Troll Discussion

[impressive]

If you're interested, I've started a thread on the AH to brainstorm ways for Lit to "tame the trolls."

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=321887

My recommendation: only votes cast when a reader is logged in count toward the rating. This would: (a) decrease the overall number of votes that Lit has to police for trolls; (b) enhance Lit's options for penalties for trolling (e.g., closing accounts, removing the stories/poems of trolls, etc.); and (c) increase the number of registered users (which will help Lit in terms of ad revenue).

Given that poetry gets far fewer readers/votes than stories, a troll vote has a significantly greater impact.

I'm kinda "on strike" until I see some indication that steps are being taken to alleviate the problem. I'm not posting any new material, and will begin gradually pulling down old material, unless something is done.

Lit may say BFD ... or Lit may realize that authors' and poets' freely shared work is essential for its existence. Only time will tell.

~ Imp

 

[Tathagata]

If you're interested, I've started a thread on the AH to brainstorm ways for Lit to "tame the trolls."

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=321887

My recommendation: only votes cast when a reader is logged in count toward the rating. This would: (a) decrease the overall number of votes that Lit has to police for trolls; (b) enhance Lit's options for penalties for trolling (e.g., closing accounts, removing the stories/poems of trolls, etc.); and (c) increase the number of registered users (which will help Lit in terms of ad revenue).

Given that poetry gets far fewer readers/votes than stories, a troll vote has a significantly greater impact.

I'm kinda "on strike" until I see some indication that steps are being taken to alleviate the problem. I'm not posting any new material, and will begin gradually pulling down old material, unless something is done.

Lit may say BFD ... or Lit may realize that authors' and poets' freely shared work is essential for its existence. Only time will tell.

~ Imp

I can sympathize with your frustration and your anger.
But they fact is there will always be trolls, there will always be low votes, and nasty comments.
people can register and vote and make an obnoxious comment and then never use the name again.

what you have to do, and it's easier said than done, is ignore the low votes, ignore the bullshit, and pay attention to the good people who offer constructive criticism and object feedback.

trolls are usually people who have 1) an agenda, 2) a mental illness, 3) no friggin life and they get off on the attention. 4) Salieri like characters who think they have talent but no one else seems to recognize it,,so they go after the " Mozart's" of the group, if you will.

The fact that you have attracted some means you are doing something right...or some whack job has a crush on you and is doing the written equivalent of pulling your pigtails at recess.
: )
Hang in there

 

[Trent_Dutch]

I don't think I've ever been the victim of a troll... and as far as I can see, the only way they can influence a submission is in the overall rating for the piece. I personally pay very little attention to ratings and very very rarely vote on a piece (A few simple words can say more than a number.... and when I think about it, the only ratings I've seen are for my own poems in my submissions page, so the ratings given to other poems/pieces has never influenced or affected me when I've read other poetry).

Do the ratings have any other purpose except to let the author know what others thought in general (without anything solid or substantial, to feed their fevered little egos), and to let the audience say what they want to with an easily categorised click of the mouse ("Hmmmm.... definitely a 4 poem".... thats not criticism, constructive or not. Thats just laziness). Infact to me, the ratings just seem like a competitive sideshow. In truth the ratings should have no bearing whatsoever on a submission... the audience/readers should take the piece for what it is. When I read a piece I'm even very careful not to read comments on the bottom of the page until i've assessed the piece to my own satisfaction, just to stop any influence on how I view the piece. Its like when I buy an old, classic or influential or controversial book, I skip through prefaces and introductions and editors notes, start at chapter 1 and ignore most footnotes, take the piece for what it is, absorb and digest it and try to stay away from others interpretations till I have interpreted it myself.

In short, I believe the ratings are pointless... this isn't a competition, and when there is a competition (such as challenges/contests) its handled quite well, so as to avoid trollish votes.

I actually prefer it when I see an overall 3.6 or so vote on a submission of mine, it usually means someones taken the time provide useful feedback to me, instead of a 5 and some simpering praise, or a 1 and no comment at all. There could actually be an argument that the opposite of the bad troll is more prolific. Thats why I comment so rarely, because I always try to say something useful to the author.

 

[Tathagata]

many people feel the ratings are pointless...and there's about 50 threads arguing the point to death.
I've found that suggesting they mean " nothing" tends to stir the pot and the debate rages , ashes ashes and we all fall down.

If you are going to take the ratings seriously then you have to accept the odd troll here and there.
the other option, as always, is to turn feedback/ voting off.
No option pleases everyone..
Go figure

 

[impressive]

...or some whack job has a crush on you and is doing the written equivalent of pulling your pigtails at recess.
: )
Hang in there

Made me smile. Thanks.

~ Imp

 

[Maria2394]

OT once told me, as we discussed the lower votes for E poems, that the lower votes were probably a way to even the playing field that has run amok. I wrote a poem to his response.

Often times, what one person may perceive as a troll, is actually someone who may not be in that persons fan club and thus does not give them the unwarranted 5's they are so accustomed to.

you have to take the lumps if you want the H's to mean anything....

sorry to sound bitter, but hey, no one is immune to the troll crap on here, pull your stuff, I pulled mine.... if it makes you feel better, do it, that way no one can give you low votes and you will have nothing else to be upset about

 

[Rybka]

. . .
sorry to sound bitter, but hey, no one is immune to the troll crap on here, pull your stuff, I pulled mine.... if it makes you feel better, do it, that way no one can give you low votes and you will have nothing else to be upset about

You don't have to pull your poems or stories. All you have to do is turn off the voting. You can even leave thr Public Comments on and just delete the nasty ones if you are so inclined.

 

[impressive]

This message contains feedback for: impressive
This feedback was sent by: Anonymous

Comments:

I just checked your page, IMpressive. You have 16 poems, only three do not have H's, and it is nearly the same for your stories. What is the troll situation with you? Did you expect everything to be a perfect 5? Im sorry dear, you arent living in the real world, why dont you try submitting your work to the outside world, to people with credentials and education and see how well it is accepted? and then maybe you will find out how good you are, or arent just a thought----seems like you are recting to nothing but a sore ego

Dear Anonymous, (of course, it's gotta be anonymous)

No, I do not expect everything to be a perfect 5. What I expect is the malicious voting to be removed or prevented to the extent feasible -- not just for me (and my ego), but for everyone who freely gives their time and creative energies to Lit.

~ Imp

 

[impressive]

You don't have to pull your poems or stories. All you have to do is turn off the voting. You can even leave thr Public Comments on and just delete the nasty ones if you are so inclined.

But then you take yourself out of the running for any contests or placement on any Top Lists. It stands to reason that if you care about the accuracy of your score, then you also care about participating in the various ways in which your work can be recognized.

 

[impressive]

sorry to sound bitter, but hey, no one is immune to the troll crap on here, pull your stuff, I pulled mine.... if it makes you feel better, do it, that way no one can give you low votes and you will have nothing else to be upset about

Perhaps that worked for you. I'm the type of person who would still be "upset" about the injustice continuing to affect the rest of Lit's authors and poets. When I see a malfunctioning system, my inclination is to try to fix it. I can no more stop doing that than I can stop breathing.

~ Imp

 

[*Catbabe*]

Often times, what one person may perceive as a troll, is actually someone who may not be in that persons fan club and thus does not give them the unwarranted 5's they are so accustomed to.

This isn't a comment on my own voting patterns because outside of the recent poetry contests, I have pretty much given up voting at literotica. The voting means nothing to me as a writer so it follows that I won't spend my time doing it as a reader. I would rather contribute to the forum by reading and commenting on the writing there.

I agree with Maria. I think it is a mistake to assume, especially if one has a following of friends voting on one's work, that the odd low vote or several low votes, are anything other than someone's honest opinions on the writing. The best way to test that is to post something under a nickname that nobody knows.

You are right Impressive that the Lit system is flawed and that voters and writers can easily cheat. I think you have to look at the site though, and consider what its raison d'etre really is.

Literotica is not about excellence in erotic writing and it never claimed to be. There is no editorial board rejecting and choosing the stories and poems that it wishes to post at Literotica. Lit. is not a publication. It is a storage site with some minimum requirments for the stories that it posts. The top lists and contests I am sure were set up when the site was smaller to encourage production to ensure that the average reader had thousands of stories to choose from when they come here.

I really do understand your frustrations Impressive but I think your efforts are wasted here because you are trying to change a site (a very successful site) into something it is not and maybe never wanted to be.

 

[sandspike]

Do girls troll guys?

Is there some beautiful thing out there keeping my poems from all having "H's"?
Maybe it is the way I write and fact that everyones life doesn't orbit around
beaches and beer. Just remember opinions ARE like assholes. People shouldn't
influence when, what, or where you write. Your core of voters love your
poetry. Listen to poets you like and keep writing. This issue isn't going away,
so try and forget it. This is Literotica, there are too many perverts here to
expect too much. I'm sorry but that is the way it is.

 

[Tathagata]

I think you have to look at the site though, and consider what its

raison d'etre

really is.
.

hey
I know some of that canada talk

" How apropos"

" It's de rigeur"


cool eh?

 

[Angeline]

These days I only vote when I want to give a 5 because I think the poem is worth it. And I don't vote unless I also comment.

People vote here for all kinds of reasons, and there is no way to control that I voted for your poem because my friend said I should or I like your av as opposed to because it's a whatever it is quality poem.

Unfortunate but true.

 

[Angeline]

Is there some beautiful thing out there keeping my poems from all having "H's"?
Maybe it is the way I write and fact that everyones life doesn't orbit around
beaches and beer. Just remember opinions ARE like assholes. People shouldn't
influence when, what, or where you write. Your core of voters love your
poetry. Listen to poets you like and keep writing. This issue isn't going away,
so try and forget it. This is Literotica, there are too many perverts here to
expect too much. I'm sorry but that is the way it is.

Sometimes I think to be here and vote solely on the merit of a poem as a piece of writing *is* the perversion. The norm has more to do with fan clubs and your "rep."

It's like any popularity contest. Yes that's cynical, but it has been that way as long as I've been here. The people who work with each other, learn, and become better writers from being here are the ones who benefit--not necessarily those who get the highest scores or win a prize.

 

[impressive]

This is what I sent to Laurel:

On the Author's Hangout, we have been discussing ways for Lit to "tame the trolls." I believe this should be a priority. It has gotten so annoying to me, on multiple levels, that I'm planning to pull my work if something is not done to alleviate the problem.

My recommendation, which has some support, is to simply discard all votes cast if the reader is not logged in. This would: (a) decrease the overall number of votes that Lit has to police for trolls, thereby lessening workload; (b) give Lit a clearer avenue to penalize those who troll by closing their accounts or removing their stories/poems; (c) increase the number of registered members, thereby statistically helping Lit in terms of ad revenue. Lit doesn't let the unregistered vote in the annual awards polls -- so why count their votes toward other contests and Top Lists?

The more determined trolls will find ways around just about any system, but I think the above suggestion would curtail the largest chunk of trolling with the least amount of effort. In addition, it would send a message both to the trolls and to those who give freely of their creative energies that Lit holds its authors in the highest regard.

Please take a look at the various ideas tossed around by those who have been dedicated to Lit's success:

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=321887

No only do we want our scores to properly reflect our work, we want to help in any way we can. We want Lit to be the best it can possibly be -- and one way to ensure that is to attract and keep the cream of the crop in terms of authors and poets.

 

[Angeline]

This is what I sent to Laurel:

My experience with Laurel is that if there's any way she can help, she will. It would be wonderful if this works out. I wish there were a way around alts, too, because I think that's another loophole in the system. As far as logging in, I don't know why people leave anonymous comments unless they forget to log in or they want to troll you.

 

[annaswirls]

Sometimes I think to be here and vote solely on the merit of a poem as a piece of writing *is* the perversion. The norm has more to do with fan clubs and your "rep."

It's like any popularity contest. Yes that's cynical, but it has been that way as long as I've been here. The people who work with each other, learn, and become better writers from being here are the ones who benefit--not necessarily those who get the highest scores or win a prize.

I think that is the truest thing I have ever read on the topic.



I do not like labeling them trolls. It dehumanizes voters.

And it puts into mind a stereotype, when in truth there are all kinds of reasons for people to vote lower than the crowd. I suspect the majority are not some evil force set out to destroy civilization or someone's chance at winning the best of this or that.

I know I have gotten more 5's than I deserved.

Way more.

It takes a while to realize this. So easy to get lost in the intoxicating feeling that comes with good girl!

I confess that I have voted lower than the crowd on poems. I have even done so without comment, only when I am pretty darn sure that the comment will not change anything except fan clubs thinking the comment reflects me and not the poem anyway. Or if I know the poet just gets defensive and does not intend to learn or grow.

If that makes me a troll well damn, I better go buy me a wig! I would like to be one on the end of a pencil. Magenta fuzz.

I don't vote anymore. Except when I love the poem or if I am looking for sexual favors.

I only leave suggestions on people's poems when they ask for it. There are threads for people who really want to work on their poems within the structure of literotica. To each his own.

Damn I need a shower.


and let's remember: Hallmark is a multimillion billion trillion dollar industry

 

[impressive]

I do not like labeling them trolls. It dehumanizes voters.

And it puts into mind a stereotype, when in truth there are all kinds of reasons for people to vote lower than the crowd.

When a voter goes through your entire roster of stories and poems in the course of a few hours and leaves a 1 vote on each and every one, I have absolutely no problem whatsoever labeling that voter a troll.

That's the type of behavior I'm trying to combat.

~ Imp

 

[Lauren Hynde]

This is what I sent to Laurel:

Like Angeline, my experience is that Laurel always tries to do the best thing possible for Literotica's authors, and I believe she will now as well. I don't think she has been online in the last few days, so don't worry if she doesn't reply quickly enough, but she will get to it.

The only other thing I want to add for now is that I really admire what you're trying to do, but I really hate this strike of yours.

 

[annaswirls]

When a voter goes through your entire roster of stories and poems in the course of a few hours and leaves a 1 vote on each and every one, I have absolutely no problem whatsoever labeling that voter a troll.

That's the type of behavior I'm trying to combat.

~ Imp

That kind of behavior is different and easily corrected by Laurels big crunching machine. I am pretty sure it eats bad votes.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

That kind of behavior is different and easily corrected by Laurels big crunching machine. I am pretty sure it eats bad votes.

Yes! And again, if that hasn't worked in the past few days (or couple of weeks) I believe it's because Laurel has been away.

 

[impressive]

The only other thing I want to add for now is that I really admire what you're trying to do, but I really hate this strike of yours.

Thanks. Considering I'm being chastised for whining and having an overinflated ego, that really helps. I've no doubt that when I finally do post something new, it's going to be voted into oblivion rather quickly.

 

[Angeline]

That kind of behavior is different and easily corrected by Laurels big crunching machine. I am pretty sure it eats bad votes.

You look so cute in that av. An adorable poet.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

Thanks. Considering I'm being chastised for whining and having an overinflated ego, that really helps. I've no doubt that when I finally do post something new, it's going to be voted into oblivion rather quickly.

I just hope that if you do feel like going on strike, at least constinue to write so that you can post a bunch of new poems and stories the minute it ends.