more kind, and more accepting of our neighbors regardless of one thing that is really small if you think about it (ex. Skin color) we can maybe see that they are a human. I am not saying that we need to sing and hold hands, but I am saying that we should see the other. Now I am interested in hearing more about your side, and what you think about my thoughts on this.
Sincerely
Drivingto

I hate to ruin your honest endeavor for convo here, Driving, but you're not going to hear about this thread's creator's side from his own words and it's highly unlikely he'll respond to your thoughts.

The OP is a total cut & paste from the article he linked to. His basic M.O. is just regurgitating articles in one seagull shit drop and then flying away to never come back.

granted, he's not the only one to do this, but he virtually never augments the articles he posts with his own voice. I guess that's just his thing here, besides the interracial porn fetish on the GeeBee.

You seem like a good chap (unless you're a closet axe murderer or something) and I just couldn't bear to see ya hold your breath on this thread, which was already a week and a half old before you bumped it back up.

 

[Drivingto]

I hate to ruin your honest endeavor for convo here, Driving, but you're not going to hear about this thread's creator's side from his own words and it's highly unlikely he'll respond to your thoughts.

The OP is a total cut & paste from the article he linked to. His basic M.O. is just regurgitating articles in one seagull shit drop and then flying away to never come back.

granted, he's not the only one to do this, but he virtually never augments the articles he posts with his own voice. I guess that's just his thing here, besides the interracial porn fetish on the GeeBee.

You seem like a good chap (unless you're a closet axe murderer or something) and I just couldn't bear to see ya hold your breath on this thread, which was already a week and a half old before you bumped it back up.

Thanks, and it is all good. I now that people will have a mixed reaction as to the career choice I have decided upon, which involves being a government official kinda like a politician, but I also want to be honest as can be expected with the game of chess that it is

 

[HisArpy]

Can I point out that Canada is by some whi have studied it a strong and vibrant democracy, with a more left of center, or socialist culture. Socialism is different from communism, and I also understand that not every culture in this world would be a good fit for a more left of center government. I just hope that you ca see what I mean, as I understand that you are arguing against tyrany

No, I argue against stupidity.

Socialism is a lie. It's based on the premise that government will provide and that individual capitalism is a bad thing.

The problem with that is without capitalism the government has no revenue with which to provide. So right off the bat anyone who advocates socialism is LYING TO YOU.

And anyone who sincerely believes it is stupid.

 

[ll74]

No, I argue against stupidity.

Socialism is a lie. It's based on the premise that government will provide and that individual capitalism is a bad thing.

The problem with that is without capitalism the government has no revenue with which to provide. So right off the bat anyone who advocates socialism is LYING TO YOU.

And anyone who sincerely believes it is stupid.

Most forms of ideologies in their purist forms are not achievable. That's why they rarely exist for long when attempted and are typically usurped by authoritarianism and consolidated power

 

[Drivingto]

No, I argue against stupidity.

Socialism is a lie. It's based on the premise that government will provide and that individual capitalism is a bad thing.

The problem with that is without capitalism the government has no revenue with which to provide. So right off the bat anyone who advocates socialism is LYING TO YOU.

And anyone who sincerely believes it is stupid.

Okay, can I also point out that Canada actually has a revenue and happens to be one of the ealthiest nations in the world. Also just because we have socialism does not exclude that we have a free Markey economy or capitalist economy

 

[Drivingto]

Most forms of ideologies in their purist forms are not achievable. That's why they rarely exist for long when attempted and are typically usurped by authoritarianism and consolidated power

Like Russia and some Capitislitc nations. Nazi Germany was an extremely capitalistic economy, and had very very free regulations, and they ended up causing the second world war. And Russia or the USSR was in a cold war with he USA because of their extremism. Now I am not saying or equivacating the US the Nazi Germany, but the guy at top has a point, and both extremes will never last, but all have their downsides. I am not saying that capitalism is wrong, but I do disagree with your statement on socialism, I doubt that I will change hearts here, but I do hope that we can agree to disagree if you don't agree with me. I think the communism is bad, bad the intention in the ideology is good, same with capitalism but the best is to be a mixed economy and a more centered state on social policies. I would consider myself more left of center of socialist if you would for social policies, but a more center or mixed economy believer for economics

 

[ll74]

Like Russia and some Capitislitc nations. Nazi Germany was an extremely capitalistic economy, and had very very free regulations, and they ended up causing the second world war. And Russia or the USSR was in a cold war with he USA because of their extremism. Now I am not saying or equivacating the US the Nazi Germany, but the guy at top has a point, and both extremes will never last, but all have their downsides. I am not saying that capitalism is wrong, but I do disagree with your statement on socialism, I doubt that I will change hearts here, but I do hope that we can agree to disagree if you don't agree with me. I think the communism is bad, bad the intention in the ideology is good, same with capitalism but the best is to be a mixed economy and a more centered state on social policies. I would consider myself more left of center of socialist if you would for social policies, but a more center or mixed economy believer for economics

Every form of socialism that has lasted has been a hybrid with other approaches....most of them capitalistic.

I think hybrid approaches are healthy and good ideas.

 

[Drivingto]

Every form of socialism that has lasted has been a hybrid with other approaches....most of them capitalistic.

I think hybrid approaches are healthy and good ideas.

I agree, most countries that have adopted a more "balanced" or in the context a hybrid structure, have been more successful, and their people have had more benefits. The US to my perspective as a Candian is going through a hard time. People don't trust the government, and big companies are turning away from traditional principals. And congress is so polarized that the discussion on helping people with Healthcare, and providing more funding to social programs which help their people have been dividing the nation. It is starting to occur in Canada, mainly in the Province of Alberta where people are talking about separating (pulling a Quebec as I jokingly call it) and I am certain that most Alberta's think that is crazy. Not only that but some of the rights like same sex marriage is potentially in danger, as well as our public, or mostly free Healthcare. We have a premier who has been found to have interfered in an investigation by our justice department, and she still got elected.
I know that is off topic, but maybe it could support my argument if I say this
Arguing with our social community that typically holds a nation together is a dangerous gamble

 

[Rightguide]

You've got it completely backwards. Without making, distributing and selling, there is no real wealth at all (nor money to be paid), and society comes to a standstill. And the bosses are always trying to get people to work extra without more money, or shipping the jobs abroad to cheaper areas. Workers' labor creates the wealth, and the bosses take most of it for themselves. And then they say what you do, i.e. that "they" spend the money and make everything possible, rather than workers' labor creating all that wealth that they've stolen.

There is nothing at all without the initial investment of "wealth" by the entrepreneur.

 

[Drivingto]

There is nothing at all without the initial investment of "wealth" by the entrepreneur.

There is a point there, but also where does the wealth of these investors come from? Money doesn't grow on trees

 

[HisArpy]

Okay, can I also point out that Canada actually has a revenue and happens to be one of the ealthiest nations in the world. Also just because we have socialism does not exclude that we have a free Markey economy or capitalist economy

1. Please slow down, your posts are really difficult to read when only half of it is there.

2. Canada is a cluster fuck.

Canada's economy currently ranks 9th in the world. It comes in behind France and Italy which are socialist nations and right above Brazil and Russia which are worse than France and Italy. That tells you, or should tell you, how well socialism does economically when compared to capitalism.

California beats the stuffing out of Canada economically, coming in at either 5th or 4th depending on how well Germany ends up doing this year. Again, you should be paying attention to the fact that socialism SUCKS when it comes to economics.

This doesn't even begin to discuss the magnitude of political fuckups which Canada has managed to do in the past few years. I need only to remind everyone of the anti-vax trucker protests which were forceably dispersed and their financial assets seized after an ILLEGAL declaration and order by Trudy to point this out.

 

[BillTheKatt90]

There is a point there, but also where does the wealth of these investors come from? Money doesn't grow on trees

Maybe I am naïve, but I know several wealthy people, and none of them came from money. The richest guy I know started writing software in his bedroom with his buddy when they were 16. They worked on the product every day while they went to college. They sold the business for low 10 figures when they were in their early 40s. My friend's investment was effectively every spare minute he had and nearly all of the others--like 80 to 100 hours a week--for about 25 years.

Second richest guy I know... same story. He made low 8 figures in real estate, then shut down everything when the market crashed in 2007, when he was like 45.

Both of them shared something: a spouse that did ALL the domestic stuff, and messy strained relationships with the kids. Both of them missed nearly every important event with their children. Both of them effectively retired in their forties.

Other wealthy people I know are nearly all similar. They start with nothing, work tirelessly for 20+ years, and gain their wealth through sickening personal time investment at the sacrifice of their family lives. I am the least successful of my friends, largely because I made a pledge to myself and my wife to be around for all my kids' activities. Now that I am an empty nester, I expect I will pour myself into my business and try to make up for time I invested elsewhere.

Maybe my town is just different from others?

 

[Drivingto]

Maybe I am naïve, but I know several wealthy people, and none of them came from money. The richest guy I know started writing software in his bedroom with his buddy when they were 16. They worked on the product every day while they went to college. They sold the business for low 10 figures when they were in their early 40s. My friend's investment was effectively every spare minute he had and nearly all of the others--like 80 to 100 hours a week--for about 25 years.

Second richest guy I know... same story. He made low 8 figures in real estate, then shut down everything when the market crashed in 2007, when he was like 45.

Both of them shared something: a spouse that did ALL the domestic stuff, and messy strained relationships with the kids. Both of them missed nearly every important event with their children. Both of them effectively retired in their forties.

Other wealthy people I know are nearly all similar. They start with nothing, work tirelessly for 20+ years, and gain their wealth through sickening personal time investment at the sacrifice of their family lives. I am the least successful of my friends, largely because I made a pledge to myself and my wife to be around for all my kids' activities. Now that I am an empty nester, I expect I will pour myself into my business and try to make up for time I invested elsewhere.

Maybe my town is just different from others?

No you are right. Just my argument was sometimes you need some government funding to help a business get going. That is all

 

[Drivingto]

1. Please slow down, your posts are really difficult to read when only half of it is there.

2. Canada is a cluster fuck.

Canada's economy currently ranks 9th in the world. It comes in behind France and Italy which are socialist nations and right above Brazil and Russia which are worse than France and Italy. That tells you, or should tell you, how well socialism does economically when compared to capitalism.

California beats the stuffing out of Canada economically, coming in at either 5th or 4th depending on how well Germany ends up doing this year. Again, you should be paying attention to the fact that socialism SUCKS when it comes to economics.

This doesn't even begin to discuss the magnitude of political fuckups which Canada has managed to do in the past few years. I need only to remind everyone of the anti-vax trucker protests which were forceably dispersed and their financial assets seized after an ILLEGAL declaration and order by Trudy to point this out.

Okay one, an INDEPENDENT review done by an INDEPENDENT panel, reviewed the action and decision around the emergency act, which allowed for the seizure of Financial assets. Also I would like to point out that the USA had a bigger fuck up with one guy trying to rig the system, and tried to pressure Gorgia state Governor to falsefy some votes for him. Also Canada yes we have our OWN mess to deal with, and rightfully so, but just because our Economy isn't as strong as France doesn't mean that we are a weaker nation. We have a more.mixed economy, meaning we have private sector, and a public sector for the economy, much like many Developed nations. And Canada has done more for HUMAN RIGHTS in the past years than the USA. We also have a better overall Healthcare, and welfare service. And I am sorry you do Har a strong economy, but you are currently doing a ton of bullshit infighting it al.ost looks to many outsiders that you are about to have a civil war.
I will add as a side note, Alberta is actually causing a lot of issues, and Conservatives in Canada are adopting scarier messages every time they loss an election federally. Yes we CAN do more, but we also have a hard question to ask ourselves. Like many western nations, how do we ensure our rights can survive. Also emergencies act can ONLY be used under a threat to national security, and to be honest if the Capital and the Border have been blockaded I feel as if that I a DANGER to national security. I will agree to disagree on that though. As always, I don't have to agree and you don't have to either, I just would hope that we can respect each other's beliefs. I am left of center meaning I am more of a modern liberalism believer. Conservatives are more Clasical liberalism, and so I do agree actually with both ideals

 

[Chernosoth]

The capitalism or socialism debate is becoming a moot point. They both need economic growth, which we don't have anymore. The USA blew its natural resources on a century of extravagant spending, and now it is losing the leverage to get cheap resources from other nations.

 

[HisArpy]

Okay one, an INDEPENDENT review done by an INDEPENDENT panel, reviewed the action and decision around the emergency act, which allowed for the seizure of Financial assets. Also I would like to point out that the USA had a bigger fuck up with one guy trying to rig the system, and tried to pressure Gorgia state Governor to falsefy some votes for him. Also Canada yes we have our OWN mess to deal with, and rightfully so, but just because our Economy isn't as strong as France doesn't mean that we are a weaker nation. We have a more.mixed economy, meaning we have private sector, and a public sector for the economy, much like many Developed nations. And Canada has done more for HUMAN RIGHTS in the past years than the USA. We also have a better overall Healthcare, and welfare service. And I am sorry you do Har a strong economy, but you are currently doing a ton of bullshit infighting it al.ost looks to many outsiders that you are about to have a civil war.
I will add as a side note, Alberta is actually causing a lot of issues, and Conservatives in Canada are adopting scarier messages every time they loss an election federally. Yes we CAN do more, but we also have a hard question to ask ourselves. Like many western nations, how do we ensure our rights can survive. Also emergencies act can ONLY be used under a threat to national security, and to be honest if the Capital and the Border have been blockaded I feel as if that I a DANGER to national security. I will agree to disagree on that though. As always, I don't have to agree and you don't have to either, I just would hope that we can respect each other's beliefs. I am left of center meaning I am more of a modern liberalism believer. Conservatives are more Clasical liberalism, and so I do agree actually with both ideals

I'll say it again; Canada is a cluster fuck. And blaming the US or Trump or trying to shift the focus away from what your leadership did and is doing isn't going to change Canada's cluster fuck into something else.

The civil war thing is interesting. Some observations might open your eyes to what's really happening:

In nature, when there are multiple predators in the family group, they will fight each other for the available food and other resources they need. The strongest one(s) will survive, the weaker one(s) may not. This applies across the board no matter the predator species.

In families with multiple children the same phenomenon occurs; the children fight (and don't clean up their rooms) and the strongest child usually leads the other(s).

Currently the US is engaged in an inner turmoil whereby the citizens are fighting over the available resources and who has to clean up their room. It's loud and messy but the 1 thing that's guaranteed is that when it's over, the strongest will be in control of the nation.

Meanwhile the rest of the world is bending its knee to the woke and weak.

 

[Drivingto]

I'll say it again; Canada is a cluster fuck. And blaming the US or Trump or trying to shift the focus away from what your leadership did and is doing isn't going to change Canada's cluster fuck into something else.

The civil war thing is interesting. Some observations might open your eyes to what's really happening:

In nature, when there are multiple predators in the family group, they will fight each other for the available food and other resources they need. The strongest one(s) will survive, the weaker one(s) may not. This applies across the board no matter the predator species.

In families with multiple children the same phenomenon occurs; the children fight (and don't clean up their rooms) and the strongest child usually leads the other(s).

Currently the US is engaged in an inner turmoil whereby the citizens are fighting over the available resources and who has to clean up their room. It's loud and messy but the 1 thing that's guaranteed is that when it's over, the strongest will be in control of the nation.

Meanwhile the rest of the world is bending its knee to the woke and weak.

Yes I will admit Canada is a cluster fuck at the moment. That is true, but mind if I ask what is Woke to you?

My understanding is that being woke means that you support minority groups and their fight for equal treatment, and recognizing that they are just people whether they are gay, black, an immigrant, or left of center or right of center. Wokism isn't a bad thing if it is about inclusion, but also I am an open minded person, and I am welcome to people explaining their beliefs and why they believe in ot as long as they agree to respect me and my opinion or at the very least agree to disagree.

So if my understanding of wha woke means is not how you understand it to be, I am open to an honest discussion. I don't see the harm in allowing gay people the right to marriage. Or allowing black people to be free and treated as a.human being.

But like I said if that is not wokism then I ask that you kindly educate me. I will respect wjat you have to say. My request is that we agree to be at least on the same page of disagreeing if we don't agree.

Also I am sorry for blaming the USA that was uncalled for, and yes I did get defensive because I truly believe in Canda, but that doesn't mean that what I said was called for.

 

[HisArpy]

Woke isn't about inclusion, it's about exclusion. It's about how cancel culture is nothing more than a means of using force to make people do what someone else wants. Or else. It's about omiting historical facts in order to create lies about victimization. It's about denying reality and shifting values which create actual harm in the name of a political narrative. It's about making victims out of innocents in order to justify false oppression against tyrants and bullies.

Woke is a lie. And everyone who believes or supports it, is a liar as well.

 

[Chernosoth]

We have the same two parties, despite all the follies and crimes of Demlicans from LBJ to Biden. Nixon was tossed and Reagan was elected with huge numbers a few years later. That's how conservative this nation is.