Why is the US currently the most powerful nation?

[Closet Desire]

pot holders, berets, and plasti-crap?

I won't give you a long list but one example: SMI (Semiconductor Manufacturing International, Shanghai). Competing head to head with TSMC (Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Co.) which is headed by mainland founder and chairman Morris Chang.

I flip over my Logitech mouse and it says--Made in China. Hmmm...this Diamond Supra SST 56K modem says--Made in China (and not an American made chip anywhere on the board). Ditto the BT Fax Machine and--oh my gawd--my new HP Fax 1220.

China figures prominently in Forbes magazine when discussing high tech and who's doing what. China doesn't make a lot of the lists because, being largely state owned, it's difficult to get accurate financial figures.

China, like America, is a land of contradictions but is nevertheless pretty solidly rooted in the 21st century.

The thing that concerns me is America's overwhelming need to be involved in the affairs of other nations. Even the US recognises mainland China rather than Taiwan yet the days of the Domino Theory mentality prevails even today. I wouldn't disagree that the US is the most powerful military force today but even that is too puny to alter the course of human destiny in the long term. One need only look at the long list of interventions and how they finally shook out. At best, American intervention only delayed and increased the cost of the final equilibrium.

 

[Ishmael]

Re: pot holders, berets, and plasti-crap?

I won't give you a long list but one example: SMI (Semiconductor Manufacturing International, Shanghai). Competing head to head with TSMC (Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Co.) which is headed by mainland founder and chairman Morris Chang.

I flip over my Logitech mouse and it says--Made in China. Hmmm...this Diamond Supra SST 56K modem says--Made in China (and not an American made chip anywhere on the board). Ditto the BT Fax Machine and--oh my gawd--my new HP Fax 1220.

China figures prominently in Forbes magazine when discussing high tech and who's doing what. China doesn't make a lot of the lists because, being largely state owned, it's difficult to get accurate financial figures.

China, like America, is a land of contradictions but is nevertheless pretty solidly rooted in the 21st century.

The thing that concerns me is America's overwhelming need to be involved in the affairs of other nations. Even the US recognises mainland China rather than Taiwan yet the days of the Domino Theory mentality prevails even today. I wouldn't disagree that the US is the most powerful military force today but even that is too puny to alter the course of human destiny in the long term. One need only look at the long list of interventions and how they finally shook out. At best, American intervention only delayed and increased the cost of the final equilibrium.

I have traveled to China a few times in the last 6 years. Mostly to Guangdong province. The purpose was to setup manufacture of the circuit boards that are used in pay telephones. Yes, the Chinese are getting very good at fabricaion. The components on the Ckt. Brd's. were manufactured in various countries. Many under design license of US manufacturers, or the Japanese.

Believe it or not, many of the Hi-tech facitlities and not to few of the core industries, are owned by high level party members. They have formed business alliances with Taiwanese business men. There are very few paper trails to follow. It requires that you meet the pricipals to really be able to figure the entaglements out. They have adopted the old Mandarin methods. They move their money out of the country via these alliances.

The workers live, eat, and sleep in sub-standard 'dormitories'. (more barracks like really) They are paid next to nothing. Pennies per hour for the most part. (justified by the company putting them up in the "Dorms".) There will come a time when the workers will demand a greater share.

The "real" Chinese hi-tech revolution is filled with graft and corruption on a scale most have never dreamed of. So much for REDWAVES 'workers paradise'. They have to keep it as hidden as they can.

So, while what you say is true, it is like an ice berg. You have seen the surface only.

As China matures, their internal problems will become a huge obstacle to future economic growth.

Ishmael

 

[Closet Desire]

I've never been...

...to China so I'm admittedly a long distance observer with all the failings that entails.

Still, I can't help but remark at the similarity it bears to America in the first half of the 19th century. My grandfather lived in a company house, bought at a company store, and worked, of course, for the company (Phillips 66).

I understand that today that lovely furniture we can buy at Ikea for next to nothing is made by workers in eastern Europe under the same conditions you've described.

Perhaps it is a necessary step toward industrialisation?

 

[Ishmael]

Re: I've never been...

...to China so I'm admittedly a long distance observer with all the failings that entails.

Still, I can't help but remark at the similarity it bears to America in the first half of the 19th century. My grandfather lived in a company house, bought at a company store, and worked, of course, for the company (Phillips 66).

I understand that today that lovely furniture we can buy at Ikea for next to nothing is made by workers in eastern Europe under the same conditions you've described.

Perhaps it is a necessary step toward industrialisation?

And that's been precisely my point all along. And I can't see them taking the next step with the form of government they have. Look at Russia.

Ishmael

 

[Spinaroonie]

There's no tyranny option.

 

[Closet Desire]

I dunno...

...'bout Russia.

It's not all rosy but it isn't doom and gloom either. When the low-cost US space launch program was suffering setbacks I had money riding on a series of Proton launches in Russia. All went off without a hitch. Electronic infrastructures are being built with gutsy entrepreneurs and venture capitalists from America and Europe. Petroleum research and development is seeing a much needed revitalization.

What's more revealing about the future is what's going on in former Soviet states where, with business partnerships with European firms, much needed capital development, jobs, and progress is taking place. Skoda, once the laughing stock of the world, is now a car equal to VW. Of course, that's because it IS a VW.

Most of this is without major changes in government but rather changes in economic policy. Government tends to be a reflection of the culture and changes only ever so slowly.

 

[Ishmael]

Re: I dunno...

...'bout Russia.

It's not all rosy but it isn't doom and gloom either. When the low-cost US space launch program was suffering setbacks I had money riding on a series of Proton launches in Russia. All went off without a hitch. Electronic infrastructures are being built with gutsy entrepreneurs and venture capitalists from America and Europe. Petroleum research and development is seeing a much needed revitalization.

What's more revealing about the future is what's going on in former Soviet states where, with business partnerships with European firms, much needed capital development, jobs, and progress is taking place. Skoda, once the laughing stock of the world, is now a car equal to VW. Of course, that's because it IS a VW.

Most of this is without major changes in government but rather changes in economic policy. Government tends to be a reflection of the culture and changes only ever so slowly.

Yes, things are looking better over there. Eventually neither Russia nor her past surrogates will look like 3rd world nations. And THAT'S exactly what they look like now. And what they looked like at the end of the Communist's throttle hold on the economy.

But please, don't even begin to tell me there hasn't been a profound change in the governments there. The profound change in the governments relationship with, and to, the economy, private sector enterprise (at all levels), the significant problems concerning the formulation of laws with regard to real estate, business, and the thousands of other little details required before foriegn investment becomes routine.

They will get there, but they will hardly be considered enmemies by then.

China has no choice but to follow or make war. A war that they would lose. I have no delusions that a land army can invade and conquer China. But their return to the Hunter/Gatherer stage of societal evolution would be rapid. They really aren't that far out of it as it is.

Ishmael

(edited for typo's)

 

[Spinaroonie]

Re: Hmmm...interesting question

Nineteen men with unarmed passenger jets brought the US to a standstill in one day and killed nearly 4,000 people with ample evidence that it could be done again today if they chose.

Stop inflating figures. The death tool is under 2900.

 

[Closet Desire]

Sorry...

...didn't look up the actual death toll but, then again, I didn't keep an exact count during Vietnam even with the numbers flashing beneath the Huntley Brinkley report--50,000? 60,000?

On the other hand--I'd say anything over twenty or thirty makes it so appalling that numbers are no longer relevant. (That's based on your average angry worker/deranged student/IRA activist death toll which is all too common.

 

[Problem Child]

Just wanted to pop in and say Ish and CD you guys both rock.

Later.

 

[Closet Desire]

Oh...

...cool!

That's just what someone at my stage in life needs to hear!

Now if all the young women would just stop telling me I remind them of their father.

 

[Ishmael]

Re: Oh...

...cool!

That's just what someone at my stage in life needs to hear!

Now if all the young women would just stop telling me I remind them of their father.

Then stop acting like their father.

Ishmael

 

[Closet Desire]

Guess...

...I should count myself lucky.

My wife still lets me photograph lovely women like the one in my av.

Of course...I have to pay them.

Do you think that will damage me psychologically--in the long run?

 

[Ishmael]

Re: Guess...

...I should count myself lucky.

My wife still lets me photograph lovely women like the one in my av.

Of course...I have to pay them.

Do you think that will damage me psychologically--in the long run?

Probably, better seek professional counseling.

Ishmael

 

[Pyper]

What's my prize, a canned ham?

In Spain, they give away hams as major prizes on game shows. No joke.

 

[Closet Desire]

Good thing...

...I married a psychologist eh?

And, about those Spanish hams, I'd rather have one of those than what a lot of shows give away!

 

[Pyper]

Re: Good thing...

...I married a psychologist eh?

And, about those Spanish hams, I'd rather have one of those than what a lot of shows give away!

I dunno about that, CD. Have you ever SEEN a Spanish ham? They come with the feet still attached. When my mother came to visit, she actually screamed out loud when I pointed out that she was standing right next to one.

 

[Ishmael]

Re: Good thing...

...I married a psychologist eh?

And, about those Spanish hams, I'd rather have one of those than what a lot of shows give away!

Jamon Serrano. Damn I love that stuff. You can get it at the Cuban markets here.

Ishmael

 

[Closet Desire]

As a matter of fact...

...I spend lots of time in Spain. Been going there since I was about 20. Sheesh...more than two decades.

Love the food, the people, and the food markets. They still know where food comes from--unlike both the Americans and the British. Fresh killed game hens hanging by their feet, rabbits, gosh the list could go on...

 

[Ishmael]

Re: As a matter of fact...

...I spend lots of time in Spain. Been going there since I was about 20. Sheesh...more than two decades.

Love the food, the people, and the food markets. They still know where food comes from--unlike both the Americans and the British. Fresh killed game hens hanging by their feet, rabbits, gosh the list could go on...

I may be in the UK in a month or two. Want to go to Spain?

Ishmael

 

[Closet Desire]

Man...

...I could use a holiday.

Unfortunately the next three months are among the busiest for us. We only manage a weekend in Paris in August if we're lucky. Spain we usually visit in January/February for a few reasons: dirt cheap (£100 week incl airfare), no flesh sizzling on the beach, and good for my wife's asthma.

We didn't get away this year because of the attacks in New York--demands for our services tripled following that and they haven't let up yet.

If you're going to be in London let me know and we'll take you out to dinner! BTW, going to Spain from the UK is a decent deal--you should be able to fly there and back for under £100.

 

[MechaBlade]

This is not really a question. America is powerful because it is the richest nation. Also having a strong military, large land mass, and lots of allies help. We wouldn't have nukes without money (not like we're going to use them), our military is strong partially because of our technology, technology = $, and diversity and spirit do almost nothing. So I voted "capitalism". Also, democracy helps keep the government from messing up our money and strength.

 

[MechaBlade]

Now, a good question is why is America so rich? Then a history teacher would have to come up and point out why for you. (isn't sch00lteacher a history teacher?)

 

[Guest]