This name must die

[Rosie_Riveter]

Different people use their tribal names in different ways. Some only use them at tribal ceremonies or local pow-wows; things like that.

Mine had become a part of me, so much that it is part of the tattoo on my back.

They mean different things to different people, it is just the individual that decides how much those names mean to them.

And as i stated above in my rant, the names are given during special ceremonies; and those ceremonies are not allowed to be discussed in detail. Sorry.

Ah, sorry, I wasn't asking about the ceremony. Just interested in names.
Thanks for your reply.

 

[Etoile]

And as to the reason i took the name off here, get real! It is a erotic sex site, more or less. And here we sit, in the BDSM forum.

If I made you upset, dove, I am truly sorry. To me, Lit is just another site, even though it is about sex. I don't check it at work, of course, but my confusion stemmed from not knowing why it was okay to have your tribal name on some sites and not others. I would have thought it was an all-or-nothing deal, but I guess not. I hope there are no tribal repercussions for you. And again, if I made you upset, I'm sorry.

 

[Betticus]

I kinda thought that this was some kind of gorean type of thing. A bdsm "tribe" with really stodgy rules and etiquette.

How wrong I was.

 

[serijules]

So yes, i am very HIGHLY pissed right now; but that is the explanation. As people wished to understand.

Why are you so pissed? You made a post with absolutely no explanation that anyone who didn't know you very well (aka, hardly anyone here??) would understand. Tribe of Elders? Why would anyone outside your heritage be expected to understand anything about that and the significances of the tribal name? You sounded all the world like you were being goofy and fooling around, or at the worst, obeying the orders of some dipshit dom. Heck, even your thread title was dramatic.

Reminds me of the whole sinnocent thing with the weight comment, which was probably the lamest pissing contest I've ever seen online. Why on earth would anyone assume that a thin woman who plasters her photo all over the forum on a daily basis and often totes how secure and self-confident she is compared to everyone else...would have issues with being called "thin"? What a bunch of baloney.

Sorry, I like you, your posts are nice, your name was/is beautiful. But in my opinion, your post on this topic was very poorly written and I don't think anyone has any reason to apologize for misunderstanding.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I dunno, I'm an Aussie and I knew about tribe elders etc., and I thought being such a huge part of US culture (well IMHO it should be) it would have been known and understood there first and foremost. Must admit I was surprised people didn't get it.

Catalina

 

[serijules]

I dunno, I'm an Aussie and I knew about tribe elders etc., and I thought being such a huge part of US culture (well IMHO it should be) it would have been known and understood there first and foremost. Must admit I was surprised people didn't get it.

Catalina

It isn't something you expect to see spoken of so vaguely on a BDSM forum, thus why I don't think most understood what on earth she was talking about. It's not like we can tell by the name or by photos or whatnot what her heritage is. Simply adding in the word "Cherokee" in there would have explained it a heck of a lot better and I'm betting have helped people make the connection a heck of a lot faster. *shrugs*

I get annoyed when it is expected that everyone to know things about others that I don't see any reason would be common knowledge. I've been here since 2002 and lots of people still don't know I'm deaf. Why would they? I'm just one of many and a voice amoungst many posts. Details help, a lot.

 

[00Syd]

The native Americans were pushed onto reservations a long time ago. The most anyone in the U.S. knows about them anymore they learned from old westerns or TV specials on gambling.

When I read the post, I didn't feel like I should comment because I don't know dos very well, but I thought that she was talking about some cult. How should I know she meant a Cherokee tribe? Tribal Elders could mean anything. And I don't know the numbers, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if there were more people belonging to cults in this country than to Native American Tribes.

Just my two cents.

Don't mean to offend or anything

 

[@}-}rebecca----]

I dunno, I'm an Aussie and I knew about tribe elders etc., and I thought being such a huge part of US culture (well IMHO it should be) it would have been known and understood there first and foremost. Must admit I was surprised people didn't get it.

Catalina

I don't want to buy into the existing controversy on this thread with the singular exception that my experience/knowledge base confirms what Cat has already stated. I understood what Dove was referring to when she used the term 'Tribal Elders' from her opening post, perhaps it's because the term is also used here in reference to Indigenous Australians, the Aborigine . Generally implies not only older people but also people of wisdom supported by the Cultural Community to offer as a guiding body across a range of responsibilities. In fact I sent a pm to Laurel expressing my support for Dove having her name changed as a matter of being respectful to cultural sensitivity on the day this thread surfaced. Dove was unaware of this action taken on my part.

 

[JMohegan]

I know absolutely nothing about Cherokee Tribal Elders, other than the fact that at least one of them apparently has a penchant for lurking on the Literotica BDSM boards.

From which I infer at least a passing curiosity about kink.

 

[Rosie_Riveter]

I know absolutely nothing about Cherokee Tribal Elders, other than the fact that at least one of them apparently has a penchant for lurking on the Literotica BDSM boards.

From which I infer at least a passing curiosity about kink.

There is that.

 

[HottieMama]

I know absolutely nothing about Cherokee Tribal Elders, other than the fact that at least one of them apparently has a penchant for lurking on the Literotica BDSM boards.

From which I infer at least a passing curiosity about kink.

Exactly! If "you" catch me here..the first thing i wonder is "why are you here yourself?"

 

[catalina_francisco]

It isn't something you expect to see spoken of so vaguely on a BDSM forum, thus why I don't think most understood what on earth she was talking about. It's not like we can tell by the name or by photos or whatnot what her heritage is. Simply adding in the word "Cherokee" in there would have explained it a heck of a lot better and I'm betting have helped people make the connection a heck of a lot faster. *shrugs*

I get annoyed when it is expected that everyone to know things about others that I don't see any reason would be common knowledge. I've been here since 2002 and lots of people still don't know I'm deaf. Why would they? I'm just one of many and a voice amoungst many posts. Details help, a lot.

This is not directed at your personally seri, just using the quote to cover the issues that seem to have arisen from this thread. I have seen many posts of dos referring to her tribal/indigenous/cultural roots over the months, but apart from that I would never think the mention of tribal elders was referring to a cult. I am very aware of cults both in the US and just about every other country on earth, but tribal elders would not be something I would immediately associate with a cult. Not to mention I thought her name alone was very typically Native American before she ever mentioned her heritage here. Can't think of any other culture I would expect to hear it in actually.

To me it is no different to the various other cultural references we see here and don't blink an eye at, nor have a problem understanding and tolerating...eg. Jewish culture; African American etc. Must admit I have also read and seen many references to the ostracising of Native Americans by contemporary Americans (not unlike our own Indigenous issues), but never expected it to be seen here by so many claiming it never occurred to them she was referring to Native American issues but did think she might be a cult member!! WTF. I admit I have no understanding why this is a problem in both the US and Oz in relation to the original (or in my mind 'rightful') owners of the land, nor do I have a tolerance for it or any form of racism.

As to it being unheard of that elders of any type would exercise this type of censoring on one of their own....ummm, there are quite a few churches alone which if you were a regular member of and they became aware of your activities would be ready to say something and follow with threats of banishment...my own cousin was thrown out of his church for getting divorced and believe me he is vanilla to the core...it is also quite commonplace in regard to many cultures apart from those ruled by the Taliban, so no, I don't buy this is something strange, unheard of and to be regarded as suspicious. I just am still sitting like a stunned mullet wondering why so much negativeness came out of something which really should not have created a ripple...not to mention the number of people here who have changed their username for various reasons, or asked for suggestions for a new name from the forum and had nothing but support. I simply don't get it.

Catalina

 

[Essene]

*nod* I knew what DOS was talking about. I think her name sounds Native American, so if I hadn't seen any of her posts, I would have thought that is what she was referring to.

*shrug*


I changed my name and started using this one for various reasons. If she feels the need to change it, then fine. I did. I don't get why this became a big deal.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I know absolutely nothing about Cherokee Tribal Elders, other than the fact that at least one of them apparently has a penchant for lurking on the Literotica BDSM boards.

From which I infer at least a passing curiosity about kink.

Could have been someone who was not an elder or part of the tribe who saw dos and reported it....given how some peoples minds work, it would not surprise me if it came about by her own references to her culture and someone who is not a fan of Native Americans notifying the appropriate people just to cause trouble. Could have been a lurker...let's face it, we know more people read here than actually ever post. As to the possibility of it being a kink minded elder lurking in these parts, if I were dos and had so much to lose, I would not be trying to use that as my defence and leverage as not only is it unlikely to ever lead anywhere positive, it could make things much worse for her and her family. Not rocket science, nor something unheard of unfortunately.

Catalina

 

[the captians wench]

I know absolutely nothing about Cherokee Tribal Elders, other than the fact that at least one of them apparently has a penchant for lurking on the Literotica BDSM boards.

From which I infer at least a passing curiosity about kink.

*giggles* this was my thought. My mom asked me once why I'm not afraid of people recognizing me. I told her "what would they say if they did? 'Hey i was looking for porn and came across your pics?'" that would give them as much explaining to do as I would have.


Not that this is the same thing. All the best dove.

 

[serijules]

Last time I flew, I saw a family. The girls were all in dresses. The men/little boys had on little black caps. The dad had a long beard and dressed in long black coat, etc. I was curious about them, but I had no idea what their religion was or whatnot. My first thought was perhaps Amish. I asked Ma'am, and she said they were Jewish.

I know next to nothing about Jews or any other religions, because I do not believe in religion and have little interest in it other than mild curiosity at times.

It's ok to be ignorant about certain things. I know nothing about the Native American tribes because I have no reason to. I know no Native Americans despite living in North Dakota. It's not something I have much interest in either. I'm really sorry she felt offended, but I still don't see any reason to be pissed about it.

Like I said, some people have been here YEARS and mentioned certain things about themselves many many times yet other long-timers still may not have run across that particular bit of info, or if they have, simply didn't remember it. I've been here 6 years and still think people are new when they change their AVs, lol. I never picked up that dove was native american and considering a dove and the word serenity are extremely common and in no way relating specifically to her heritage, I'm not seeing how the name sounds native american either.

What can we do. I'm not trying to start a fight or anything, just trying to point out why people commented the way they did. NONE of the comments were meant to jest, make fun of or disrespect DOS or her heritage, NONE.

Intention really should speak louder than words, especially when those words were uttered in simple ignorance, not maliciousness.

 

[JMohegan]

Could have been someone who was not an elder or part of the tribe who saw dos and reported it....given how some peoples minds work, it would not surprise me if it came about by her own references to her culture and someone who is not a fan of Native Americans notifying the appropriate people just to cause trouble. Could have been a lurker...let's face it, we know more people read here than actually ever post. As to the possibility of it being a kink minded elder lurking in these parts, if I were dos and had so much to lose, I would not be trying to use that as my defence and leverage as not only is it unlikely to ever lead anywhere positive, it could make things much worse for her and her family. Not rocket science, nor something unheard of unfortunately.

Catalina

My comment was based on what Dove wrote in the opening post of this thread.

Recieved a letter in the mail a couple days ago. It was from the Tribal Elders.

i guess one of them had been lurking around Lit, and saw my tribal name on here

 

[serijules]

Could have been someone who was not an elder or part of the tribe who saw dos and reported it....given how some peoples minds work, it would not surprise me if it came about by her own references to her culture and someone who is not a fan of Native Americans notifying the appropriate people just to cause trouble. Could have been a lurker...let's face it, we know more people read here than actually ever post. As to the possibility of it being a kink minded elder lurking in these parts, if I were dos and had so much to lose, I would not be trying to use that as my defence and leverage as not only is it unlikely to ever lead anywhere positive, it could make things much worse for her and her family. Not rocket science, nor something unheard of unfortunately.

Catalina

They would have to have personally known her in real life to have mailed her a letter, wouldn't they? Seems highly unlikely.

 

[A Desert Rose]

... I just am still sitting like a stunned mullet wondering why so much negativeness came out of something which really should not have created a ripple...not to mention the number of people here who have changed their username for various reasons, or asked for suggestions for a new name from the forum and had nothing but support. I simply don't get it.

Catalina

Yea, so she changed her name... Big deal. I didn't even know this person until all this silliness, therefore I wouldn't have even known there'd been a name change. LOL

Christ. There's no end to a reason for drama here, is there?

 

[Rosie_Riveter]

In all seriousness, I knew what she meant by tribal elders but was confused as to how this board came to their attention.

It took me forever to find it.

 

[catalina_francisco]

They would have to have personally known her in real life to have mailed her a letter, wouldn't they? Seems highly unlikely.

No, as the elders do know her in RL and it was they who sent the letter, not the person who discovered her activity here. If someone was stirring shit, all they needed to know was what was posted here and I imagine finding the Council of Elders would be a fairly simple process from there, then I imagine the elders would have verified the information, then sent the letter. Fairly simple really and no need to personally know her...let's face it, we get government and utilities mail regularly and those people don't personally know us. If it was an elder who saw her here and took things further, once again they wouldn't need to know her in RL, just that she was a member and her tribal name, then have records checked for contact details, and once again, contact her with the letter...once again fairly simple. I can even look on the internet and find the address of people I know in Oz, and goodness knows I have very basic internet skills.

Catalina

 

[BiBunny]

I think it's silly that she had to change the name, but I understand why she did. Also, on the dos profile, she had a little blurb about being Cherokee. I don't know if she's removed it or not, but, having seen that before, it sort of tipped me off to what she was talking about in her first post.

Anyhow, welcome back, dove.

 

[nh23]

Welcome back dove!

 

[Etoile]

People are getting more worked up about this than I would have imagined. Yeah, I figured out she was talking about Native American elders, but I didn't see why she should have to disappear because of it. Okay, so they told her to do it because they felt it was disrespectful. I don't see why this has gotten so big. Like I said, I think the Taliban comment would have been rude except Betticus said he genuinely didn't get it. I'm not saying Dove got upset over nothing, but why are we still going on about this?

 

[Sir_Winston54]

... but why are we still going on about this?

Because some people just can't let something die of its own inertia unless they get in the last word before entropy triumphs?