This Pisses Me Off

[Boxlicker101]

According to this, California is going to be suspending executions, for fear some bloodthirsty killer/rapist might suffer a few minutes of discomfort. I honestly believe we should go back to public hangings. That was the method used when the Bill of Rights was written, and it was constitutional then, so it would still be constitutional.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061216/ap_on_re_us/executions_suspended

Anybody with an ounce of sense knows that injunction against cruel and unusual punishment meant things like burning at the stake or pressing to death or hanging in irons or drawing and quartering or the other things that used to be done to amuse the kings and emperors of Europe.

People put up with more pain getting tattoos.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

They are all pussies out there in California, what do you expect.

 

[Boxlicker101]

They are all pussies out there in California, what do you expect.

Actually, the voters always vote overwhelmingly in favor of capital punishment. They would probably vote for public hanging if they had a chance. I certainly would. The problem is the asshole judges who don't believe in doing their jobs. Especially the ones appointed by Governor Moonbeam. We got rid of the State Supreme Court members appointed by him as soon as we could, but the lower courts are harder to clean up. Now he's all set to be the AG. Most likely he will try to get all prisoners released from prison if they say a couple of Our Fathers, or some such crap.

I know this particular judge was a federal judge, but he's an asshole too.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Actually, the voters always vote overwhelmingly in favor of capital punishment. They would probably vote for public hanging if they had a chance. I certainly would. The problem is the asshole judges who don't believe in doing their jobs. Especially the ones appointed by Governor Moonbeam. We got rid of the State Supreme Court members appointed by him as soon as we could, but the lower courts are harder to clean up. Now he's all set to be the AG. Most likely he will try to get all prisoners released from prison if they say a couple of Our Fathers, or some such crap.

I know this particular judge was a federal judge, but he's an asshole too.

The federal court system in California has been seeded with left wing nut cases for the last 20 years. The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals is so left they tipover every time they make a descision, plus they love to create new law. Of course they have been over turned by the SC on a number of occations.

 

[Boxlicker101]

The federal court system in California has been seeded with left wing nut cases for the last 20 years. The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals is so left they tipover every time they make a descision, plus they love to create new law. Of course they have been over turned by the SC on a number of occations.

I know that. More often than any other COA.

I'm not sure how district court justices get appointed. I know it is by the president, but I think the pres. always appoints the person recommended by the senior senator, or some such thing. That would mean that most district judges in Ca. were effectively appointed by Alan Cranston, who was a real pussy. He didn't resign in disgrace, but he declined to run for re-election after he got caught being an honest politician. By that, I mean he stayed bought.

 

[TE999]

The federal court system in California has been seeded with left wing nut cases for the last 20 years. The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals is so left they tipover every time they make a descision, plus they love to create new law. Of course they have been over turned by the SC on a number of occations.

That's The Ninth CIRCUS Court of Appeals, BTW.

Actually, hanging is a humane way of execution if done properly.

The neck snaps, and presto, no more scumbag.

If it was good enough for the Nazis at Nuremburg, it's good enough for our murdering refuse.

Le Gey-yo-teen is pretty foolproof too. Except for those with really thick necks.

They had to drop the blade on one guy three times. He was the exception, though.

I thought California had the gas chamber?

Or has that been retired?

Air dance em' I say.

Peace.

 

[Boxlicker101]

The gas chamber used to be used. Maybe they stopped because of air pollution. I agree with hanging. It was used for about 150 years, and I don't know why it was stopped. Maybe it was because if a woman was hanged while wearing a dress, bystanders might have been able to see her underwear. I'm not kidding about that. I believe there actually were some complaints to that effect.

 

[TE999]

The gas chamber used to be used. Maybe they stopped because of air pollution. I agree with hanging. It was used for about 150 years, and I don't know why it was stopped. Maybe it was because if a woman was hanged while wearing a dress, bystanders might have been able to see her underwear. I'm not kidding about that. I believe there actually were some complaints to that effect.

When they hung Mrs. Surratt that helped kill Abe Lincoln.

They tied her skirt together at the ankles.

She wasn't goin' anywhere, 'cept down.

Problem solved (grin).

Peace.

 

[rgraham666]

Foolish of me but I'll list my objections to capital punishment.

1. You can't fix mistakes.

2. It isn't carried out fairly.

3. It's a political tool, not a judicial one.

That's it. I'm gone.

 

[Liar]

I'm not going to debate whether authority organized murder is right or not. I'm convinced it never is, and I'll leave it at that. It's irrelevant for this discussion.

Now, back to my point.

Most execution methods are beyond stupid.

Hanging, gas chanbers, electric chairs, lethal injections, guilliotines... they're all for show, a spectacular way for the revenge hungry to watch their nemesis go down. None of them are instant, and all of them are easy to mess up. But they take a few seconds, up to a minute. Enough for the spectators to say "take that, you bastard" under their breath.

IF you want to administer a fast and painless death, minimize the risks of getting it wrong and prolonging the suffering, you do what the chinese do (or at least used to do). You shoot them in the head. One bullet to the brain, and the convict is dead before he realize it.

IF you nessecarily have to sentence people to death, carry it out properly. You did not snetence them to "a minute of suffering, then death". So aim for instant obliteration of brain. Or don't kill.

Anything else is just dumb.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Foolish of me but I'll list my objections to capital punishment.

1. You can't fix mistakes.

2. It isn't carried out fairly.

3. It's a political tool, not a judicial one.

That's it. I'm gone.

The thing to do is to scrupulously avoid making mistakes. That is why the system of appeals is set up.

It is carried out fairly. Nobody is ever ut to death more than once.

What is political about exterminating some murdering scum? I agree that the death sentence should be pronounced by the jury, and that the presiding judge should have NO POWER OR AUTHORITY WHATSOEVER to change it.

 

[3113]

It is carried out fairly. Nobody is ever ut to death more than once.

Blink, Blink. Come again? Are those sentences suppose to go together?

 

[geronimo_appleby]

According to this, California is going to be suspending executions, for fear some bloodthirsty killer/rapist might suffer a few minutes of discomfort. I honestly believe we should go back to public hangings. That was the method used when the Bill of Rights was written, and it was constitutional then, so it would still be constitutional.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061216/ap_on_re_us/executions_suspended

Anybody with an ounce of sense knows that injunction against cruel and unusual punishment meant things like burning at the stake or pressing to death or hanging in irons or drawing and quartering or the other things that used to be done to amuse the kings and emperors of Europe.

People put up with more pain getting tattoos.

I understand that the 'common herd' used to enjoy this a bit too. Of course the religious zealots got a buzz outta the burning 'witches' at the stake, but I digress.

 

[geronimo_appleby]

I'm not going to debate whether authority organized murder is right or not. I'm convinced it never is, and I'll leave it at that. It's irrelevant for this discussion.

Now, back to my point.

Most execution methods are beyond stupid.

Hanging, gas chanbers, electric chairs, lethal injections, guilliotines... they're all for show, a spectacular way for the revenge hungry to watch their nemesis go down. None of them are instant, and all of them are easy to mess up. But they take a few seconds, up to a minute. Enough for the spectators to say "take that, you bastard" under their breath.

IF you want to administer a fast and painless death, minimize the risks of getting it wrong and prolonging the suffering, you do what the chinese do (or at least used to do). You shoot them in the head. One bullet to the brain, and the convict is dead before he realize it.
IF you nessecarily have to sentence people to death, carry it out properly. You did not snetence them to "a minute of suffering, then death". So aim for instant obliteration of brain. Or don't kill.

Anything else is just dumb.

How do you know that?

 

[R. Richard]

Most execution methods are beyond stupid.

Hanging, gas chanbers, electric chairs, lethal injections, guilliotines... they're all for show, a spectacular way for the revenge hungry to watch their nemesis go down. None of them are instant, and all of them are easy to mess up. But they take a few seconds, up to a minute. Enough for the spectators to say "take that, you bastard" under their breath.

IF you want to administer a fast and painless death, minimize the risks of getting it wrong and prolonging the suffering, you do what the chinese do (or at least used to do). You shoot them in the head. One bullet to the brain, and the convict is dead before he realize it.

Hanging is NOT death by asphyxiation, at least not the way it was done in US executions. Death was caused instantaneously by the shock of breaking of the neck after a fall of at least four feet.

Back in the old days, death by hanging was death by asphyxiation. In the old West, the subject had its hands tied behind it and then was mounted on a horse and then the horse was whipped away fron underneath the subject. Death was slow and agonizing.

 

[Liar]

It is carried out fairly. Nobody is ever ut to death more than once.

After reading those two sentences for the fifth time, I gave up. What do you mean?

What is political about exterminating some murdering scum?

It's a political tool because it appeals not to pragmatics, but to bloodlust.

And don't say "a murderer put to death will not kill again". That is just a result of a mistake in prison security. And like you just said: The thing to do is to scrupulously avoid making mistakes.


Damn, here I do, debating the death penalty. It's like pounding a brick wall with a lump of cookie dough every time.

 

[Liar]

How do you know that?

Ok, sure, since I haven't hanged, gassed or shot anybody in the head, I guess you're right. I don't. Nobody ever knows anything other than cogito ergo sum.

But it's a fair guess based on what people cleverer than me about a) the history and practices of executions and b) the human body, tells me.

 

[Liar]

Hanging is NOT death by asphyxiation, at least not the way it was done in US executions.

Never said it was.

 

[Mesachie]

The theory that we can avoid mistakes ignores reality . We make mistakes. There is no way around that. Sometimes justice is simply a conspiracy to see things are done, over and tidied up quickly. Sometimes it has a prejudical view, likely racial or economic. There is zero chance of zero mistakes.

Some folks say chop a few innocents if that is what it takes. (aka "kill them all and let god sort them out" theory.) A willingness to accept a bit of collateral damage if we can really whack the bad guys.

First see the beginning paragraph, because we may not only whack a few innocents, but we are also letting the real bad guy off since the crime will have been "solved" for good.

Second, I can understand the "let god sort them out" view intellectually, but then I can also see myself sitting on death row, knowing I was innocent and knowing that no one really cares since I'm just part of that small statistical anomaly that is acceptable. Hmm, maybe I'm self-centered, but I find that a less than acceptable reason for taking my life. If you end up the on death row, I'm pretty sure you would too.

I don't have a serious objection to the death penalty if we didn't make mistakes. I wasn't sorry to see Ted Bundy get executed. There are any number of individuals that I am willing to see pay the ultimate price for the choices they made. But I know that I can't guarantee *every* individual put to death will meet my criteria.

And you really can't take it back. So I don't support the death penalty. In actual practice, anyway.

 

[geronimo_appleby]

Ok, sure, since I haven't hanged, gassed or shot anybody in the head, I guess you're right. I don't. Nobody ever knows anything other than cogito ergo sum.

But it's a fair guess based on what people cleverer than me about a) the history and practices of executions and b) the human body, tells me.

Good ol' Descartes, eh?

And to assume that other people are cleverer...?

Hmmm.

I suppose the only way to prove/disprove the theory is to subject oneself to the trial of being shot through the brain - And then come back and... Oh shit...

I knew I stopped reading philosophy for a reason!

 

[Liar]

I suppose the only way to prove/disprove the theory is to subject oneself to the trial of being shot through the brain - And then come back and... Oh shit...

Yeah. I'd rather be dumb than dead.

 

[geronimo_appleby]

Yeah. I'd rather be dumb than dead.

Don't knock it 'til ya try it. Uhm... Shit ...again.

 

[3113]

The federal court system in California has been seeded with left wing nut cases for the last 20 years.

Yep. It's those damn California liberals! Only they would be nuts enough to put lethal injections and executions on hold just because some inmates are enduring a little suffering! You'd never catch, say, a Florida conservative doing something like this! No, sirree!

Oh. Wait....this just in....

A special commission will review Florida's lethal injection policy after an execution on Wednesday took twice as long as normal.

TALLAHASSEE - Gov. Jeb Bush halted all Florida executions and ordered a special commission to review lethal-injection policies after a medical examiner Friday suggested Miami killer Angel Nieves Diaz's execution was botched.

...A violent career criminal, Diaz was executed Wednesday for the 1979 killing of a Miami topless-bar manager. It took 34 minutes for him to die -- more than double the average time -- as he grimaced, flexed his jaw and opened his mouth.

Evidently, the Judge's decison in California came the same day as Gov. Bush's decision in Florida. But never fear, the California Judge said that the state's system "is broken, but it can be fixed," meaning that CA can get back to excuting people if it makes sure that certain, very sloppy points in its method of execution are fixed (points listed in this article: Lethal Injection Problems).

I'm not so sure if the outlook is so rosy for Florida.

But getting back to the point: when did Jeb Bush become a liberal?...and why isn't anyone pissed at him for doing the exact same thing for the exact same reason?

 

[rgraham666]

I've often wondered what the reaction would be if the role of executioner was filled by a draft?

With everyone eligible to vote in the lottery.

 

[geronimo_appleby]

I've often wondered what the reaction would be if the role of executioner was filled by a draft?

With everyone eligible to vote in the lottery.

I'd never win!