NFL Players kneeling for the anthem

[Rightguide]

It's been said that horses can be lead to water but not made to drink. If you put a gun to most people's heads you can get them to fold their hands and drop to their knees but you can't make them pray in earnest. You can insist that people stand for a ceremony but what have you accomplished?

Conditions of employment. If you don't like it, get a job somewhere else. If as an employer, you insist on a business model that alienates a huge aspect of the market, suffer the economic and social consequences.

 

[jp55665566]

Our multi-service Auto/Truck Plaza is refusing service to Trump haters - haha.

 

[IG_88]

Conditions of employment. If you don't like it, get a job somewhere else. If as an employer, you insist on a business model that alienates a huge aspect of the market, suffer the economic and social consequences.

You sure care a lot about something you claim you don't care about.

 

[Luk]

You sure care a lot about something you claim you don't care about.

Don't bother to tell him that the NFL isn't suffering a single bit from the non-traversy notwithstanding vettebirther's poutrage.

 

[someoneyouknow]

 

[BotanyBoy]

They are protesting mostly the treatment of minorities within the law.

Right....by taking a knee during the anthem/flag waving.

They have no issue with the flag or anthem themselves. Not usually anyway.

Then they should have been more thoughtful about using those things as a symbol of what they are protesting??

To get a rise, to get all the red white and blue lovers pissed.

Which is fine....but let's not pretend they picked a divisive method of protest for the sake of extending an olive branch to the people who don't think the USA is some horrible Nazi state that persecutes everything not white male and christian.

 

[nowisthetime]

Exactly, you would never see these rightist extremist thugs in here bitching about those supremacist hoodlums. Why? Because some of them believe in the same ideals.

What's new?

This thread is still going?

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

Not a peep from anyone.

 

[coati]

To get a rise, to get all the red white and blue lovers pissed.

Which is fine....but let's not pretend they picked a divisive method of protest for the sake of extending an olive branch to the people who don't think the USA is some horrible Nazi state that persecutes everything not white male and christian.

^^^^^says the master baiter of right-wing paranoid hyperbole.

He loves baiting others by mentally jacking off with extreme characterizations of his perceived villains. Constructing straw men is a propaganda tool of the BotBoy.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Conditions of employment. If you don't like it, get a job somewhere else. If as an employer, you insist on a business model that alienates a huge aspect of the market, suffer the economic and social consequences.

Elle, Oh Elle.

Flag worship is a religion.

Employers can dictate employees' religious preferences now?

Assume for a moment that you would have kept your job as a clerk in your father-in-law's print shop when he died (you wouldn't have, but let's pretend). Say the new owners were Muslim. Could they dictate you kneeling to Mecca 5 times per day?

 

[LincolnDuncan]

Conditions of employment. If you don't like it, get a job somewhere else. If as an employer, you insist on a business model that alienates a huge aspect of the market, suffer the economic and social consequences.

"Conditions of employment" is an incomplete sentence so I'm not sure of the point you're trying to make. However, I've noticed that you have attempted to reduce this issue to it being a simple matter of labor and contractual obligation. That does not come close to addressing the issue I am raising, that forcing someone in the free United States of America, to participate in a ceremony is nothing more than a whipping at the whipping post. You can force people to stand or kneel but you can't force them to respect you.

 

[JohnnySavage]

The point isn't the protest, it's when they are choosing to do it. Why during the anthem? Why don't they take a knee during the first play of the game?

Being disrespectful during the anthem is an easy out for them as it wouldn't cost them money like taking a knee when a pass was thrown to you would. Spoiled, entitled little bitches.

If I owned a team: My team; my stadium; my field; my employees. Don't like my rules; find another employer.

 

[IsItBad]

It is a shame that all Americans can not appreciate and comprehend the sacrifice that has been made to afford the freedoms we enjoy every day.

The issue relating to football players kneeling really has much more to do with the venue and the rules. the NFL has had a clearly published and understood rule about standing for the anthem since the beginning of time. the players are at work. at work, you follow the rules.

when you get your own stadium and your own league, then you can make some new rules and do whatever you want.

that is the issue to me. society wants to make it all about race etc. it is not a racial issue at all. it is employees flagrantly disregarding the rules of the engagement.

it cost the NFL hundreds of millions last year in revenue and if it starts again this year it will be the same.

 

[runsilent]

Exactly, you would never see these rightist extremist thugs in here bitching about those supremacist hoodlums. Why? Because some of them believe in the same ideals.

What's new?

This thread is still going?

Ok I will offer a peep. Those alt right asholes are just bad and should be ignored. Just like the alt left wing assholes. As we have become more politically polarized we have decided the other side has no right to speak. That is a bad thing. Becoming outraged about what the other side said leads to censorship. Some of you think that is fine but wait till you end up on the wrong side of popular opinion.

 

[IG_88]

The point isn't the protest, it's when they are choosing to do it. Why during the anthem? Why don't they take a knee during the first play of the game?

Being disrespectful during the anthem is an easy out for them as it wouldn't cost them money like taking a knee when a pass was thrown to you would. Spoiled, entitled little bitches.

If I owned a team: My team; my stadium; my field; my employees. Don't like my rules; find another employer.

Kaepernick kinda did that in that he got himself blackballed. But then he probably wouldn't be starting anywhere right now anyway. Still, backups make decent money.

 

[RobDownSouth]

The point isn't the protest, it's when they are choosing to do it. Why during the anthem? Why don't they take a knee during the first play of the game?

Being disrespectful during the anthem is an easy out for them as it wouldn't cost them money like taking a knee when a pass was thrown to you would. Spoiled, entitled little bitches.

If I owned a team: My team; my stadium; my field; my employees. Don't like my rules; find another employer.

The point IS the protest, and the national anthem is most entirely appropriate place to take a stand against perceived government abuse.

They are taking a knee for what they believe in. It's called "principle".

Whining that they are "spoiled entitled little bitches" and railing about "If *I* owned a team" is simply pettiness on your part.

 

[runsilent]

Hey think about this. There are plenty of ways he could have protested outside of his job. For some reason he chose to do it there.

 

[JohnnySavage]

The point IS the protest, and the national anthem is most entirely appropriate place to take a stand against perceived government abuse.

They are taking a knee for what they believe in. It's called "principle".

Whining that they are "spoiled entitled little bitches" and railing about "If *I* owned a team" is simply pettiness on your part.

Why?



...so they are standing on "principle" for expressing their opinion, but I'm being petty. Got it.

 

[BoyNextDoor]

The point isn't the protest, it's when they are choosing to do it. Why during the anthem? Why don't they take a knee during the first play of the game?

Being disrespectful during the anthem is an easy out for them as it wouldn't cost them money like taking a knee when a pass was thrown to you would. Spoiled, entitled little bitches.

If I owned a team: My team; my stadium; my field; my employees. Don't like my rules; find another employer.

Because that is the specific moment they are being asked to participate in a civil ritual celebrating the life, liberty and pursuit of happiness that America is built on and yet in their experience law enforcement does not "protect and serve" them in that pursuit. So, why participate in the ritual when the promise of it does not apply to you?

 

[JohnnySavage]

Because that is the specific moment they are being asked to participate in a civil ritual celebrating the life, liberty and pursuit of happiness that America is built on and yet in their experience law enforcement does not "protect and serve" them in that pursuit. So, why participate in the ritual when the promise of it does not apply to you?

Horseshit. They are mostly in their early 20s and millionaires.

Few of them have done anything to earn the right to take a knee.

 

[pointless]

Because that is the specific moment they are being asked to participate in a civil ritual celebrating the life, liberty and pursuit of happiness that America is built on and yet in their experience law enforcement does not "protect and serve" them in that pursuit. So, why participate in the ritual when the promise of it does not apply to you?

johnny doesn't care about any of that. there's no profit potential in any of this, so it means nothing to him.

 

[IG_88]

The whole thing just doesn't bother me. The flag, the song, protests, whatever. I just don't get worked up over it cuz who cares? I wanna watch football, I couldn't care less what else those guys do unless it's illegal and even then I'm pretty forgiving.
I was at a baseball game once and wasn't paying attention, tried to order some food while the anthem was being sung and of course had to wait until it was over. Nobody gave me shit for it and honestly I was a little peeved I had to wait. Pulled pork waits for no man or song.

 

[Rightguide]

"Conditions of employment" is an incomplete sentence so I'm not sure of the point you're trying to make. However, I've noticed that you have attempted to reduce this issue to it being a simple matter of labor and contractual obligation. That does not come close to addressing the issue I am raising, that forcing someone in the free United States of America, to participate in a ceremony is nothing more than a whipping at the whipping post. You can force people to stand or kneel but you can't force them to respect you.

Can you go to work and engage in behavior that openly insults your company's customers, or damages the company brand?

Every company has rules of behavior which amount to "conditions of employment" for its employees, rules against sabotage or disruptive behavior, for instance. You don't have a First Amendment right in the private workplace.

If part of the pregame ceremony is for both teams to stand on the sidelines while the Anthem is played the NFL could make these players do so or get fired for cause.

 

[BotanyBoy]

^^^^^says the master baiter of right-wing paranoid hyperbole.

He loves baiting others by mentally jacking off with extreme characterizations of his perceived villains. Constructing straw men is a propaganda tool of the BotBoy.

It's not a strawman nor hyperbole.

Watch the news sometime or just read what's being posted here by team "progress".

They have no bigger enemy than the socioeconomically successful white (or white enough) male. If he's Christian he's the ultimate boogieman.

 

[coati]

Hey, eight pages of discussion so far, and this is only one of the threads on this topic! From the sounds of the all whining right wingers, it certainly appears that the founder of this movement really hit on a prime target for peaceful protest-- ritualistic flag worshiping at sporting events.

This uppity football player really found a sensitive pressure point, as witnessed in how many whiners have vehemently complained about "not the appropriate time or place for a peaceful protest".

This has stimulated a national debate and has forced people to think about whether patriotism could possibly mean more than simply expressing ritualistic support for the military branch of our society.