The Nice Guy

[Trombonus]

Ok, this was kind of brought up in another thread, so I thought it might be interesting to talk about. What do you think about the "nice guy." Are they overlooked too often? Are they undesirable by women? Do women secretly fear them? Anyone sick of being the "nice guy"? What's the deal?

 

[Guest]

Ok, this was kind of brought up in another thread, so I thought it might be interesting to talk about. What do you think about the "nice guy." Are they overlooked too often? Are they undesirable by women? Do women secretly fear them? Anyone sick of being the "nice guy"? What's the deal?

More questions for considation:


Is it a biological imperative for women to seek out the "not nice guy" aka asshole?

Was it assholes who were the best hunters? The best protectors of their women and children?

 

[Trombonus]

More questions for considation:


Is it a biological imperative for women to seek out the "not nice guy" aka asshole?

Was it assholes who were the best hunters? The best protectors of their women and children?

Both questions I was thinking about but was hoping someone else would bring up.

 

[Guest]

Both questions I was thinking about but was hoping someone else would bring up.

I suspect I know what you are going through but haven't yet articulated.

Hot women you'd love to have sex with, who don't see you that way, instead bitch to you about their asshole boyfriends, and ask why there aren't any nice guys out there.

 

[McKenna]

On the flip side, why don't more men fall for the nice girl?

 

[Guest]

On the flip side, why don't more men fall for the nice girl?

Married one.

But I see a support group forming. Maybe we can take that, make it into a chain of nightclubs, and later, single resorts!

 

[tanyachrs]

I think if the best you can say about someone is that he's "nice" it's not saying much. Anyone who calls me nice gets smacked.

 

[AppleBiter]

Ok, this was kind of brought up in another thread, so I thought it might be interesting to talk about. What do you think about the "nice guy." Are they overlooked too often? Are they undesirable by women? Do women secretly fear them? Anyone sick of being the "nice guy"? What's the deal?

I can't count the number of times I've had this discussion with single, male friends of mine. It seems like the nice guys are always getting the shaft. Here's my take on things:

I love the nice guys. I married a nice guy and he's just the best husband that anyone could ever ask for. That having been said, he's nice to me. He's nice to most other people, too, but if you step on his nuts, he'll put you in your place and fast. He's not a doormat and he's not emotionally an open book to anyone but me. He's all man, but he doesn't have to be a dick about it. I respect that.

However, a lot of nice guys (in my experience) are usually of the too nice variety. If I may explain: Okay -- I'm a straight girl. I like men "in that way." So, when a man acts like one of my girl friends, I don't necessarily see him "that way." Does that make sense? It's kind of like how some guys see certain girls as "one of the guys" and couldn't see themselves ever dating her because she's too much like their buddies.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think you have to be an asshole or hide all of your emotions in order to be a guy. That's ridiculous. But, if you act like one of the girls, the girls are likely to see you as one of the girls. That's where I think that some nice guys run into trouble, IMO.

 

[rgraham666]

Ok, this was kind of brought up in another thread, so I thought it might be interesting to talk about. What do you think about the "nice guy." Are they overlooked too often? Are they undesirable by women? Do women secretly fear them? Anyone sick of being the "nice guy"? What's the deal?

In order.

I can't speak of them from a sexual attractiveness POV, but I like them better than the testosterone addled jerks that make up too much of my gender.

Yes, they are overlooked.

Yes, they are. Niceness is equated to weakness in our society and women look for strength.

No, nice guys rarely register. See above.

I'm very sick of being a nice guy. But it's nailed to my spine so I can't stop.

It's biology and culture. Both, despite the efforts of feminism, insist that women look for men stronger than themselves. Nice guys don't come across as strong. It's also why 'bad boys' are so attractive. Viciousness and callousness can easily be mistaken for strength.

 

[McKenna]

Seriously, though, I've been wondering about this.

Aside from one or two psychoses <cough> I'm a reasonably balanced person. I'm not a damsel in distress, I don't need someone to save me or help me sort through my emotional baggage. I'm somewhat damaged, but I still have a decent warranty. I don't let my imperfections define me and I'm not afraid of the dark (much.)

I'm attracted to people who seem well-balanced and centered. Yet time and time again I run into men who need to "save" someone in order to feel important or needed. Either that or they're sadists who enjoy the pain of being walked on, dumped on, pushed around, led around by their testicles, or generally demeaned as human beings.

Here's what I require: A spine, a sense of humor, a smidgen of humanity, and a dash of humility, and for God's sake please don't be intimidated by a woman like me.

I need intellectual intercourse. I need someone else to catch this drift.*






My apologies to Trombonus. This probably wasn't where you wanted this thread to go.


*Thank you, Alanis.

 

[Trombonus]

Well, if we're gonna use me as an example, perhaps it'd be best to do it properly and explain my situation.

Yes I'm a nice guy, I'm supportive, caring, and loving to the girls in my life. I get attached and fall in love far too easily, mostly due to my feeling of loneliness. However, things have been ok. I'm attracted to a good personality. That's why most of my friends who are girls usually end up as my crushes. Of course, I'm not going to lie and say that physical attraction plays no part in what I feel for a girl. What I'm getting at I guess is I want companionship more than anything. Sure I'd love to have sex, don't get me wrong, but in the end I'd much prefer the person to the pussy.

It sucks for me to see the girls I'm attracted to with other guys, especially when I know those guys take the girls for granted, or even mistreat them. I can't tell you how many countless times I've seen some of my friends just blatently ignored or mistreated in front of me. I always place my girl first, and me second, also to my own detriment.

My worst problem is I'm shy. I just don't know where to even begin with girls. How to approach them, what to say, how to go about wooing them so to speak. I'm literally clueless. In all honesty, both my previous relationships just happened. There was no courtship process, we just kind of ended up together. What I want is to just go out and date. Get myself out there more, but like I said, I have no idea how to do that, and even if I did, I'd have to bust through the thick wall that is shyness.

It's gotten to the point where I'm sick of this "nice guy" routine. I've been considering being more of an ass, and can feel that side of me creeping out a little as the years go by. I know I have a wild side, and I was also thinking that I want a girl to bring that side out of me. Therein lies the confusion. I want companionship and a loving relationship, but another side of me wants to get out there and experience new things. There's so much I haven't experienced. I hear about all these experiences people have had on here, which seem really wild to me, but to them is just kind of an everyday thing. Now I'm not sure what I want.

 

[impressive]

I married a nice guy. He is stable and dependable ... like a cinder block (and almost as exciting).

 

[3113]

There've actually been a ton of threads on this. Same old complaint: "Nice guys finish last!" and "Girls always go for assholes."

Couple of things that rarely get mentioned:
1) Is the nice guy really nice or is he just a bore?
2) Is the asshole really an asshole or is he just an asshole to the bore?
3) Is the girl going for the asshole worth going for? She's sexy and hot and can have any guy she wants...and treats you like dirt...so, er, aren't you going for the asshole?
4) Why don't the nice guys go for those not-so-nice-looking but very nice girls?

These have to be answered before the question can be answered. Because I don't always believe that the "nice guys" complaining are (1) nice guys. I knew a guy who bitched about being nice and not getting the girls. Know what? He wasn't a nice guy. He whined and complained all the time, bitched about his life and circumstances, never made a real effort to change, rarely listened to anything that was said to him (prefered to talk about his woes), and anytime you said something optimistic he'd say, "Yeah well the world's going to hell, let me tell you why...." and throw dark clouds across the sun.

And he thought the girls didn't want him because they wanted assholes instead of nice guys. Truth was, they didn't want Mr. Rain-on-Every-Parade-and-Have-no-Life. He wasn't that nice.

Nor do I believe that those complaining should (2) be calling the kettle black. If they're not dating nice girls or they want to date the asshole girl than they've no reason to bitch about girls not going for nice guys. Period.

Having gotten that all off my chest...Nice guys finish last only because they go for the wrong girls. I remember a wonderful diatribe by a dominatrix on this forum about how much she LOVED nice guys and went for them everytime. I don't recall her direct words, but she said something like loving the quiet guy she could hang from a cross, the bookish guy she could chain in the basement, the romantic ready to lick her shoes.....



There are women out there who love nice guys. You've just gotta be willing to look for them

 

[Aurora Black]

I took a nice, shy guy and helped him gain confidence in himself until he became the balanced sweetie/macho (sometimes asshole) that he is now.

 

[Trombonus]

Seriously, though, I've been wondering about this.

Aside from one or two psychoses <cough> I'm a reasonably balanced person. I'm not a damsel in distress, I don't need someone to save me or help me sort through my emotional baggage. I'm somewhat damaged, but I still have a decent warranty. I don't let my imperfections define me and I'm not afraid of the dark (much.)

I'm attracted to people who seem well-balanced and centered. Yet time and time again I run into men who need to "save" someone in order to feel important or needed. Either that or they're sadists who enjoy the pain of being walked on, dumped on, pushed around, led around by their testicles, or generally demeaned as human beings.

Here's what I require: A spine, a sense of humor, a smidgen of humanity, and a dash of humility, and for God's sake please don't be intimidated by a woman like me.

I need intellectual intercourse. I need someone else to catch this drift.*






My apologies to Trombonus. This probably wasn't where you wanted this thread to go.


*Thank you, Alanis.

No not at all McKenna, I want to hear these things. I have to admit, I do get the "hero" complex sometimes. I don't think at the time I realize it, but that's kinda what my last relationship was like. However, that situation didn't come around until much later in the relationship, after she had confided things in me. However, I learned from that experience, and should a situation like that occur again, I would probably end the relationship rather than continue it. I invested so much emotional energy into that relationship and she ripped my heart out more times than I can remember. Of course, you seem to me to be a million times stronger than she was. As it is, I am very attracted to the "nice girl." In all honesty I think you're a beautiful person, inside and out, and any guy'd be lucky to have you, and I hope sooner or later one of them's going to see that.

 

[Guest]

I love the nice guys. I married a nice guy and he's just the best husband that anyone could ever ask for. That having been said, he's nice to me. He's nice to most other people, too, but if you step on his nuts, he'll put you in your place and fast. He's not a doormat and he's not emotionally an open book to anyone but me. He's all man, but he doesn't have to be a dick about it. I respect that.

All men should read that paragraph!

That goes with my theory (not mine, actually, it has scientific support), that women want the asshole for the good provider/security aspects. But the nice guy at home for the emotional support/child rearing.

When a young girl says "where are the nice guys", she hasn't yet found a man like Apple has. On the other hand, maybe young guys haven't learned to balance the public need to be aggressive, with the private need to be open/sharing/nice.

So Trombonus, take Apple's paragraph to heart would be my advice.

And as a shameless self-promotion, I wrote a story on this topic recently where a young man struggled with this. Forewarned: it should have been non-consent story.

http://english.literotica.com:81/stories/showstory.php?id=269879

 

[3113]

Shy Guy Lovers are out there

My worst problem is I'm shy. I just don't know where to even begin with girls. How to approach them, what to say, how to go about wooing them so to speak.

That is a problem. But if my readership is any clue, there seem to be a lot of women out there who lust after shy guys just like you.

I've written a few shy guy stories and not only are they among my most popular stories, but they get a lot of feedback from women who tell me they love shy guys (also romantic/nice guys) and would I please write more of those stories.

Now, of course, maybe they just want to read such stories and when faced with a real shy-guy it's different, but that's what they say.

 

[AppleBiter]

All men should read that paragraph!

Thanks, Ted.

P.S. I totally agree w/your theory.

 

[rgraham666]

Now, of course, maybe they just want to read such stories and when faced with a real shy-guy it's different, but that's what they say.

That is what they say. But my experience has shown otherwise.

 

[Trombonus]

Couple of things that rarely get mentioned:
1) Is the nice guy really nice or is he just a bore?
2) Is the asshole really an asshole or is he just an asshole to the bore?
3) Is the girl going for the asshole worth going for? She's sexy and hot and can have any guy she wants...and treats you like dirt...so, er, aren't you going for the asshole?
4) Why don't the nice guys go for those not-so-nice-looking but very nice girls?

Ok, to answer your question.
1) Once I get through the initial shyness barrier, I think people consider me to be fun. I can be just as flirty as anyone. The problem is breaking out of the "friend zone."
2) When I say asshole I'm saying a guy who is an asshole to the girl. I don't care if the guy's an ass to me, but treats his girl alright, that's between me and him.
3) I'm not attracted to that kind of person, and I've known many attractive women like that.
4) I did go for that. My best friend would repeatedly ask me why I was with someone like her. The point is she was attractivee to me because she made me feel good, and I enjoyed being with her. She was a bit heavy and had several emotional issues she wasn't willing to deal with.

 

[impressive]

I'm attracted to people who seem well-balanced and centered. Yet time and time again I run into men who need to "save" someone in order to feel important or needed. Either that or they're sadists who enjoy the pain of being walked on, dumped on, pushed around, led around by their testicles, or generally demeaned as human beings.

Here's what I require: A spine, a sense of humor, a smidgen of humanity, and a dash of humility, and for God's sake please don't be intimidated by a woman like me.

I need intellectual intercourse. I need someone else to catch this drift.*

Does "he" have to have a dick? 'Cause I, um, volunteer!

 

[Guest]

Yeah, we are discussing issues here that have been gone over before. Part of this, is a support group for nice guys & nice girls.


McKenna, everytime you mention being alone, I am astonished. Such a gem should be hooked up. And you will be. I'm good at two things, predicting which women will find worthwhile mates, and which young actresses will one day be Oscar nominees. If I was right about Jennifer Tilly, I'm right about you.

Your guy is coming. He's just not ready for you yet. He has to ripen a bit, and grow into the public asshole/sensitive lover you deserve and Apple so well described.

And of course, it wouldn't hurt to carry your AV in your wallet and show it to guys!

 

[Trombonus]

All men should read that paragraph!

That goes with my theory (not mine, actually, it has scientific support), that women want the asshole for the good provider/security aspects. But the nice guy at home for the emotional support/child rearing.

When a young girl says "where are the nice guys", she hasn't yet found a man like Apple has. On the other hand, maybe young guys haven't learned to balance the public need to be aggressive, with the private need to be open/sharing/nice.

So Trombonus, take Apple's paragraph to heart would be my advice.

And as a shameless self-promotion, I wrote a story on this topic recently where a young man struggled with this. Forewarned: it should have been non-consent story.

http://english.literotica.com:81/stories/showstory.php?id=269879

Well, I'm no pushover. I can argue with the best of them, and I don't sit there and take abuse from someone. I'm certainly not afraid of speaking my mind against something I believe is wrong. I'm just a little afraid of the opposite sex is all.

 

[AppleBiter]

Well, I'm no pushover. I can argue with the best of them, and I don't sit there and take abuse from someone. I'm certainly not afraid of speaking my mind against something I believe is wrong. I'm just a little afraid of the opposite sex is all.

If I may make an observation . . . you did state that you fall quickly for girls because you are lonely, which (I'm not meaning this to sound harsh) can come across as desperation. You also said that you're too shy around women, which can come across as being a pushover. That's not saying that you are, but that you might be presenting yourself that way.

Have you ever heard of the phrase "fake it till you make it?" Perhaps you should try that, where confidence is concerned. IMO, confidence is one of the sexiest attributes that a person can have and if you can fake being confident and independent (even though you may feel lonely and shy on the inside), you may just start to feel that way for real. *shrugs* It's worth a shot, anyway.

 

[Guest]

I'm just a little afraid of the opposite sex is all.

They don't bite, unless it is recreational.


Fear of rejection, maybe?

There's a lot of strategies for getting past that. Getting a sales job for one. The most single minded skirt chasing I've ever seen done was by salesman. They are immune to rejection.

I'm being lighthearted there, but finding the right person is a numbers game. The more people you meet, the more likely you will meet the right person (or someone to at least share your life and bed for short, interesting periods of time).

If I were 20 again, I'd DO more things. Get into various sports, travel, take classes, join clubs, go out for causes (where better to meet passionate women then where they are doing something they are passionate about).

And don't worry about rejection. Here's a truth no one ever thinks about. Assuming we all marry just once, we therefore reject and are rejected by every single person we are interested in, or is interested in us, except for one.