The War Nobody Wants

[LordOfDarkness]

When WTC was hit by the terrorists, the whole world sympathised with the USA. Most of us (the rest of the world) said "We are now Americans!".

Then came the attack on Afghanistan.

Somehow, the Americans know best how to do good. America and George Bush's puppet (Tony Blair) want to attack Iraq now. British poll suggests 89% of the British people are against military action, unlesswith the sanction of the UN.

America seems always to be two steps ahead of the rest of the world, and the rest of the world regrets this.

Solidarity of the 9-11 is somehow lost now, with the arrogant impatience of the US.

Rightly, Russia has said that Tony Blair's documents about Saddam's evil deeds are nothing but propaganda. France, China and Russia, the other Security Council members of the UN with veto powers, are, thank God!, sane enough not to follow the US.

 

[Coolville]

Not everyone wants war. Here are some encouraging american links:

September Eleventh Familes for Peaceful Tomorrows

War Without End? Not in Our Name

and there is an anti-war march in London today.

 

[LordOfDarkness]

Good links. Many thanks.

 

[Pagliacci]

<SNIP>
Solidarity of the 9-11 is somehow lost now, with the arrogant impatience of the US.

You're simplifying it to much,just because people might disagree with US foreign policy doesn't mean that the solidarity with US citizens is lost.

Oh and as always when quoting figures and facts,please present the source from where you got the information so it can be checked for authenticity.

 

[Coolville]

Re: Re: The War Nobody Wants

You're simplifying it to much,just because people might disagree with US foreign policy doesn't mean that the solidarity with US citizens is lost.

Oh and as always when quoting figures and facts,please present the source from where you got the information so it can be checked for authenticity.

Re: the first statement. The citizens of the world express solidarity with the citizens of over 90 countries lost in the WTC, including the Americans.

Re: the 2nd: If you were a well-read individual who takes interest in such matters and reads a wide-variety of media, you would know the facts and figures already and others wouldn't have to waste time educating you.

 

[Lost Cause]

Maybe.....

They know something they can't divulge? When we go in and come out with nothing, it will be the end of the "World Police" mentality that has us spread all over this fucking rock! When we go in and come out with a couple of assembled nukes, well, they can tell us how they found out and say they told us so. Sometimes an uninformed population has to be dragged into the fray, for their own good and survival. Say we don't go in, and in a few years DC is a 13 mile ground zero, and the nuke was traced to Iraq, who we gonna point the finger at? It won't bring back the 60,000 plus Americans, nor exonerate the ones that kept us from intervention. Maybe it'll be London, Paris, Sydney, or Rome next time.
I agree, the President should go on the TV and in a Cuban Missle Crisis type of address, explain with pictures and graphs what's up. Of course, the conspiracy America haters will still say the info was doctored.

Where was all the hoopla when President Clinton invaded Haiti, overthrew and installed a US friendly despot for the security of this Hemisphere? (1995)

 

[Velius]

I hate these propaganda wars. People eat it up and it's just sickening.

 

[Pagliacci]

Re: Re: Re: The War Nobody Wants

Re: the 2nd: If you were a well-read individual who takes interest in such matters and reads a wide-variety of media, you would know the facts and figures already and others wouldn't have to waste time educating you.

I'll try and not take this as an implicit insult on my level of education and how much I read,something you've no idea about.

Though if you are well read and highly educated you then ought to be more than aware of the simple fact that any and all statistic can be twisted to conform with what you want to show.
Also that in polls you can by the way of phrasing a question get answers that could be used to twist something to a certain view.

It happens every day.

I don't know about your teachers but mine always told me to be critical of what one reads and is taught and to double check everything instead of jumping on the bandwagon and just swallowing what is said.

 

[RastaPope]

I want a war.


CNN is getting awfully boring these days.

Let's bomb some brown people.

I'll bring the marshmallows.

 

[Coolville]

Re: Maybe.....

I agree, the President should go on the TV and in a Cuban Missle Crisis type of address, explain with pictures and graphs what's up. Of course, the conspiracy America haters will still say the info was doctored.

Where was all the hoopla when President Clinton invaded Haiti, overthrew and installed a US friendly despot for the security of this Hemisphere? (1995)

Tony Blair just did this. Using all the "proof" he and Bush have been going on about. Didn't convince anybody. Not even the right-wingers in the parliment and the press.

Haiti? Good question. But that was before GWB's Crusade to Get the Guy Who Tried to Kill My Dad

I, for one, protested against the invasion of Grenada. Ooh, big commie threat. What did they find? A bunch of medical students smoking pot.

 

[HeavyStick]

I support the US taking out the WMD, but not a military assault with extended conflict above and beyond destroying WMD.

Here's a list provided by CNN of the stance of the worlds major countries.

For military action:

US
Australia
Pakistan
United Kingdom
Spain
Italy
Israel



Neutral unless a clear and present danger is proven:

New Zealand




against military action:

India
Germany
Syria
Iran
Qatar
Bahrain
Oman



Misc:

China (most likely abstain from a UNsecurity council vote)

Indonesia No public support

France wants the WMD destroyed, but not overthrowing Saddam

Ukraine very biased, has been selling Iraq equipment

Soviet Federation is against a US unilateral attack, but would not support Saddam in an international stand off, Soviets are also very displeased by Iraq's handling and constant changing of the agreements concerning weapon inspectors

Jordan and Egypt belief in settling the Israel/Palestine issue before taking on Iraq

Turkey to worried about it's economic problems to care

Saudi Arabia would support US forces by allowing use of bases in Saudi Arabia, but only if UN sanctioned

Kuwait would support by allowing use of bases

 

[LordOfDarkness]

Re: Re: The War Nobody Wants

You're simplifying it to much,just because people might disagree with US foreign policy doesn't mean that the solidarity with US citizens is lost.

Oh and as always when quoting figures and facts,please present the source from where you got the information so it can be checked for authenticity.

I got the figures from BBC radio. Go see the link.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/?ok

It was on "Talking point" last night.

Thanks for your response. Much appreciated.

 

[LordOfDarkness]

I want a war.


CNN is getting awfully boring these days.

Let's bomb some brown people.

I'll bring the marshmallows.

Brown people? Please don't generalize.

Brown people include Arabs, Mexicans, The Malayo-Polynesian race (like me), the Amerindians, The Indians from the Indian sub-continent, the Maoris .... etcetera.

Its the Arabs who caused all these problems. You should call them Arab terrorists instead of Islamic terrorists. Go after the people, not the religion or the color.

 

[RastaPope]

Brown people? Please don't generalize.

Brown people include Arabs, Mexicans, The Malayo-Polynesian race (like me), the Amerindians, The Indians from the Indian sub-continent, the Maoris .... etcetera.

Its the Arabs who caused all these problems. You should call them Arab terrorists instead of Islamic terrorists. Go after the people, not the religion or the color.

Turn the whole middleast to glass and take their oil. More trouble than they're worth, man.

 

[TWB]

Uh, brown people? I think that was called sarcasm.

 

[Coolville]

Regarding the countries Heavy Stick listed...

With exception of the US and Israel and the UK, all the countries listed want a UN Mandate first. Even in the UK, 71% of the population are against a US go-it-alone action but they support a UN mandate.

The EU is generally opposed to unilateral action. UN or nothing. This includes Spain, Italy, et al. Spain has agreed to the US using their airspace. Italy's government are notoriously racist so they're on board anything against Islam. Berlusconi has called Islam an inferior culture, much to the chagrin of the EU.

anyway. UN or nothing.

 

[Coolville]

Soviet Federation is against a US unilateral attack...

Is that meant to be sarcastic? Still referring to "Soviet"? Just asking.

The Russian Federation want, like the EU, weapons inspectors in now.

 

[sch00lteacher]

Some of us want to go back and finish what was left un-done. Wish we could do that with Vietnam as well.

Some of us want this war, and are willing to fight and die in it. It that moron gets just one nuke... It could be over for all of us folks. Look at some of the scenarios out there.

They lob theirs into Israel, who responds in kinds, with a few added for good measure. Some Islamic states don't take too kindly to that, so they...

He has to go. As does any mad man with that much power. And no, Bush does not have that kind of power. He can't launch just because he is pissed off or crazy.

 

[Gaultier]

war ???

A war ? The guy who tried to kill my Dad ?

Nukes ?

I was more thinking about vertical diversification.

The US has the industry, the Middle East has the raw materials.

supplier (middle East / the evil ) -> producer (US and the good guys) - > the market (everybody = good + bad guys )

Oh yeah, Irak/Iran are with Saudi Arabia the top three raw oil suppliers in the Middle East.

(http://www.bp.com/centres/energy2002/index.asp)


Maybe I'm simplifiy too much.

And what about those gaz pipelines through northern Afghanistan ?

(http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/1984459.stm)

http://www.worldpress.org/specials/pp/pipeline_timeline.htm

Another annoying fact :

Hamid Karzai, american educated, was a consultant for an american oil company ( UNOCAL ) during the Taliban regime. And now he happens to be in power in Afghanistan...no wonder people want to see him dead over there!

http://www.lemonde.fr/article/0,5987,3210-7019-254716,00.html

translation for those who don't speak french (I personally speak french and this translation seems ok to me...)

http://csf.colorado.edu/forums/m-fem/2001/msg00455.html




I completly aware that you can't reduce politics to mere economic factors...but the facts are here.

I am sure I don't have to remind you that Dick Cheney and Condoleezza Rice (among others) were executives in oil companies...


Ok now, I don't see what this topic has to do on www.literotica.com but it is a general board, isn't it.

A last question :
What petrol shares shall I buy ? Anybody has an idea ?

 

[Coolville]

Some of us want to go back and finish what was left un-done. Wish we could do that with Vietnam as well.

"some of you", fortunately, are in the minority.

you american fundamentalists don't give a shit about civilians and that is disgusting.

 

[miles]

LD, you live in a small world. Somehow you seem to think the majority of people think the same as you on everything.

 

[Coolville]

LD, you live in a small world. Somehow you seem to think the majority of people think the same as you on everything.

If you're referring to Lord Darkness, then I would have to remind you that he is a member of the majority on this planet, regarding this issue.

 

[miles]

If you're referring to Lord Darkness, then I would have to remind you that he is a member of the majority on this planet, regarding this issue.

Bullshit.

It's beside the point anyway. Why should "the rest of the planet" give a damn?

It's no coincidence that many of the countries who oppose the war have been trading with this nouveau Hitler all along and stand to be highly embarrassed.

If we do nothing and that animal gasses his own people again, you'll be jumping up and down because we didn't stop him.

He isn't some pesky little tin horn dictator.

 

[riff]

England needs a governor who has the balls to tell America to piss off.

Blast the French all you want, but at least they are independent.

Where the hell is freescofr when you need him?

 

[weed]

Is it just me or is it true the folks who support military action most are often the ones that complain about taxes and the cost of government. I find this ironic.

I disagree with war for moral reasons based upon my own values but if there just HAD to be a war I would think it would be better to have international agreement and military support so that the US didn't bear so much of the cost.