OK What's Fair Game For Scores & Comments?

[lovecraft68]

I got this feedback yesterday an its typical of what I get props for the content and remarks about my shoddy grammar.

But the last part is what I found refreshing

Something for everyone...
10/26/15 By: Arago007
This covered pretty much every sexuality and kink - though the primary story is definitely magic and nightmarish content. I gave it 5 stars, I just couldn't give less for something so well developed, but it had more typos than I would expect for a contest story, or from this writer.
Seriously a gift - to get to read something this good for FREE

Nice to see a reader, instead of griping, calling out how awesome it is to read stories for free here and saying they appreciate it.

 

[karaline]

Really, what feedback can you live with? Whats fair?

I get almost no feedback. I get an occasional insult and never anything useful or illuminating. I LOVED IT is as lame as YOU SUCK.

A while ago I posted my criteria for scores:

You get a ONE for the effort (rather than nothing)
You get a TWO for whats coherent rather than word salad.
THREE means your effort is coherent and cohesive, it holds together and makes sense.
FOUR means its interesting and worth a read.
FIVE means I wanna read it again. Its a keeper.

Generally I only give 5's, if i don't like a story enough to give it a 5 I tend not to vote. I have been known to vote less, but only if the content of a story offends me.

I only ever leave positive feed back publicly, if I want to make a criticism however mild I send a message. before I send the message I carefully consider how useful my criticism will be, if I think your writing is a lost cause I won't bother, if I think its good but could improve in small way I will try and say so in the gentlest terms possible. I have avoided giving criticism to friends if I've felt they won't be receptive to my feedback. I am more likely to vote for and favourite new authors, to offer encouragement. I never say I like something if I don't -I just don't say anything, that said I am one of those nauseatingly positive people who likes lots of things.

The feedback I've had for my writing has generally been very positive but not that helpful. I have never received any useful critique on my writing style. Twice i've had someone anonymously describe my work as appalling (para-phrasing there obvs) but i don't know whether this was a criticism of my writing or the plot (I have a feeling it was the latter). A few times people have pointed out small plot holes (for which I am grateful) or discussed the behaviours and reactions of my characters almost as though they see them as real people, which i have found amusing, and flattering and frequently insightful.

For a long time I longed for critical feedback, on my writing, far more than on the content of my tales, I left school when I was 15, (I couldn't write my own name until I was 8 years old) I have no formal qualifications, I was assessed for dyslexia in my early 20's and told i have it quite severely. So I am far concerned with being able to write than telling stories -form over content you might say. But more recently I've reached the conclusion that not only is the whole area completely subjective, but I am more suspicious of peoples motivations for offering feedback and what frames their opinions. So I don't know if I would find it that helpful. I guess I would welcome feedback from someone who I felt understood what I was trying to achieve, I may be quite dismissive of it otherwise.

 

[sr71plt]

I've been writing for pay for decades and don't believe in vigilante "help" by commenters I know nothing about. This isn't a critique site and that's not what I use it for. (It provides me a much broader audience than anywhere else has--some of these are not going to like what I write and will attack it, with the voting system here giving them a preponderance of power to pull a story down), but there are so many others reading and keeping me on top of at least one of the genre popularity lists, that this is satisfying enough for me. If I get a critique that contains some criticism I see as legitimate, then fine, I'll take it--and most likely thank the critiquer if they give me a legitimate reply address. That doesn't happen much at Literotica, as far as I can see. Most I see giving "guidance" here know a whole lot less about writing than they think they do. For the others, I didn't ask for vigilante criticism, so, unless I recognize the person sending it as competent in writing, I just ignore it.

 

[ElectricBlue]

My favourite:

"Oh my! Original, fabulous and very effective. My response is... considerable!"

One happy reader, then!

 

[Nathan_Brazil]

Listen to the Oracle...

Writing for this crowd is an exercise in commercial writing.

Figure your audience out.
Entertain them.

The End.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

Generally I only give 5's, if i don't like a story enough to give it a 5 I tend not to vote. I have been known to vote less, but only if the content of a story offends me.

I only ever leave positive feed back publicly, if I want to make a criticism however mild I send a message. before I send the message I carefully consider how useful my criticism will be, if I think your writing is a lost cause I won't bother, if I think its good but could improve in small way I will try and say so in the gentlest terms possible. I have avoided giving criticism to friends if I've felt they won't be receptive to my feedback. I am more likely to vote for and favourite new authors, to offer encouragement. I never say I like something if I don't -I just don't say anything, that said I am one of those nauseatingly positive people who likes lots of things.

The feedback I've had for my writing has generally been very positive but not that helpful. I have never received any useful critique on my writing style. Twice i've had someone anonymously describe my work as appalling (para-phrasing there obvs) but i don't know whether this was a criticism of my writing or the plot (I have a feeling it was the latter). A few times people have pointed out small plot holes (for which I am grateful) or discussed the behaviours and reactions of my characters almost as though they see them as real people, which i have found amusing, and flattering and frequently insightful.

For a long time I longed for critical feedback, on my writing, far more than on the content of my tales, I left school when I was 15, (I couldn't write my own name until I was 8 years old) I have no formal qualifications, I was assessed for dyslexia in my early 20's and told i have it quite severely. So I am far concerned with being able to write than telling stories -form over content you might say. But more recently I've reached the conclusion that not only is the whole area completely subjective, but I am more suspicious of peoples motivations for offering feedback and what frames their opinions. So I don't know if I would find it that helpful. I guess I would welcome feedback from someone who I felt understood what I was trying to achieve, I may be quite dismissive of it otherwise.

I awarded plenty of 5's in the past but now no 5 unless I save the story. I've saved 3 in the last year.

Statistically 2% of stories should score ONE, 16% should score TWO, 66% should score THREE, 16% should score FOUR, and 2% should score FIVE. At LIT we're like the folks of Lake Woebegone where all are above average in everything unless they have jobs, pay their bills, served in the military, and have custody of their children.

 

[HectorBidon]

Distribution of ratings in different categories

I’ve submitted stories in a couple different categories, and I got to wondering whether there is a difference in the range of ratings that might be expected in one category versus another. So I looked at a month’s worth of stories to see how the ratings were distributed.

I downloaded the last-thirty-day toplists for each category on Nov 1, 2015. The lists show the top rated stories that appeared in each category over the previous 30 days. On this particular date, all the lists contained less than 250 stories (the maximum number that the website shows), so I’m pretty sure that they included all the stories that appeared (in English) over the 30-day period, essentially the month of October.

For each category I tabulated the number of stories, the percentage that were stand-alone as opposed to chapter stories, the median number of votes received, and the percentage of the ratings that were below 3, between 3 and 4, between 4 and 4.5, and above 4.5. Here are the results.

[tr][td].[/td] [td].[/td] [td]%Stnd[/td] [td]

Med​

[/td] [td]

_____​

[/td] [td]Ratings[/td] [td]_(%)_[/td] [td]______[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Category[/td] [td]Stories[/td] [td]

Alone​

[/td] [td]

_Votes​

[/td] [td]

__0-3​

[/td] [td]

__3-4​

[/td] [td]_4-4.5[/td] [td]_ 4.5-5[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Incest/Taboo[/td] [td]

249​

[/td] [td]

53​

[/td] [td]

231​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

18​

[/td] [td]

55​

[/td] [td]

27​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]E Couplings[/td] [td]

246​

[/td] [td]

67​

[/td] [td]

35​

[/td] [td]

2​

[/td] [td]

22​

[/td] [td]

50​

[/td] [td]

26​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Loving Wives[/td] [td]

150​

[/td] [td]

63​

[/td] [td]

269​

[/td] [td]

23​

[/td] [td]

57​

[/td] [td]

19​

[/td] [td]

1​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]BDSM[/td] [td]

144​

[/td] [td]

53​

[/td] [td]

32​

[/td] [td]

6​

[/td] [td]

29​

[/td] [td]

44​

[/td] [td]

21​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Gay Male[/td] [td]

123​

[/td] [td]

48​

[/td] [td]

70​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

13​

[/td] [td]

50​

[/td] [td]

37​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Sci-Fi Fantasy[/td] [td]

122​

[/td] [td]

26​

[/td] [td]

51​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

8​

[/td] [td]

25​

[/td] [td]

66​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]NC/Reluctance[/td] [td]

122​

[/td] [td]

50​

[/td] [td]

79​

[/td] [td]

2​

[/td] [td]

24​

[/td] [td]

54​

[/td] [td]

20​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Romance[/td] [td]

120​

[/td] [td]

43​

[/td] [td]

81​

[/td] [td]

2​

[/td] [td]

11​

[/td] [td]

34​

[/td] [td]

53​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Fetish[/td] [td]

97​

[/td] [td]

55​

[/td] [td]

30​

[/td] [td]

4​

[/td] [td]

30​

[/td] [td]

43​

[/td] [td]

23​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Group Sex[/td] [td]

95​

[/td] [td]

55​

[/td] [td]

66​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

23​

[/td] [td]

53​

[/td] [td]

24​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]NonHuman[/td] [td]

84​

[/td] [td]

21​

[/td] [td]

74​

[/td] [td]

1​

[/td] [td]

2​

[/td] [td]

25​

[/td] [td]

71​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Exhib & Voyeur[/td] [td]

83​

[/td] [td]

45​

[/td] [td]

82​

[/td] [td]

1​

[/td] [td]

16​

[/td] [td]

48​

[/td] [td]

35​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Lesbian Sex[/td] [td]

74​

[/td] [td]

64​

[/td] [td]

73​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

32​

[/td] [td]

36​

[/td] [td]

31​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Interracial[/td] [td]

74​

[/td] [td]

59​

[/td] [td]

48​

[/td] [td]

12​

[/td] [td]

24​

[/td] [td]

47​

[/td] [td]

16​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Mature[/td] [td]

73​

[/td] [td]

62​

[/td] [td]

162​

[/td] [td]

1​

[/td] [td]

11​

[/td] [td]

58​

[/td] [td]

30​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Trans & Cross[/td] [td]

58​

[/td] [td]

40​

[/td] [td]

99​

[/td] [td]

2​

[/td] [td]

17​

[/td] [td]

41​

[/td] [td]

40​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Novels Novellas[/td] [td]

56​

[/td] [td]

23​

[/td] [td]

23​

[/td] [td]

2​

[/td] [td]

11​

[/td] [td]

32​

[/td] [td]

55​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Celebs[/td] [td]

55​

[/td] [td]

53​

[/td] [td]

19​

[/td] [td]

2​

[/td] [td]

16​

[/td] [td]

38​

[/td] [td]

44​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]E Horror[/td] [td]

54​

[/td] [td]

65​

[/td] [td]

28​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

11​

[/td] [td]

43​

[/td] [td]

46​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]First Time[/td] [td]

45​

[/td] [td]

58​

[/td] [td]

87​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

24​

[/td] [td]

56​

[/td] [td]

20​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Text w Audio[/td] [td]

43​

[/td] [td]

93​

[/td] [td]

27​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

26​

[/td] [td]

47​

[/td] [td]

28​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Mind Control[/td] [td]

42​

[/td] [td]

38​

[/td] [td]

120​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

12​

[/td] [td]

57​

[/td] [td]

31​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Anal[/td] [td]

36​

[/td] [td]

56​

[/td] [td]

62​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

14​

[/td] [td]

81​

[/td] [td]

6​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Non-Erotic[/td] [td]

12​

[/td] [td]

75​

[/td] [td]

37​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

33​

[/td] [td]

42​

[/td] [td]

25​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Humor & Satire[/td] [td]

8​

[/td] [td]

100​

[/td] [td]

59​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

25​

[/td] [td]

50​

[/td] [td]

25​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Illustrated[/td] [td]

5​

[/td] [td]

80​

[/td] [td]

273​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

20​

[/td] [td]

40​

[/td] [td]

40​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Toys Masturb[/td] [td]

4​

[/td] [td]

100​

[/td] [td]

54​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

50​

[/td] [td]

25​

[/td] [td]

25​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]How To[/td] [td]

4​

[/td] [td]

100​

[/td] [td]

23​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [td]

50​

[/td] [td]

50​

[/td] [td]

0​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Chain Stories[/td] [td]

0​

[/td] [/tr] [tr][td]Letters & Trans[/td] [td]

___0​

[/td] [td]

____​

[/td] [td]

____​

[/td] [td]

____​

[/td] [td]

____​

[/td] [td]

____​

[/td] [td]

____​

[/td][/tr] [tr][td]Total[/td] [td]

2278​

[/td] [td]

53​

[/td] [td]

--​

[/td] [td]

3​

[/td] [td]

21​

[/td] [td]

44​

[/td] [td]

31​

[/td][/tr]

In all, a total of 2,278 stories appeared during the month. The categories with the most stories were Incest/Taboo (249) and Erotic Couplings (246). The other popular categories ranged from Loving Wives (150) down to Anal (36), while Non-Erotic, Humor and Satire, Illustrated, Toys and Masturbation, How To, Chain Stories, and Letters & Transcripts each had 12 stories or fewer.

I tabulated the percentage of stand-alone stories just for my own curiosity. It seems to me that stand-alone stories and series provide a very different reading experience. I’m usually more apt to look into a story if it’s a stand-alone than if it’s the umpteenth chapter of some series. However, I have read and enjoyed a few series, and on occasion I’ve even looked forward to the arrival of new chapters. So I can see the attraction of swinging both ways.

Anyway, it turns out that about half the stories overall were stand-alone and half were chapters. This was pretty much true across the categories, although there were a few notable exceptions. Text with Audio was almost all stand-alone, and Erotic Coupling was about two thirds stand-alone. On the other hand, Science Fiction/Fantasy, Non-Human, and Novels and Novellas were all about three quarters chapter stories.

The median number of votes is intended to give an idea of the size of the voting community in each category. The median is obtained by throwing out the story with the most votes, then the story with the least votes, then the one with the next most, then the one with the next least, and so on until you get to the story right in the middle. Its vote count is more representative than the average vote count if there are a few stories with really high vote counts.

The median vote counts ranged considerably between categories. The most-voted-on categories were Illustrated (median vote count 273), Loving Wives (269), and Incest/Taboo (241), with Mature not too far behind (162). The least-voted-on categories were How To (23), Novels and Novellas (23), and Celebrities (19). This shows that the size of the voting community varies quite a bit from one category to another. As another way of looking at this, the most-voted-on story in Loving Wives got 1766 votes, while the most-voted-on story in Celebrities only got 54.

The rating distributions give an idea of how the voters in each category give out their ratings. A rating below 3 stars means that most of the voters didn’t like the story. A rating between 3 and 4 means that they “liked it” and would encourage the writer to keep on writing. A rating above 4 means that they “really liked it” and considered it a “good read.” A rating above 4.5 means that at least half the voters “loved it” and considered it “one of the best.” The stories with ratings above 4.5 are the ones that receive the red H’s.

Across the entire site, a full three quarters of the stories (75%) received ratings above 4, and almost a third (31%) received ratings above 4.5. Only a very small number, 3%, were given ratings below 3. In most of the individual categories, the ratings were distributed roughly along these same lines. This can be interpreted to mean that, by and large, authors are writing stories that the voters enjoy reading.

However, in some categories the distributions were somewhat different. The most noticeable example was Loving Wives, in which the distribution was shifted down about one full star. More than half of the stories in Loving Wives only received ratings between 3 and 4, and almost a quarter received ratings below 3. Only 1% of the stories cracked the red H threshold.

At the other end of the grading curve were the Non-Human and Science Fiction/Fantasy categories, in which the distributions were shifted up about half a star. Two thirds of the stories in these categories received ratings above 4.5. The distributions were also shifted up in Romance and Novels & Novellas, with more than half the stories in these categories receiving the pink H.

The Anal category was unique in that 87% of the stories had ratings above 4, but only 6% had ratings above 4.5. However, there were only 36 stories in this category, so these percentages might not be truly representative.

So there were definitely differences in the distribution of ratings between categories. You can speculate about the reasons for this. Authors with different levels of experience may be preferentially drawn to certain categories more than others. The same may be true for voters with different temperaments along the generosity/pickiness scale. Some category communities may have developed a consensus about what constitutes a good story, while others may be conflicted, so that it is impossible to please one faction of voters without ticking off another

There are many threads in this forum that discuss the various reasons people have for voting the way they do, and the various strategies authors can employ to court higher ratings. The different ratings distributions in the different categories suggests that a rating in one category doesn’t necessarily mean exactly the same thing as it would in another. Readers should keep this in mind when browsing for stories, as should authors when toting up their laurels.

Bottom line, the ratings have their uses and their glitter/stigma.I probably obsess over them as much as the next fellow. But when I really think about it, I guess what I’m proudest of is having written the stories I wanted to write, then of having received kind comments from readers who enjoyed reading them, then of my vote counts, and only then of my ratings.

--------

A couple more points.

October is the month leading up to Halloween, and that may have biased the findings for some categories. The toplists included some stories that had only been up a few days, and so might have had low vote counts for that reason. Nevertheless, the data in the table probably presents a reasonable snapshot of activity across the different categories.

Vote counts and ratings can also be different for stand-alone stories and chapter stories. For example, in Nonconsent/Reluctance the median vote count for the chapter stories was only half what it was for the stand-alone stories (54 vs 107), but the median rating was quite a bit higher (4.36 vs 4.14). This same trend was true in Science Fiction/Fantasy (votes: 43 vs 66, ratings: 4.69 vs 4.44). In Loving Wives, however, the chapter stories received slightly lower median ratings (votes: 200 vs 314, ratings: 3.40 vs 3.51). I didn’t check all the categories, but I expect that they mostly follow the Nonconsent/Reluctance trend. That is, chapter stores tend to be read primarily by a small group of loyal followers who rate them highly. Except in Loving Wives, where it is a group of disgruntled followers.

I also suspect that there has been a rating inflation over the years. I sometimes come across older stories with so-so ratings that it seems to me would receive substantially higher ratings if they were submitted today.

 

[TxRad]

HectorBidon,

Two other factors you haven't taken into account in your list are:

1: The gaming of the top spots in each category. Some, more so than others.

2: Troll voting/sweeps at the end of each month or during a contest.

 

[NotWise]

Thanks for doing that.

As near as I can tell the chapter stories and standalone stories are probably different statistically. I know that the one series I posted got more views on the first instalment than on anything else and probably a lot of the people who read the later instalments were people who liked the first one, so views were lower but the ratings were higher.

Comparing standalone stories to the books or series may be an apples-to-oranges comparison.

Your table underscores what other authors have said about Loving Wives. I'm not sure why anyone posts there. It's a group that needs an attitude adjustment.

 

[GoldenCojones]

Your table underscores what other authors have said about Loving Wives. I'm not sure why anyone posts there. It's a group that needs an attitude adjustment.

I post there to stir the pot so to speak. Sure you get blasted by trolls but you also get loved on by fans. LW is fun to post to as long as you don't take death threats seriously and honestly how can someone make a serious death threat against someone that they have no clue who they really are.

Besides the funniest comments are almost always made in LW. They crack me up.

 

[TxRad]

I post there to stir the pot so to speak. Sure you get blasted by trolls but you also get loved on by fans. LW is fun to post to as long as you don't take death threats seriously and honestly how can someone make a serious death threat against someone that they have no clue who they really are.

Besides the funniest comments are almost always made in LW. They crack me up.

I've offered my address to a couple of the idiots. So far, I've had no takers. Maybe they've heard of the stand your ground laws here in Texas.

 

[GoldenCojones]

I've offered my address to a couple of the idiots. So far, I've had no takers. Maybe they've heard of the stand your ground laws here in Texas.

I wouldn't go that far. The paperwork is a bitch.

 

[TxRad]

I wouldn't go that far. The paperwork is a bitch.

A loving wives plot bunny if I ever heard one.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

AMENDED


You get a ONE for the effort (rather than nothing)
You get a TWO for whats coherent rather than word salad.
THREE means your effort is coherent and cohesive, it holds together and makes sense.
FOUR means its interesting and worth a read.
FIVE means I wanna read it again. ITS HARD TO PUT DOWN. Its a keeper.

 

[NotWise]

I've been getting a different kind of comment, and it surprises me. Twice in my brief experience I've had Anonymous posters offer their own short stories as comments. The first time it happened their story kind of spun off my story. The most recent one is nearly unrelated.

Is that common?

 

[NOIRTRASH]

I've been getting a different kind of comment, and it surprises me. Twice in my brief experience I've had Anonymous posters offer their own short stories as comments. The first time it happened their story kind of spun off my story. The most recent one is nearly unrelated.

Is that common?

Copycats are the best fans.