The Fourth Reich

[dr_mabeuse]

We, as was Hitler...are in a microcosm of time...There is not much of a threat from the Bush administration...not much at all and although I wish it would not, the political pendulum will most likely swing left in 2008 and you can smile again.

amicus...

I don't know about that. Erosion of rights are like temporary tax increases. Have you ever known a tax increase that didn't become permanent?

Have you ever heard of a government voluntarily restoring its citizens' rights? Do you really think that the War on Terror will be declared over someday and the provisions of the Patriot Act rescinded?

I don't. I predict the War on Terror will last longer than the War on Drugs, and be about as successful.

 

[rgraham666]

I used to talk to God.

Then they changed my meds.

 

[R. Richard]

Evil never has any doubts. The most dangerous people in the world are not the wicked, but the ones who know beyond a shadow of a doubt that they're right. The ones who talk directly to God.

I must slightly disagree with you here, Dr_M. The most dangerous ones, of course know they are always right. However, the most dangerous ones do not just talk directly to God, they give God orders and/or they ARE God.

I know whereof I speak. I have been to Africa and talked to "The God/King!" On a slightly lower level of insanity I have also talked to "The President For Life!"

 

[Huckleman2000]

That's exactly it. Evil never has any doubts. The most dangerous people in the world are not the wicked, but the ones who know beyond a shadow of a doubt that they're right. The ones who talk directly to God.

Not to hijack, but as a chronic depressive, I have a gut-level distrust of anyone who is too sure of themselves. As a friend once said, "Never trust a man who looks like he spent too much time on his hair."

Having said that, I will push things in a good online argument. Sometimes people will get emotional, or self-righteous - it's good to have your beliefs challenged. Also good to get put in your place now and then. And I mean that for myself, too.

Colly, you have taken this as a cause celebre', and bless you for it! It is through these carefully orchestrated cuts at liberty, where they can paint the opposition with all manner of nastiness while they whittle away, that the most damage is done.

 

[Huckleman2000]

Beautiful

A ticket-holding University of Arizona student was turned away from a Bush town-hall meeting about Social Security policy, for wearing a Young Democrat t-shirt.

And just a bonus: A picture of a 13 year old girl being led away by police after lobbing an egg at the Bush motorcade.

UA Young Democrat Turned Away at Bush Forum

 

[amicus]

This is a rather large forum, I.E Literotica, in numbers at least.

I came here some time ago, because my writings were too risque for family rated sites...I did not expect much.

But I was,truly, amazed when my story 'Susan' received a monthly award and that peaked my interest in the site.

I am not a novice at debate or controversy, as is most likely obvious. I browsed the forum, several months before the 2004 General election and noticed the Bush bashers in full swing.

First off, I thought only to offer an opposition....but the hellfire and damnation of the Liberal Left, assaulted not only my ideas but with Perdita, demeaned my personal life...and that really pissed me off.

Since that time, I have, when time permits, done my utmost to display the absolute ignorance and illigitimacy of the Liberal Left wing that so dominates this tiny little corner of the web.

Most of the pukes who defend the left, do so with righteous impertinence, as if every one 'knows' it is the right thing to 'save the whales and the spotted owls', that is mantra and catachism, not to be questioned.

And if one should ever dare question the 'right' to take a human life, aka abortion, OMG, do the ladies vehemently set forth.

Forget rational discussion, let the hormones and the Epistles reign....

I guess this is a Dr. Mabeuse response...not sure...I like the guy...if he is a guy, he is a good writer, has good thoughts...but he is fucked up...he knows it...so do I , cuz I read him...I know what he writes...and can guess why....but then...

This in not about Dr. Mab...not at all...it is rather about the really stupid fucking idiots who 'believe' they have the right to dictate the morals of others through majority rule...no...not the 'Fundies' but the Liberal Left Wing politico's who have managed media since the time of Fonzie and Happy Days, and, what is it, All in the Family? that shit for brains series that introduced the extremes as acceptable in normal society...you know, archie bunker and all that shit....

You Fucking Liberals have had a thirty year run...time's up...the pendulum swings, you are on the downward leg...will it be better without you? Time will tell.

There will actually be movies and television shows in the coming years, that do not feature homosexuals, single moms, single dads, adopted children, interracial marriages and children and all the other aberrations of a really fucked up generation of people.

What it will be...I not only can guess, but have offered my writings for future films and television productions...

wish me luck

amicus...


(ps...if you have cable...make a list of movies showing, note the categories, then survey the nerd channels...history, science, discovery...note the political influence and enjoy...for it will soon change, thank amicus)

 

[Op_Cit]

I guess this is a Dr. Mabeuse response...not sure...I like the guy...if he is a guy, he is a good writer, has good thoughts...but he is fucked up...he knows it...so do I , cuz I read him...I know what he writes...and can guess why....but then...

This in not about Dr. Mab...not at all...it is rather about the really stupid fucking idiots who 'believe' they have the right to dictate the morals of others through majority rule...no...not the 'Fundies' but the Liberal Left Wing politico's who have managed media since the time of Fonzie and Happy Days, and, what is it, All in the Family? that shit for brains series that introduced the extremes as acceptable in normal society...you know, archie bunker and all that shit....

How are you any different?

As best I can tell you are a member of the mob that supports taking money by force from me to hire (or conscript) soldiers "for my defense". Yet these soldiers are used for whatever purpose the party in power wants to use them for: Go over here and hand out food, go there and get involved in a civil war, man this base and keep this foreign regime in power, pull out of this place and allow genocide to take place... Do I need to continue the list? Clinton used the military to kill innocents to curry favor of the electorate or misdirect public scrutiny. Bush has done the same (and yes, he has probably exceeded Clinton on the innocent deaths count, but they are the same.)

The supporters of these actions will argue simply, "It's our responsibility to take care of those who cannot defend themselves". So they put a gun to my head and take my money to spend it in a fashion which has the least benefit: 90%+ of all foreign aid is siphoned off by the chain of leadership in those foreign locals, and most military reactions result in severe, unplanned backlashes.

By supporting a standing army you support forcing somebody else's morals on me. (Remember the founding fathers feared even the thought of a standing army.)

DrM made a good point about evil: It is almost always done for the best of intentions. The only place he may be failing is in only looking in one direction (to the right) for that evil.

 

[KarenAM]

You Fucking Liberals have had a thirty year run...time's up...the pendulum swings, you are on the downward leg...will it be better without you? Time will tell.

There will actually be movies and television shows in the coming years, that do not feature homosexuals, single moms, single dads, adopted children, interracial marriages and children and all the other aberrations of a really fucked up generation of people.

What it will be...I not only can guess, but have offered my writings for future films and television productions...

Actually, Amicus, Liberals in the form of the Neo-Cons now control the Congress and White House and are in the process of dismantling the Constitution, which is what this thread is all about. Conservatives have found themselves co-opted, as have Liberals, by a group of Bolshevik-style revolutionaries intent on turning America into an authoritarian state.

So I agree that Liberals are on the downward leg, though I hope it doesn't stop them from fucking. Conservatives need to fuck too.

Now, I just posted my thoughts on some of the kinds of television shows and movies and other art you mentioned here, and so won't repeat that discussion in its entirety, since it is somewhat off-topic. But remember that television shows and movies are a form of art, and that it is the nature of art to often push the boundaries of society and social norms. This is why Mr. Bush and Mr. Gonzales and their cadre are so intent on regulating it to exclude sex, as well as, in all liklihood, "homosexuals, single moms, single dads, adopted children, interracial marriages and children and all the other aberrations of a really fucked up generation of people," as you put it. Eliminating art about groups you don't happen to like just means that the art that remains is dull and safe and frequently nothing more than propaganda for those in power.

Perhaps you like it, perhaps not. But by writing erotica and porn, you, like the rest of us, are challenging the current administration. You're standing up against those who would so casually take away your rights, whether they are on the Left or the Right or out in the stratosphere like the Neo-Cons. Having the right to do something is like having a penis or a vagina; it will atrophy if you don't use it.

 

[cantdog]

I'd like to remind you both that the media giants who put those homosexual shows on the tube, who pay the millions to make them, are the very ones who bankrolled the current cabal of radicals.

They made the shows happen, supported the Bushies, and the Bushies complained about the shows and bemoaned the demise of America. Partly because of those shows, they got in. Nothing but an intensification of that sort of content has happened so far.

 

[elsol]

I'd like to remind you both that the media giants who put those homosexual shows on the tube, who pay the millions to make them, are the very ones who bankrolled the current cabal of radicals.

And that's the beauty of it all... corporations by their nature are about money.

How far can the Bushies cut into their pocketbooks before they cut the cords?

If the Bushies want to attack something like porn, they're going to have to find a nice way to replace the money.

That's what I think the 'tax cuts' are about...

Bushies: Let us do this...

Corpies: Uh... that puts a 5% dent in my profits.

Bushies: We'll give you a tax break...

Corpies: At least 7% or no deal...

Sincerely,
ElSol

 

[mismused]

This is a rather large forum, I.E Literotica, in numbers at least.

I came here some time ago, because my writings were too risque for family rated sites...I did not expect much.

But I was,truly, amazed when my story 'Susan' received a monthly award and that peaked my interest in the site.

I am not a novice at debate or controversy, as is most likely obvious. I browsed the forum, several months before the 2004 General election and noticed the Bush bashers in full swing.

First off, I thought only to offer an opposition....but the hellfire and damnation of the Liberal Left, assaulted not only my ideas but with Perdita, demeaned my personal life...and that really pissed me off.

Since that time, I have, when time permits, done my utmost to display the absolute ignorance and illigitimacy of the Liberal Left wing that so dominates this tiny little corner of the web.

Most of the pukes who defend the left, do so with righteous impertinence, as if every one 'knows' it is the right thing to 'save the whales and the spotted owls', that is mantra and catachism, not to be questioned.

And if one should ever dare question the 'right' to take a human life, aka abortion, OMG, do the ladies vehemently set forth.

Forget rational discussion, let the hormones and the Epistles reign....

I guess this is a Dr. Mabeuse response...not sure...I like the guy...if he is a guy, he is a good writer, has good thoughts...but he is fucked up...he knows it...so do I , cuz I read him...I know what he writes...and can guess why....but then...

This in not about Dr. Mab...not at all...it is rather about the really stupid fucking idiots who 'believe' they have the right to dictate the morals of others through majority rule...no...not the 'Fundies' but the Liberal Left Wing politico's who have managed media since the time of Fonzie and Happy Days, and, what is it, All in the Family? that shit for brains series that introduced the extremes as acceptable in normal society...you know, archie bunker and all that shit....

You Fucking Liberals have had a thirty year run...time's up...the pendulum swings, you are on the downward leg...will it be better without you? Time will tell.

There will actually be movies and television shows in the coming years, that do not feature homosexuals, single moms, single dads, adopted children, interracial marriages and children and all the other aberrations of a really fucked up generation of people.

What it will be...I not only can guess, but have offered my writings for future films and television productions...

wish me luck

amicus...


(ps...if you have cable...make a list of movies showing, note the categories, then survey the nerd channels...history, science, discovery...note the political influence and enjoy...for it will soon change, thank amicus)

===================================================

ami cus,

You really are a cus this time, and no bones about it! Talk about a hate filled, riot inciting post. Whew! I haven't read anything that anyone has posted since this came out, but I bet you get your wish.

Really, you sound as if you had too much sauce last night. Better go easy if that's the case, bad for your liver, you know.

Wish you luck? Man, I suspicion you're going to need it, but then again, I think you really thrive on riling up the populace.

mismused

Edited to add P.S.

P.S. I'm neither liberal, nor conservative, or any other classification.

 

[elsol]

P.S. I'm neither liberal, nor conservative, or any other classification.

I'm an extreme moderate...

It means I'm EXTREMELY pro-abortion... and EXTREMELY pro-death penalty... EXTREMELY free-speech... EXTREMELY pro-guns... an ISOLATIONIST...

The reason I say moderate is cause when you average everything out... i'm dead center.

Sincerely,
ElSol

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Not to pick a fight, Mab...but I had a thought...reading your post...

A way back when, aka Jean Auel, and the 'flat heads' and the 'others' Neanderthals and Homo Sapiens...a fast forward to the Germanic tribes and the Roman Empire as it expanded into Europe...another fast forward to the Mongols that pressured Rome...

Then the Crusades and the wallowing back and forth through the middle east, the Napoleonic Wars...Colonization by European powers, the Dutch, the Germans, the Spanish, even the Italians and of course, the English...

We, as was Hitler...are in a microcosm of time...There is not much of a threat from the Bush administration...not much at all and although I wish it would not, the political pendulum will most likely swing left in 2008 and you can smile again.

amicus...

Amicus,

I would have thought you, considering your love of personal freedom and your dislike of government expanding it's powers would have seen this for what it is. The swing of the politicalpendulumisnot important. The precedent set is.

That precedent, that the federal legislature may set aside the decisions of a state court, remove it's jurisdiction over a case, and assign that case to a federal court, reguardless of the fact the issue is a reserve power of the states, is tyranical. Whether the current group of politicians do it again or if it dosen't come up until ten years from now, the action sits and festers and gains acceptance through its just being on the books.

This isn't about Teri Schavio, she is just an unwiting judas goat in the matter. this is about a fundamental expansion of the power of the legislature that has no basis in constitutional law. It's about the weaking of the independence of the judciary and a fundamental wekening of its power as a check over the legislature.

The legislature is supposed to create law, not enforce it, not interpret it. If the judiciary becomes subject to congrssional tampering in it's basic duties, then the congress has gained an unprecedented tool for intimidating the judiciary.

By this law, you have no rights anymore. You have priveledges, priveledges that exist at the pleasure of congress. There are no longer reserve powers of the states, if congress possess the means of moving any case they wish from a state court to a federal court, stripping the state courts of their jurisdiction in the matter along the way and setting aside their verdicts.

Where is the check on congressional power if they may write a law specific to you, over turn the verdict in a court if that court upholds your rights and retry it in a new court, even if that court previously had no jurisdiction in the matter? The rule of law has been sacrificed, as congress now has the power not only to write laws, but to set aside judicial decisions, strip courts of their jurisdiction and move the case to a court of their choosing.

The only thing missing now is a Feisler. Should they manage to find and appoint one, John Ashcroft would be perfect, a tyranny has been established, albiet a legal tyranny.

They may write a law, for example homosexuals must wear a pink triangle on thier clothes at all times.

If the state court demurs, they may simply set the decision aside, remove the state court's jurisdiction in the matter and pass it on to Ashcroft's court.

He may then choose to hear it and decide it's a good idea,so he sides with the government.

If you have packed the SCOTUS And appellate courts with arch conservatives, they may simply choose not to hear the appeal. And then what?

While it may not come to this, god hope it dosen't, this law opens the way for the progroms to commence. And it's a very scary prospect.

 

[Guest]

So, you don't fancy a shag, then?

What about mutual wank?

 

[Halo_n_horns]

I'm still in shock that this could happen. That congress would become so monumentally arrogant as to belive it has no check upon it's power. That a U.S. president would echo that sentiment. Now only the courts can speak up for us, or we are lost.

There's no surprise here. This is the direction our country has been going for a very long time. Bush being in office only compounded the decay with much more dramatic affect.

Individual rights will be stripped away for as long as people decide to be lemmings and hand over the way their lives are run to the government or its close friends, instead of standing up for themselves with some pride and courage and making their own decisions, like those who founded this country.

Someday this site and other sites like it will make the top of the hit lists of the so-called and well-empowered "righteous," and who will stand up for it? Laurel and Manu? Nothing is sacred, be it writing, reading or viewing erotica or a person's choice to allow a loved one to pass to end suffering.

I had a thread going about Penthouse magazine caving in to "the current political climate" some time back. Almost no one got into the conversation. But it's all tied together. We're practically handing over so many of our own life's decisions to so many people and entities who have no real right to those decisions, or they're taking them from us when our backs are turned. I voted against doing that despite the fact that there was no real candidate who was for my individual rights. Will we ever have one with the genital fortitude to stand up for people exercising common sense and their own right to live as they see fit? Not a chance in hell. Bush wants to make the religious fundamentalists happy, and because of the response he got to that every president that follows him will attempt to tap that vein for all it's worth.

The interesting correlative fact to this woman's feeding tube being removed is that those decisions are being made by hundreds if not thousands of people all over the US every day. My wife made that decision with her mother a little more than a year ago (I had a thread going about that one also, but it was dismissed as fluff). But I don't remember seeing massive amounts of people standing outside the care facility protesting or supporting my wife's decision. All this circus says to me is that these people have an opinion about it and are so incredibly narcissistic that they feel they have the right to force that opinion on everyone else in the name of someone they don't even know, nor do they know all the facts about. If these people were really that concerned about this situation and the woman who is at the center of it, they would be traveling the nation in mass and going to every care center that these decisions are being made in every day.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

This is quite disheartening:

"The thing is," Turley said, "I have never seen such a disconnect between the political rhetoric and the legal reality as in this case. I have gotten a lot of calls from members of Congress, including two who were on the floor [Sunday] night, and it is striking how little appreciation there is for the law. The law is relatively clear in this area."

He said the law is clear that such cases as the Finn and Schiavo matters are to be decided in state courts. Turley said that as the U.S. House debated its proposal to give jurisdiction over Schiavo's case to federal courts, members of Congress were calling him. " 'Is there any way I can vote for this without violating federalist principles?' " he recalled one member asking him. "I said, 'No. There is no way to spin this.' "


Jonathan Turley, a law professor at George Washington University Law School.

His Credentials:

http://www.jonathanturley.com/JonathanTurley.htm


Members of the house having to call and ASK if this violates federalist principals?

How idiotic do you have to be to even entertain the question of the legislature stripping a state court of it's jurisdiction over a reserve power?

The only comfort I can take is to hope they acted out of gross ignorance rather than this being a malicious power grab. For some reason, I don't find that much of a comfort.

 

[elsol]

Members of the house having to call and ASK if this violates federalist principals?

There is surprise about this?

How many of these people were practicing professors on Constitutional Law, SCOTUS precedents, and US Government?

Colleen... there's senators that need to have their 'email' printed out because they don't 'do' that new-fangled technology thing making decisions about that very new-fangled technology thing.

Sometimes I wonder if Supreme Court Justices don't have little blips given them to them every morning about bills Congress passed that will eventually end up in front of them.

How idiotic do you have to be to even entertain the question of the legislature stripping a state court of it's jurisdiction over a reserve power?

It doesn't take stupidity... it take ignorance or a willing to 'change' things.

The only comfort I can take is to hope they acted out of gross ignorance rather than this being a malicious power grab. For some reason, I don't find that much of a comfort.

They weren't ignorant... I know it.

It's really very simple, how many of these fucking politicians have visited her?

President Bush?
Jeb Bush?
The Three Senatorial Stooges?

Reasonable to me says "If I'm going to do something about this... I should park my ass in that room for a few hours and check for myself."

What do I think about Terry... nothing... I've seen a 4 1/2 minute video made by the parents and their doctors edited down from 4 1/2 hours.

I've heard statements from a husband with a financial stake in the outcome.

My favorite is the 'independent' medical review that was court ordered... 2 doctors chosen by the 'family, 2 by the husband, and one by the judge.

The 2 doctors chosen by the 'family' said 'she can get better'. The 2 doctors chosen by the husband said 'Not a chance'. The 1 doctor chosen by the judge said 'Not a chance'.

Reading that was fun, fun, fun... and made me think "Great, so when I go to a doctor his 'political', 'religious', or 'moral' beliefs might decide whether or not I have a problem!"

Sincerely,
ElSol

 

[Op_Cit]

The interesting correlative fact to this woman's feeding tube being removed is that those decisions are being made by hundreds if not thousands of people all over the US every day. My wife made that decision with her mother a little more than a year ago (I had a thread going about that one also, but it was dismissed as fluff). But I don't remember seeing massive amounts of people standing outside the care facility protesting or supporting my wife's decision. All this circus says to me is that these people have an opinion about it and are so incredibly narcissistic that they feel they have the right to force that opinion on everyone else in the name of someone they don't even know, nor do they know all the facts about. If these people were really that concerned about this situation and the woman who is at the center of it, they would be traveling the nation in mass and going to every care center that these decisions are being made in every day.

You're on the right track. Activism is the silliest of activities.

Ask the people who run the soup kitchens/shelters what really pisses them off the most. It's the "fair weather friends", the celebrities, well to do, and other do-gooders that are only to be seen on thanksgiving or christmas and who want to stand at the counter dishing out food visible to all, for a few hours. They never want to wash dishes in the back, get their hands dirty, actually work... and they're never to be seen at the other times.

One of the things that always piss me off are those "random acts of kindness" bumper stickers. I want to go over to them and ask, "What are you, a psycho? Why can you not be methodical, systematic, and consistent when it comes to kindness?" (But the answer always comes to mind in the form of Al Pacino's voice in some movie I don't remember where he says, "Because it's too hard.")

 

[Kassiana]

Re: the private laws I mentioned in this thread, Dr. M said:
Are these laws passed as a means of reversing judicial decisions?
--I don't recall, but I'd venture a guess that they're not, because I think I'd remember it if my professors had said "And these laws are passed in order to overturn the decisions of the judiciary." Also, I think if they were, y'all would already know about them. Judges don't get to be judges because they think their decisions should be overturned. They tend to think their decisions are important, and if they were being tampered with to this degree, they'd scream to high heaven.

Sche: has anyone ever seen Leni Riefenstahl's Triumph des Willes?
--Yep. Took all the movie courses I could in college, and I saw it in one of them. Nazi propaganda, of course, but beautifully filmed and documents Jesse Owens' win fairly.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Yeah. "Triumph of the Will" was one of those movies that moved you even though you'd dug your feet in and didn't want to be moved.

It remnded me of when I used to play army as a kid. We always wanted to be Nazi's because they had the coolest uniforms. "Triumph" makes fascism look appealing.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Yeah. "Triumph of the Will" was one of those movies that moved you even though you'd dug your feet in and didn't want to be moved.

It remnded me of when I used to play army as a kid. We always wanted to be Nazi's because they had the coolest uniforms. "Triumph" makes fascism look appealing.

Triumph stands out because it's propaganda elevated to art. Leni used unique camera angles to achieve a lot of her results. For example, if you ever watch it take note, you never see Hitler from an even on or top down view, it's always from a bottom down view. Looking up to him.

After the war, Leni actually made a come back as a photographer, taking pictures of african tribesmen. If you see some of that work, you really get a sense of how inspired her asthetic sense was.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Colly

I've followed this since you started this thread. I haven't commented up until now for a few reasons. First, the best thoughts don't come when you're naturally angry and, second, I had my fingers crossed that the Constitution would prevail.

I've just read this with immense pride in our country:

U.S. Supreme Court rejects Schiavo appeal
Florida judge also acts to block Gov. Bush's move to help parents

Updated: 12:35 p.m. ET March 24, 2005WASHINGTON - The U.S. Supreme Court turned down Terri Schiavo’s parents Thursday, declining to intervene to keep the brain-damaged woman alive, while a Florida judge reinforced his order to keep her feeding tube from being reconnected.

The Supreme Court decision, announced in a terse one-page order, marked the end of a dramatic four-day dash through the federal court system by Bob and Mary Schindler.

The justices did not immediately provide legal reasons for the decision, and no justice issued a written dissent with the ruling. The Supreme Court had declined other opportunities to get involved in the Schiavo case and legal experts said there was little reason to believe justices would intervene this time.

Schiavo’s feeding tube was removed last Friday and doctors have said she likely would die within a week or two at a hospice in Pinellas Park, Fla., where she is being cared for.

In Florida, Gov. Jeb Bush and Florida’s social services agency filed a petition in state court to take custody of Schiavo and reconnect her feeding tube. It cited new allegations of neglect and challenged Schiavo’s diagnosis as being in a persistent vegetative state.

The custody request was being heard by Judge George Greer, who has presided over the case for several years and issued the ruling last month that allowed the feeding tube to be removed.

Greer issued an emergency order Wednesday to keep the Department of Children & Families from reconnecting the tube. On Thursday, before ruling on the custody question, Greer reinforced that order.

The custody request was based on the opinion of a neurologist working for the state who observed Schiavo at her bedside but did not examine her.

The neurologist, William Cheshire of the Mayo Clinic in Jacksonville, is a bioethicist who is also an active member in Christian organizations, including two whose leaders have spoken out against the removal of Schiavo's feeding tube.


U.S. Supreme Court rejects Schiavo appeal
Florida judge also acts to block Gov. Bush's move to help parents

Despite your worries, the Judiciary (even strongly leaning to the Right) have rejected the intemperate reactions of the Legislature and the Executive. Let us all go down on our knees and be grateful that Supreme Court judges don't face election. Wanna start a thread about democracy??

I've read what you and carson say about 'legal guardian' and I understand completely, even if I'll prolly get married and won't have an issue.

It may not sound erotic, but the guy I'll marry, or take out a 'civil partnership' contract with, will be the person I trust to take the right decisions for me when I'm not able to myself. Soon, I'll be an 'orphan' and I get really scared that prejudiced or, even worse, motivated people will take decisions that will debase my self-pride or dignity.

I believe in my heart that Terri has won this, though I wish we could consider euthanasia to avoid the indignities she will suffer.

We worry too much about property - even kids - if you and carson want to start a campaign to get same-sex partners given legal guardian status, I promise to man the barricades with you, and I reckon we've got a pretty substantial following on Lit who would fight the good fight with us.

Let's do it in memory of Terri Schiavo!!

(Long-winded - but even the silent MAJORITY care)

Love

Elle

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Kinda PS,

Whatever your opinion, your heart has to go out to Judge Greer. Who amongst us would ever want to be put in the position of playing God. Especially knowing that the Senate is one step higher telling us we've got it wrong!!

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Colly

I've followed this since you started this thread. I haven't commented up until now for a few reasons. First, the best thoughts don't come when you're naturally angry and, second, I had my fingers crossed that the Constitution would prevail.

I've just read this with immense pride in our country:

U.S. Supreme Court rejects Schiavo appeal
Florida judge also acts to block Gov. Bush's move to help parents

Updated: 12:35 p.m. ET March 24, 2005WASHINGTON - The U.S. Supreme Court turned down Terri Schiavo’s parents Thursday, declining to intervene to keep the brain-damaged woman alive, while a Florida judge reinforced his order to keep her feeding tube from being reconnected.

The Supreme Court decision, announced in a terse one-page order, marked the end of a dramatic four-day dash through the federal court system by Bob and Mary Schindler.

The justices did not immediately provide legal reasons for the decision, and no justice issued a written dissent with the ruling. The Supreme Court had declined other opportunities to get involved in the Schiavo case and legal experts said there was little reason to believe justices would intervene this time.

Schiavo’s feeding tube was removed last Friday and doctors have said she likely would die within a week or two at a hospice in Pinellas Park, Fla., where she is being cared for.

In Florida, Gov. Jeb Bush and Florida’s social services agency filed a petition in state court to take custody of Schiavo and reconnect her feeding tube. It cited new allegations of neglect and challenged Schiavo’s diagnosis as being in a persistent vegetative state.

The custody request was being heard by Judge George Greer, who has presided over the case for several years and issued the ruling last month that allowed the feeding tube to be removed.

Greer issued an emergency order Wednesday to keep the Department of Children & Families from reconnecting the tube. On Thursday, before ruling on the custody question, Greer reinforced that order.

The custody request was based on the opinion of a neurologist working for the state who observed Schiavo at her bedside but did not examine her.

The neurologist, William Cheshire of the Mayo Clinic in Jacksonville, is a bioethicist who is also an active member in Christian organizations, including two whose leaders have spoken out against the removal of Schiavo's feeding tube.


U.S. Supreme Court rejects Schiavo appeal
Florida judge also acts to block Gov. Bush's move to help parents

Despite your worries, the Judiciary (even strongly leaning to the Right) have rejected the intemperate reactions of the Legislature and the Executive. Let us all go down on our knees and be grateful that Supreme Court judges don't face election. Wanna start a thread about democracy??

I've read what you and carson say about 'legal guardian' and I understand completely, even if I'll prolly get married and won't have an issue.

It may not sound erotic, but the guy I'll marry, or take out a 'civil partnership' contract with, will be the person I trust to take the right decisions for me when I'm not able to myself. Soon, I'll be an 'orphan' and I get really scared that prejudiced or, even worse, motivated people will take decisions that will debase my self-pride or dignity.

I believe in my heart that Terri has won this, though I wish we could consider euthanasia to avoid the indignities she will suffer.

We worry too much about property - even kids - if you and carson want to start a campaign to get same-sex partners given legal guardian status, I promise to man the barricades with you, and I reckon we've got a pretty substantial following on Lit who would fight the good fight with us.

Let's do it in memory of Terri Schiavo!!

(Long-winded - but even the silent MAJORITY care)

Love

Elle

My fear wasn't that the courts would return her feeding tube, my fear was that the law would stand. So far, no challenge to it has been made and if it stands, it sits as precedent for future abuses.

I have been somewhat heartened of late by conservative commentators. Long silent as our party has been taken over by religious nuts, this action has provoked disgust in many of them as in myself. Despite Bush's 'political captial" and his parties complete control of congress, he and his handlers miscalculated on this.

While th courtsmaintaining their independance is heartening, i won't really feel better until this act is struck. If Teri passes before it is reviewed, it is likely to stand. A festering wound on our system of rule by law and a temptation for congress to try again on some other matter dear to their little hearts in the future.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Kinda PS,

Whatever your opinion, your heart has to go out to Judge Greer. Who amongst us would ever want to be put in the position of playing God. Especially knowing that the Senate is one step higher telling us we've got it wrong!!

I feel for him. I feel for the legislators who recieved death threats for oppsing the intervention legislation in the florida legislature, I feel for her husband, having to go through so much misery in what should have been a private decision, I feel for her, I feel for her parents.

It is a tragedy on so many levels, not the least being it's adoption by a few powermad senators as an excuse to try and bring the judicary to heel.