Why I don't like your story

[HandsInTheDark]

I don't get a lot of pleasure from reading stories on Lit, and I realised some time ago it's because I'm too busy rewriting all of it in my head to match my own writing preferences. (This only seems to happen for erotica). Maybe it's because I grew up on Alistair Mclean stories, but for the most part I feel bogged down in most of I see on the site. From women writers it's generally the adjjectivitis. For guys I'm usually annoyed at the overly detailed mechanics of sex and the focus on physical descriptions (cf discussions of breasts size).

Mostly I look at stories when I get favorited and I go see what else the fan is fond of. (Usually I'm horrified.) This morning I ran across a highly rated (4.8+) story and got about three paragraphs in before I had to stop.

Yes, I know that's my problem and no true reflection on anyone's writing. But I'm curious about something.

As an exercise, I'm going to post a few of the story's paragraphs, unattributed (and apologies if it's yours). And then my rewrite. I'm inviting people to add their own rewrites; I want to see how other people deal with it. Try to maintain the personalities the two paragraphs hint at.

-- Original
Henry tightened his hold on her legs, preventing her feeble and half-hearted attempts of escaping the pleasure of his tongue. He looked up at her, smiling mischievously at her flushed face and heaving chest, "just relax Elena, you will like this..." he cooed while maintaining a firm hold on her legs.

Elena stiffened as she felt Henry's fingers part her delicate folds with one hand while his other hand continued to stop Elena's attempts in covering herself from him. She gasped loudly as she felt his warm, firm tongue push between her folds, sliding into her pussy, inch by wet inch. She let out a deep breath as she felt his tongue slide back out, but gasped anew as Henry's tongue pushed back in, deeper than before.

-- Mine (I tried to keep her relative innocence and his playfulness.)

"Henry!" Elena gasped, as Henry's tongue began to tease the folds of her pussy. "What - stop it"! She shifted, trying to get away, but his grip on her legs tightened, forcing her into a more exposed position.

"You'll like it," he chuckled mischievously. "Listen to your breathing. It sounds to me like you already like it a lot."

She tried to push him off. "It just feels stran- stop! No mor-"

His tongue pushed deep into her suddenly, and her protests collapsed into a ragged moan. It pressed deeper, then slid out and flicked lightly, spreading her open.

"Stop," she said, more weakly. "This is so wrong-"

His only reply was a teasing series of fluttering teases around her clit, and then forceful flicking. Her head fell back and her body tensed, slowly. "Henry... don't..."

And then a fingertip, slowly parting her folds, then suddenly forcing into her. She sobbed, arching, rigid, already hungry for more. His muted chuckle brought a hot blush to her cheeks.

 

[SusanJillParker]

[Personal attacks and trolling prohibited per our Forum Rules]

 

[jsmiam]

They both suck.

Normally, we can avoid non con rape while still halfheartedly acknowledging the freedom of choice of others by just not going to the non con section if we don't want to.

Then, times like this, non con is inflicted on us without our consent.

 

[BuckyDuckman]

I don't get a lot of pleasure from reading stories on Lit, and I realised some time ago it's because I'm too busy rewriting all of it in my head to match my own writing preferences. (This only seems to happen for erotica). Maybe it's because I grew up on Alistair Mclean stories, but for the most part I feel bogged down in most of I see on the site. From women writers it's generally the adjjectivitis. For guys I'm usually annoyed at the overly detailed mechanics of sex and the focus on physical descriptions (cf discussions of breasts size).

Mostly I look at stories when I get favorited and I go see what else the fan is fond of. (Usually I'm horrified.) This morning I ran across a highly rated (4.8+) story and got about three paragraphs in before I had to stop.

Yes, I know that's my problem and no true reflection on anyone's writing. But I'm curious about something.

As an exercise, I'm going to post a few of the story's paragraphs, unattributed (and apologies if it's yours). And then my rewrite. I'm inviting people to add their own rewrites; I want to see how other people deal with it. Try to maintain the personalities the two paragraphs hint at.

-- Original
Henry tightened his hold on her legs, preventing her feeble and half-hearted attempts of escaping the pleasure of his tongue. He looked up at her, smiling mischievously at her flushed face and heaving chest, "just relax Elena, you will like this..." he cooed while maintaining a firm hold on her legs.

Elena stiffened as she felt Henry's fingers part her delicate folds with one hand while his other hand continued to stop Elena's attempts in covering herself from him. She gasped loudly as she felt his warm, firm tongue push between her folds, sliding into her pussy, inch by wet inch. She let out a deep breath as she felt his tongue slide back out, but gasped anew as Henry's tongue pushed back in, deeper than before.

-- Mine (I tried to keep her relative innocence and his playfulness.)

"Henry!" Elena gasped, as Henry's tongue began to tease the folds of her pussy. "What - stop it"! She shifted, trying to get away, but his grip on her legs tightened, forcing her into a more exposed position.

"You'll like it," he chuckled mischievously. "Listen to your breathing. It sounds to me like you already like it a lot."

She tried to push him off. "It just feels stran- stop! No mor-"

His tongue pushed deep into her suddenly, and her protests collapsed into a ragged moan. It pressed deeper, then slid out and flicked lightly, spreading her open.

"Stop," she said, more weakly. "This is so wrong-"

His only reply was a teasing series of fluttering teases around her clit, and then forceful flicking. Her head fell back and her body tensed, slowly. "Henry... don't..."

And then a fingertip, slowly parting her folds, then suddenly forcing into her. She sobbed, arching, rigid, already hungry for more. His muted chuckle brought a hot blush to her cheeks.

Rather ballsy move, HandsInTheDark. I respect your opinion, however, I think it's rather presumptuous for you to want every story on Lit to fit your style preferences.

Lit includes a wide variety of skill levels, voices, and techniques. Your post suggests a one-size-fits-most style.

True, there are lots of differing skill levels on display at Lit. Some highly ranked stories, to me, read as nothing more than graphic strokers where the appeal must be the content and not skill level of its author. But they find an audience who enjoys them, even if it's not you.

Re-writing another author's work to "fix" its style feels like re-recording a song to give it a Reggae beat, because who doesn't love a Reggae beat?

I think the original passage is fine as is.

 

[lovecraft68]

You're free to express your opinions but I feel this is a little pretentious.

I am sure people could find plenty they would want to rewite in yours. Things like this cut both ways.

We all write stories the way we feel they should be written and we all see stuff that makes us go ugh but we have to understand our ugh is another readers "wow"

I think you might take some heat on this

 

[lovecraft68]

They both suck.

Normally, we can avoid non con rape while still halfheartedly acknowledging the freedom of choice of others by just not going to the non con section if we don't want to.

Then, times like this, non con is inflicted on us without our consent.

Thank you for this post.

 

[TxRad]

As for rewriting stories in your own style... wouldn't it be better to write your own stories.

 

[GoldenMaia]

I liked the original better.

Writers here post stories for free to enjoy the craft of spinning a story.

Trolls will be trolls but I don't think you were trying to do that--maybe -- giving the non-con subject matter, who knows.

Here is a good rule of thumb: If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all.

(I know this is a concept this site doesn't grasp, nor does the internet as a whole. Glass houses and all that. Stop your stone chuck'n.)

 

[sr71plt]

As with many rewrites, the rewrite here changes the original. The original doesn't go as far as nonconsent. It's reluctance, but the original has her acknowledging she's getting pleasure from the tonguing in the first line and her counter attempts are defined as half-hearted right off the bat. She hasn't gone to the "no." The rewrite starts with the "no," so it starts off as nonconsent.

As far as erotica writing, I think the original is far more sensual than the rewrite.

As far as the complaint, I suggest that the OP look more deeply into the story file--there's got to be stories in a file that large that will satisfy--and just to leave the ones alone that don't satisfy as they probably do satisfy other readers with equal rights to be satisfied by the stories at Lit. If you don't like what you're reading at Lit., write your own stories.

 

[Nathan_Brazil]

Game

Both are fine. Art can be enjoyed in a variety of ways... I'm sure there are readers who enjoy it either way.

This, however, seems to lead us to a game. We need an author to post 2 or 3 paragraphs of their own material... And encourage everyone to take a crack at it.

 

[sr71plt]

Both are fine. Art can be enjoyed in a variety of ways... I'm sure there are readers who enjoy it either way.

This, however, seems to lead us to a game. We need an author to post 2 or 3 paragraphs of their own material... And encourage everyone to take a crack at it.

You first. I don't write by committee.

 

[Desiremakesmeweak]

All the same... I have noticed a recent ideology around the world, to do with writing, and half the time it comes from Universities claiming to teach literary writing skills, and the other half it is from people trying to develop some sort of automated program to do the job.

And one of the things that comes up time and time again, is this dogma about dialogue.

So... The thing is about Henry and Elena, is it? And Henry is going to force his way onto Elena.

Sounds to me like it would read more realistic if it were Ali Hassan and some Yazidi woman:

"It's slave market day!" Whooped Ali, through his ugly teeth and stained lips.

The woman just stood there, silent. Angry, silent, powerless.

"I'll pay a pistol for that Yazidi slave. The pale-haired one. Ha-har-har-harrrggh."

Ali Hassan stuck his hand crudely between her legs like the sexual illiterate that he was.

Back in America, millions of useless, mindless, and equally sexually illiterate and naiive males sat back and did absolutely nothing, as their criminally insane and corrupt government crudely managed the slave markets of today's world from well behind the gauche scenery painted onto televisions screens by the entangled media. Well, they didn't do 'absolutely nothing' at all - some of them flicked the channel selector switches on their tv remotes, and others of them, in similar arrogant style as with the swaggering Obama/Widido arrogance that was the zeitgeist of all of their leaders, arrogantly tried to tell real writers how to write.

And you couldn't really say it was all just because none of them knew how to fuck properly; they certainly did know how to think about thieving sex from someone who was at a clear disadvantage. And mostly they thought it could be achieved by holding down, and gripping or holding very firmly - with superior force or power - and then prising open, and then, and only then, SLOWLY parting the lips, and THEN SUDDENLY FORCING!

And thrusting, no doubt. And forcing and thrusting. And thrusting. Ugh, ugh, ugh, unh, mhph-mnnnn. Rrgh, rrgh, rrgh, urrrrrgh.

(Wipes lips.)

 

[sr71plt]

I'm sure there must be an English translation available for this somewhere.

 

[DwellerDark]

As for rewriting stories in your own style... wouldn't it be better to write your own stories.

Yeah, this is how I feel.

I don't see the sense in trying to change somebody else's style. Just write the kind of stories you wish others were writing, and if others agree then you'll find your audience and maybe even influence other writers.

 

[rjordan]

I don't get a lot of pleasure from reading stories on Lit...

I do. I have no idea how many stories appear each month in the 2-3 categories I scan, but I'm happy if I find half a dozen that appeal to me enough to finish them.

That may seem harsh, but it's about the same percentage as I find in mainstream publishing. There are hundreds of new books published each month. I'm happy if I find two a month that appeal to me.

I'm not saying the rest are crap. I'm just saying for one reason or another they don't appeal to me. They obviously appeal to others.

Read what you enjoy. Write what you enjoy. Leave others to do the same.

rj

 

[NOIRTRASH]

People confuse good writing with popular fashion, and fashion changes tho good writing doesn't.

 

[sr71plt]

What's considered good writing at any given time is influenced by fashion of the time as well.

 

[lovecraft68]

As with many rewrites, the rewrite here changes the original. The original doesn't go as far as nonconsent. It's reluctance, but the original has her acknowledging she's getting pleasure from the tonguing in the first line and her counter attempts are defined as half-hearted right off the bat. She hasn't gone to the "no." The rewrite starts with the "no," so it starts off as nonconsent.

As far as erotica writing, I think the original is far more sensual than the rewrite.

As far as the complaint, I suggest that the OP look more deeply into the story file--there's got to be stories in a file that large that will satisfy--and just to leave the ones alone that don't satisfy as they probably do satisfy other readers with equal rights to be satisfied by the stories at Lit. If you don't like what you're reading at Lit., write your own stories.

Good observation. Especially amusing as the op and I have locked horns on the fact they refuse to admit they like flat out rape porn.

But here they take a story that is reluctance and following the spirit of lits "victim should enjoy it rule" and this upset them so they rewrote it as flat out non con. Therefore proving beyond a doubt what they are here to read and write.

Also to add to a previous post I feel things like non con as well as incest that we all know offend many people need not be placed in public posts out of courtesy.

The op made it clear in a previous thread they abhor incest stories as much as I don't like non con.

Difference is I get many feel that way and wont post incest excepts on threads unless that is the purpose of the thread.

Anyway thanks for making the point. It validates my take things

 

[karaline]

I don't get a lot of pleasure from reading stories on Lit, and I realised some time ago it's because I'm too busy rewriting all of it in my head to match my own writing preferences. (This only seems to happen for erotica). Maybe it's because I grew up on Alistair Mclean stories, but for the most part I feel bogged down in most of I see on the site. From women writers it's generally the adjjectivitis. For guys I'm usually annoyed at the overly detailed mechanics of sex and the focus on physical descriptions (cf discussions of breasts size).

Mostly I look at stories when I get favorited and I go see what else the fan is fond of. (Usually I'm horrified.) This morning I ran across a highly rated (4.8+) story and got about three paragraphs in before I had to stop.

Yes, I know that's my problem and no true reflection on anyone's writing. But I'm curious about something.

As an exercise, I'm going to post a few of the story's paragraphs, unattributed (and apologies if it's yours). And then my rewrite. I'm inviting people to add their own rewrites; I want to see how other people deal with it. Try to maintain the personalities the two paragraphs hint at...

I have to say I think this is an extraordinary thing to do.

It would be my idea of hell on earth to log into the authors hangout and find people dissecting my feeble attempts at writing.

 

[Hypoxia]

When I first hit LIT as a reader my tech.editor radar lit up constantly. Almost everything I read looked like it needed SERIOUS editing. After a while I learned to go with the flow. And after a while longer I figured, "I can do better than this!" and I started writing my own. It can be a process, hey?

Now I mostly don't bother reading others' stories. Mine are better.

 

[Nathan_Brazil]

You first. I don't write by committee.

I would, but thus far, I've only posted the one piece. Maybe with my Christmas piece.

 

[HandsInTheDark]

Wow. I thought it would be interesting to compare and contrast styles and get into a discussion of technique. This is a little more vitriol than I was expecting, especially after I pointed out that my dislike of the style reflected my limitations and not a dig at the story. That story got a 4.81, people, it's clearly successful and stands above my criticism.

I wanted to discuss style, and see how others would spin that same text. But skip it.

The only point I'll respond to is that I found the story under noncon and I don't think I violated the original authors intent by adding the word No. But I do get that it's uncool to spring a noncon scene on people without warning. Mea culpa.

 

[TamLin01]

It's true, there's a lot of bad writing out there. Most people have no professional training or experience and no access to a professional editor, after all. But that's the nature of the beast: If EVERYONE was a good writer it wouldn't be remarkable. If it's really bad, stop reading. If you think it can improve, leave a comment. And, as always, work harder at your own writing. Everything else is out of our control.

 

[BuckyDuckman]

Wow. I thought it would be interesting to compare and contrast styles and get into a discussion of technique. This is a little more vitriol than I was expecting, especially after I pointed out that my dislike of the style reflected my limitations and not a dig at the story. That story got a 4.81, people, it's clearly successful and stands above my criticism.

I wanted to discuss style, and see how others would spin that same text. But skip it.

For what it's worth, by picking someone else's writing, you set yourself up for the reaction you got. Not everyone likes the Mona Lisa, but suggesting it would be better if done in the style Pablo Picasso is a stretch. I certainly understood you didn't intent picking on the original author. Regardless of intent, it was implied too strong.

I think you'll find a waiting group of authors ready to weigh in on the topics of styles and techniques, just not at the expense of someone else's work.

 

[sr71plt]

The only point I'll respond to is that I found the story under noncon and I don't think I violated the original authors intent by adding the word No. But I do get that it's uncool to spring a noncon scene on people without warning. Mea culpa.

The category isn't Noncon, it's NonConsent/Reluctance. So, I stick with my response, and what I see of what wasn't erased from this thread wasn't really vitrol at all. My point was that it originally was reluctance, which legitimately fits in that category, and you changed it to nonconsent.